Would you recommend an SV650 as a starter bike?

[CirclesCenter]

A busa is a good starter bike if the rider isn't a twat...but most riders.....

I disagree. One wrong move in second gear and you've got a front wheel that believes it's a bird. (Or one fully intentional move after you get used to it. Not that I'd do it...  )

Yes the bike is comfortable, predictable and extremely well mannered. That doesn't change the 160hp commanded by an inexperienced right wrist. It's not a question of being an ass or not, it's a question of balancing the throttle input and the fact that the Busa has MOUNTAINS of power on tap that even with a few degrees of throttle to much can very quickly become WAY too much.

The power amplifies any error that may be made on the throttle.


That being said if you pulled the plug boots on two of the cylinders it would work out great.

[coyotee]

to answer you question.. yes an SV650 is a decent beginner bike. more power than a gs,  but if your friend is a responcible rider he shouldnt have a problem with it.

[Alphamazing]

From SVRiders:

http://forum.svrider.com/index.php?topic=72320.0

Two schools of thought here.

The first (as usual) is the guys who have never ridden anything but an SV650, chiming in how it's the ideal beginner bike.  Of course, they have no other experience to compare it to, and so by definition have a limited perspective.

Then there are the old farts like me.  People who started out on horrible old bikes like CB360s and KZ400s and beat up dirt bikes held together with coat hangers and spit.  They'll tell you that limited horsepower and mild manners are the new rider's best friend.  And they'll have the perspective to back it up.

The problem here is that there aren't a whole lot of genuine learner bikes on the market today.  You can choose from tiny chopperettes like the 250 Rebel or 250 Virago, and a couple of smaller sport bikes like the GS500 or EX500.  From there you jump immediately to larger (650-2000cc) cruisers, hypersports (600-750-1000cc) and some large displacement dual-sports.  The SV650 somehow falls into the gap that spans the two, and by default becomes the "beginner" bike that you supposedly won't outgrow.

A little historical perspective.  When I started riding in 1977, the biggest, meanest, fastest bikes on the market were the GS1000, KZ900, and  XS1100.  The SV650 will outrun them all.  This so-called "beginner" bike (and commonly dismissed as a "girl's bike") is quicker and faster than the fastest production bikes on the planet, circa 1977.  Sure, it's no great shakes compared to current literbikes, but that's simply a matter of engineering progress, which hasn't been accompanied by a similar improvement in human reflexes and skills.

You can learn to ride on an SV650.  Just realize that you're potentially making the learning process more difficult and dangerous than it needs to be.  The problem with learners is that they're, well, learners.  They'll make the usual, expected beginner's mistakes.  The idea is to minimize the consequences of those mistakes.  That isn't necessarily easy when you have 70 horsepower and a bunch of torque waiting for nothing more than a quarter turn of the throttle.

There's a lot to be said for a bike that won't unintentionally wheelie or send you into someone's living room if you make a common newbie mistake.  Yes, people will argue that "the throttle works both ways" but here again you're learning a whole new set of skills.  Modulating a throttle and clutch simultaneously while maintaining balance and teaching your feet to shift and apply brakes, while scanning for traffic and idiots who're too busy yakking on their cel phones to see you can add up to a whole lot of stuff to concentrate on.  The idea is to not add an extra level of complexity and detract  from what should be a fun and enjoyable process.

This is why so many of us, um, experienced riders recommend a real beginner bike for beginners.  Something with limited potential to punish you for the inevitable newbie error.  Something like an EX250 or CM400/450 or GS500 or EX500 or a 350cc dual-sport.  Something that will chug along no matter how badly you botch your clutch engagement.  A bike that won't fling you into places you don't want to be if you're too enthusiastic or ham-fisted with the throttle.  A bike that won't cost you $300 if (when) you drop it backing out of a parking space.  Heck, you can pick up a good beginner bike for well under $1000.  This leaves plenty of money for other essentials, like riding gear and taking the MSF course.  A lot of new riders object to the idea of having a somewhat beat up bike to ride around on.  They want to look cool and figure that they'll be looked down upon by other riders for having a bike that isn't as state-of-the-art as what everyone else is riding.  The problem with this sort of thinking is that pretty much everyone drops their first bike.  That shiny new bike will really show off the scratches and dents that come with learning.

Remember that military pilots start out in single-engined, propeller-driven trainers, not F-16s.  Kenny Roberts teaches aspiring road racers to find the limits of a bike's potential by sticking them on 125cc dirt bikes and sending them out on a flat track.  A smaller, less-powerful bike is much more forgiving of newbie mistakes, and will give you much more warning before it reaches its limits.  A modern sport bike (SV650 included) will simply spit you off into the weeds once you reach those limits.

I can pretty much guarantee you that if you spend a year on a true beginner bike, and learn to ride it to its limits, and then move up to an SV650, you'll be a better, more capable rider than someone who started out on and spent the same amount of saddle time on an SV650.  And when you do step up to the SV, you'll be far more capable of using it to its full potential, because you'll have safely learned what it feels like when a bike is approaching its limits.

For the record, I've owned larger, more powerful, faster bikes than my SV650, but none of them were as fun to ride.  And I currently own and ride a couple of other older, slower, less-capable bikes.  There's a lot to be said for flogging an old, slow, poor-handling bike to its limits.  Lots of fun there, without having to be concerned about getting ticketed.  And, truth be told, after riding them for a week or so and getting back onto my SV, I have to re-acclimate to the SV's hyperresponsiveness.  No more full-throttle blasting away from stop lights.  Remember to only use two fingers for applying the brakes.  Use lighter, more subtle inputs.  Regardless of what the magazines or websites or your friends might say, the SV is plenty capable, and capable of getting the new rider in way over his head. 
There's also a lot to be said for embarrassing guys on 600cc supersports when you leave them behind in the twisties on something like an EX250.  Horsepower and weight aren't necessarily your friend. 

If you've got dirt bike riding experience, if you've had a year or two on a smaller bike, if you've additionally gotten the MSF course under your belt, you'll have a blast on an SV.  Short of this, however, you may not be doing yourself any favors.  Not trying to be dramatic here, just honest in passing along what I've learned from almost 30 years of motorcycling.

[Jake D]

That was well written and probably the best advice.  But that being said, the SV isn't much more powerful than a GS. 

And I should know.   Sure I owned a GS but I learned to ride on an 2003 SV650S.  I really don't know how else to tell you guys.  I've done this very thing, this thing that is being questioned in this thread.  I did it.  It was easy.  I never got in trouble with the power.  The SV just isn't powerful enough to spit you off into the weeds (unless MAYBE you weight like 130 pounds).

But sure.  Maybe I'm wrong.  I'm not anybody's mommy.   

[NiceGuysFinishLast]

I DO weigh 130lbs... So does Brian..

[Jake D]

And lets not forget I crashed that SV.  But, hey.  One of those life's lessons. 

[GeeP]

Nice find Alpha. 

The question isn't so much "Can it be done?"  The question is, "Is it advisable?"  We're all perfectly capable of sticking our hands into an operating meat grinder, but it isn't the best thing for our hands. 

Similarly, it's perfectly possible to ride a Hayabusa as a first bike.  I know of at least one person who has.  He claims to have 20,000 miles of commuting experience, yet his posts show that he does not understand the basics of motorcycle dynamics.  Because he doesn't have a firm foundation of skills, the bike or his environment will eventually write a check his skills can't cash.

[RVertigo]

My buddy started on an SV650 and he's only crashed once...     And I can totally out-ride his ass in the twisties... Unless it's night time, 'cause his headlight is way better. 

So...  It's the same as it ever was.  If you want to be a good rider, start on a smaller bike...  Learn to ride...  Learn to carry your speed through the corners...  Learn to hang off so you can corner faster...

But, if you don't want to be a good rider and you want to jump on your rocketship and blast off in a straight line...  Take out a good insurance policy and get a SuperSport.

I went on a road trip with an SV650 and a H#nda 919...  The only time I had trouble keeping up was when we were near the top of the mountain pass going up a steep hill at 90 MPH....  And even then I caught up in the corners.  And on a day trip through different mountain pass, I had to wait for everyone to catch up...  'cause they didn't want to go more than 20 over the limit through the twisties.     Stupid Fast, Smart Slow...

I'm walking (or riding) proof that even the GS can get you into plenty of trouble...  And Yes...  A good rider on a GS is faster than a bad rider on a 600rr.

[CirclesCenter]

I'm walking (or riding) proof that even the GS can get you into plenty of trouble...  And Yes...  A good rider on a GS is faster than a bad rider on a 600rr.

Or a bad rider on a Busa. 

[RVertigo]

My grandfather is faster than a bad rider on a 'busa...  They start out fast, but .01 seconds later they're not moving at all.

[The Buddha]

The SV I had just felt really really chintzy ... it was the 1/2 fairing 1st generation one that was exceptionally well kept. In contrast a GS feels absolutely top shelf. Just my .02.
Cool.
Srinath.

[Jake D]

I like how so many people on this site have convinced themselve that they are the most awsome riders because they started out on a GS or still ride one.  It is also interesting that so many people on this site have convinced themselves that anybody that rides a 600 or bigger can only go fast in a straight line.  I know I'll get flamed for this.  But somebody needs to explain to me how 9 times out of 10 a guy on a GS can own everybody in the twisties.   

[RVertigo]

Come out to Seattle and ride with me and my buddies...  Even if you can own me in the twisties, I can still own them in the twisties.   


I think the real reason is that I'm a little crazy...   

[NiceGuysFinishLast]

I wouldn't say I can own people. But I have walked away from guys on SV650s and R6s in the twisties. Not because I am the supreme end all and be all of motorcyclists, but because they're guys who jumped to bigger bikes without mastering the basics of riding first, and thus, I can outride them on the technical stuff. Of course, I've been walked all over by a guy on an rz350.. holy crap, he's one of the fastest riders I've ever met... and the smell from his 2 stroke RZ was awesome to follow around all day!

[Jake D]

So do you think there are guys on the R6 forum that ask questions like, "I consistently get beat in the twisties by guys with 50 hp bikes that have late 80's suspension technology, steel frames, and sport touring tires.  Is the R6 only fast in a straight line or is it me?"    Or "Bike Won't Turn, What to Do - FAQ". 

[NiceGuysFinishLast]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA......  best threads evar!

[3imo]

I am the most awsome rider because I started out on a GS and still ride one.  It is commom knowledge that anybody that rides a 600 or bigger can only go fast in a straight line.  9 times out of 10 a guy on a GS can own everybody in the twisties.  Hands down.

What? 

[Stephen072774]

I was so fast on my gs500 that chuck norris told me to get a 400 because I made him look bad

[tussey]

I was so fast on my gs500 that chuck norris told me to get a 400 because I made him look bad

haha....stupid... 

[RVertigo]

To give you an example Jakey...  My buddy that lives in Spokane got pulled over and ticketed for going 90+ in a 60...  But, when I was talking to him about countersteering, he told me that he doesn't do that.

I asked how he turns the bike and he told me "leaning works..."