gaskets, cylinder hone, runs good

[BeerGarage]

This was the first time I did this myself.  I guess I "helped" my dad by holding the flashlight long ago, but this I did myself.  I feel proud.

cylinder and head
note the shiny bore.


Valves seal well as seen by holding the WD40 overnight!


Clean valves.


Clean the gaskets.


Copper the gaskets.


Got the cylinders out.



Cleaned those up.


Cylinder hone!


Machine head!



Oil pan with Fruity Bunnies organic cereal box gasket.


Reassemble
Heat
Retorque
Ride

[jeremy_nash]

so you are re-using your head gasket? 
i didn't know you could do that

[johnny ro]

So does it run better? Might make less power with the less carbon in there, which raises compression. If you fixed air leaks it will run better though I bet.

Why consumer cardboard on sump?  I did not previously grasp that it has removable oil pan. I'm dropping mine to clean it out.

[gs500Ant]

so you are re-using your head gasket? 
i didn't know you could do that

me too i replaced both head and base gasket after i had to do mine

i would of thought the gaskets previously being under torque already would render them useless as re-torqueing to the same lbs pressure would not make a true seal    ??

[ecpreston]

yeah, cool pics, and congrats, but.... I'm pretty curious about your gasket choices too.... 

[O.C.D.]

x3 on the gaskets.  You went to all of that trouble and you are re-using the head gasket?  I implore you to wait and purchase a OEM one for at least the head.  I wouldn't want a painted gasket that was old being reused.

But, other than that great job!!!  I think this is a great way to learn about engines.  Definitely not a newb project, but great none the less.

[BeerGarage]

I hear your concern on the gaskets. 
I hesitated to make that choice as well.  My decision came down to this:

Money is really tight right now.  I have time to do this again if it doesn't work the first time.
People have been making their own gaskets and painting and reusing metal gaskets for years, so I am not breaking any new ground there. 
Also, I used copper gasket sealant made specifically for this purpose, though I have read that many people use silver spray paint with good results too!
I have ridden it 45 high revving, back road racing miles, with no leaks found.  My wife said it smelled hot when I brought it home last night.  She may have been talking about the smell of a burning oil leak, bit I think she smelled my awesomeness.

SMELL MY AWESOMENESS!

[dgyver]

I used Copper Coat on the head & base gaskets 1 time... and only 1 time. It did not seal and I had to replace the gaskets at the track. I hope it works for you.

[The Buddha]

Your hone job also looks pretty rough, but maybe its a camera angle thing.
Cool.
Buddha.

[tt_four]

I tried making a gasket for a moped once, and it kept leaking, but I think I'm gonna give it another shot before I go ahead and buy come. I've heard the cereal box thing works as well. No complaints? Did you soak it in oil before you put it in, or did you just clamp it in dry?

Also, where'd you get that tool you used to hone the cylinders? I've looked around for flex-hones locally but haven't had any luck finding one, I may just order some online. I've never seen one like that one, I've only ever see the ones with the little around balls on the outside that looks like fake cylinder christmas trees for a model train set.

[BeerGarage]

This is all an experiment for me.  I am not saying this is THE way to do it.  I am sharing my experiment with you, and I will report the results like the nerd that I am.

tt four-
Cereal box is working for the oil pan so far.  I hear it is not advised for high pressure areas, ie: head.  I coated the cereal gasket with oil as I traced the shape with the broken oily old gasket, but did not "soak" it.  It was dark with oil but not soaked.

Buddha -
I think the deglaze is a bit rough too.  I set the spring tension to the middle tension, but that may be too tight for a new hone with new stones and a new spring in the hands of a new technician.

dgyver-
When I first started it to heat it, it did not leak, Monday morning.  When I raced the shaZam! out of it, it leaked, Monday evening.  Then I let it cool down and retorqued all the head bolts, which I think were about 30% undertorqued after that heating - cooling cycle.  (Exhaust bolts were loose too by the way and there was an audible exhaust leak.  I had coated those with anti seize.  Retorqued and leak gone.) Now it does not leak, yesterday or today, revving to 10k and racing a mini cooper around the vineyards.  Tomorrow we will see.

Also, honey, if you happen to read this, of course I was not racing.  I am just lying to look cool in front of my internet friends.  Please do not take my bike away.

[black and silver twin]

Also, honey, if you happen to read this, of course I was not racing.  I am just lying to look cool in front of my internet friends.  Please do not take my bike away.

Good save!

SMELL MY AWESOMENESS!

I can almost smell it through the computer

[The Buddha]

I have heard that the cereal box gasket trick works well if you slightly sand the side that has print on it. I didn't and I have had the sausage left case leak. Of course a sausage without a head leak is a miracle in itself, so I am not eager to fix it. Its normal for a sausage.
Cool.
Buddha.

[BeerGarage]

I heard that you put the printed side toward the case, and the brown side toward the cover.  The reasoning I heard is the printed side is not likely to stick, and the brown side is likely to stick, and the cover you can clean on the bench, and the case you clean lying on the garage floor.

The cardboard on the back of a legal pad looks like a good brown on both sides material.  Also heard of using printed on both sides paper from a wall calendar.  No idea if those ideas work and for what applications.

Just in case I did the copper coats while the gaskets lay on cereal boxes.

[dbarile]

Thanks for the posts and the pics. 

I understand the 'low funds' situation. I hope the rebuild works out for you.

[cboling]

First off, thanks for posting this. I have been working to get the parts together (cylinder head, valve head) so that i can prepare them similar to what you have done mainly so that if my motor decides to take a dump, I will have those parts ready and waiting. (Top end)

My concern is the honing of the cylinders. Should they be very smooth afterwards with no visible scratches or marks? I would also assume, new rings and seals? New Pins? Also, do pistons ever get completely fatigued or can they be re-used unless there is visible damage?

Also, does anyone know how easily the lower end of the motor has problems? (Crank bearings, etc...)

[BeerGarage]

I forgot to say that I got the hone stone thing at napa for $20.  They had a larger one for $35.  Harbor Freight had a similar large one for $15, but I am tired of buying tools that break after one use.

I read on some old car restoration forum that 400 grit is good, another guy said 220.  They were saying you have to leave enough rough to grip the gasket, but not so rough the spray can't fill it.  Some guys on thumpertalk said to use a figure eight motion, but on an 8x11 sheet of paper I could only do little circles.

I saw a good youtube on deglazing:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtJAuDZXmiU

[BeerGarage]

This is what "Popular Hotrodding" says about cylinder deglaze/hone.



http://www.popularhotrodding.com/enginemasters/articles/hardcore/0612em_cylinder_head_honing/photo_06.html

"Crosshatch angle is important, but not as critical to creating a perfect bore as roundness, straightness and surface finish. Typical crosshatch angles are 45 or 30 degrees, +/-5 degrees. Lighter tension rings will usually use the 30 degree crosshatch angle. A steep crosshatch provides a faster relief of oil, while lesser angle holds more oil. Another aspect is ring rotation, which is driven by steeper angles, so the lower angles are more appropriate with low-tension, thinner, rings."

[BaltimoreGS]

Much respect to BeerGarage for taking on this project, it's not one I care to repeat anytime soon. For others considering it, call around to some local machine shops before you buy a hone and attempt the cylinders yourself.  A shop near me honed my cylinders for $40.  I felt better paying someone else with experience to do that part of the job.

-Jessie

[DoD#i]

Also, where'd you get that tool you used to hone the cylinders? I've looked around for flex-hones locally but haven't had any luck finding one, I may just order some online. I've never seen one like that one, I've only ever see the ones with the little around balls on the outside that looks like fake cylinder christmas trees for a model train set.

You simply have to try all the auto-parts stores until you find one that expects people to actually do work on engines. I think it took me 5 before I found a similar hone (which I was using on a badly dinged hydraulic cylinder on a backhoe, not an engine - it helped, but failed to produce any miracles. The ball types would not have helped at all.) Not surprisingly, the same auto parts store would be the one that actually had an 8 inch drop hitch adapter I recently needed, and it was even made in USA, and it cost less than the 8 inch drop Chinky-Chinese hitch adapter at Tractor Supply. It's a regional chain (Bond, Vermont) - the national chains (IME, and NAPA probably excepted, but my local NAPA went out of business) run much more to China and "nope, don't have that".

Otherwise, yeah, Summit Racing or whatever online.