Confused with my Problem (if it is a problem :dunno_white:)

platinum_black · March 10, 2009, 04:58:01 PM

I have been having loads of fun on my gs the past two days, getting to grips with her and getting used to how she runs and used to the speed and acceleration of her, and since i got her she has started first time every time but tonight i dont know what happened.
i came out and went over to her and it was a relatively cold night so i tried to start her and nothing, put a bit of choke on. nothing. again a bit more choke. nothing. i then realised wait my headlight is on ill turn it off so turned off lowered the choke again and tried it and all i heard was an almighty bang which scared the living crap out of me and my friends, two seconds later she started up fine and off we went. stopped oiff two minutes down the road and she wouldnt start again this time i had no lights on so i had to run her down the hill to start her, (now i do think the battery was a little tired after the previous hassle getting her started.) and well yeah i was confused.

Now i understand that my wee old gs doesnt like the cold and could be a little resistant to starting when its cold but the bit that bothers me is the bang, i mean i actually thought i had fired a spark plug out or something it was that loud, but i went for a drive and she is running fine.

is this just that i have flooded her trying to start her over and over and its all come at once? or does it sound like something else.

ohgood · March 10, 2009, 05:11:39 PM

bangs are normal if you try starting a few times in the cold, with choke. sure, it's not something you shoot for, but what you're describing is typical of trying to start like that.

especially if your battery is low. it gets -just- enough juice to fire the starter and coils, then there is extra fuel in the exhaust and BLAMO ! no big deal.

charge or replace your battery, and enjoy trouble free motorcycling again.

(battery tenders are good idea for cooler climates)

cafeboy · March 10, 2009, 05:14:12 PM

Couldn't say it better ohgood

platinum_black · March 10, 2009, 05:45:06 PM

thanks for that was rather worried, and this is where i sound like a right noob and ask what is a tender?

Esteban · March 10, 2009, 06:22:56 PM

Quote from: platinum_black on March 10, 2009, 05:45:06 PM
thanks for that was rather worried, and this is where i sound like a right noob and ask what is a tender?

No problemo, here are some Battery Tenders on 2 good sites:
http://www.newenoughhp.com/track_garage/battery_chargers__tenders/deltran/waterproof_motorcycle_battery_tender.html (I've got this one)
http://www.newenoughhp.com/track_garage/battery_chargers__tenders/deltran/motorcycle_battery_tender_jr.html
http://www.newenoughhp.com/track_garage/battery_chargers__tenders/deltran/motorcycle_battery_tender_battery_management_system.html
http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15238
http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15246
http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15249
http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15244

platinum_black · March 10, 2009, 06:42:10 PM

what do yu do connecting it inbetween your leads that you would usually connect to the battery and the battery? or is it for recharging your battery?

Esteban · March 10, 2009, 07:25:27 PM

Quote from: platinum_black on March 10, 2009, 06:42:10 PM
...or is it for recharging your battery?

Bingo

pronator · March 10, 2009, 07:34:02 PM

I've got the Deltran Battery Tender Plus* and love it! It makes sure your battery doesn't fry by automatically changing from a charge to a float mode when you're all charged up.

$42 and change at Amazon. No tax. Free shipping.

* Esteban posted the Bikebandit link: http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15246

platinum_black · March 10, 2009, 08:02:53 PM

how long does it usually take? but then my battery was charged only a month ago.

Esteban · March 11, 2009, 11:13:11 AM

Quote from: platinum_black on March 10, 2009, 08:02:53 PM
how long does it usually take? but then my battery was charged only a month ago.

They are trickle chargers, so it's best to put them on after every time you ride (if possible). They prevent the battery from draining too much while sitting (e.g., in your case, for a month) and can allegedly help prolong battery life. I like mine because now it will crank hard and the bike will start the first time, regardless of how long the battery has been out of the bike. As for how long it takes to get a full charge, that is dependent upon the charging current. Mine is 800ma, but you can get up to 5A charging current (with http://www.bikebandit.com/product/15238). With the 800ma, it's best to leave it on for a day the first time and usually a couple of hours/overnight on consecutive occasions. The charging time ultimately will depend on how how well your charging circuit in the bike is running and how depleted the battery is. Lots of short rides will cause the voltage to sag while longer rides will recharge it to optimal capacity.

bill14224 · March 11, 2009, 06:19:59 PM

The manual sez not to charge the battery at more than 1.2 amps, which seems weird to me because when it's in the bike the regulator will charge it a heluva lot faster than that. But the others are summing it up well. If you ride daily, or almost daily, your bike will keep your battery charged. If it goes dead in a week or so, that's an indication it's almost shot and it's time for a new one. A good battery will take several months to discharge enough by itself where it won't start the bike.

I don't have a battery tender. I take it inside for the winter then charge it on the low 2 amp setting for a few hours with my regular auto battery charger before I put it back in come springtime. (or the first thaw!)

platinum_black · March 11, 2009, 06:21:27 PM

ended up having to get a jump start this evening as it died completely so came home and used the car battery charger and it worked a dream, still a 12v took about an hr and a half but will check it in the morning maybe give it a top up if needed.

bill14224 · March 12, 2009, 03:05:04 PM

Don't leave a MC battery on a car charger for very long.. it'll wreck the battery. A motorcycle battery only holds 11 ampere hours, so don't let the product of current and hours go beyond 12, allowing for electrical losses. So with 2 amps, 6 hours will fully charge your battery if it was completely dead. (assuming it's still in good conditon, which it probably isn't if it's more than a few years old) If it's going dead by just sitting for days, it's time for a new one, unless there's something in the electrical system loading it. You can find out by taking the bike on a good long ride, taking the battery out, waiting several days, then start the bike with it. If it's weak, it's time for a new one.

sledge · March 12, 2009, 05:05:43 PM

The Amp-hour rating of a battery relates to its capacity and ability to deliver current over a period of time. It does not relate directly to its charge rate but plays a part in determining it

The max safe charge in Amps for lead acid motorcycle batteries is determined by the C/charging factor rule where C= capacity in AHr. The Charging factor depends mainly on its physical size, 6, 8, 10, 12 etc. Generally the smaller the battery the lower its charge factor and it is usually included in the ID code of the battery. In the case of the GS5 the 10 in the JIS YB10-LB2 code indicates it has a charging factor of 10.

So in the case of the GS5 battery with its charge factor of 10 and capacity of 11Ahr its 11/10=1.1. So the battery should not be allowed to see any more than 1.1A during its charging cycle..... allowing it see any more than this will cause it to overheat, boil off the acid, damage the plates and ultimately kill it given enough time.

Trickle chargers and ramp chargers that "force" current into the battery should be avoided. Their output is unregulated but is low enough to be below the max charge rate of the large auto type batteries they are intended to be used on and as such will not harm them, but for smaller capacity bike batteries its a different story. Intelligent or Tender type chargers that continously monitor the batterys state of charge and adjust their charging rates, or float, to suit the condition of the battery are the type to use. Generaly they are regulated to a max output of 1-1.25A anyway so its impossible for them to overcharge anything with a capacity of more than 12Ahr assuming a charge factor of 10.

platinum_black · March 12, 2009, 07:39:59 PM

Quote from: sledge on March 12, 2009, 05:05:43 PM
The Amp-hour rating of a battery relates to its capacity and ability to deliver current over a period of time. It does not relate directly to its charge rate but plays a part in determining it

The max safe charge in Amps for lead acid motorcycle batteries is determined by the C/charging factor rule where C= capacity in AHr. The Charging factor depends mainly on its physical size, 6, 8, 10, 12 etc. Generally the smaller the battery the lower its charge factor and it is usually included in the ID code of the battery. In the case of the GS5 the 10 in the JIS YB10-LB2 code indicates it has a charging factor of 10.

So in the case of the GS5 battery with its charge factor of 10 and capacity of 11Ahr its 11/10=1.1. So the battery should not be allowed to see any more than 1.1A during its charging cycle..... allowing it see any more than this will cause it to overheat, boil off the acid, damage the plates and ultimately kill it given enough time.

Trickle chargers and ramp chargers that "force" current into the battery should be avoided. Their output is unregulated but is low enough to be below the max charge rate of the large auto type batteries they are intended to be used on and as such will not harm them, but for smaller capacity bike batteries its a different story. Intelligent or Tender type chargers that continously monitor the batterys state of charge and adjust their charging rates, or float, to suit the condition of the battery are the type to use. Generaly they are regulated to a max output of 1-1.25A anyway so its impossible for them to overcharge anything with a capacity of more than 12Ahr assuming a charge factor of 10.

my thoughts exactly

the mole · March 12, 2009, 09:51:10 PM

Looks like sledge confused you. If so, try and understand it by re-reading and further research. If you can understand what he wrote, you will understand better what your battery is capable of in terms of receiving charge. If you live in a cold climate and don't ride for a few days and your battery is not exactly new, then a battery tender is a very good idea. It won't overcharge your battery, but will keep it topped up and make starting easy. It will also mean you can recoup the cost of it by using an old battery a bit beyond its use-by date. (That should appeal to a Scot

.)
When you're starting from cold, I'd suggest using full choke, then reducing it as needed to keep revs around 2000-2500 until it warms up a bit (a couple of minutes or couple of miles).
Your bang was unburnt fuel in the muffler exploding when the engine fired up. It won't hurt the engine, but could damage the muffler. I've seen car mufflers blown wide open that way. The unburnt fuel got in your exhaust because when you tried to start it, the engine wasn't firing, probably because you weren't using enough choke.

platinum_black · March 13, 2009, 03:59:18 AM

Quote from: the mole on March 12, 2009, 09:51:10 PM
Looks like sledge confused you. If so, try and understand it by re-reading and further research. If you can understand what he wrote, you will understand better what your battery is capable of in terms of receiving charge. If you live in a cold climate and don't ride for a few days and your battery is not exactly new, then a battery tender is a very good idea. It won't overcharge your battery, but will keep it topped up and make starting easy. It will also mean you can recoup the cost of it by using an old battery a bit beyond its use-by date. (That should appeal to a Scot .)
When you're starting from cold, I'd suggest using full choke, then reducing it as needed to keep revs around 2000-2500 until it warms up a bit (a couple of minutes or couple of miles).
Your bang was unburnt fuel in the muffler exploding when the engine fired up. It won't hurt the engine, but could damage the muffler. I've seen car mufflers blown wide open that way. The unburnt fuel got in your exhaust because when you tried to start it, the engine wasn't firing, probably because you weren't using enough choke.

firstly not all us scots are tight arsed b******ds, i am one of those ones that if i know something is going even if its still got quite a bit of life in it i will replace it there and then to save later hassle of it dying whilst im using it and secondly turned out wasnt because of lack of choke it wouldnt start it was due to battery not quite having enough juice to start her up cause i was using the choke

News:

Confused with my Problem (if it is a problem :dunno_white:)