how long should it take to warm up?

[debtman7]

Against the advice of everyone in the entire world, I was going to play with my gs in the cul de sac to start to get a little familiar with throttle/clutch control even though my MSF course is still 2 weeks away...

One thing I noticed after firing it up tonight is that even after around 5 minutes of idling in the garage, if I turn the choke all the way off, it dies. If I keep the tiniest bit of choke on it idles around 1500 fine. Should it take longer than 5 minutes in 75 degree weather to be able to shut the choke off? Maybe I just need to adjust the idle? It also seemed a little rough, it idled mostly steady but every now and then would jump up maybe 500 RPM's. Normal or a problem? It's still got stabilized fuel in the tank, would that contribute to this?

[jordan172005]

I don't know how long it should take to warm up if it's just sitting there. I usually just give mine a little bit of gas and press start and she'll fire up. Then I hold it at about 5k for ~10seconds and then I go.

[groff22]

5 minutes is enough... too much actually... Should be ready to go in a minute or so... Check spark plugs first to see what condition they are in... It will tell you if you have engine problems... But I bet your carburetor jets are clogged...  Clogged, loose, or damaged jets will produce symptoms like this. What year is your bike and was the bike sitting for any lengthly period of time?

Cheers,
J

[JamesG]

Check the plugs to see their condition. Do you know how to read plugs?

Could be just sitting around and/or short bits of running have fouled the plugs. A good long ride usually cleans them up, assuming your jetting is right and nothing else is wrong.

At 75 degrees, you should be able to fire up the bike with the choke on and in the time it takes to get your gear on > 1 minute, she should be warm enough to turn the choke off. When going off choke you might have to give it a litttle throttle to keep it from dying, thats the nature of carbs...

Oh and don't drive with the choke on, that screws up the mixture and makes it run too rich, which can lead to fouling.

[debtman7]

It's a 96 with 3600 miles so it's had plenty of sitting around. Replacing spark plugs is next on my list of things to do, haven't looked at them yet. Any odds a can of seafoam will improve the situation? I'd rather not dig into the carbs yet if I can avoid it... I was planning on doing spark plugs and checking valve clearance in the next few weeks. But how do I know if there's a problem or if the idle just needs adjusted?

[debtman7]

Ok, just pulled a plug:



Any thoughts? Doesn't look good to me, but I don't know what it tells me about what I should do.

Could it just be running rich from the tank of gas with stabil? Or maybe I just need new spark plugs?

[groff22]

Yeah seafoam, I've heard it works good but haven't tried it... I have had luck with PJ1 Carb and Choke Cleaner... spray it into the carburetor throat and worked the rubber diaphram up and down a few times. Worked great if you're in a rush and it's pretty inexpensive. I've used it to solve similar problems on a handful of ATV/Quads...

Linky:
http://www.cyclegear.com/spgm.cfm?L1=52&L2=&L3=&L4=&item=TUC_53-6070&tier2=275 -- You can get it at pretty much any automotive store.

You'll still have to take off the airbox/airfilter to get to the carb intake mind you ... and there is really no substitute for a good ol' carb scrubbing!

Cheers,
Jeff

[groff22]

You might want to check the carb/jet settings...  Read http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/tech/motorcycle_jet_kits_carburetion/

and http://cgi.stanford.edu/~sanjayd/gs500/Upgrades/Rejetting

[mach1]

Ok, just pulled a plug:



Any thoughts? Doesn't look good to me, but I don't know what it tells me about what I should do.

Could it just be running rich from the tank of gas with stabil? Or maybe I just need new spark plugs?

Carbon fouled plugs (slow-speed riding, plug heat range too cold, weak ignition, or rich misture) pick your problem and work with it. Im assuming your running rich bit that's just me.

[debtman7]

Ok so basically, I'm going to need to take the carbs apart and clean them? Or are there other things that could cause this? Or other things I can check?

I have no idea what I'm doing here...

Anyone want to come to central ohio and help me with carb cleaning, I've got kegs of homebrew on tap

[gsJack]

That plug could be fouled like that just from keeping the choke on too long to keep the bike idling.  Adjust the idle speed first and see if you can get it idling right.  I can just reach under there and adjust the idle while sitting on the bike, too simple.

Leaving the choke on makes the engine run rough and idle rough.  My 97 would die after a couple blocks in warm weather coming to a stop if I left the choke on, flooded it out.

Try the easy stuff first before tearing the carbs apart. 

[debtman7]

That plug could be fouled like that just from keeping the choke on too long to keep the bike idling.  Adjust the idle speed first and see if you can get it idling right.  I can just reach under there and adjust the idle while sitting on the bike, too simple.

Leaving the choke on makes the engine run rough and idle rough.  My 97 would die after a couple blocks in warm weather coming to a stop if I left the choke on, flooded it out.

Try the easy stuff first before tearing the carbs apart. 

Ok, I'll try bumping the idle up. I guess the question would be, if I do that and can get a stable idle out of it, does that mean the carbs are ok? Or if I have a plugged pilot jet, would I be unable to get it to idle by bumping up the idle speed? This is my first experience with carbs, no idea what to look for here

[debtman7]

Ok I adjusted the idle screw. Turned it maybe 1 or a little more turns counter clockwise and adjusted it for idle at 1200 RPM with no choke. It idles ok with this set up, I can idle with no choke on and it more or less idles fine. It does jump around over a 100-200 RPM range while idling, although this diminished the more it idles, but I don't know if that's normal or not.

I can get on the throttle and it revs freely, no backfiring, stuttering, missing, hesitation, etc.

Given that should I assume the idle was just off and the carbs are likely ok?

[gsJack]

I would assume that it well might be as good as new shortly. 

I bought a used 85 Nighthawk 650 some years ago and parked the CM400A that I had been riding, just parked it in the corner of the garage and left it sitting for 2 years.  Then with about 50k miles on the NH it started smoking when hot and really was bad in summer traffic so I decided to get that old CM400 running, licensed, and insured again.

Wouldn't start jumping battery with car and we opened the carb drain plugs and the gas had jelled, it oozed out like white molassas and took some time to get the not so fresh gas from the tank coming thru.  Then began cranking again and after much cranking a neighbor walked over and gave it a shot of starter fluid and it started and ran.

That bike was a bit rough for awhile as I used it some and pretty soon it smoothed out and was as good as ever.  It had 84k miles on it then and when I traded that NH in on the 97 GS500 the CM became my winter bike for a few years.  That CM had 98k miles on it when I got the 02 GS and gave it to a friend, it has over 100k miles on it now and still runs as good as new.

I'm one who is not too quick to tear a carb apart now, used to half century ago when gas was different.  Todays gasolines have a fair amount of cleaners in them to keep fuel injectors functioning and if the passages in carbs are not fully plugged up, I think they will clean up nicely with some regular use.  And those gas fouled plugs will clean up too.

Just my opinion, other opinions may vary.   

[debtman7]

yeah, my only concern is the fact that it's 11 years old with 3600 miles and I have no idea how well it was stored other than knowing that the previous owner (who had it a whopping 4 months) stored it properly. Since it idles ok, I'll plan on the seafoam method of cleaning I guess As long as it idles ok it's worth a shot. Since we're just learning to ride though, if it develops other issues I'll have to take the carbs apart. I don't think learning on a poor running bike is a good idea

[Flywheel]

I had the same warm-up problem with my own gs500 last season. Being new to motorcycles (and air cooled motors), I initially thought the older technology just needed the extra time, because of the cold. As spring and summer progressed, however, it was clear that there was something wrong--the engine would stall if it didn't get five minutes of choke, even on the hottest days of the year. The plugs looked normal and the bike ran fine afterwards, so I wasn't quite sure what to make of it. I eventually pulled the carbs out, but the float bowls, jets and butterfly valves were perfectly clean. Synchronizing them proved impossible; I got different, unstable readings over the course of three nights, with combustion gases backfiring through the left vacuum port. The only thing left was to check valve shim clearances. The left exhaust valve shim was quite loose (~0.10 mm). This led me to replace the shim with a thicker one and...presto! The GS fired up immediately, with half the usual amount of choke. It took a few minutes to re-balance the carburetors properly, after which I let the bike cool down. Further restarts were the same: only a minute or two was needed to sort the engine out. Cutting the choke didn't stall things, either--the RPMs merely dropped to ~1000. 

[TheUnHun]

MY "new" 1996 GS500E would demand 15 minutes of choke with the original pilot pilot jets.  I put n the 120 pilot jets and one washer as detailed elsewhere on this site and it now starts and idles happily after a minute or two of partial choke.  Do it now and it will make your early ride exercises MUCH easier, since you will have a bike that can actually idle.

Jeffrey

[debtman7]

I'd like to rejet it, but I've got enough to do and don't want to add the carbs in yet I'm saving that for next year. Since I've adjusted the idle screw, it now fires up with half choke and after 30-60 seconds I can turn the choke off and idle it at 1200 rpms. So, hopefully, that's all I needed to do. Hopefully