crappy front suspension on 2004??

[mike24]

hi all,

I got my new baby a couple of months ago, a brand new (blue) F model.

after i was done with the break in, and started going in speeds of
80+ Mph (120+ kmh) i noticed a real lack of stability, sometimes even in real danger of losing control if it was windy.
i took it in to the main dealer , and spoke there with the head mechanic, who explained to me the front suspension was changed from 2004 models, and im not the first one who complains about it.

tomorrow im goin there again and meeting with the guy from customer relations , in hope they will take responsibility for the lousy suspension and replace/improve it.

does any1 here know of this change, or have a similar problem?

will improving (spacers/change of oil) make a real difference??

thanks guys.

mike.

[gs500freak]

i have an 04 500f and i have notice the lack in stabability with the front suspension. i spoke to a mechanic in houston at the dealer where i got my bike, he is the one that works on the bikes that are gettin tricked out. he also told me that the oil and spacers should help alot. i am still trying to find a store that sells plastic that i can use as the spacers.

[coll0412]

Sounds kinda like BS because I have looked at the 04 bikes and saw no discernible difference in the suspension...

anyone else?

[cernunos]

How much experience riding motorcycles at high speeds? I ask because too much rider input at speed will give the sensation of instability when in actuality the bike is doing exactly what you are telling it to. Plus, the Baby G is not a very heavy bike and weight on a bike tranlates into better stability. Factor in that the little twin has a fairly "sporty" rake and it tends to go where you point it...quickly. I was always used to riding HD's and when I first rode the White Owl I thought "wow, this thing turns quick!". If this is so, then try relaxing more when these episodes happen and don't fight the bike...it will tend to wander back and forth. Kinda like flyin' an airplane. Love the Baby GS and this forum.

C.......

[scratch]

How much experience riding motorcycles at high speeds? I ask because too much rider input at speed will give the sensation of instability when in actuality the bike is doing exactly what you are telling it to. Plus, the Baby G is not a very heavy bike and weight on a bike tranlates into better stability. Factor in that the little twin has a fairly "sporty" rake and it tends to go where you point it...quickly. I was always used to riding HD's and when I first rode the White Owl I thought "wow, this thing turns quick!". If this is so, then try relaxing more when these episodes happen and don't fight the bike...it will tend to wander back and forth. Kinda like flyin' an airplane. Love the Baby GS and this forum.

I'll echo that (and the love, too). I have gone to the 110/80 series front and even raised the bike through the triple clamps 2mm to give it a little more rake and stability.

[wraithR1]

How much experience riding motorcycles at high speeds? I ask because too much rider input at speed will give the sensation of instability when in actuality the bike is doing exactly what you are telling it to. Plus, the Baby G is not a very heavy bike and weight on a bike tranlates into better stability. Factor in that the little twin has a fairly "sporty" rake and it tends to go where you point it...quickly. I was always used to riding HD's and when I first rode the White Owl I thought "wow, this thing turns quick!". If this is so, then try relaxing more when these episodes happen and don't fight the bike...it will tend to wander back and forth. Kinda like flyin' an airplane. Love the Baby GS and this forum.

C.......

I concur!  Great point!  If you're hands are tired/sore when done with a moderate ride, you are certainly gripping the clipons toooo tight.   If you ever ride a larger race replica/sport bike with more aggressive geometry, you will find that, especially without a damper, the bike will get upset with the smallest of movements.  Stay relaxed!!!

I do agree with the soft suspension.  I can bottom the front fork while corneriing.  Albeit, I weigh about 195, but without anymore suspension travel to keep the front planted,  I'm just asking for a get off.

[dgyver]

I was wondering if the stability issue of the soft forks is amplified with the addition of the fairings?

[addison]

I also have an '04 model. It is my first bike and when I got it I had the same concerns as you did - over a certain speed it would wobble alot. Come to find out that since I was a new rider I kept a death grip on the handle bars while riding, as soon as I loosened my grip I had no more problems at higher speeds.

[Jeff P]

How have we gone this many responses without the magic words being spoken?  :lol:  Progressive springs!

Without commenting on your observation that the bike feels unsafe, or what your mechanic said, suffice it to say that soft forks on the GS are a complaint going all the way back to the '89s.  You can use spacers to stiffen the stock springs a bit, but the better solution is going with a set of Progressive springs for about $65.  If your dealer is cool maybe they'll install 'em for free?  :dunno:  If not it's a pretty straightforward DIY job.

I never had any serious complaints about the springs (and I'm 185 lbs) but definitely found the Progressives to greatly reduce dive under braking, or when going over speed humps and stuff.  I wasn't pushing the bike enough in the turns back then to get a feel for issues with the stock springs, but have no problems now.  

jeff

[The Buddha]

Dgyver pretty much hit it on the noz ...
The 89-02 was shitty to begin with, add unsprung weight in the form of fairings and barn door sized side panels wiht no cross air flow and bingo ...
Progressive front, Katana/GSXR rear shock are a must ... now that davipu has managed to showhorn a GSXR 1000 rear shock in and he makes dog bones to get the ride height to where you want it ... maybe its time to try that ... Front and rear need to be upgraded for  full effect I think ... cos a lot of that fairing will transmit side loads to the rear wheel ...
Cool.
Srinath.

[The Buddha]

Oh yea You need my thicker fork brace too ...  :lol:  ...
But Honestly ... under braking and in turns if it wiggles ... stiffer brace will help.
Cool.
Srinath.

[mike24]

hi guys, thanks for the replies.

i was at the dealer's mechanic today, the manager of the shop took the bike for a spin, and came back and said it feels fine and nothing is wrong with it.

i insisted, saying there's no way im giving up and told him i intend to make a lot of noise with this.

after that he told me, ok , we just want u to be pleased, and we settled for spacers and changing of oil to a thicker one.

when i came to get it back, he told me he changed the oil but did not install spacers, bcz when he did the fork didnt close and it couldnt be done (sounds like BS to me).

on the way home, the suspension did feel better, BUT, the main problem persists: over 80mph if the bike's in the slightest angle, the bike wobbles as if im shaking the bar.

about what u  guys wrote (btw its the E model not the F), i do put weight on the bar, but in high speeds, since im 1.85 cm (6"1) i have to bend forward bcz of the wind, so im guessing that doesnt help.

what do u think i should do? keep pursuing it with the dealer, or am i making a fool of myself?

thanks.

[se7enty7]

hi guys, thanks for the replies.

i was at the dealer's mechanic today, the manager of the shop took the bike for a spin, and came back and said it feels fine and nothing is wrong with it.

i insisted, saying there's no way im giving up and told him i intend to make a lot of noise with this.

after that he told me, ok , we just want u to be pleased, and we settled for spcaers and changing of oil to a thicker one.

when i came to get it back, he told me he changed the oil but did not install spacers, bcz when he did the fork didnt close and it couldnt be done (sounds like BS to me).

on the way home, the suspension did feel better, BUT, the main problem persists: over 80mph if the bike's in the slightest angle, the bike wobbles as if im shaking the bar.

about what u  guys wrote (btw its the E model not the F), i do put weight on the bar, but in high speeds, since im 1.85 cm (6"1) i have to bend forward bcz of the wind, so im guessing that doesnt help.

what do u think i should do? keep persuing it with the dealer, or am i making a fool of myself?

thanks.

honestly? I think you're making a fool of yourself.  From what it sounds, the dealer is doing his best to make you happy.  More than likely you are putting too much wieght on the bars, and gripping them too tightly.




IMO it's not the dealers responisibility to fix the front shocks of the gs.  It's a known issue, and YOU can put progressives in.

[Jeff P]

Making a fool out of yourself?  Probably not, but you're making a bigger deal than necessary out of it.  

Look, the GS500 is a budget/commuter/beginner/etc bike.  It's got some lower-grade components.  Among these are the front springs.  Is it a "problem" as you term it?  I don't think so.  I consider it an "issue".  It clearly bothers you, so I highly recommened looking into those Progressive springs.  

jeff

[The Buddha]

Yea pretty much buy the bike and start changing stuff ... They cut some corners for $$ and some for passing various regulations ...  Nice thing though ... its in the 4-5K range even new ... not 15-25K where the problem still persists ... maybe even worse ... The more you pay the more they realise you'll pay even more to get it perfect ... so the factories themselves start making good parts to sell you after you buy the bike ... Like admitting the stuff they put on it was shaZam! and the good stuff ... ha "pay up sucker"
BTW did the dealer ride your bike at 80mph in the parking lot ... If not ... no reason you should take his word ... But The problem may be beyond the scope of the dealer ... And WTF ... they charge $60-70 an hour and cant stuff an extra spacer in ... Bring it to my house and I'll stuff it in for you free ...
Cool.
Srinath.

[Jeff P]

Srinath raises a good point.  Depending on where you are there could be another GSr nearby who'd be happy to help you with some wrenching.  

jeff

[scratch]

Most mechanics at dealers know how to ride properly.

Our bikes have a 26 degree rake and 3.7 inches of trail (an R6 has 24.5 degree rake, 3.7 in trail), so they're pretty twitchy. Proper suspension set-up is key to any rider, so suggesting Progressive springs is probably a good idea, I'll second that.

70camguy was going to put in 1 and 1/2" spacers in his forks when we realized that it would be too difficult to compress the springs. 0.75" spacers are ideal and what are suggested by Progressive. You can use the schedule 40 white PVC endcaps available at Home Depot.

[mike24]

3 questions:

1. how can i not put wieght on the bar? i have to lean forward, so the arms take some of the wieght.

2. i really dont have any exp. in wrenching etc. is installing spacers simple enough so i can do it? and if so how do i do it?

3. and also, what's progressive springs? where can i get it?

thanks.

p.s. thanks for the suggestions, but i dont think any of u guys are in the GS's range (i live in israel  :lol:  )

[wraithR1]

"1. how can i not put wieght on the bar? i have to lean forward, so the arms take some of the wieght. "

As previously stated, use your back and ab muscles.  Also, lightly grip the clipons and stay relaxed.  I ride a R1 and never weight my clipons, so it can easily be done on a GS500.  Not adhering to the above information will make your riding sketchy at best.  To truly enjoy the capabilities of your machine, you must focus on your riding technique.  There is no suspension or bike mod that will correct your problems like improving your skill.  I've had my GF bike well over 90mph (sustained) on a windy day with ZERO instability problems.  The only problem with the suspension is that it is too soft to take advantage of hard cornering safely (as with any improperly tuned suspension regardless of the bike).  This issue is almost irrelevant at highway speeds in straight line.  

Have you considered a riding school or a track day?  Most folks at the track are more than willing to help out with technique.

[mike24]

another question:

some1 told that adjusting the rear shock might help.

do any of u guys agree?

as i understand it has 7 grades of stiffness, i weigh 160 pounds (72 kg) what level should it be?

how can i see what level is it now, and how do i change it?

thanks a lot for the input guys.