05 Overheated and now seized!

[wayne242]

"it broke lose" then it as seized. there was actually a video on youtube that showed how to soak these engines to free them up(diesel  and something else mixed into the cylinder), but i would be concerned with how it got hot enough to seize in the first place (no oil flow etc).

[gsJack]

"it broke lose" then it as seized. there was actually a video on youtube that showed how to soak these engines to free them up(diesel  and something else mixed into the cylinder), but i would be concerned with how it got hot enough to seize in the first place (no oil flow etc).

It's an 05, an F model with fairings and running at fast idle while not moving it got so hot inside the fairings of the parked bike it cooked the oil and seized the engine.  Gotta have some air moving thru there cooling the engine even with an oil cooler.

...................Then I tried softly to manually crank it. Nothing. I tried later a bit more umph and it broke lose. After that tried to start it again, still nothing just clicking.......................

Like oldmech said above you've put a lot of miles on that engine real quick and possibly done some damage to the rings/cyls too.  I had a CB750K years ago, a hot running engine already, that seized up on me one very hot summer day in heavy traffic, I managed to swing into a McDonalds parking lot and get it pushed into a parking place.  Just clicked when I tried to restart so I sat inside drinking cokes until the engine cooled and tried to start.  Clicked it a number of times until the engine finally broke loose and restarted and rode it home.  Bike was never the same after that, the #4 cyl was damaged and had little compression.  It ran reasonably smooth with that cyl firing but very rough when it quit firing.  The plug would oil foul out every 500 miles or so and I carried a couple spares with me and changed that plug when it fouled out to finish that season.   

[Beau]

well i got the top end off and i screwed it up good heres some pics lol yay

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[oldmech]

ouch!! sorry to see that dude.
how do the cylinders look?

[Beau]

not a scratch on the walls the piston itself has a small scratch. It looks as though the spring seat ruptured after being heated and rapidly cooled. going to go through it a bit more tomorrow hoping thats the only issue though.

[ToneZone]

Im assuming those you you who need to choke your bike are up north and in colder climates?

With mine dead cold, I can hit the starter and it will fire up and I can jump on it and ride with no issues. No choke needed for me.

I live in San Diego and my bike starts fine with no choke. I do usually let it idle with some choke for like 30 seconds because it will die at idle right after starting. I start it and ride it with no real problems though I've just stalled it at lights before cold and don't want to relive the embarrassment.

[sledge]

Thats a dropped valve seat, the head has got that hot its expanded beyond service limits and the seat has loosened off and ......dropped out!

If the bottom end turns freely you might be lucky and get away with just a replacement head.

If the rest of the engine has lived change the oil and filter.

[slipperymongoose]

Will the pistons move freely now? And before the incident happened when was the last time you checked your oil?

[sledge]

http://mechdb.com/index.php/Valve_seat

[wayne242]

http://mechdb.com/index.php/Valve_seat

Good info there, just got done reading it myself 

[Beau]

thanks to everyone for your help. I think i may get away with only replacing the seat itself. The cylinder and head are both still in factory spec. the piston only has a scratch on the top.

Im going to hone the cylinder and polish the piston replace the piston rings while im in there. I have spent the last day checking the head and cylinder for damage.

Neither seem the worse for wear.

[Suzuki Stevo]

http://mechdb.com/index.php/Valve_seat

Back in the 70's very Datsun B210 with an A14 engine had brass<IIRC? valve seats, the aluminum head would expand at a different rate and the valve seat would eventually fall into the cylinder.

[sledge]

thanks to everyone for your help. I think i may get away with only replacing the seat itself. The cylinder and head are both still in factory spec.

I doubt it 

After this sort of damage I would be very surprised if the seat housings in the head are not damaged and can still give the necessary amount of interference needed to hold the seat in place, I would also be surprised if the exhaust valves are not bent or damaged on the sealing face. These things need to be checked with precision measuring equipment, you just cant do it by eye.

"I think i may get away with only replacing the seat itself"

It may be possible but its not something you yourself will be able to do......they dont just hammer in 

This sort of thing needs to be left to a pro. What usually happens is you take the head to an engine shop, they do all the inspections and checks and determine the workscope. If the head is salvageable they will supply or make a suitable seat if the housing is significantly oversized and a new valve and guide if needed. Fitting the seat involves freezing it with liquid nitrogen so it contracts and shrinks to fit the housing. Its then machined in situ to give the correct heights/diameters. You then need to lap the valve and reassemble and shim the valvegear

http://www.ultimatep.com/Engineering_Services_Valve_seat_insert_replacement.asp

Its a straightforward and easy job for someone who knows what they are doing and has the gear but.......it will cost you.

Issues like this become a question of economics, the price of a decent used head ready to fit against the time and cost of having the original professionally reclaimed and everything else that is involved...I know what option I would take but its your call   

[Beau]

The seat Im speaking of is part of the head and does just hammer in. However no one sells them so rather than spena bunch of time having one machined im just going to replace the head. You know it's funny when you have to buy a $100 part because they don't sell the $2 part. LOL but screw it