Calling all welders.

[The Buddha]

OK how do I weld teeth back on to a gear ... its fairly light duty ... but well its broken ... so maybe its not ...
However the POS breaks all the time ... rather weld it, and when it dies ... weld again ... till I cant weld any more.
Anyone know how they can be welded.
Cool.
Buddha.

[Danny500]

I don't know where I've seen it but someone actually used 2 bolts to replace teeth. What you do is remove all that's left of the tooth and drill 2 holes where the tooth was. Then, tap them and thread in 2 bolts. Next, grind the bolt heads down to match the profile of the original teeth. Just make sure the holes are far enough apart to ensure the bolt heads don't hit each other...

I'll see if I can't find that post...

Dan

[ohgood]

OK how do I weld teeth back on to a gear ... its fairly light duty ... but well its broken ... so maybe its not ...
However the POS breaks all the time ... rather weld it, and when it dies ... weld again ... till I cant weld any more.
Anyone know how they can be welded.
Cool.
Buddha.

c'mon, describe the stresses / uses of this gear a little ! if it's truly low stress/torque, BRAZE IT UP BUTTERCUP and recut it, it will last a long, long time.

side notes:

1) did you preheat before welding ?
2) did you stress relieve after welding ?
3) c'mon, really, what's it for / how much torque/speed/uses ?
4) don't forget the power of a little brazing + an angle grinder for cleanup.


if it's not a gear that will take 3 days of setup and digging through the Machinist's Bible to make, send it to me and i'll make a new one or three.



PICTURES SS PICTURES !

[gearman]

I agree with ohgood, brazing would better than steel. How are you re-shaping the tooth?

[The Buddha]

Butter cup ...  ...

http://fiche.ronayers.com/Index.cfm/Module/Main/TypeID/26/Type/Motorcycle/MakeID/2/Make/Suzuki/YearID/27/Year/1986/ModelID/6281/Model/LS650P_SAVAGE/GroupID/257135/Group/STARTER_CLUTCH

That is the part. The big one on the crank which is part of item 5. One reason I wont buy it from suzuki is ... its sold only with that ring and the multi teeth thing, the actual starter clutch) which never ever breaks, is very very gentle on this gear, so gentle in fact that after 30-40K you cant even see wear on the part where it grips ... and I have one of those lying around in my garage already from the one I replaced 2 years ago. BTW that pic is wrong, the bolt part 7 goes the other way and bolts the starter clutch to the back of the rotor magnet.

Anyway, make 1 or 3 ... I'll gladly send ya. Google said I can just stick weld it. Sheilded metal arc weld ... stick right. BTW its 7mm wide, ~167.1 outside dia. ~80 teeth. Send me an approximate $ ... I am trying to match something else ... 1500 intruder maybe, volusia maybe ...
Cool.
Buddha.

[The Buddha]

OK I am near about certain this POS is an off the shelf item ...
The thing 1/2 inch away from the teeth has a tear in it ... its freaking too weak to hold up ... the teeth area is thicker than the part between the hub and teeth.
Anyway ... The outside diameter is 6.5 inches. The C to C distance between teeth is 1/4 inch. The thinckness is 7mm but its also 9/32's and I think it should be that same thickness all the way across ... so it wont tear at the thin part by the holes. Anyway ... what is the things root diameter and what is the diametral pitch. I believe its a 14.5 angle cut.
I get a good clean number for that and I prolly buy off the shelf from boston gear types.
Cool.
Buddha.

[gearman]

A 2 module-80 tooth spur gear will have an OD of 6.456"[164] and root diameter of 6.095"[154.8]. When you say angle cut, do you mean the teeth are cut at an angle other than 90 degrees to the sides (helical gear)?
          _____________                    _________________
Helical /////////////////             Spur |||||||||||||||||||||

If it is a helical gear, you may have a hard time finding an aftermarket replacement.

[The Buddha]

Straight cut ... if it was helical I wont even try this ... and I meant pressure angle, I believe its 14.5 degrees, not 20 or 25.
OK so 6.456 and root dia 6.095 and it prolly has 6.25 pitch dia ... I approximated to that ... and 80 teeth make it 12.8 for diametral pitch.
Its possibly metric then. Somehow I am certain someone who knows this will identify what it is in a fraction of a second. I am measuring, correcting, re measuring and making myself crazy.
It is a dead even 7mm thick. So a mod 2 80 tooth metric gear should have a diametral pitch of 160 and an OD of 167.1 ... cos I am measuring 167.1 mm OD. I have not tired root diameter yet.
Cool.
Buddha.

[gearman]

It's probably 20 deg. pressure angle due to the fact it mates with a pinion that has a low number of teeth. 14.5 deg. would produce severe undercut in the pinion making it weak. It's also possible that they increased the pinion dia. [long addenum] and decreased the gear dia. to make the pinion stronger. If so, standard gears won't work.
Standard 2 module pinion dia. will be #teeth+2 / 12.7

Check out p/n ss2-80 on this page:
http://www.qtcgears.com/RFQ/default.asp?Page=../KHK/newgears/KHK046.html

The other possibilty is that it is a special pitch. Not unusual when a manufacturer is making tens or hundreds of thousands of a gear set.

[The Buddha]

It may be a special pitch. Its definetly not 164, Its 167mm atleast OD.
This things pinion is smaller than a GS pinion if you can ever believe that. Tiny quarter sized pinion. Now if its a 20 degree pitch ... You know I can get pics for you. GS pinion will mate to it ... so gimme a few mins.
Cool.
Buddha.

[The Buddha]

http://picasaweb.google.com/srinath.the.man/SavageStarterClutch#

That is the pics. Thanks guys. Now it looks like 20 degree and then the 167.1 OD definetly says its a weird pitch.
Cool.
Buddha.

[sledge]

Doubt you will find one of them off the shelf from anywhere other than Suzuki, esp` one with a widened boss machined out to accept that needle-roller. You could fill the Che Stadium with Gear-wheels and still not have the right one.

As the Maching Dept have already confirmed, braizing and recutting is an accepted reclaimation technique for small lightly loaded gears but even then its far from simple unless you have got the kit to do it as these pics show......

http://www.rlfox.com/metal/gear/index.html

You might find someone prepared to take the job on but it will probably cost as much as a new one and it will never be as reliable as the OEM part............get your hand in your pocket and buy a new one 

[The Buddha]

Sledge dude ... that welding and recutting I almost instinctively knew will work ... and a web search confirmed that it can be stick welded.

http://books.google.com/books?id=tsFoJjMU4dgC&pg=PA91&lpg=PA91&dq=welding+to+a+gear+teeth&source=web&ots=Ck-fqMay3g&sig=7YLm4sVKA7poCW90jQtSES9Gb_A&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result

I was gonna hand grind it with dremel tool after the first turn and side wall shave on a lathe ...

And it prolly will not cost more than 30-40 bucks ...

There is 2 reasons I wanna replace it with a different one even if it means extra $ ...

The webbing has a start of a tear ... aka a design flaw ... and 2 ... suzuki will only sell this with that starter clutch ... which is their excuse for fleecing us for 195 bucks ... sorta like the high beam indicator on the GS ... I make or figure out what it is ... and all the savagers get it ... much like somneone is making those light covers out of acrylic ... why dont we all buy a dash panel ... same reason. If enough of us get together we move the market ... one of the savagers made a cam chain with nitrided pins. Cost ... $40 ... too bad I was inbetween savages then ... that savage group is almost as nice as this ... I have to do it if I can ... even after I replace mine if I happened to buy new or used ... just to get it over with, I'll be working on it.

Cool.
Buddha.