Never push your bike if you run out of gas.

[sledge]

3imo?
With all due respect I think you will find the first personal comments were made by you and Sesh when you started talking about Grammer and Punctuation.  Besides I dont see this as an argument, I see it as a friendly debate on the subject. If Sesh has had enough all he has to do is say so and I happily will drop it.
Anyway you dont figure in this.........I am talking to the Organ Grinder......not the monkey!

Sesh?
I cant believe you have suggested someone might have accidently knicked  the bag with a knife......you are giving me more ammo`. My comment to that is that it proves just how weak the material is and reinforces the fact it has little strength and is prone to damage from sharp edges/objects, unlike a DOT container. I am tempted to ask you if you think they are stronger when full of gas` but I wont.

You have contradicted the real experts and said its safe. Just prove what you saying is true...back it up...give us some hard evidence instead of dodging the issue, copping-out, and digressing. Tell me where you are getting all this info from. Show me anyone with any real knowledge on the subject who agrees with you because personal opinions count for very little, unless you have a PhD of course.

I am sat next to a Design Engineer (if you choose to believe me) who has a BSc in Plastics Engineering ....he is laughing his **lls off at everything you have said.........and says, Quote:"anyone who tries it deserves to fry" (not that I would wish this to happen to you). Can you blame me for doubting what you say and reinforcing the dangers to others?

[ixolas]

Dead horse + continued beating = this thread.

DROP IT, go drink a bear or something and forget about getting the last word... just drop it.

[The Buddha]

3imo?
With all due respect I think you will find the first personal comments were made by you and Sesh when you started talking about Grammer and Punctuation.  Besides I dont see this as an argument, I see it as a friendly debate on the subject. If Sesh has had enough all he has to do is say so and I happily will drop it.
Anyway you dont figure in this.........I am talking to the Organ Grinder......not the monkey!

Sesh?
I cant believe you have suggested someone might have accidently knicked  the bag with a knife......you are giving me more ammo`. My comment to that is that it proves just how weak the material is and reinforces the fact it has little strength and is prone to damage from sharp edges/objects, unlike a DOT container. I am tempted to ask you if you think they are stronger when full of gas` but I wont.

You have contradicted the real experts and said its safe. Just prove what you saying is true...back it up...give us some hard evidence instead of dodging the issue, copping-out, and digressing. Tell me where you are getting all this info from. Show me anyone with any real knowledge on the subject who agrees with you because personal opinions count for very little, unless you have a PhD of course.

I am sat next to a Design Engineer (if you choose to believe me) who has a BSc in Plastics Engineering ....he is laughing his **lls off at everything you have said.........and says, Quote:"anyone who tries it deserves to fry" (not that I would wish this to happen to you). Can you blame me for doubting what you say and reinforcing the dangers to others?

Oh ... that is your whole argument ...
OK I will add that to my statements about a bag.
The bag may leak when cut with a knife, or scissors or poked with a needle ... OK happy.
BTW I just said it was possible. I also have said the press type tap can flow when ... pressed ... Might as well add that too ... bag may also flow when tap is opened.
And you have experts who have said that its unsafe unless you happen to have a Phd ...
Once again for the hard of comprehension ...

http://www.flymetothemoon.com.au/homebuilding/mylar%20chemical%20properties.pdf

That shows its resistance to chemicals and solvents. I have dunked it in gas and yes its impervious to it in the week it sat there.

http://scholle.com/about/PDFs/Press-Successisinthebag.pdf

That shows its construction details and the fact that its approved for storing and transporting battery acid and bleach and other liquids including hot coffee, pasta sauce  and of course wine.
So, add the 2 statements ... gas is a liquid much like everything else. Gas cant eat bag. So its safe for carrying it.
Please dont stab it with a knife or poke it with a needle ... cos as we all know those things happen evreyday. Sometimes twice a day. Maybe if that's the case, your bike wont be there when you get back with a stabbed gas bag. I guess a plastic can will need to be stabbed a lot harder. But not a problem, the very determined thugs will get the muscle to stab that too I am sure.
Cool.
Srinath.

[3imo]

* 3imo throws monkey poo at sledge

[sledge]

3imo?
Was that humour or sarcasm? either way it was a very good comeback....Respect.

Sesh?
Over here, industry legislation requires us to perform a risk assesment before carrying out a task that may be classed as dangerous, it highlights potential risks and asks you to come up with safe ways of dealing with them. I have had to do about a thousand of them in my time. Personally I will never agree that it is 100% safe, nor will I ever do it myself based on my qualifications experience and training but lets meet halfway and strike a deal. I suggest coming up with and suggesting "The safest and most realistic methods and guidelines"...ie: do`s and dont`s relating to storing fuel in winebags. My concern has always been the safety of others and NOT having the last word in a debate. You cant dissagree that it is risky, but those risks can be minimised.

I will start the ball rolling and say:

"Storing/transporting fuel in a winebag should be seen only as the last possible resort when all other options are impractical or impossible".

Over to you.

[3imo]

Actually I thought your monkey joke was funny.

IMO your posts made it seem that you were taking this too seriously and are only out to make a fool out of a good dude and a valuable member of this forum.

You say it is a friendly debate, then who am I to interfere.

[The Buddha]

<snip>
"Storing/transporting fuel in a winebag should be seen only as the last possible resort when all other options are impractical or impossible".

Over to you.

I dont think this covers it ... Too vague and each persons "last possible" or "impractical" are wildly variable.
Transporting or storing fuel in a wine bag should be done for the shortest period of time required, and contact with hot or sharp objects should be avoided at all costs even when the bag is not in use.
I'd say its common sense, but here it is as a warning.
Lets see what warnings will have to be there on a Plastic can ...
Hot objects, sharp objects, tipping, weight placed on it or hard object impact, open flame near it.
Cool.
Srinath.

[sledge]

Good points Sesh....in addition what about keeping it out of direct sunlight, being aware of drips and if possible keeping the valve uppermost when full in case it does leak? I think it would also be a good idea to write "GAS" on the bag in case the situation arises were someone thinks it is actually full of wine and takes a good old chug on it 

I think disposal could be an issue too.....you would need to make sure when its disposed no-one is going to throw it on a fire or put another liquid in it that could become contaminated

Can I throw it open....anyone else got comments???

[3imo]

**NOTICE**

DO NOT USE WINEBAGS TO STORE OR CARRY FUEL, ESPECIALLY IN A BACKPACK.

If you like you may keep a winebag in your tool kit in case you run out of fuel and need a easy to carry disposable container to move fuel from a freinds bike to yours.  Dispose of the bag immediately and do not use it to transport fuel.

-----
<snip>

[The Buddha]

You wont be keeping it anywhere. Its meant to be carried back to your bike in your hand.
The valve itself is very leak proof, dont ever see how it can leak, the part where valve is inserted into the bag may leak after a few remove and put back in types, but I am yet to have that happen either, but beware of leaks and transport it with valve on top. Easy enough too.
Writing GAS on it, big deal, you'd have filled up say 10-20 mins ago, so you're that forgetful
But all these are comming up on the point of being stupid enough that someone if they get torched by one of those errors, call the darwin awards.
For disposal, I'd put paper towels in it (gas stations have them for spills right by the pumps) and soak up the gas, then take it out, toss the towels and the bag separately.
But Like I said, I still have the bag I soaked. it was dry enough and it cleaned up well enough that isnt not even smelling anymore, but it did smell for a few days while I air dried it.
I have ridden by places that reeked of gasoline, so have several others I am sure ... god knows what was going on in there ...
Yea, keep away from open flames, prolonged sunlight, transport with valve up, write GAS on it and throw it away properly.
I dont think a can is subject to any of these though.
BTW a silver colored bag may resist sunlight better, though I dont buy those personally for non gasoline related reasons - like I hate that wine.
Cool.
Srinath.

[nightrider]

There is only one way to solve this:

http://www.judgejudy.com/SubmitCase/submitcase.asp

[The Buddha]

I am sorry, but JudgyJudy is so ghey ... I mean, watching it is just ghey.
Cool.
Srinath.

[MrDan]

I kind of lost track with all the snarky comments so forgive me if this was already mentioned.  Someone brought in donuts and coffee from Dunkin' last week .. they use similar bags to hold the coffee.  Probably identical to what you're thinking of Srinath, but just thought I'd pass it along.  I've liked the idea from the start ... I'll probably play with the actual functionality of it once nicer weather rolls around.

Much of enjoying life is about calculating risk ... I don't think Srinath is approaching this half-assed ... it's not like he's drinking the wine out of the bag on the way to the gas station.

[Stephen072774]

i learned from my Dad (an engineer) at a very young age to never put gas in anything not meant specifically for gas.  That lesson has served me well over the years and i'm sticking to it.  Now I'm big on personal liberties, and I'd fill up a milk jug or wine container with gas in an emergency, but I wouldn't tell others its ok to do the same.

[OctaneMotorsports]

At the end of the day, it was a suggestion. Simply that, if you have an empty wine bag available to you, then it could be used to fill with fuel in an emergency. Is it dangerous? Possibly. Is it a bad idea? Possibly. Is it your choice? Absolutely. Nobody is making you do anything, it is simply a suggestion. This constant arguing over the logistics of putting fuel in an empty wine bag is ridiculous and unnecessary. Remember that everything is dangerous if you are stupid enough. C'mon guys, I'm fourteen years old and even I'm more mature than that.

[pandy]

At the end of the day, it was a suggestion ... C'mon guys, I'm fourteen years old and even I'm more mature than that.

Out of the mouths of babes (and I mean that in the BEST way  ). You show more sense than many people three times your age, Octane. 

In this case, I think they're just arguing for the sport of it.....Srinath won the last Olympic Arguing Gold Medal...I'll bet ya' didn't know that!   

He even hints at his prowess in his .sig: And Yes arguing is a competetive sport ... 

[Chuckles]

What kind of wine does it come from?  Just Franzia?  Sounds like a good idea and better then hauling around a gas can.  Its not like you need much to get the bike back to the gas station to fill up.  Could always use a big bottle of mountain dew or something with the wide top...  I have no reserve on my bike due to fuel starvation problems.  Installed a pingel tank valve and 5/16 fuel cutoff.  Before that, the bike shuts off/ stalls  on the hw due to lack of fuel.  All I do is pace semis and sports cars but end up at almost wot and sometimes just loose track of mileage due to too much fun riding.  (152?155 jets)

Its funny to read about someone complaining about a suggestion.  Its only offered as an alternative to buying and then transporting a gallon plastic gas can that is way overpriced at any gas station.  Why don't people just say its a good idea, but not for them?  I would trust the mylar over a plastic can made as cheaply as possible.

Would duct tape work as a handle?  I guess you could always ask the teller for a bag...

[The Buddha]

Duct tape handle ... now ... that's redneck ... Some bags have an extra corner that is 4 layers thick and you may string a shoelace through it, though I've never tried it myself. I was thinking of a cloth bag when I said it, and those are sorta common in injun housholds, but prolly hard to find in the normal western household.
BTW The redneckiest thing I have ever seen ... absolutely ... was in New york city, messenger types had a set of elephant grips made out of duct tape. Un freaking beliveable.
Franzia is almost the only brand of wine I buy and they all have the same twist type cap and clear translucent bag. I have seen shiny bags with the press type cap and I have experimented standing on those when they were inflated too (vella or some other brand of wine almaden maybe) ... but I gave up on the wne and I dont have the bags at this time (that I remmeber anyway) ... so I guess Franzia (YMMV at your neck of the woods, cos I do believe they can swap them about - after all you're buying wine, not the tap or bag). Maybe Vella has a patent on their tap Dont they write crap about air entry or somehting on their boxes.
MrDan: How would you know I wasn't drinking out of the bag on the way to the gas station ...  ... or for that matter ... back from the gas station ...    ...
Cool.
Srinath.

[MrDan]

MrDan: How would you know I wasn't drinking out of the bag on the way to the gas station ...  ... or for that matter ... back from the gas station ...    ...
Cool.
Srinath.

True true .... damn - now I want a drink too. 

[pandy]

It's not a real argument if Srinath is the only one arguing!  Someone fire him up again!