Why did you choose your particular religion?

[indestructibleman]

Afterall plenty of us are still proud Americans despite the corruption in our own government, aren't we?

jeff

funny you should mention that.  i was thinking of using that as an example. the government has a lot of power and there's a lot of corruption, but ultimately it still serves a very important purpose.

so, yeah, actually by the time i finished my earlier response, i realized that we were more in agreement than i had originally thought.

cheers,
will

[luksi]

I always wondered why the Missions in San Antonio had 2 ft. thick walls.

[cernunos]

Actually, I always found my old Electraglide easier to maneuver and move around than any other bike I have owned or rode upon. She was much easier to maintain, simply designed to work on and repair...she never broke down on me, never stranded me, and she never once rode in the back of a truck or trailer. That bike, more than any other, brought such joy to me that selling her was like losing a member of my family.

There are things in life that bother me; I hate seeing our forests and wilderness areas slowly being consumed by the juggernaught of greed and waste. I don't like to witness and know theft, rape, torture, violence of any kind and selfishness. I despise bigotry and prejudice because both are brought about by the selfishness and closed-mindedness of individuals and herds with the mentality that others should behave as they do merely because that's what they wish, never minding that those others cause no harm to the individual, the herd or any others around them.

I believe in a supreme being and have faith and hope in Jesus Christ, or at the very least I absolutely adore the teachings of the man. Being an existentialist and believing in a supreme being are not mutually exclusive; I can believe their is a God and yet feel that I have a free will at the same time. I can exist and allow others to exist with tolerance to their acts as long as those acts do not start "causing" pain and anguish upon their fellow humans.

Joe can argue that if we allow some to do as they wish then what happens next. But I argue that if we don't allow all to do as they wish, without causing harm or being malicious, then what is next. You should be allowed to play your stereo, but when it interferes with my privacy you must turn it down. You should be able to practice sex as you wish with with your loved one, but when it starts to corrupt the innocent or goes against your partners wishes you must not continue. You can ride your bike wherever or whenever you want, but when you start placing me or others in harms way you have to stop.

At what point does a tad-pole become a frog Joe? If you give a poor man a penny he will still be poor. But it doesn't follow that if you give a poor man many pennies he will still be poor. There is not always a fine line defining at which point a thing is bad or is good, but there is always a way to see the difference if it is followed to the end.

I love the little GS and this forum.

C.......

[Cal Price]

Joe,

Royalty foxed me for a while there, then I realised we were getting our threads entwined. No a modern country does not need them, this is a point-of-view that, over here, makes me a REPUBLICAN, frightening thought for a secular champaign socialist !

Oh well I think I'll go on my local forum and stir it a bit more about the general election we have on 05-05-05.

[john]

[Cal Price]

Point taken John.

[Anonymous]

Jeff P,

You make an excellent point.  Why ARE people loyal to an organization or a country that is obviously corrupt? A VERY good question...  

If there was a perfect country I think I'd move there.  The US is about as good as you can get in this world.  It's corrupt but toward business.  If business does well, usually the people do well too.  Because business supplies the jobs, the goods, everything we need and want.  The government teaches you that you are free.  You ARE free to work as you wish, spend as you wish, do a lot as you wish, but you're not REALLY free.  You have to follow the laws, of which there are many.  You have to pay taxes.  To sum it up, you are free to make the people who run the country (businesses and government) lots of money.  So, you're not REALLY free but you are closer to it than people in many other countries.

I think that in the very beginning the people who ran things, like the tribal leaders, NEEDED something to keep people in line.  What better than a "God" with the same rules that the chief needed to keep everyone living together in harmony.  You see, it's perfect.  The "God" already was the one responsible for everything that was unknown.  How did the earth get here... God.  How does the sun shine... God.  How did the animals come about... God.  So, if God makes the rules to live by, then they must be important.  I mean people fear an eternity in hell more than a week in the stockade.  I think religion was started as a means of control.  Then the people who kept the "God" stories going, the shamans or priests, realized that THEY were almost as important as the chief.  Woohoo!  Let's build on this...  Religion was born.

Now the church teaches you all this "be good to each other" stuff because they want members.  If the outward appearance of the organization looks nice and friendly you're more likely to want to join up.  But, there are underlying motives to what they preach.  If you don't practice birth control, you get more people who will probably join the church.  If you help the poor, they're grateful and you keep more people alive who can join the church.  All these people will be good little "whatever religion".  It also makes you feel good to be in a large exclusive group.  People want to be included.  Religious groups are ALWAYS looking to increase their numbers.  The more people you have, the more money you can get and the more powerful politically you become.  But I still say that you're being conned.  That many of the leaders are only out for the power.  And the organization is only out for the power.  All the ritual is just trappings, a show to keep you entertained.

Now this doesn't mean that EVERY religious sect is this way.  There are many "non-affiliated" small time churches who are run by people who truly believe in God and what they are teaching.  I'm just talking Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, the biggies.  I'd bet that right from day one they were looking at the power side of things.  At first maybe only to TAKE power from the other churches.

I read a story about the Pope.  I don't know if it was true because I wasn't there.  It struck me...  Here it is:  The Pope was in Africa visiting poor starving children.  What does he do?  He walks down the line praying for them and touching them on the forehead.  Then he leaves.  What is wrong with this story?  Where is the food?  The Catholic church has billions and billions, most likely trillions in assets.  SPEND some of it.  Put your money where your mouth is.  If they are SO into all that love and compassion that they teach why do they hoard like that?  They should be NON-PROFIT giving away everything they get to the needy!

Answer that one people.

luksi,

You also make an excellent point.  It's because when the Spansih arrived in the new world they FORCED their religion on the natives.  What is it, HALF the Catholics live in Central/South America.  Now, how can that be?  They were FORCED to submit to the Spanish.  Convert or die.  Pretty simple choice.  And MANY times there were revolts and the early Conquistadors (conquerers) were all killed by natives who weren't too keen on conversion.  Hence, missions that were really forts.

c,

I'd LOVE it if there weren't any laws, no rules and everyone could be trusted to "self govern" but we ALL know that it just doesn't happen.  Just look at the post in the general forum "loud bikes unite" or something to that effect.  I gather he rides a loud bike and has a band that practices at his house.  I'll tell you what, if I were the neighbor I'd be pissed too.  That  IS the problem, people DON'T care how their actions effect others.  And ghey sex IS corrupting the innocent.  When a alternative lifestyle man guy goes after a straight kid, he's corrupting him.  And it's PROVEN that they are the number 1 spreader of HIV which is also BAD.  Why can't you people admit that???

A tadpole becomes a frog when it's legs grow in.  But a kid becomes an adult when they learn SELF control.  Sometimes that takes a lifetime, sometimes it never happens.

I agree 100% that the line between good and bad is a fine one and it's not always straight, it's oftentimes blurry, and it moves around from time to time.  But, there are definately things that are good and bad for us and condoning unhealthful behavior and allowing 10 million criminals in the country are not good.  I have my feelings of right and wrong and for now, I'm sticking to them.

And come on, a 300lb GS and an 800lb Hog handle the same?  And they're so LOUD.

Everyone...  Go for a nice ride today!

[cernunos]

No no no...I did not say that a "Hog" and a GS "handle" the same. I said my Electraglide was very easy to maneuver and move around. There is a difference...she definitely wouldn't fly through the turns as quick as the Baby GS but with the low center of gravity and the wide buck-horn bars she was child's play to move around at low speeds or up out on the free-way. Very stable. She was even easy to pick up when down on her side. I'm not talking shaZam! here, I have owned both, and the Baby, while lighter, is not as easy to maneuver when you get down to walking speeds. The little twin is a fine machine, I love it, but it does not compare with the experience of owning an old Shovel. Kinda like the difference between an old '69 Chevelle SS and a new Subaru WRX. Much rather have the old SS.

And yes, because of things like the "loudbikes" thread, and the problems caused thereof, we do need laws by "Caesar". It's an unfortunate fact of life that some people, you included, can't just get along and let people live their life.

C.......

[Budrick320]

All I am goin to say is 'read my quote'. Peace

[Anonymous]

If there IS a God and if God is as smart, all knowing, just, etc. as is said about him.  Then he's got to be wise enough to know that not everyone is going to follow the crowd without some REAL evidence.  AND, he CAN'T be that petty, DEMANDING worship from such insignificant beings as ourselves.  We have as much in common with a "God" as an earthworm has with us.  Do YOU demand that THEY worship you?

How can you people believe all that religion crap?  It's ALL just made up stories to keep a hold over you.  Wake up!

[Old Mr. Wilson]

Cernunos! My MAN!!............. Dude........................
Dr. Wilson want's you to back off on the morphine drip.  Then 2 cc's of crystal meth per day for a week. Then let's talk and we'll adjust.

You KNOW I love my "little Baby Suzi Q"!!!!

[RVertigo]

I chose mine because it made the most sense to me.

[pizzleboy]

three simple words...

Born Into It

That isn't the only reason to belong to a religion.