Do like in egypt

[jserio]

It's my understanding that social security didn't start out as government redistribution of wealth. It was originally in it's own trust fund so to speak. Then somewhere along the line the money was borrowed by the government and put into the general fund to be used for whatever and the government promised to pay it out of their pocket. (or ours depending on your perspective. Had it been left alone it its own fund, I don't think it would be in as much trouble as it is today. Of course, that's just my opinion.

[nikfleisch]

Well no matter how it started its current state is a joke.

[Toogoofy317]

Well, sir what would you do to change it? It seems everyone is very quick to knock the gov't we have yet no one really gives any viable alternatives.

I do believe that we could save millions to billions of dollars each year if we made preventative healthcare mandatory and free. As it is now people don't get medical treatment until they have done irreparable damage to their bodies and then it costs millions of dollars to care for a "chronic" condition that if the person had the opportunity to see a doc on a yearly basis that it could have been avoided all together.

mary

[nikfleisch]

Social security should be gone, legislation passed against ever allowing it again. I think churches need to be the main source of help for poorer families, churches and other nonprofit organizations have the capabilites to monitor, help and encorouge ina way the the governemtn cant and never will be able to do. Healthcare is a whole different story I'd need to continue with research to come to a possible conclusion but I know all of my research thus far has told me that government run healthcare is not the answer.

[madjak30]

Careful man, you're openning a can-O-worms there...

Later.

[Toogoofy317]

Churches really, while I love my church and they have helped me in so many ways that is for sure not the answer. First, there is this wonderful clause of seperation of church and state. Secondly, who will monitor their doings and which churchs will be allowed to distribute funds. What if someone is Atheist they don't deserve help too?

What is your beef with Social Security? You put the money in there its not like your getting the "free" ride you describe. If we went to private insurances like W. proposed can you imagine what would happen to those that were retiring in 2008. Yeah, you would have put into an account for 40 years and find out some Capitalistic pig blew all of your hard earned money on high risk hedge funds and the such that got us in this financial mess in the beginning.

I'm not saying that socialism is the answer but Capitalism sure isn't the answer for healthcare either. I do believe that it should be mandatory for everyone to carry health insurance because it tends to be those that have no insurance that tend to run up bills that and those who are not here legally. When everyone has insurance they can then get the smaller health problems taken care of at a doctor's office rather than an ED. When I was an EMT I would look out into the waiting room and see that 90% of those people weren't there because they had an "Emergency" they were there because they didn't have insurance and knew they had to be treated.

There are no easy answers but you have to include the needs of the whole country when deciding on such things.

Mary

[nikfleisch]

thats not america, requiring things of americans, and just becuase you aren athiest doesn't meant they don't get help, Im christian, whether or not a homeless person is has no effect on the amount I would help them..........

[yamahonkawazuki]

Yeah, that kinda pissed me off this week. I have had hypoglycemia and the Crohn's issue and so I asked my PCP if I could get a referral to see a nutritionist. She said insurance would not cover it until I was diagnosed with full blown diabetes! Ok so instead of paying the $100 for me to get my diet straightned out and prevent me from getting the diabetes they'd rather pay to treat the diabetes which once you got it it is not cheap to treat!

Mary

before the liberal governor kicked me off of medicaid, i had same issue mary. i replied to them, fine, ill just go to ER. ( i needed insulin needles, but am allowed 1 doc visit per mo. after a week of going to ER twice per day, for an injection, they reconsidered

[Toogoofy317]

thats not america, requiring things of americans, and just becuase you aren athiest doesn't meant they don't get help, Im christian, whether or not a homeless person is has no effect on the amount I would help them..........

That is you sir not how the rest of the world operates. I mean take that Baptist church that goes to soldiers funerals singing "God hates America" and "Fags deserve AIDS" according to U.S tax codes they are just as much of a "church" as the church I go to First Baptist Church of Kissimmee. I do believe that  a "church" model is quite acceptable my church for example. We run a free clinic (which I volunteer at) it is open two times a week we also serve one meal a day. The clinic saved my life when I lost my health insurance because they got me the cardiac meds that I could not live with out.

I believe that we can take that model along with mandatory insurance and preventative care and create something viable that will help the whole country not just the very poor or the very rich.

Mary

[yamahonkawazuki]

Well, sir what would you do to change it? It seems everyone is very quick to knock the gov't we have yet no one really gives any viable alternatives.

I do believe that we could save millions to billions of dollars each year if we made preventative healthcare mandatory and free. As it is now people don't get medical treatment until they have done irreparable damage to their bodies and then it costs millions of dollars to care for a "chronic" condition that if the person had the opportunity to see a doc on a yearly basis that it could have been avoided all together.

mary

agreed. odds are ill be dead in a years time. almost happened twice this year. +1 on preventative  doc type stuff. can do wonders. i just wish it were available long ago

[Toogoofy317]

 Have trust in the Lord Yama. When it is your time to go then it is your time. But, I got a feeling you and I have bigger things to do which is why God is preparing us through these trials.

You know I am always praying for you

Mary

[yamahonkawazuki]

Have trust in the Lord Yama. When it is your time to go then it is your time. But, I got a feeling you and I have bigger things to do which is why God is preparing us through these trials.

You know I am always praying for you

Mary

i know. i just get aggrivated tho. i cannot get help for nothing. no mass transit. no way to get around. except via bicycle. i cant ride the race bike anymore due to pain, and shortness of breath. doc called other day, somethign about spots on chest xray. im like okay WTF. i had htis xray 5 weeks ago FIVE WEEKS. ehh time for vitamins or whatever else i can clear this up with. cant sleep breathign thru nose. not enough air. i breathe thru mouth, i wake up dry as sahara desert lol. anyhoo, i think requiring those to buy insurance. i dont like htei idea. i DO HOWEVER think, need ot go back to federal medicaid programme. my state under a liberal gov. cut me, and many many thousands more off of it, and THEN spent several million dollars for a reception room at the mansion. WTF. priorities dude. i cannot work hardly anymore. i got my net service back up, so if i could sell somethign online i would have hte ability to do so. and so far so good. but other than that, am broke lol

[XealotX]

Capitalism...The engine that has powered medical breakthroughs which have exponentially increased our standard of living.

How many medical advances have come out of Burma (Myanmar) lately? Those of you waiting for a cure to cancer from Laos any time soon better not hold your breath.

[trumpetguy]

Capitalism...The engine that has powered medical breakthroughs which have exponentially increased our standard of living.

How many medical advances have come out of Burma (Myanmar) lately? Those of you waiting for a cure to cancer from Laos any time soon better not hold your breath.

OTOH, LOTS of medical advances have come from Europe, where they have universal health care and a much bigger social welfare net than we do.

Capitalism is a great system for those who inherit lots of money, especially when they are able to buy legislators and indeed whole parties.  It allows them to keep their money and gradually get ours as well.  Observable fact.

[XealotX]

OTOH, LOTS of medical advances have come from Europe, where they have universal health care and a much bigger social welfare net than we do.

Capitalism is a great system for those who inherit lots of money, especially when they are able to buy legislators and indeed whole parties.  It allows them to keep their money and gradually get ours as well.  Observable fact.

True, lots of medical advances have come from Europe in the last 100 years...compared to Myanmar or Laos. It is still a fraction of what the US has produced.

Your comments on Capitalism translate just as easily to Socialism. Observable fact.

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money."--Margaret Thatcher

[Toogoofy317]

Yeah, its great that America has created all of these medical miracles but typically those with money and insurance are the ones that benefit. I mean take a look at Yama's leg over in the Tard Farm. In a country like the good 'ole US of A that atrocity should not happen. One medication for my Crohn's disease is about $2,000 for one infusion. My Ranexa about $400 for a half month supply. The Duragesic patch another $350. The Multaq for my arrythmias $4.50 per pill!

Of course there are probably some out there that think if we can't afford the medication then we don't deserve to live survival of the fitest eh? But, if that were the case we would have to say good bye to Stephen Hawking right? I mean what does he have to contribute to our society. All he has is the use of a part of one finger.

Mary

[yamahonkawazuki]

TG, i can agree @ some point about europe. BUT i will have to input this, ive considered socialism for a brief bit. i am open minded as it were. now. those with " universal healthcare. " it is NOT free. tax rates?, id be open to this idea IF this govt didnt waste money like it currently does, did, and WILL do. if we could manage OUR money wiselymight be a viable alternative. BUT until then i dont think so. NOW as far as my leg/s go, it IS getting worse. BUT until i go in on deaths doorstep, teh ER will NOT do anything. ive tried 4 times over past year. insurance would have helped yes. BUT my liberal governor. ( out now thank GOD) cut myself, and many many hundreds of thousands of ppl, OFF of our medicaid system, AND decided in his infinite wisdom, that the governors mansion needs a party room at several million dollars , cut off covertn enrollment in 09 due to budget. ever see green pus on a leg wound?,and urine that has more head ( bubbles) on it than guinness stout @ room temp. to me it dont look good, but hell to local ER docs? they dont seem to give a f%$k. they dont even check the damned thing. i keep it as clean as possible. but now my face is swelling too lol. i look like the pillsbury doughboy with bill clintons face. before we try an implement other programs, we NEED to manage our money carefully. whether is uneccesary wars as you claim, ( ill respect your points of view TG) or other expenditures, we need to rein in our spending and watch CAREFULLY where our money goes OUT . regarding costs. those countries with cheap meds?, the US pays for the R&D. my insulin is @ 63 per bottle. times 2/mo. im running on donations. i was planning on birthday money to go see doctor. BUT no birthday money the 16th of jan so no go. id support obamacare, BUT only if this country reined in its out of control spending FIRST. as in not spending money that did NOT need to be spent

[Cal Price]

XealotX, I think the country that has made most advances in medicine in the last fifty years is Cuba. I'm not advocating Cuban style govt but when Castro first came to power his population was decimated by an epidemic. He said "We can't have a revolution without people" and made medicine an absolute priority, some of the best research on the planet is done there.
This does not illustrate that socialism or a dictatorship is best but it does illustrate what you can do if you have overiding national WILL, like China who developed the bomb and space travel whilst still a "third-word" country.
The problem with "western" medical research is that no drug company wants to produce a cure for anything, bad for business, the ideal drug for them is one you have to take every day for the rest of your life to "control" a condition.

I take you point though and await the next big medical breakthrough from south east Asia with bated breath! cough! choke!

[yamahonkawazuki]

XealotX, I think the country that has made most advances in medicine in the last fifty years is Cuba. I'm not advocating Cuban style govt but when Castro first came to power his population was decimated by an epidemic. He said "We can't have a revolution without people" and made medicine an absolute priority, some of the best research on the planet is done there.
This does not illustrate that socialism or a dictatorship is best but it does illustrate what you can do if you have overiding national WILL, like China who developed the bomb and space travel whilst still a "third-word" country.
The problem with "western" medical research is that no drug company wants to produce a cure for anything, bad for business, the ideal drug for them is one you have to take every day for the rest of your life to "control" a condition.

I take you point though and await the next big medical breakthrough from south east Asia with bated breath! cough! choke!

I already know what that is. its a cure for lead poisoning 

[XealotX]

For the record...I'm not picking on Southeast Asian countries in particular...just socialist and communist countries in general. There are plenty of other countries to choose from...or California...