Perceptions change with experience

[Cosimo_Zaretti]

It's funny when I got my GS two months ago every bridge seemed to have brutal crosswinds, and I loathed my first few runs on the freeway, I felt all this buffeting in the chest and headchecking into the next lane was a chore, as the wind battered me in the side of the helmet as I turned my head.

I think we've been getting some better weather, because I never seem to encounter too much of a crosswind on any of the bridges that used to a problem, and it's as if I'm getting a permanent tailwind on the freeway in comparison to my first few runs. 

[Shaddow]

Cosimo I found the same thing over time. The days that used to make me stop and consider getting the van keys out now don't even make me blink. Hail I still shy away from cause it hurts.

[Ken in Regina]

Crosswinds and gravel are the two things that tend to spook most riders, inexperienced a little more than experienced.

Experienced riders always say to "Relax the upper body." or "Relax your grip on the bars." They are absolutely right.  But they usually don't say why and they almost never tell you how.

Why?

Whenever the bike is being moved around under us, we want to be in better contact with the bike so we don't lose it. The automatic tendency is to tense up and grip the bars harder. That's exactly the wrong thing to do. But why? Because the harder you grip the bars, the more steering inputs you make. So every movement of the bike that causes your upper body to move gets translated into a steering input. This exaggerates every movement of the bike into an even bigger move. If you keep it up, pretty soon you can set up a totally scary weave. All caused by your steering inputs as your upper body gets moved around, either by wind buffeting both your body and the bike or the natural tendency of a bike on gravel to try to "hunt".

How?

That's the important question. Turns out it's pretty easy. Just grip the tank really hard with your knees. If the bike is moving about pretty good, just try to put dents into the sides of the tank with your knees. (You can't, but try to anyway.) This will allow you to maintain good solid contact with the bike while relaxing your upper body and your grip on the bars. It also helps if you lean forward a little from your normal riding position. If you do this while gripping tight with your knees, relaxing your upper body and lightening your grip, you can relax and let the bike move around.

If you never develop this riding technique you will never get really comfortable with riding in buffeting crosswinds or on gravel. If you work on it you will start to trust it and get way more comfortable.

For those who wonder where I'm coming from, I started riding in 1965, back when if you wanted to go anywhere there was about a 50% chance you had to take some gravel roads on at least part of the trip. I taught the Canada Safety Council rider training course (kind of like the MSF course) for ten years.  I wish I had a buck for every student who came back to thank me for that single riding tip in helping them get confident and make their riding so much more pleasant in conditions that had them completely spooked.

So just remember, when the bike starts to move under you, squeeze with the knees, relax everything from the hips up and stop fighting the bike.

Now go find a nice gravel road or windy bridge to practice on until it becomes more instinctive than the death grip on the bars. 

...ken...

[XealotX]

Yep, two years ago I had just learned how to ride and hit crosswinds that had made a group of Harley riders pull off the road. I wanted to get home so I kept going but was doing half the speed limit and still getting blown across my lane. With the death grip I had on the handlebars I'm surprised I didn't leave a permanent imprint in them.

A few weeks ago I was riding in nearly the same conditions and didn't even realize how windy it was until I pulled up to a stoplight. Proper riding technique makes a world of difference.

[plewis51]

Crosswinds and gravel are the two things that tend to spook most riders, inexperienced a little more than experienced.

Experienced riders always say to "Relax the upper body." or "Relax your grip on the bars." They are absolutely right.  But they usually don't say why and they almost never tell you how.

Why?

Whenever the bike is being moved around under us, we want to be in better contact with the bike so we don't lose it. The automatic tendency is to tense up and grip the bars harder. That's exactly the wrong thing to do. But why? Because the harder you grip the bars, the more steering inputs you make. So every movement of the bike that causes your upper body to move gets translated into a steering input. This exaggerates every movement of the bike into an even bigger move. If you keep it up, pretty soon you can set up a totally scary weave. All caused by your steering inputs as your upper body gets moved around, either by wind buffeting both your body and the bike or the natural tendency of a bike on gravel to try to "hunt".

How?

That's the important question. Turns out it's pretty easy. Just grip the tank really hard with your knees. If the bike is moving about pretty good, just try to put dents into the sides of the tank with your knees. (You can't, but try to anyway.) This will allow you to maintain good solid contact with the bike while relaxing your upper body and your grip on the bars. It also helps if you lean forward a little from your normal riding position. If you do this while gripping tight with your knees, relaxing your upper body and lightening your grip, you can relax and let the bike move around.

If you never develop this riding technique you will never get really comfortable with riding in buffeting crosswinds or on gravel. If you work on it you will start to trust it and get way more comfortable.

For those who wonder where I'm coming from, I started riding in 1965, back when if you wanted to go anywhere there was about a 50% chance you had to take some gravel roads on at least part of the trip. I taught the Canada Safety Council rider training course (kind of like the MSF course) for ten years.  I wish I had a buck for every student who came back to thank me for that single riding tip in helping them get confident and make their riding so much more pleasant in conditions that had them completely spooked.

So just remember, when the bike starts to move under you, squeeze with the knees, relax everything from the hips up and stop fighting the bike.

Now go find a nice gravel road or windy bridge to practice on until it becomes more instinctive than the death grip on the bars. 

...ken...

Best response in this thread. Thank you very much for the insight because I had not idea why to loosen up the grip and upper body. Like you said, it's instinctive to grip harder for control but that is totally wrong.

[Pelikan]

Was approaching an intersection (green) in the right lane, with SUV in the left.  We were staggered, with the SUV in front.  As we went through the intersection, a big, loud, blinged-out Dodge Magnum started to turn left behind the SUV, into my lane.  I had a def "Oh f@$&!!" moment with this thing still moving at me about 6" away.  Didn't really have anywhere to go so laid on the horn.  Guy stopped.

Moral of story:  Don't drive into an intersection with an SUV obstructing your view.

[Ken in Regina]

Moral of story:  Don't drive into an intersection with an SUV obstructing your view.

Or get up far enough beside it to use it as a shield so it doesn't matter if a left-turner does something dumb. 

...ken...

[mister]

Moral of story:  Don't drive into an intersection with an SUV obstructing your view.

Or get up far enough beside it to use it as a shield so it doesn't matter if a left-turner does something dumb. 

...ken...

I always use the other vehicle as a shield at round-a-bouts. And like it specially when they are buses or trucks cause if something hits them they have too much bulk to be pushed into me.

As for road/hazards to fear... I should I say, things I am additionally cautious or unnerved about...

Hail.

I learned on dirt so that's not an issue. Rain doesn't bother me. I am triple alert to all around me, so like the other day when the car next to me decided to just come right on over despite my beeping of the horn, I had already moved across the lane and even onto the shoulder while accelerating away. I know of the debris zone at all intersections (where gravel/sand gathers cause no cars drive there and taking a corner wide will see you in it) so that's nothing to fear.

But hail. I'll do anything to avoid that bad boy. Hard enough driving on it in a car. Don't want to be driving on cold marbles on a bike. Good thing hail doesn't take you by surprise so there is time to find shelter and let it pass.

Michael

[Shaddow]

Crosswinds and gravel are the two things that tend to spook most riders, inexperienced a little more than experienced.

Experienced riders always say to "Relax the upper body." or "Relax your grip on the bars." They are absolutely right.  But they usually don't say why and they almost never tell you how.

Why?

Whenever the bike is being moved around under us, we want to be in better contact with the bike so we don't lose it. The automatic tendency is to tense up and grip the bars harder. That's exactly the wrong thing to do. But why? Because the harder you grip the bars, the more steering inputs you make. So every movement of the bike that causes your upper body to move gets translated into a steering input. This exaggerates every movement of the bike into an even bigger move. If you keep it up, pretty soon you can set up a totally scary weave. All caused by your steering inputs as your upper body gets moved around, either by wind buffeting both your body and the bike or the natural tendency of a bike on gravel to try to "hunt".

I love your response. Its so informative. The only thing I was initially told was stay loose up top cause the stiffer you are the more hard surface the wind has to push on. It kind of makes sense. Yours makes the perfect sense though. Wish someone had told me that first up.

[bill14224]

Riding on the road since 1980.  The short answer is anything and everything.

- Other drivers, of course.  Just because they're looking at you doesn't mean they see you!
- Road hazards; potholes, loose gravel, construction zones, (asphalt stripped away leaving parallel grooves going down the road) deep gravel, sticks, broken glass, oil, whatever debris there may be, especially in corners.  I once encountered a DISCARDED METAL BEDSPRING IN THE MIDDLE OF A SHARP CORNER!
- animals
- high winds
- heavy rain causing hydroplaning and/or inability to see

I also ride a Yamaha 750 triple and even that bike gets blown around if the winds are strong enough so high wind is a concern no matter how big your bike is.

The only cure for all of this is keep your head in the game and SLOW DOWN.  All this is why I don't listen to music while I ride.  I haven't been hospitalized yet and I want to keep the streak going!

[murf425]

Just grip the tank really hard with your knees. If the bike is moving about pretty good, just try to put dents into the sides of the tank with your knees. (You can't, but try to anyway.) This will allow you to maintain good solid contact with the bike while relaxing your upper body and your grip on the bars. It also helps if you lean forward a little from your normal riding position. If you do this while gripping tight with your knees, relaxing your upper body and lightening your grip, you can relax and let the bike move around.

I did this today, and it worked like a charm.  Still wasn't exactly FUN coming across the bridge, but it was much less scary. 

[Ken in Regina]

I'm glad it helped.  "Less scary" is what it's about. It has allowed some folks to ride on days they otherwise wouldn't. Others, with practice, don't much think about conditions that would have had them peeing themselves before.

...ken...

[steezin_and_wheezin]

AWESOME thread! this is the stuff i need to be reading/studying. definitely helps the mental confidence, now i just need to man up and go ride in this rain!

[Cosimo_Zaretti]

As mentioned above, we instinctively like to put other vehicles between us and any approaching hazard, but it tends to just blind us to the hazard and make it harder for other vehicles to see us.  Better to just put yourself where you have a complete view of the situation, and give yourself plenty of stopping distance, rather than trying to stay shielded.

[bill14224]

AWESOME thread! this is the stuff i need to be reading/studying. definitely helps the mental confidence, now i just need to man up and go ride in this rain!

Concerning confidence, I should have said a little more about gravel.  Gravel still freaks me out when I don't know how deep it is because if you go into deep gravel at anything above a crawl it will swallow your wheels and make you fall no matter how good a rider you are.  Entering gravel parking lots and driveways is the most common place you'll find it.  Gravel can also be deep in construction zones and it's particularly dangerous there because you'll likely be trying to maintain more speed than you would entering a parking lot.  That's the last place I got a scare.

Hard rain is really no biggie as long as you stay off/get off the interstate and go slower than normal.  How slow is up to your tires and how hard it's raining.