Valve clearance check, Service Manual or Kerry's video?

[J_Walker]

sparks and chain are both in check.. Do you have to HOLD IT? or can you put a screw driver threw the chain and hold it raised like that?

[BaltimoreGS]

I would hold it on one finger while I spin the rotor.  You have to keep tension on it so it doesn't bind on the crankshaft.

-Jessie

[J_Walker]

I would hold it on one finger while I spin the rotor.  You have to keep tension on it so it doesn't bind on the crankshaft.

-Jessie

Yeah I just figured that out.. I was holding it with my hand, and I guess it was to wide, and bunching up or something. Went smoothly. First line after RT. DONE. now. time to go buy shims.. Still don't know where ima get freaking shims.. Or feeler gauges.

[BaltimoreGS]

You'll need the feeler gauge first so you know what shims to buy.

-Jessie

[Paulcet]

Jessie,  You have the patience of a saint!

[BaltimoreGS]

Jessie,  You have the patience of a saint!

   

I was young and ignorant once too.  You have to give the guy credit for taking this job on, I don't mind giving some pointers.  We all started wrenching somewhere.  Ver4 went from not knowing a thing about his GS to working on F-16 fighter jets.  Who knows what J_Walker will be wrenching on a few years from now   

-Jessie

[J_Walker]

Jessie,  You have the patience of a saint!

   

I was young and ignorant once too.  You have to give the guy credit for taking this job on, I don't mind giving some pointers.  We all started wrenching somewhere.  Ver4 went from not knowing a thing about his GS to working on F-16 fighter jets.  Who knows what J_Walker will be wrenching on a few years from now   

-Jessie

Nothing, we'll all be dead this year

[BaltimoreGS]

The last company I bought shims from is here:  http://www.newmotorcycleparts.com/motor_parts/valve_shims.html

Shipping was a bit slow but the price is good.

-Jessie

[piresito]

You can get them on Ebay as well!

[mike10]

I wish you Guys hadn't started talking about this. Now I'm wondering how I did mine Climers manual I think? Or Kerry video? DANG!

[BaltimoreGS]

The general consensus seems to be there is minimal (if any) difference between the 2 methods so you should be fine   

-Jessie

[twocool]

The general consensus seems to be there is minimal (if any) difference between the 2 methods so you should be fine   

-Jessie

Why not just check em' both ways?  You just have to rotate the engine and check....If ther're in spec both ways you're good to go.  If it's tight one way, I'd go to smaller shim, then you'd be in spec both ways anyway!

Remember the important thing we need to check is that we don't want too tight valve clearance...

The way the Suzuki manual says to do it, you can check three valves at one engine position, and then you only have to rotate the engine once.   But I'm in no rush, so I concentrate on one valeve at a time....If I have to rotate the engine all the way around again so what?

Cookie

[BaltimoreGS]

My point to mike10 was I don't think it is worth tearing his bike apart again if everything was in spec.  I trust the way the repair manual says to do it but I agree it doesn't hurt to do both methods   

-Jessie

[gsJack]

The general consensus seems to be there is minimal (if any) difference between the 2 methods so you should be fine   
-Jessie

I agree that it won't do any harm to check it either way, no need to worry about it.  But I definetly found a difference when I did my first valve check at around 600 miles on my 97 GS so many years ago and could have changed shims on a couple valves if I hadn't rechecked with the cams on the timing marks as the manual says.  On the other hand, ohgood above checked them both ways and found no difference and I don't doubt it.

Seems to me it's just easier to do it the manual way, only takes a minute to pull the little signal cover and make the 19 mm hex available for turning the engine.  With the crank on the mark and the cam notches inwards 3 valves can be checked and then one turn of the crank back to the mark turns the cams 180* with notches outwards and the remaing valve (left exhaust) can be checked.  Besides, if you change a shim or two the crank should be turned a couple full turns before rechecking clearances.

I'll continue to advocate using the timing marks to check GS valve clearances which is unusual for me as I usually do things my own way before even looking at the manual and also to give the exhaust valves a little extra clearance or at least set them to the high side of Suzi specs for longer exhaust valve life.   

[piresito]

Yes, doing both ways showed me that the difference is not relevant (>0.005 and <0.01mm) in my bike. Maybe for sake of simplicity I will stick to Kerrys method.
Anyway, those two exaust shims made me so f***ing mad that I could only read them at 2:30 am! I guess I scratched a bit of the case around the bucket also! 
Anyway, could get both shims out to measure them, but...when I was pressing them down, sometimes the shim would jump out of the bucket  other times it won't. Why does this happen?
If I know how to make it jump, it would be a lot easier to pop them out than picking it with a screwdriver in the bucket notch.

One thing that came to mind, was measure them without removing them from the bucket. With a vernier calliper, you can sit the calliper on the shim, and then extend the bottom ruller until it touched to botton of the notch in the bucket. My calliper is too big to do this in the exaust valves, but I did it on the intake valves and it gave me exactly 2.75mm, which is a potential value. The problem is that I was too tired to get the shim out of there to confirm that value.
Has anyone tried that?


EDIT: For those guessing which method is "better", if in any of them if the clearance is tight, it would be tight in both of them, so there is no point "fussing" (is this a English word?!) around that. As Budda said, it would make a lot of difference in a bike that the valves lift faster than they go down, or vice versa. In a GS, the clearance shouldn't change that much.

[gsJack]

I've found a tweezers to be handy to lift the shim out of the bucket at the notch after the bucket is depressed.  The sharper the ends are on the tweezers the easier it is to get a hold of the shim and using the tweezers you can keep a grip on the shim to lift it out.  Just prying it out with a screwdriver usually results in the shim sliding down on the other side where it's sometimes hard to get a hold of to remove.

Measuring the shim thickness with the shim in place with the vernier caliper like you suggest would only be accurate if the notch was exactly the same depth as the c'bore for the shim.  Think I have a few buckets in the garage that I'll take a look at later.

[piresito]

It took me 1 hour to realize that tweezers would be great as the shim "slided to the other side"... Yesterday I ended up using the feeler gauge "casing" as tweezers, to pick the shim stuck in the back of the bucket...
But I didn't think of them to lift the shim out of the bucket, thank you! Will try the in a while, as soon as I buy the shims. My girlfriend should have one in her things... lol 

Wouln't be nice to measure the shims without taking them out?! Noobs dream!!  hehe

Thanks!

[gsJack]

My wife is still looking for the missing tweezers that are hidden away in my tool box.   

[mike10]

Has anybody used the zip tie method to hold the shim buckets down to get the shims out. On the GSresource site, some Guys go through the spark plug hole, crank the engine around till the Valve is open. then stick a folded in half, zip tie under the valve head. that holds the valve open and the bucket down, when you crank engine around more till the  lobe is out of the way, then pull the shim out. I'm not sure this can be done on a 500. But they love it on the 850's and others. The Valve tool can be a TOOL sometimes.

[BaltimoreGS]

Haven't tried it but I'd like to play devil's advocate, what happens if the zip tie breaks off in the cylinder??

-Jessie