first day of MSF over

[cujosocal]

.....................

All said I thought it was a good course and well worth the $20 I paid to get in.  We have it good in IL, it's free.  

If I had paid $20 I would have been MUCH more than satisfied.  the $250 is ridiculous

You must be in Calif... That's what I paid also! I didb't get the pin and patch   .... Too bad you can't just take the last riding session for a discounted rate! The entire class was worth it for me. I had never ridden a motorcycle before the class unless you call a friends Honda Trail 50 a motorcycle!! LOL...

[ghettorigged]

Did I mention it was $400 in NY?

I hate all of you!  :mrgreen:

[John Bates]

Did I mention it was $400 in NY?

I hate all of you!  :mrgreen:

$400................,  $250...............,  whatever.  :guns:

Quit complaining.  

I paid only $25 but my taxes are higher. :x

[ghettorigged]

<--- no, no! not complaining, just being humorous!

I feel my $400 was VERY well spent on my course and I wouldn't trade it for one of the free courses with questionable instructors.  

I would have to question the higher taxes than Philadelphia though... (is it possible?)  :lol:

[Roadstergal]

I would have to question the higher taxes than Philadelphia though... (is it possible?)  :lol:

We've got sales taxes pushing 10%...

But it all evens out.  We have low vehicle tabs, thanks to Eyman (don't even start me on him!), and the city is having serious budget problems.  Seattleites aren't used to being a big city, and the fact that a big city is a big tradeoff.  Chicago, where I'm from, is used to that; you have to pay for a sticker every year to park a vehicle in the city (even just to park for an afternoon's shopping), but the transit is so good, I never needed a vehicle, and there was just so much cool stuff to do, from parks to museums to public art, and so on.

We don't have MSF; we have companies contracted by the Washington Safety Council (I think that's its name?).  They offer courses for $250; some of the money from motorcycle licensing fees are kicked back into $100 subsidized courses.  A motorcycle endorsement is $25 per renewal on top of the auto license.

[GeeP]

One girl high-sided a 125 out of a wheelie on the first day

How the hell do you do that...?

We were practicing quick stops.  When she reached for the front brake she managed to get full throttle.  It scared the crap out of her and she let go of the clutch.  Quite Impressive, she rode it for about 50 ft before pulling in the clutch and grabbing the front brake.  She came down with the bars turned to the left and got thrown off the right.  

She was all ready to get back on until her knee started acting up.  I think I would have called it a day!  

[Roadstergal]

When she reached for the front brake she managed to get full throttle.  It scared the crap out of her and she let go of the clutch.  Quite Impressive, she rode it for about 50 ft before pulling in the clutch and grabbing the front brake.

That's pretty impressive, all right!

It must take some doing to be able to get anywhere near the front brake while pulling full throttle, though.  Well, I guess something that has a one-in-a-million chance of happening on a given ride is going to happen if a million people ride...

[se7enty7]

hah.. those gn125's I don't think I could have MADE one do a wheelie

[Rema1000]

It must take some doing to be able to get anywhere near the front brake while pulling full throttle, though.

I had a related problem several times during MSF:  I grabbed the brake, but while pulling back on the brake lever, I rolled the throttle grip at the same time.  Imagine laying your palm over the handgrip, with the fingertips curled around the brake lever.  Now slide your whole hand towards yourself, pulling the brake lever while rolling the throttle.

Luckily, the clutch was always pulled too, but it produced several panic stops where the engine was whining like jet turbine (125cc, I think ).  I just froze, then gradually figured out which hand I needed to move, and let go with the RIGHT hand.  I got some stern looks from the instructors, but eventually learned not to do that!

[cujosocal]

It must take some doing to be able to get anywhere near the front brake while pulling full throttle, though.

I had a related problem several times during MSF:  I grabbed the brake, but while pulling back on the brake lever, I rolled the throttle grip at the same time.  Imagine laying your palm over the handgrip, with the fingertips curled around the brake lever.  Now slide your whole hand towards yourself, pulling the brake lever while rolling the throttle.

Luckily, the clutch was always pulled too, but it produced several panic stops where the engine was whining like jet turbine (125cc, I think ).  I just froze, then gradually figured out which hand I needed to move, and let go with the RIGHT hand.  I got some stern looks from the instructors, but eventually learned not to do that!

I did the exact same thing ONCE except for some reason I didn't pull the clutch in. We were using 250cc's. It was when I was coming into the "staging area". Luckily I was in the 2nd row. Blasted right in between the people stopped in the front row.... The look on their faces!!! (And mine!)...
I was really careful after that about rolling off the throttle fully before braking... I kind of did the same thing a couple of times (but not to an extreme) while practicing my first hundred miles or so. No problems now 1500 miles later...

[Jace009]

ok unlike everyone here who took the MSF then got their licens in MD you have a choice:

#1 -pass written and physical [driving] test through DMV aftering riding w/ a permit for 4months...
#2-pass MSF beginners course

Me being the "nerd"   Went to the DMV got a motorcycle pamphlet and studied that thing like the bible and passed the two test having never ridden a motorcycle.  the driving part was basicly quick stops, the u-turn in the box and cone weaving and a quick stop on a turn.

Days later I buy a GS500e as "my bike" having obtained my permit through my dad's ol' 750nighthawk...ok ya 750 was intimidating for my little 120lb frame slim jim :nana:  When I got on the GS for a real spin [after the sale]  IMHO is has more bite than the nighthawk. Watch out for the disc brake invention I managed to lock the front tire on my first "quick stop" on the GS..didn't drop the bike but it was an intresting feel

MOrals I have learned having gone back and taking the MSF beginners and advanced is that squids will be squids. People are dumb and arrogant. My two instructors were good offering alot of pointers to brand spanking new motorcyclst. I admit I did some showing off in the beginner's class because I had already ridden my dad's 750 and my GS500 for a few months and had mastered some skills. However I did pick up the name "speedy" on the range because I liked to see what those 250 rebels could crank out Lets just say you might as well push them up the highway on-ramp...but I would be doing the beginner circles and oval track exercises in 3ard gear while everyone else was putt'n in 2...THere were 3 women in our class 2 were quite good and the third took a low side and came back the second day and finished the class  While us "men" consisted of me "speedy" young and a bunch of mid 40's guys that I assumed ride "hogs" I'll never forget when the instructor showed up for class ridding in on a ninja zx-9r and I was almost in tears in shear beauty :kiss:  :kiss:  I quote her "don't any of you guys/gals go off and buy a sport bike untill you master my couse [insert evil laugh]" then the other instructor shows up on a "hog" It's all good I learned things in the advanced course I didn't know and fine tuned my skills and "inspired" others in the beginner's course

In MD it was $125 for the beginner's and $50 for the advanced since you supply the bike and all...I'd cry If I droped my bike

[Roadstergal]

ok unlike everyone here who took the MSF then got their licens in MD you have a choice:

#1 -pass written and physical [driving] test through DMV aftering riding w/ a permit for 4months...
#2-pass MSF beginners course

Same choice in WA.  I took the course this past weekend a) for the discount and b) what the heck, I might learn something.  And I did!

[starwalt]

It seems there are some skill building errors that are common to all new riders, myself included.

The roll-on-throttle-while-braking thing started to happen to me also. I also heard more than one high revving engine before a classmate figured out what was wrong.

Skill Building. That's it plain and simple. Riding motorbikes requires multiple simultaneous extremity movements and constant processing of surroundings to be successful. Once that becomes instinctual, if it could ever become that way, skill level may plateau.

I obtained a new perspective of the word "motorsport" after MSF.
From the street safety perspective I paraphrased, "Assume everyone with more than two wheels is trying and will try to kill you."

From the equipment perspective I learned that bikes ridden by everyone are not comfortable for anyone.

From the classmate perspective I learned that it takes all kinds to make up beautiful thing like motorcycling. Yes, even squids. Darwinian theories usually take care of them.  

[Eisenfaust]

Hmm. About rolling-on-the-throttle while braking? What about blipping for downshifts under braking? I do that occasionally.... roll off the throttle, apply frint brake.. clutch in, hit the downshift while using my palm to give a quick blip, then feed out the clutch while easing off the brakes... go into the corner, roll on.  :dunno:  :dunno:  :dunno:

[GeeP]

ok unlike everyone here who took the MSF then got their licens in MD you have a choice:

#1 -pass written and physical [driving] test through DMV aftering riding w/ a permit for 4months...
#2-pass MSF beginners course

Me being the "nerd"   Went to the DMV got a motorcycle pamphlet and studied that thing like the bible and passed the two test having never ridden a motorcycle.  the driving part was basicly quick stops, the u-turn in the box and cone weaving and a quick stop on a turn.

Oh lord!  That reminds me of when I took my CDL tests at the DMV.  I didn't practice for the range driving test at all.  While I was finding a place to park I asked the guy with me where the truck range was.  He pointed and said "over there, inside the motorcycle range."  I just kinda sat there for a moment before saying "Did you say INSIDE the motorcycle range!?"    That stupid range was pure torture.  :x

I decided when I wanted to get my motorcycle endorsement that I'd plunk down the money, however much it happened to be and take the course.  

[Nerobro]

Okay second day done.

This honestly is a joke.  If it weren't for an insurance reduction and automatic full mc license I'd demand a refund.
......
I wish I didn't have to say this... but waste of $250.  Also this stupid wh0re in the class banged her helmet clasp against my mirrored faceshield.. scratching it. arg.  On a better note, the guy with the cbr1000rr let me try on his scorpion helmet (REALLY nice looking, seems of much better quality than my HJC cl-14.. only his helmet seems really small for a L) and tried

I was given the op[toin of getting my money back at the end of the MSF course here in illinois.  if you paid $250, was it really a MSF course?  or was it a private lesson company?

As for the CL-14.   It is the lower end dot and snell helmet from HJC.  Try on a AC-11 and you might have a better opinoin.  The CL-14 is a plastic noodle bucket, the AC-11 is composite.  It's somewhat lighter, and comes with a breath guard, and you can't feel the seams in the liner like you can with the CL-14

[Jace009]

ok unlike everyone here who took the MSF then got their licens in MD you have a choice:

#1 -pass written and physical [driving] test through DMV aftering riding w/ a permit for 4months...
#2-pass MSF beginners course

Me being the "nerd"   Went to the DMV got a motorcycle pamphlet and studied that thing like the bible and passed the two test having never ridden a motorcycle.  the driving part was basicly quick stops, the u-turn in the box and cone weaving and a quick stop on a turn.

Oh lord!  That reminds me of when I took my CDL tests at the DMV.  I didn't practice for the range driving test at all.  While I was finding a place to park I asked the guy with me where the truck range was.  He pointed and said "over there, inside the motorcycle range."  I just kinda sat there for a moment before saying "Did you say INSIDE the motorcycle range!?"    That stupid range was pure torture.  :x

I decided when I wanted to get my motorcycle endorsement that I'd plunk down the money, however much it happened to be and take the course.  

GEEEZ that's ruff when I get out of the ARNG [construction equipment operator] I'll probably go down and get my CDL as well or might get that through the National Guard...but ya

[se7enty7]

Okay second day done.

This honestly is a joke.  If it weren't for an insurance reduction and automatic full mc license I'd demand a refund.
......
I wish I didn't have to say this... but waste of $250.  Also this stupid wh0re in the class banged her helmet clasp against my mirrored faceshield.. scratching it. arg.  On a better note, the guy with the cbr1000rr let me try on his scorpion helmet (REALLY nice looking, seems of much better quality than my HJC cl-14.. only his helmet seems really small for a L) and tried

I was given the op[toin of getting my money back at the end of the MSF course here in illinois.  if you paid $250, was it really a MSF course?  or was it a private lesson company?

As for the CL-14.   It is the lower end dot and snell helmet from HJC.  Try on a AC-11 and you might have a better opinoin.  The CL-14 is a plastic noodle bucket, the AC-11 is composite.  It's somewhat lighter, and comes with a breath guard, and you can't feel the seams in the liner like you can with the CL-14

I thought that the cl-14 and ac-11 shell's were identical.. that the only difference between the two is a breath guard and removable/washable cushioning inside

[Nerobro]

Nope, the differences are somewhat more signifigant than that  The price difference is justified  I own both.