Any ideas's ? Carbs, Valves, Emissions ?

[JohNLA]

At 15K miles my bike started having trouble and started stalling at idle(tried fiddeling with idle screw with no luck) and now at 16k miles the battery is not holding a charge.

Yesterday, I put the battery on a one amp charger and I took the carbs apart for the first time. Everything looked pretty good.
Very little build up on the metal but I cleaned it with carb cleaner since it was open. The diaphrams looked new I replaced the eight screws on the bottom with allen head bolts for easy access.
Today, I am putting it back together.
My carb question is will shimming the needles help even with stock air and exhaust ? and do the washers go an the long tapered side of the c-clip on the needle or where there is less room at the wider end of the needle ?
Also, I have neglected doing a valve check but I have never experienced any new sounds from the engine. Could this be the more likely culprut ?
I will keep posting as I make progress.
Is it possible to remove that California emmisions crap?

[Adam R]

John you can get ride of the emissions crap, but you should plug with the holes in the carbs with rubber caps (I got a whole pack of them at Autozone for $2)

[miket]

John,

Yes, shimming the needles will help even with stock setup. At least, it did on my 93. I suppose it will on your 2002 as well.
The washer goes on the longer tapered side. See my web page for a picture:
http://www.angelfire.com/mt2/mikesgs500/rejetting

[JohNLA]

Thanks Mike and Adam
Mike, your tutorial was what got me through the process and I am proud to say my GS is running and now wil idle If I am ever in you neck of the woods the beers are on me.
I only added one washer because I could not find ones smal enough at Radio Shack, Auto Zone or Home Depot. I ended up using some 4mm washers I found after dremeling half of the outside diameter off to get them to fit in the shaft.
I was not able to adjust the pilot air screws I had no trouble turning the screws with the carbs off the bike but I could not get them to turn once I had it all back together :dunno: I don't know maybe I need a special small screwdriver . I cut the end off an old screwdriver but I couldn't get that to work either.

[miket]

Hi John, I'll be happy to accept those beers   I am glad it was useful.
As you can see in the last picture, I used a screwdriver drill bit. I could turn it by hand, but you can use a 1/4" open end wrench or socket to turn it if it's too hard. You can also buy a cheap set of S-shaped screwdrivers. I bought mine form K-mart for like $2. I haven't used them though.

[Ed89]

I was not able to adjust the pilot air screws I had no trouble turning the screws with the carbs off the bike but I could not get them to turn once I had it all back together :dunno: I don't know maybe I need a special small screwdriver . I cut the end off an old screwdriver but I couldn't get that to work either.

I don't know how different your carb if from my 89, but I managed to adjust the carb installed with a flat head bit.  Had to wear a glove while adjusting as the engine was a little hot.

Cheers,
Ed.

[JohNLA]

Thanks Ed. I tried using the flat head bit but it wont budge. I will try again to loosen it when the engine is cool.
Today was the first time I refered to my GS as a POS  
My brand new $86 Yuasa battery is dead :x
It died the same way the stock one did while the engine was good and warm. If it was a car I would think altenator but I have no clue where to look on the GS :dunno:

[mayz2010]

Get a multimeter what a electrion use's to get what voltages go though things, while the bike is off put use the setting on DC on the battery the setting is 20 on the left not right, connect to the batter u should have just over 12 volts, if not the battery is dead start the bike if u can, and then see how much volts ur getting out of the bike it should be over 13 volts if it's over the reg/rect is gone if below then i don't know might be fly wheel. hope that works

[JohNLA]

Thanks Mayz, I did a search after I posted and that was the course of action I was planning on taking but it is reasuring to hear it from others.

[pantablo]

I hope you sort it out soon since its your means of making a living....Doing palomar saturday...interested?

[JohNLA]

I took it to the shop Shhhh, don't tell Sinrath.
I didn't have a digital multimeter to test things so I got lazy and took it in.
I will have to get back to you about the Saturday ride.

[The Buddha]

   
A digital multimeter costs like $17.99 at walmart.
Cool.
Srinath.

[JohNLA]

and a cab ride to get there and back would have cost me $60 but I will look for one next time I'm at Sprawl Mart.

[The Buddha]

Ok fine... you could have asked me for one... I'd have sent one over via Priority mail. Just kidding.... I would have sent it but its not practical waiting a week to read the voltage.
Cool.
Srinath.

[JohNLA]

Well, my local mechanic took 2 1/2 days to charge the battery and tell me he can't test the charging system until the carb problem is sorted :x He said it would be another $165 and it would be at least 2 days until they can get to it. Needless, to say I went and picked up my bike and I won't be patronising that shop anymore.
Last night I tore the carbs apart once again. This time I removed the 2 washers and returned it to stock and it is working just like before I started any of this.
I can get it to idle even a low below 1k rpm to set the air pilot screws.
The problem is when I am moving at 30mph or higher and come to a stop. It will 9 times out of 10 conk out. Occasionally, the idle will jump up to 3k but I can usually make it drop back down be putting it in gear.
I am starting to run out of ideas.

[The Buddha]

Now that you have learnt your lesson "Never take it to a shop... especially if you want it fixed right" OK the alternator can be diagnosed independent of the carbs.
Get a digital multi meter. Or if you want mine... I'll send you tommorow.
Check the voltage at the battery. electrexusa.com has a trouble shooting chart... but it it makes 13.5 volts or so at idle... I'll leave it alone for now.
Idle dies if you shut it after 30mph or hangs when you make a sudden stop. Ok are all the cables free to move about. Does the problem get worse when you turn left or right on centerstand... I mean at idle turn bars left to the lock, and try right. See if it changes.
Also check if the choke is on due to cable slipping out of the place its supposed to sit in. Check if Throttle cable is hanging. Then check if all the hoses are connected to the airbox, the one at the bottom and the top one to the valve cover. Make sure the tank is vented, fuel is flowing and see if its worse in on/res than prime. Then check for vacuum leaks with WD40. Lemme know what all these turn out to be. Then see if we can narrow it further.
Cool.
Srinath.

[Kerry]

Since your carbs are clean, the choke is my first suspect.  On one of my Canada rides there was a day or two when the bike would die every time I made a full stop.  It didn't happen very often - since we were putting on a lot of highway miles - but it frustrated me.  I finally noticed that my choke lever was pulled back just a bit, and I turned it all the way off.  End of problem.

I asked my brother later, "Does it make sense that having the choke slightly ON would kill the engine at low revs once the engine is warm?"  He said something that amounted to "Well, DUH ... of course!"     And then a couple days later it happened again and it took me a while to remember what the solution was.    

============

Back to YOUR bike.

I wouldn't be surprised if it exhibits the high idle when the engine isn't warmed up all the way.  That's what the choke is supposed to do, right?  But then if the choke stays on long after the bike is warmed up, it makes sense that it would "conk out" at full stops.

I don't know anything about the 01+ carbs, but in the earlier carbs it can be a little tricky to get the "fuel enricher plungers" snapped back into place correctly.  Any idea whether that part of the procedure went OK?  (Did you pop them out & clean their "innards" when you opened the carbs?)

Otherwise, I would examine the choke cable - especially the spring, etc. at the "business end" like Srinath mentioned.  You might even try lubing it to eliminate any worries about it not being free to move/spring back.

[JohNLA]

Bike battery is giving 14 to 15 volts when started. I have an analog meter and I am not sure if I am reading it correctly but I haven't had to charge the battery in a couple days. (finger crossed)

All cables are checked and working properly. The idle does not change by moving the handlebars and I have checked the choke cable several times on and of the bike and I can see nothing wrong.

I tried WD40 sprayed around the carb to engine boots and at the air filter with no change in the revs.

I removed the hose that connects to the bottom of the airbox. The one that is capped at the other end. Clymer suggested cleaning it, if I ride in the rain. So I pulled it off and started cleaning it . I got all excited thinking I had just found the problem while cleaning but it turns out the is a little foam filter in there. At first I thought I found a 1 inch plug of dirt.
I'll let you know how it goes.

[JohNLA]

Update:
Cleaning the airbox drain hose did nothing.
The battery is now dead and on a charger.
Tommorow, I will try and find a digital multimeter and try checking the signal generator and ignitor unit.
BTW, I pulled the plugs and got a nice blue spark and I could feel compression. The engine sounded pretty cool as a single

[Rema1000]

Some quick things to check:
FIRST
-water level is OK
-battery is fully charged using a known-good charger
THEN
-voltage with the bike off is about the same when you finished charging it, as it is the next morning.
-voltage at 3krpm+ is above 14.1v
-voltage is always below 15v, at any RPM

Some stupid tips:

It's safe to jump-start the bike from a car battery, if the car isn't running.  

It's helpful to park up high in the parking ramp at work, so you can bump-start on the way down

BTW, unless your bike just won't run before the carb was fixed, there is no reason that the mechanic couldn't check the charging system.