Oil problems!

[crazyivan]

So, unfortunate first post:
I'm almost a year into my GS500 ownership and I'm having some issues.  The bike is a 96 500E that I bought with ~6k on it and I've put somewhere upwards of 1000 miles on it.  400 miles ago I changed the oil and filter.  Since then I've ridden it without incident...until...I checked the oil last week and noticed that it smelled burnt.  Not like burnt oil, but kind of acrid and pretty foul.  So, after receiving new oil and a filter today, I proceeded wih an oil change.  So that the oil would drain (and because I didn't think the oil mysteriously went bad since I last rode) I ran the bike for 5 or 10 minutes.  No problems, ran fine.  Popped the filter cover off and drained an alarmingly small amount of oil.  I let it drain for ~10 mins and only got an estimated quart out of it.  Hmmm...odd, I thought.  Checked the dipstick before I put new oil in and it was showing full!

So, my theory is that I have some issue that has my dipstick showing F when it is actually E.  I check the oil about every other ride, but if it was constantly showing F, I may have been roasting the motor for the past 400 miles.  The odd thing is that the oil doesn't look super black.  I have to admit that the oil I put in for the last oil change was Maxima brand (which doesn't seem crazy reputable, but I figured oil is oil).  That being said, the minimal oil drainage and showing F when supposedly E seems highly suspicious.  So, if anybody has any wisdom that can help me and Ruby out, I would be highly appreciative.

[Paulcet]

Where did you drain it?  From the oil filter cover?  How about the drain plug in the bottom of the pan?

[weedahoe]

Im assuming after you drained the oil and with the oil all out, you checked the dipstick, cleaned it off and checked it again?

[crazyivan]

How silly do I feel...
I definitely did not take out the drain plug.  Having since done that and drained a good bit more oil out, I'm still wondering why my oil smells like hell.  I've loosened my clutch cable on the off chance I had it adjusted too tight and was accidentally riding the clutch all the time.  Any other thoughts...any help is welcome.

[jacob92icu]

Hmmm stinky oil... I would need a better description of the stench in order to analyze it. You say the oil was relatively brown, not black?

[crazyivan]

The oil was definitely brown, and not "detroit motor" black.  It smells a bit like a more offensive version of burnt popcorn.

[jacob92icu]

Was it hot when you drained it? Hot oil has a stronger smell than when cold. The fact that it is still brown is strange, but I don't think you have to worry about it. Are there any visible metal scrappings or debris in the oil that you drained?

[crazyivan]

The oil was warm (not hot) when I drained it.  I didn't see any debris at all, though I didn't run the old oil through a cheesecloth either.  Also, it smelled plenty gnarly with the bike at 30 deg F.  Note that the bike had been sitting for nearly two weeks without running, not sure if that makes any difference?

[OldTwinzNeverDie]

Ideally, you should always try to get the oil up to full operating temperature and run it for a while before draining it. A lot more "gunk" will stay in suspension with the oil and be successfully drained out than if you drain it with engine cold or just luke warm. There can also be condensation in the oil if it is not allowed to reach full operating temp. This will create "milky" colored oil that is quite obvious if there's enough of it.

If I were going to ride my 500F much in cold weather I would have the oil cooler completely blocked. Air-cooled engines do a *great* job of keeping things cool, too cool, in the winter. I had a thermometer dipstick on my Moto Guzzi. After 45 minutes of riding (commuting at highway speed) in the winter, some nights the oil temp never went above 150 degrees, way too cool!

FWIW, A pair of heavy duty nitrile gloves are nice for dealing with oil changes. They're "chemical resistant" and can keep your hands safe from all kinds of things that shouldn't be on them...like gasoline!

[jacob92icu]

Hmmm, do you smell oil often? Just trying to clarify any confusion between smells. I have not personally ever smelled a bad oil like you are describing. That being said, I doubt that you have to worry about the smell of the oil if there are no metal scrappings or debris that you know of. Has there been any malfunctions or anything that could be the culprit? If there are no malfunctions you should be safe to change oil again, and check for the smell just by opening the dipstick area and smelling after a couple days of riding. And to answer your question, leaving the bike sit for a short amount of time should not do anything to the oil. 

[craigs449]

also keep in mind that an air cooled machine is going to cook the oil more than a water cooled motor will.....everything that you described sounds normal for the gs....except for the drain plug fail..lol....

[Twisted]

Can you take a photo of the oil or have you already disposed of it?

[crazyivan]

Ideally, you should always try to get the oil up to full operating temperature and run it for a while before draining it. A lot more "gunk" will stay in suspension with the oil and be successfully drained out than if you drain it with engine cold or just luke warm. There can also be condensation in the oil if it is not allowed to reach full operating temp. This will create "milky" colored oil that is quite obvious if there's enough of it.

If I were going to ride my 500F much in cold weather I would have the oil cooler completely blocked. Air-cooled engines do a *great* job of keeping things cool, too cool, in the winter. I had a thermometer dipstick on my Moto Guzzi. After 45 minutes of riding (commuting at highway speed) in the winter, some nights the oil temp never went above 150 degrees, way too cool!

FWIW, A pair of heavy duty nitrile gloves are nice for dealing with oil changes. They're "chemical resistant" and can keep your hands safe from all kinds of things that shouldn't be on them...like gasoline!

I didn't want to run the bike too terribly long with the burnt-smelling oil in it (at the risk of causing unknown harm), just long enough to warm the oil up from the 40 deg ambient.  The bike is a '96 and doesn't have an oil cooler.

Hmmm, do you smell oil often? Just trying to clarify any confusion between smells. I have not personally ever smelled a bad oil like you are describing. That being said, I doubt that you have to worry about the smell of the oil if there are no metal scrappings or debris that you know of. Has there been any malfunctions or anything that could be the culprit? If there are no malfunctions you should be safe to change oil again, and check for the smell just by opening the dipstick area and smelling after a couple days of riding. And to answer your question, leaving the bike sit for a short amount of time should not do anything to the oil. 

Yeah, it is kind of hard to describe the smell.  It definitely doesn't smell like the normal oil burning off of hot headers smell.  I've had no mechanical issues with the bike that would suggest a problem, but when things start smelling burnt, I get nervous.

Can you take a photo of the oil or have you already disposed of it?

The oil is in a drain pan mixed with other old oil, but I may be able to wring some out of the filter and post a pic tonight.

Incidentally, I finished changing the oil last night and rode the bike to work this morning.  She ran fine with no issues.  The oil still smells burnt, but it seems to have dissipated some.  I guess I'll keep an eye (and nose) on my oil, but otherwise I'm just going to ride it.  Thanks everybody for the assistance and for helping me through my drain plug brain fart .  If anybody else wants to chime in on the burnt oil (I think I've got the mysterious drain plug issue figured out ), feel free!

[bombsquad83]

Does it smell at all like gasoline, or does it smell more like burning rubber or plastic?  If it's more like the former, then I would check your float height, condition of your needle valves in the carbs, and operation of the vacuum petcock.  If it smells like the later, then I'm wondering if you have some plastic burning in there somehow.  Possibly the epoxy from the generator magnets coming loose and burning?

[jacob92icu]

Does it smell at all like gasoline, or does it smell more like burning rubber or plastic?  If it's more like the former, then I would check your float height, condition of your needle valves in the carbs, and operation of the vacuum petcock.  If it smells like the later, then I'm wondering if you have some plastic burning in there somehow.  Possibly the epoxy from the generator magnets coming loose and burning?

This is a good point about the epoxy from the generator magnets. Unfortunately the only way you would know for sure is to remove the stator cover and check it out. You don't commonly hear of stators failing, but if so, its not too troubling of a fix.

[adidasguy]

Magnet epoxy: a few flakes do come off and get into the oil sump pan. Remember that is ALWAYS in the oil - the magneto swims in oil. So the epoxy burning is not gonna happen unless your engine is overheating and that would be a problem for all parts of the engine.

[Twisted]

Are you sure you don't have a bit of plastic/rubber burnt onto your headers or engine and this is what you are smelling?

[crazyivan]

There's nothing stuck to the headers or the front of the motor.  Though while checking that, I noticed that the front fender was a bit melted.  So, I guess it is possible that I overheated the motor sometime recently and roasted the oil.  Either way, she has new oil and ran fine for the ~10 mile round trip to/from work.  I guess I'll just keep a watchful eye.

[jacob92icu]

Damn! Haha. Your probably safe to do that, but be sure to keep an eye (or a nose) on your oil and make sure it doesnt start to smell super bad again.

[802 305]

im going to start a punk band called "drain plug brain fart" 

Burnt oil sounds bad, can't say I don't recognize the smell. Klotz racing red oil smells like raspberries when you warm it up, its freaking hilarious. They advertise it as the "klotz traditional racy scent" or some bs but I do love it. You'll notice the smell changes from raspberry to pretty gross burnt ass oil smell when it warms up if its really dirty like mine was, yesterday.

Good luck. And use some freakin reputable oil!