Regarding obama

[trumpetguy]

well i dont support wikipedia on this, mainly because it can be edited at will BY ANYONE  , got a link to a neutral source?, you are the one making the pro obama claims

These are not Pro-Obama claims.  It's about whether Al Qaeda existed in Irag before we "liberated" them.  The sources are there in the Wiki article.  If you need me to hold your hand and link them here, ask McCain. 

Oh, that's right, he's computer illiterate.  In 2008. 

[spc]

And I'm saying, regardless of Wiki, everything I've seen has shown a 'grudging friendship' between the two.  Neither wanted to be openly viewed as helping the other but they both were of use to the other.  There's a reason Al Q wanted to overthrow Saddam, but never did.

[trumpetguy]

And I'm saying, regardless of Wiki, everything I've seen has shown a 'grudging friendship' between the two.  Neither wanted to be openly viewed as helping the other but they both were of use to the other.  There's a reason Al Q wanted to overthrow Saddam, but never did.

Could be a grudging friendship, since they're both Sunni.  And Saddam kept down a Shia majority. 

But there was no active Al Qaeda cell before 2003, and there was NO connection to 9/11 with Iraq.  We had no reason to go there other than the false reasons which were manufactured by the neocons, fed to Congress, and willingly spread by a compliant press.

[bettingpython]

Yes there were connections between Iraq and Al Quaeda, Al Quaeda used Iraqi state owned banks to launder money.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/05/08/uttm/main552868.shtml

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/hosadw.htm

[trumpetguy]

Yes there were connections between Iraq and Al Quaeda, Al Quaeda used Iraqi state owned banks to launder money.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/05/08/uttm/main552868.shtml

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/hosadw.htm

A May 2003 civil case using now discredited "evidence" and a Spring 2003 "we think Saddam supported Al Qaeda" quote?  That's the evidence?  Come on.  That has not been proven and probably wasn't proven because it couldn't be.  Don't you think Bush an Cheney and all their echo chamber would be abuzz with real evidence if it existed?

The alleged meeting in Prague discredited by the agent involved in Dec 2003:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=980CE1D6153CF930A25751C1A9659C8B63

Bush denying Iraq and 9/11 connection in September 2003:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/attack/140133_bushiraq18.html

My statement that Al Qaeda didn't exist in Iraq until 2003 (after we invaded) still stands.  Saddam was trying to get money out of Iraq for his "retirement" in exile.  I doubt that he would have been stupid enough to launder money for terrorists.  Even if he did, they were not active in his country.  With Al Qaeda's connections in UAE and other Arab countries, they didn't need Saddam's banks.

[pkhoff]

So my friend are you saying that because you don't want to pay $4 a gallon for gasoline you are simply going to kill civilians, destroy peoples homes, their lives, blue on blue kill british troops. So you can fill your car up for cheap??? My god its a f%$king good job i don't live by you because you deserve one hell of a slapping.

No, I'm not saying anything of the sort, I am merely pointing out that of the many reasons/excuses given for going to war, securing oil is no less legitimate than many others.

Yes, it is a good f%$king job you don't live near me, in the U.S we are still allowed to defend ourselves against assault.

Its people like you that give America a bad name in the world. You have it in your head that you can storm accross the world taking what you want to make your own pidly life better. I think even American troops would want to pay you a visit. Loosing their lives just because you think it is good for their lives to be put on the line to satisfy yourself.

Again, I'm not advocating war for the purpose of taking oil, or any other reason for that matter. Though I do believe that in some cases war is a necessary evil.  I am pointing out that when someone spits, "This war is all about oil", that person should try going without and then see how they feel about it.

I think you are beginning to see my point. Going to war over oil has HUGE negative connotations. This is a world economy. Its not like theres no oil out there for you. Its just you have to pay for it. Like the country which is farming it is having to pay for that. You buy it off them. You dont just go in and take it and destroy everything on the way.

Again, I said nothing about "just taking it". Going to war, period, has HUGE negative connotations.

You are not going to starve, you are not guna run out of special 'filter water' and yes you will be able to get to work and have a job there. It will all just cost abit more. As the worlds supply of oil goes down, demand will increase. Same for everyone - your no different. Infact you pay about half the price that we do over here in Europe for the benefits oil brings us. So go away and rethink what you just said.

Yes, the supply will decrease, and the demand will increase, especially as China becomes more industrialized. I understand this, that's why I think alternative energy sources should be explored and expanded. One day there will be no more oil, or so little of it that the price will be so high that only the richest can afford it.

Can i please just come and stangle you?

I really wish you wouldn't, here in the U.S. we are not required to submit to robbers and thugs, and it likely wouldn't turn out well for you.  OTOH, I'm not sure what "stangling" entails, I might like it. 

[bettingpython]

OKay lets discuss some of Obama's campaign points direct from his website.

"Obama will ban racial profiling by federal law enforcement agencies and provide federal incentives to state and local police departments to prohibit the practice."

So your telling me that you support a cndidate who wants to fairly and eqitably let Arabs from suspect nations ithrough our borders? Manpower resources are limited and must be effectively targeted at the highest risk groups to attempt to catch potential terrorists seeking to enter our country. Otherwise we would need a huge expansion in federal law enforcement.

"Extend and Expand Unemployment Insurance: Barack Obama believes we must extend and strengthen the Unemployment Insurance (UI) program to address the needs of the long-term unemployed, who currently make up nearly one-fifth of the unemployed and are often older workers who have lost their jobs in manufacturing or other industries and have a difficult time finding new employment"

Yes theres a great Idea let's keep paying people who are unemployed, who pays for unemployment insurance? The employers? No the employed do, every matching dollar of unemployment insurance paid by your employer is a dollar not being paid to you. Let's invest in something more meaningful such as job retraining programs. Let's get the illegals out of the country so that they don't take jobs for substandard pay. Plumbing is a very unpleasent job, licensed plumbers make good money, why? because it compensates them to what is oftentimes a literally shi@@y job. Ditch diggers used to make a good wage until a crew of illegals could be hired to do it for less.

Ahh yes one of my favorite subjects. Labor, minimum wage and unionization having had a herd of strippers try to use collective bargaining on me when I ran a bar this is one of my pet peeves.

What does raising the mandated minimum wage do? Employers affected by this are usually highschool or entry level jobs, low pay is an incentive to do something more with your life. It was for me anyway. Suddenly McDonalds and other industries which were traditionally in this category focus on a lean manufacturing model to maximize production and minimize employee staff numbers thus lessening the financial burden on the corporation and increasing the number of welfare recipients getting unemployment, whisch is even lesss than minimum wage. Through a combination of education and hard work its been over 15 years since I made anywhere close to Minimum wage, if a highschool dropout like me can bust his ass and get to where I am there's lotsa people out their who can do it. shaZam! pay is it's own incentive instead he is saying it's okay not to hope dream be an individual and aspire to be more and pursue hapiness, we'll give you more money to stay where you are at.

You know maybe I should be pro Obama because I could easily have been replaced in almost every Job I have ever held if just a few more peopel would apply themselves. Never mind it's okay to live off the government handouts that way you don't compete with me in the job market.

[bettingpython]

Found it!!!

Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama also favors commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. He supports closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. He also supports making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

Magazines for hundguns with capacities in excess of 10 rounds were banned under this act for all but LEO's,

And the Tiahart ammendment only forces non federal agencies to get their information from the federal government, it restricts gun trace information from frivilous uses and public release intentional or accidental to nefarious individuals.

This is the cry of the gun banning left, we support you but let's be reasonable. Soon reasonable will mean you can own an airsoft pistol only if it's registered federally.

[bettingpython]

YES WE CAN CONSUME LESS, LIVE ON LESS HAVE FEWER POSSESIONS AND LIVE IN SMALLER HOMES THAN OUR PARENTS GENERATION!!



Do as I say not as I do I am better than you.

[yamahonkawazuki]

know what i might just stock up on clips higher than 10 rounds. cause if this goes through ( a hard thing to do, BUT possible.) those currently in possesion, usually are grandfathered in, and values would adjust accordingly, if he tries to take my guns away, he wont succeeed. they wont be found. ( except by me )

[jdanna]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/afghanistan.asp

welcome to the internet
im writing in ron paul anyway.

[yamahonkawazuki]

i still wonder why he didnt visit teh military hospital in germany?, yeah he couldnt do it as a campaign visit, but hell he can use his own fundage, and go there himself. and leave the press behind. what gives with that?