Food for thought: Ignition advancers.

[Dom]

I took mine out today with two thoughts in mind:

1)  Could I modify the stock I.A.?  Probably not.  Trying to achieve 5 degrees(or whatever...) by sawing it and welding it back together might be extremely problematic, though  I havn't given up on the idea altogether.

2)  Could I pay someone to fabricate 100 pieces(+/-) and sell them to you and on Ebay and possibly milk the Cash Cow a little bit.  Yes.  Could I do it profitably? Who knows?  Vance and Hines clearly doesn't see it as a profitable venture...oh yeah, well I have an extremely low overhead(none), and the tax man doesn't even know that I exist...report what?

I would not mind researching this project, and feel slightly more enamoured of this project and it potentialities than my dual header project for three main reasons, A: It's something that everyone can afford.   B: it affects performance for the better.  And C: most everyone who has heard  of one wants one.

Whaddaya think?

[Kerry]

1)  Could I modify the stock I.A.?  Probably not.

Are you thinking of doing it in a way fundamentally different than the way Bob Broussard does it?  He has been modifying the stock arrangement for folks for basically the cost of shipping for a year or two now.

2)  Could I pay someone to fabricate 100 pieces(+/-)

Now THERE is an idea!  After all, the advancer itself is just a single chunk of material, right?  If you've got a machinist or metalcaster or someone up your sleeve, you would definitely have a market ... at the right price.

[Jeff P]

Kerry, how would I get in touch with Bob to get that done?  Are there any drawbacks to the advancer?

jeff

[MarkusN]

Are there any drawbacks to the advancer?

The engine will become less tolerant to low RPM overload (lugging), and may lose some of its low octane tolerance.

[Jeff P]

Ok so it might run crappier in that 1,500-2,500 range and might need a step up to mid-grade?  I think I can handle that.  The upside is improved power & response in the upper half of the rpm range right?

jeff

[Dragonfly]

yup

[The Buddha]

Or - rejet ... the richer mix burns much slower and cooler ... I run premium on all my stock bikes and regular on all that I have jetted ... I jet them till I see a drastic drop in performance and then back up 1 step... as rich as possible.
Cool.
Srinath.

[Jeff P]

aw man my winter plans just keep getting bigger.  

Looks like I'll go for the advancer and a rejet.  Questions on the proper jetting choices:

I got your PM srinath, and I also checked out the FAQ.  Stock pipe, K&N drop in (with restrictor) is my current setup, not particularly interested in changing the pipes.  #40 pilots, looks like a 125 with 1 washer is the way to go?  Would removing the restrictor do anything good, and if so would I need to go with say 127.5 and 2 washers?  Thanks,

jeff

[dolepineapple]

Dom:  Great idea with the ignition advancers.  After reading from the FAQ's on gstwin.com, it's a tease to read the advantages that ignition advancing can do and no one makes it anymore. . .if you end up making them, COUNT ME IN!

[Kerry]

Kerry, how would I get in touch with Bob to get that done?

See the ignition advancer mod thread.  Send an email or PM first (his GStwin handle is Bob Broussard) to make sure he's still "in the business".  He created that thread almost a year ago.

[Dom]

Bob's method actually sounds superior to the method that I had envisioned.  I was going to saw it somewhere around the skinniest point, rotate it, and weld it back together.  Of course I would just make a jig so I could clamp the pieces in and ensure uniformity and maintain tolerances exactly... I rarely go anywhere without my calipers.   :mrgreen:

I have a mini mill table but it runs off my drill press and I havn't yet figured out how I could ensure square cuts, or even square the table up to the drill.

[Dom]

Nevermind, I figured it out...Bob's way is much, much simpler.  Even making the jig is a snap...just rotate it 5 degrees, cleat it in, bolt it through the jig to a nut welded to the underside, and make the pass.  I'm doing mine tonite.

[dolepineapple]

Dom:  sounds like you know you what you're doing. . .would YOU be willing to do the ignition advancing on my GS500F? (just a thought)

[Dom]

Sure I would, but we need to figure out if the Fs are the same.  I also remembered that I need to buy the right end mill bit, so it might be a couple days out.

[Kerry]

Nevermind, I figured it out...Bob's way is much, much simpler.

Did you find Bob's actual description of what he does, or just figure it out from some clues?

In case you're interested, see THIS POST.

[The Buddha]

The point on the inductive end also was made smaller ... atleast on the CA ones it was ... its dwell based ... make it smaller and the ECU thinks its running higher rpm and adnavces it more...
Cool.
Srinath.

[se7enty7]

bob I've got an extra rotor.. I can send it to you.. as a loaner type deal..


like.. someone wants their rotor advanced.. but their bike has to be out of commission... so when someone orders a rotor send them the one I send you, and then they send you their old one.. and so on and so forth

that way noones out of a rotor...   :dunno:

[Dom]

Kerry, yeah I got the idea for the procedure from that thread.

Srinath, I don't understand what "dwell based" is, or "inductive end"...  :dunno:

[Dom]

It may be that I got very little sleep and am lacking in motivation, but I think if Bob already has a jig all set up and is only charging $10+s&h, it would probably be easier and cheaper(for me) to see if he is willing and able to do it.  An HSS 1/8" mill bit is at least $30, even more for carbide.

An 1/8" bit is 0.125 and I measured the channel at 0.120.  You think five thousandths will make a difference, or should I get the 7/64"(0.109) and make a couple passes?  I don't know how accurate my table is.

[The Buddha]

Yea there we go re inventing the wheel...
Anyway the advancer has a small projection ... that projection as it flies by the ignition triggers the induction takes place ... where its magnetic field is disturbed by the presence of that extra lip of ferrous metal ... that lip has a certain length, and inbuilt into the black box is that length and its used by the black box to determine what speed the motor is running and advance the spark accordingly ... shave that and make it a smaller pprojection ... and the black box now thinks you are running higher rpm... and more advance ...
Cool.
Srinath.