Wet-Riding Technique

[Roadstergal]

Go to a track day and you'll have a date with a wall...

[pandy]

Go to a track day and you'll have a date with a wall...

Walls communicate better than some menz!  

[Alphamazing]

In cars I much prefer to downshift like this...  Press in clutch, shift, pop clutch.  

I did that for a while. I burned out my clutch so damn fast it wasn't even funny. Let me tell you, it's a pain in the ass replacing clutch plates in a FWD car, too.

[RVertigo]

Go to a track day and you'll have a date with a wall...

Why would I take a Hyundai to a track day?   :lol:

[Roadstergal]

I've seen odder - there are twins in our car club who are both excellent drivers, and one of them had some crappy FWD rental that he took to the mini-track session that's the reward for the instructors after the driving school.  Malibu?  Something like that.  I took a ride, and the thing was just sideways all of the way around the track, and he was keeping up with cars a Malibu should never keep up with.

After the session, I looked at the car hood - it was a rainy day, and the hood was just covered with criss-cross mud splats.  Between that and the tire wear, I would love to have seen him return it.   :lol:

[RVertigo]

Malibus can be fun...  Somehow I got all 4 sliding down an on-ramp.   :dunno:

Rental insurance RULES!   :lol:

The Hyundai would be useless on a track...  I'd either get rear ended every time I went into a corner or the front would push through and end up in the wall.

I'd have to get some DAMN sticky tires to keep the front from pushing.

[Roadstergal]

Nope, just a lot more skidpad time.  Understeer is curable with technique.  

[RVertigo]

I know all about understeer...   I've driven lots of FWD and a bug (which would understeer and fishtale at the same time   )...

This thing has the worst I've ever seen...  I have to take ramps and interchanges at only 5 over the suggested speed or the front just floats off into oblivion.  It actually pushes on the freeway going 80.  

But, the damn thing handles great at 110 MPH in a straight. :dunno:

[phire]

I was about to say, but RG beat me.

Rev matching people!

Takes practice, but once you get used to the character of the bike, it becomes second nature.

Is there anything that breaks mechanically when you don't rev-match? At least something common?

[snowhownd]

I was about to say, but RG beat me.

Rev matching people!

Takes practice, but once you get used to the character of the bike, it becomes second nature.

Is there anything that breaks mechanically when you don't rev-match? At least something common?

If I'm not mistaken it is hard on the valves on the engine side (and obviously any hard jolt would impact the drivetrain (clutch, etc.))... but I'm no expert so I could be full of    I think you'd have to be really downshifting hard to hurt things though.

[cobalt135]

Rev matching is where it's at.  It takes some practice for sure to be smooth.  It is almost like a spasm of the throttle hand...you pulled the clutch in and as you are kicking down a gear you blip at the same time then let out the clutch.  Like others said only need to raise the RPM by about 1,000.  Once you get smooth with that then start trying to give front brake while blipping down to turn or stop.   You will probibally be jerky with the front brake at first but you'll eventually smooth it out.  I use index finger and thumb around throttle and the other three fingers  for the brake.  I guess I really don't grip with the index..err, hell I don't know how I do it, it just happens I guess :lol:

Decided to take a pic

[cobalt135]

Is there anything that breaks mechanically when you don't rev-match? At least something common?

Your back tire might wear quicker

[Roadstergal]

Harder on the clutch.

In direct answer to the question, though, possibly your head.

[pandy]

Rev matching is where it's at.  It takes some practice for sure to be smooth.  It is almost like a spasm of the throttle hand...you pulled the clutch in and as you are kicking down a gear you blip at the same time then let out the clutch.  ... :lol: Decided to take a pic

Thank you for the pic and additional description...this is *definitely* going to take some practice for me. Plus, I think I'm going to need to adjust my brake lever, cuz my hand just won't do throttling and braking well at the same time (and my hands aren't small!).

Practice, practice, practice...I was practicing some on today's long ride, but it's gonna take a loooong time to become smooth with this.

Thanks again to everyone for their input (including my bf :kiss:   , who's apparently been trying to tell me this stuff for a while ...good thing I'm good at listening, eh? :lol: ) !!!!  :mrgreen:

[pandy]

In direct answer to the question, though, possibly your head.

Ya...this is kinda the same thing my bf told me....  

[Alphamazing]

Hmm, when I do rev matching, I've still got two fingers on the front brake, index and middle, and blip using the grip of my thumb and other fingers, along with my palm. It's a personal thing, I think; whichever way you feel most comfortable with giving throttle is the way it should be done. I feel most comfortable using the throttle without my index and middle fingers.

[NightRyder]

I just made this up.. off the top of my asleep head.. but..
I think to pratice rev matching, you should:

Get in a high gear with low rpm's
Pull in clutch
wait a sec...
Rev the engine back up (it has fallen now)
Let the clutch out modertly fast.
Review it. Did the engine need to speed up/slow down?
Figure out how much you were off by, and adjust it.
Repeat

Try one gear to the one right below it.
Try so that you don't feel the shift in your butt.
Then try two gears down, etc.

I think it not only makes the shifts smoother, but quicker for larger downshifts. (the engine doesnt have to speed up, you already did it)



/me ponders if that makes sense... gah need sleep...



AH! Here's a good question.. Can you get the engine to accelerate faster then if you were in neutral? Open the throttle, and include a huge downshift  non-revmatch? ie. go fast, pull clutch, let rpm drop, smash open throttle, while poping the clutch in a much lower gear?

Is there a point where not the rpm's but the acceleration of the engine itsself will be a problem?

[pandy]

a whole buncha stuff....

Anyone care to translate this into moto English for me?  :dunno:  :mrgreen:

[RVertigo]

Rev matchiunbg is for people that don;t like new tirews.   :nana:

OK... My drunk ass is foing to sleeps now/.

[Badger]

Note:  the entire downshifting procedure should be one fluid action.

Squeeze the clutch, change gears, give the throttle a sharp little twist and release it (blip it), and let out the clutch.  The whole thing should happen nearly simultaneously and result in a smooth shift.

Some additional thoughts:
Ultimately you're trying to accomplish two things:  get the engine spinning faster (closer to the speed it will be at in the new gear) and also unload the drive bits (if it were in gear it wouldn't be accellerating or engine braking).  

You don't have to pull the clutch all the way to the bar...use the first two fingers on the lever and use your ring finger to limit the travel of the clutch.  Less clutch movement = less 'useless' travel before it engages = finer control.  The closer you are to the correct engine speed, the faster you can reengage the clutch.  Ideally, you want to let the clutch out quickly to get it reengaged before the engine slows down (which would defeat the purpose of the blip).

The 'blip' doesn't have to be extremely accurate...just give it a quick twist and release.  It won't take long to get a feel for how much is enough.  Note that it varies depending on which gear you're in (i.e., 2nd to 1st is a much bigger blip than 6th to 5th) When the clutch engages it should happen smoothly (even if you just dump the clutch)...if it doesn't, reassess your blip.  If the bike hesitates when you release the clutch, give it a bigger twist...if it jerks forward, a little less.  It becomes an exercise in timing.  The result of good timing is smoothness.

Practice doing this while also applying the front brake.  Since you always want to be in the proper gear for the speed you're going, that means downshifting while braking.  Of course, you don't want to be under power and on the brake at the same time, so it's extra important to make sure the throttle is closed when you release the clutch...but you still want to go through the same clutch, shift, blip, release procedure for each gear as you decelerate.  Use two fingers on the brake and practice holding even pressure while you blip the throttle with the other two fingers.  Go through the whole cycle for each gear as you decelerate...three downshifts means three clutch operations.