Buying 1991 GS500 as a first bike?

[RadekSkylark]

Hallo everyone

Past summer I finally got my licence, and as I'm a student currently and will be studying for at least 3years I'm trying to find a cheap bike for the first one. Actully it wont be the first one, when I was a kid I used to own we 50cc bikes, and did own a Honda VTZ250...
Today I found a GS500 which costs 680$ US, seller says that it's totaly fine and there is no major problems with it so I should be able to pass the anual inspection. As it is 120 miles from me, I want to be really sure is this a good deal or not, before risking going all that trip to get disapointed or maybe lucky So I just wanted to get some inputs about how the bike looks, and what are your thoughts about its price. Also I would be thankful if you could point out what to check if I go and view the bike, as I'm not familar with technical stuff on bikes, though I have done a turbo project on Honda Civic

Here are the pictures of the 1991 GS500 with 33k miles on it, for 680$:












Other 1991-1995 GS500 cost around 1100$ and up. Just for comparison, this is unregistred 1997 GS500, with better milage (I suspect so, although it is from Holand, so maybe it was riden alot), costs 1150$ without registration but I will need to register it and it will cost around 100$, so total of around 1250$.



Just to clarify, my budget for the first bike (if I want to buy it for next season, which I would like to, cause I better would ride a cheap bike than would not ride anything) is somewhere around 700-800$. Of course if I would skip the upcoming season and save up my money I'm pretty sure I could be looking at a price range of 1500$ then. And then I could try and get my hands on a cheap GSF600, or XJ600, or something similar, maybe a cheap CBR600F2... Althogh I also want to invest in good gear, which will throw me back for another 1000$ down the road...

Some inputs? Should I suspect that the bike has been rebuilt once, or could it been going for 33k miles without a rebuild and a rebuild will be needed soon? Should I skip a season and save up for a better bike?

[RadekSkylark]

Someone with an input on this?

[sledge]

At that age and mileage you need to check the splines on the output shaft before anything else.

Is that a semi-heamatic fridge compressor in the background?

[adidasguy]

Run it. Take it for a ride.
If engine runs good, no bad smoke then it is a steal.

Expect to do new tires if they are more than a few years old. Might need brake pads. At $650 if it runs half way decent, it is a steal.
Any maintenance you need to do people are here to help you and guide you. These are fun bikes and easy to work on.

Ask about drops. That's NOT a bad thing - just good to know. You can spot drops by scratches on the engine and/or bent brake/clutch levers.
Why selling it? How long has it been sitting?
Oh, look in the tank. Some rust is OK and expected. Major rust or signs of leaks are bad.
Expect maybe $100 - $300 to bring it into like new shape. That's normal for a used bike so don't be scared.
Check the chain and sprockets. Never hurts to put on new chain and sprockets.

Where are you located?

Oh, good running bikes usually go for $1000 or more. You might be getting a real deal!

[mister]

Patience friend.

First, welcome to the forum. A lot of information can be found by making good use of the search function - top right. Doesn't always give you the most recent or accurate results, but it still helps. 

Now for things to look for.

To start, visit this page and read it. It's not GS500 specific but very good http://www.clarity.net/~adam/buying-bike.html And you can familiarize yourself with the bike by watching this lengthy video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzTpSMWFhbY

All bikes require more maintenance than cars. Good for us a lot of that is more visible than on cars.

Chain

Check the chain and rear sprocket. Ask the seller to put the bike on the center stand if you don't know the technique (the video above shows you) or just feel uncomfortable doing it. With the bike in neutral, spin the rear wheel and watch the chain. You are looking for excessive movement up and down and noise. A good chain - that is, one not full of rust, with lube on it and in which the sprockets are fine - will have a consistent noise and the chain will not appear to move up and down. Up and down usually means a kinked link. As it goes around the sprocket the effect is to tighten the chain - the bottom of the chain, which you can, appears to rise. The kink isn't a full bend and can be very slight...



A worn sprocket and dud chain mean you will need to change them soon. No chain will last 33k miles. And depending on the care the owner has given it, it could be due for a new one soon as they may have gotten 17k miles out of each chain.



Also check for play in the chain...



Suzuki suggests in the owner's manual - download a copy from the wiki http://wiki.gstwins.com Maintenance / How To Books -  a play of 20-30mm (an inch to inch and a quarter). Now in the pic above you'll see a bolt in the middle of the rear sprocket, which also goes through a small longer hole on the swingarm. That's where the chain tension will be adjusted. If that is all the way back (not tightening left) and the chain is loose as, then you'll need a new chain and sprockets (wise to change them at the same time).

A badly neglected chain and sprockets is an indication of neglect in other bike maintenance.

Fork Seals

Have a look at the first photo. The fork closest to the camera. Midway between the fender and the indicator stalk you can see a dark ring around the fork. That is a line of grime pushed up that high, as that is how far down the fork plunged under braking and riding. If that dark ring is excessively oily your fork seals are on the way out and may need replacing soon. Also look at the rear of the small black plastic on the forks but just above the fender. Excessive leaking will trickle onto that black plastic bit. So if the seller wipes away for fork grime push down hard a few times on the front and then double check - double check after a test ride too.

Engine Oil

Check it while the bike is on the center stand from your chain check. You're looking for the color and amount. Remember, bad chain care indicates bad other care. Ideally, the oil would be honey color and near the full mark. To check the oil, unscrew the oil cap - right hand side of the engine, wipe clean, then reinsert into hole BUT only rest it on the hole, do not screw it back in. Pull out and take reading.

Dark tar colored oil indicates time for an oil chain and filter change.

At the front of the engine, at the bottom, you will see the oil filter cover. Check all the bolts are there.



Starting / Riding

It's cold in the US at the moment so the humble GS will be harder to start. Seller might try to prewarm the bike for you so it starts right up. Only thing is, that can mask other starting issues not present when it's cold. So feel for heat from the engine to know if it has been prestarted. Read the thread below explaining cold weather starting. And know and accept that a cold start in cold temps might not happen first go - specially if the bike is kept outside. That is the nature of the GS500.

Plenty videos online of running GS500s so you can know how they should sound.

Take the bike for a spin. 4th gear at 37.5mph is roughly 4000rpm. If they are pretty close - speed and rpm - you have stock sprockets and know the owner has not put different ones in. 4th gear can take the bike from that lowly speed to 87mph at 9000 rpm (mine anyway). Not suggesting you go that fast ona test ride. Just that, as the bike can do that if the test bike struggles - eg tops out at 6000 - you know something isn't right somewhere - might be fuel or any number of reasons.

Underseat

Check under the seat. usually only a couple of things to see - tool kit and battery. How does it look? Battery all corroded and whatnot?

Tires

Self evident. Nice deep treat no cracks? Check the age. It's usually in an ovoid slight depression on the side of the tire. Indicates the week the tire was made and the year. As such...



First one is 10th week 2004, second one is 43rd week 2009. If there are only 3 numbers then the tire was from before 2000.

The above is just a cursory inspection. Just gives you an idea of Some of the things you Could be up for right away. But at $650 is seems like a good bargain.

Do tell us where you're located. Plenty of members here. Some might be close by you and can help.

[RadekSkylark]

Hey guys Big thank you for the advices given, as it's really quite hard to jump from cars to bikes everythings quite different

I'm located in Latvia, Baltic states. It's winter here, but as we don't have snow this winter yet  the temperature is around +2-4 celsius.

Also wanted to ask, if I won't be able to get someone experianced in bikes with me to view the bike, from reading the article posted and checking some videos of gs500 should I be able to get a good understanding of the condition of the bike and not make the wrong decision purchasing it?

P.S. As I understand 680$ compared to 820$+ to other gs500 localy should be a good deal if there are no major problems with the bike, correct?

Thanks alot!!!

[GS500F2004]

Does look like it's been used a fair bit which the 53,000km seems to indicate. Sounds like a good price, but it's hard to say because you're in Latvia, only you will be able to know what used bikes of that vintage go for! Have you looked around for parts availability there? If parts are hard to come by for the GS500 there which I doubt then that could be some expensive $$$ shipping.

Being such an old bike and popular in Europe I guess there'll be plenty of parts there. At that age I suspect the engine will burn a bit of oil, I'm sure the others here will chime in on that.

[RadekSkylark]

Does look like it's been used a fair bit which the 53,000km seems to indicate. Sounds like a good price, but it's hard to say because you're in Latvia, only you will be able to know what used bikes of that vintage go for! Have you looked around for parts availability there? If parts are hard to come by for the GS500 there which I doubt then that could be some expensive $$$ shipping.

Being such an old bike and popular in Europe I guess there'll be plenty of parts there. At that age I suspect the engine will burn a bit of oil, I'm sure the others here will chime in on that.

I would not say that there are a lot of used parts here localy, but there is some, and as Latvia is not a big country, we got Estonia and Lithuania in neighborhood, so parts could be located in those countries as well, and shipping would not be that high.

As I mentioned in the OP, the next GS500's are from 820$+, the is a GPZ500 1988 for 840$, but in the price range of 800-1000$ there are basically only few GS500, couple of GPZ500, and some bad condition bikes like YZF600, FZR600 etc. which look like they have been through hell This currently is the cheapest running somewhat decent condition bike localy sold.

[mister]

The price difference between the six hundred dollar bike and the eight hundred one is not significant. The price difference alone will not tell you one is better than the other. Private sellers - even dealers - have an odd way of pricing things.

To me, one bike is shown "as is" the other has been given a spiff up to look better - doesn't mean it is better, but it could show some care at least.

One other thing you'll want to check on is your country's horsepower requirements - same applies for the one from Holland. We know, for instance, that in the UK you can get a restricted GS500 and an unrestricted one. Maybe Sledge or someone else in the UK can chime in with any visible way to tell if a restriction is in place.

In Australia we now have a Written Off Vehicle Register (WVR). Any time a bike is in a crash and insurance is involved, it is noted in this register as either a Statutory Write Off (cannot be registered for the road ever again - only now good for parts or a track bike) or a Repairable Write Off (cost to repair damage with new parts exceeded the insured amount). Might pay to find out if your country has something similar.

When we buy bikes over here, we pay for a REVS check (Register of Encumbered Vehicles) now knows as PPSR check (Personal Property Securities Register). Standard is to check for any encumbrances (money owing, matching vin and engine numbers) but now also includes a check in the WVR.

Regarding, getting a good understanding of the condition of the bike and not make the wrong decision purchasing it... watch the videos, read the articles, etc. Then head on down to a local dealer and look over the bikes there - armed with your new found knowledge - and see what you see. Go look at brand new bikes, then go look at the cheapest of the cheap of any brand and engine capacity and run the bikes through your newly-acquired-knowledge-filter. Good practice.

Unfortunately, unless your do a full engine diagnostic there is no guarantee the bike you buy will run for long. BUT, if the rest of the maintenance is good, and everything else matches up well, and the engine sounds good, pulls good and isn't leaking, blowing smoke, etc., then you Should be fine. Also understand, however, that even with good maintenance an owner may have gradually gotten used to a problem which came on slowly and they might not be aware of anything, while you will notice everything.

At the end of the day, after your purchase you will question yourself about whether you did the right thing or not and maybe should have bought the other bike (whatever other bikes there is at the time). It's called Buyers Remorse. Expect it. Then go buy some bling or something (rim tape, tank protector, whatever) to help reinforce your decision as correct and then get out riding 

While the GS500 is known to have quite bulletproof engines (100k miles well known and documented), they will not last long when run without oil. Which is why it is so imperative to take the bike for a spin so you can feel the engine working underload, as opposed to just revving it standing next to it.

When you ride and apply the rear brake, expect a squeak. This is normal.

[the mole]

If the seller didn't have the time to give it a quick wash before he took the photos, to me it indicates he may not have put much effort into maintenance. Other than that it looks OK in the photos.

[RadekSkylark]

The price difference between the six hundred dollar bike and the eight hundred one is not significant. The price difference alone will not tell you one is better than the other. Private sellers - even dealers - have an odd way of pricing things.

To me, one bike is shown "as is" the other has been given a spiff up to look better - doesn't mean it is better, but it could show some care at least.

One other thing you'll want to check on is your country's horsepower requirements - same applies for the one from Holland. We know, for instance, that in the UK you can get a restricted GS500 and an unrestricted one. Maybe Sledge or someone else in the UK can chime in with any visible way to tell if a restriction is in place.

In Australia we now have a Written Off Vehicle Register (WVR). Any time a bike is in a crash and insurance is involved, it is noted in this register as either a Statutory Write Off (cannot be registered for the road ever again - only now good for parts or a track bike) or a Repairable Write Off (cost to repair damage with new parts exceeded the insured amount). Might pay to find out if your country has something similar.

When we buy bikes over here, we pay for a REVS check (Register of Encumbered Vehicles) now knows as PPSR check (Personal Property Securities Register). Standard is to check for any encumbrances (money owing, matching vin and engine numbers) but now also includes a check in the WVR.

Regarding, getting a good understanding of the condition of the bike and not make the wrong decision purchasing it... watch the videos, read the articles, etc. Then head on down to a local dealer and look over the bikes there - armed with your new found knowledge - and see what you see. Go look at brand new bikes, then go look at the cheapest of the cheap of any brand and engine capacity and run the bikes through your newly-acquired-knowledge-filter. Good practice.

Unfortunately, unless your do a full engine diagnostic there is no guarantee the bike you buy will run for long. BUT, if the rest of the maintenance is good, and everything else matches up well, and the engine sounds good, pulls good and isn't leaking, blowing smoke, etc., then you Should be fine. Also understand, however, that even with good maintenance an owner may have gradually gotten used to a problem which came on slowly and they might not be aware of anything, while you will notice everything.

At the end of the day, after your purchase you will question yourself about whether you did the right thing or not and maybe should have bought the other bike (whatever other bikes there is at the time). It's called Buyers Remorse. Expect it. Then go buy some bling or something (rim tape, tank protector, whatever) to help reinforce your decision as correct and then get out riding 

While the GS500 is known to have quite bulletproof engines (100k miles well known and documented), they will not last long when run without oil. Which is why it is so imperative to take the bike for a spin so you can feel the engine working underload, as opposed to just revving it standing next to it.

When you ride and apply the rear brake, expect a squeak. This is normal.

As this particular bike was for sale when season was still going, it costed around 950$, and now its anual inspection has ended (I will need to go for an anual inspection +pay 100$ fee for use or public roads for 2 years), I think it should be in good order... OH, and I made a terrible mistake, the white bike in the OP costs 1100$!!! And that is the next cheapest GS500, but as I mentioned above, there is GPZ500 for 850$. So the price difference between those GS500 is quite big.

We dont have horsepower requirments, as far as I know. Also, if that bike would have a restriction to 33bhp, could I remove it?

About the insurance thing... if the bike is ok, it can be registred, as this one as far as I know is registred, it should be alowed in traffic. But thanks for reminding me that I should also check for that!

Also, if the engine smoke is a little bit blue, is it really bad, or nothing major?

Thanks alot!!!

[GS500F2004]

The price difference between the six hundred dollar bike and the eight hundred one is not significant. The price difference alone will not tell you one is better than the other. Private sellers - even dealers - have an odd way of pricing things.

To me, one bike is shown "as is" the other has been given a spiff up to look better - doesn't mean it is better, but it could show some care at least.

One other thing you'll want to check on is your country's horsepower requirements - same applies for the one from Holland. We know, for instance, that in the UK you can get a restricted GS500 and an unrestricted one. Maybe Sledge or someone else in the UK can chime in with any visible way to tell if a restriction is in place.

In Australia we now have a Written Off Vehicle Register (WVR). Any time a bike is in a crash and insurance is involved, it is noted in this register as either a Statutory Write Off (cannot be registered for the road ever again - only now good for parts or a track bike) or a Repairable Write Off (cost to repair damage with new parts exceeded the insured amount). Might pay to find out if your country has something similar.

When we buy bikes over here, we pay for a REVS check (Register of Encumbered Vehicles) now knows as PPSR check (Personal Property Securities Register). Standard is to check for any encumbrances (money owing, matching vin and engine numbers) but now also includes a check in the WVR.

Regarding, getting a good understanding of the condition of the bike and not make the wrong decision purchasing it... watch the videos, read the articles, etc. Then head on down to a local dealer and look over the bikes there - armed with your new found knowledge - and see what you see. Go look at brand new bikes, then go look at the cheapest of the cheap of any brand and engine capacity and run the bikes through your newly-acquired-knowledge-filter. Good practice.

Unfortunately, unless your do a full engine diagnostic there is no guarantee the bike you buy will run for long. BUT, if the rest of the maintenance is good, and everything else matches up well, and the engine sounds good, pulls good and isn't leaking, blowing smoke, etc., then you Should be fine. Also understand, however, that even with good maintenance an owner may have gradually gotten used to a problem which came on slowly and they might not be aware of anything, while you will notice everything.

At the end of the day, after your purchase you will question yourself about whether you did the right thing or not and maybe should have bought the other bike (whatever other bikes there is at the time). It's called Buyers Remorse. Expect it. Then go buy some bling or something (rim tape, tank protector, whatever) to help reinforce your decision as correct and then get out riding 

While the GS500 is known to have quite bulletproof engines (100k miles well known and documented), they will not last long when run without oil. Which is why it is so imperative to take the bike for a spin so you can feel the engine working underload, as opposed to just revving it standing next to it.

When you ride and apply the rear brake, expect a squeak. This is normal.

As this particular bike was for sale when season was still going, it costed around 950$, and now its anual inspection has ended (I will need to go for an anual inspection +pay 100$ fee for use or public roads for 2 years), I think it should be in good order... OH, and I made a terrible mistake, the white bike in the OP costs 1100$!!! And that is the next cheapest GS500, but as I mentioned above, there is GPZ500 for 850$. So the price difference between those GS500 is quite big.

We dont have horsepower requirments, as far as I know. Also, if that bike would have a restriction to 33bhp, could I remove it?

About the insurance thing... if the bike is ok, it can be registred, as this one as far as I know is registred, it should be alowed in traffic. But thanks for reminding me that I should also check for that!

Also, if the engine smoke is a little bit blue, is it really bad, or nothing major?

Thanks alot!!!

Blue smoke means burning oil as would be normal for that many km's, but how much is something you need to look into very carefully. How do you know it has blue smoke though? You might want to take it for a ride, once warm give it some good hard throttle and see how much blue smoke is blowing out.

[RadekSkylark]

I dont know yet, I'm just asking to know if there will be some, what should I espect

P.S. Just checked the metadata of the 2,3,4 picture, there where taken yesterday, which of course is nice to know how the bike looks now not whene pictures are half year old At least it seems that rear type has still some rubber

[RadekSkylark]

Just edited OP adding few more pictures, which seller sent me today, just didnt saw them before.

Ok, as I now know the plate number I was able to gather some publicly avaliable information... the owner said to me that bike is registered as 250cc....

So, the info I found is that this bike is actually registered as Suzuki RGV250, and it last time did anual inspection to be able to ride in traffic in 2009, ODO was 29,5k miles, there were no defects found on the bike at 2009 by inspectors.

The question now is, if there is everything ok with the registration and VIN numbers and stuff, how could this bike gathered 3k+ miles for the past years without official anual inspection which is needed to ride in traffic??? I would guess that maybe in 2009 it was a real RGV250 at the inspection though that would not explain ODO readings, which kind of makes sense.

I'm really interested to hear what owner will say about this...

EDIT: new facts on the horizon - there is an anual fee debt on the bike dating from 2010 to 2013, total amount 98$... that means that the bike didn't have anual inspection for last there year indeed. When I talked to the owner today he said that he owns this bike for a year or so... that means either he lies or the bike is not registered on him... cause when you re-register vehicle you need to pay for all the debts... This is really starting to turn from a good deal to some kind of mystery. Now I'm really interested what the owner will say about this. Though if he'll drop at least 80$ from the bike, so that the price sets to 600$, and everytihng else including registration VIN numbers and stuff is ok + the bike itself is ok, I should take it home

[adidasguy]

Registered as wrong model makes me run away.
The VIN is stamped on the steering column and is on a sticker.
Insure the real, stamped VIN matches the title.
A vin for a GS500 starts with JS1GM51A. Decode a VIN and that indicates a G500.
I would not buy it UNLESS the seller took it for a current inspection and paid all penalties.
Buy it as it is now, and all it is good for is a parts bike. If you can't register it, it is parts.

[radodrill]

Whenever buying any vehicle private party you want to be sure that the seller has a clean title in his name.  Also be aware that to get the title transferred into your name you will need to pay the tax and title to the DMV (and registration to use it on the road).

If the vehicle isn't currently registered, then you have to be more attentive and look for things that could affect it's ability to pass inspections (if your state/country requires them).

If it was titled as a different vehicle; that warrants even more scrutiny.

[mister]

A mechanic doesn't make such a mistake as titling a wrong bike - well, maybe in your neck of the woods. I'm now thinking, he had an  RGV250 and after he crashed it or whatever, simply took the plate off and put it on the GS500. That would explain why not subsequent test - cause there was no RGV250 left to test and it would have been noticed as a GS500 instead.

There are other possibilities. Like maybe he did buy it, but didn't get any paperwork to transfer it to him. So now he has a GS500 in someone else's name with his old plates on and... yeah... sounds thin to me.

Check the VIN against the ownership registration papers. Ask him to photograph both to show you.

Too many mysteries there for me. I'd give that one a miss. Might be nothing - but - could be a whole heap of headaches sorting out the mess. After all, if he lies about one thing what else is he lying about?

[RadekSkylark]

Just talked with this current owner of the bike. So, the bike is registered on another person - his friend. He claims that there are no problems re-regitering it on me, cause the friend will come to re-register if needed. Also when I asked how they maneged to register it as an 250, and is there everything fine with VIN numbers and stuff, he said that everythings fine with VIN... When I asked about anual inspection, he said that I can check in on my own in the CSDD (road safety direction office) with the plate number, which he now know I have, I said that I found out that the bike hasn't had anual inspection for past three years, he said that it could be possible... Also, when we talked I pretended to use the online CSDD portal to check how much is the anual fee and debt is shown in the same window, when I told him there is a debt, he didn't know what to say... I think he really didn't know that Cause since 2010, that were law changes and even if the vehicle was not getting anual inspection and was not used, if it was registered you had to pay the fee. Until 2010 if you didn't go anual inspection you didn't need to pay fee, if it was registered. So, he said that hell check it out tomorow and will call me, we'll see if he does

I mean in the end, if he calls me, gives me a good price on the bike, I can go view it, if everthing is fine, if everything is fine with the VIN, or even if it is not the GS500, I can still pay 10$ @ CSDD so they physicly check the VIN, like they do when you first register vehicle in out country, and if they say its ok, then really should it bother me?

Thanks guys!

[mister]

Ah, the old "It's not my bike even though I originally said it was, it's a friends and after paying the money he'll help sort it if needed" trick.

Um, yeah, ok, someone else's bike. That someone else is the only one who can sign the bike over to someone else.

I'd be getting the ID of this friend to double check it. Anyone can Say they are anyone and sign as that person. You'd need to see ID to be sure.

Good you are doing your due diligence. Keep looking into it and let us know how you go.

So how did they manage to register it as a 250?

Does your search give you the VIN that belongs to the plate? How does that VIN stack up to the actual VIN of the GS you're looking at?

[RadekSkylark]

He didn't know how did they registered it as an 250cc... but there are few bikes here in Latvia that are registered as smaller engine bikes, seen it.

As far as re-registration process goes in CSDD, to re register, you need an technical passport of the bike, where there is info of the bike, VIN, owner and other, then you need the owner, and the buyer, we go into CSDD give our both documents - licences or passports, give the bikes technical licence, pay the fee, and then it gets re-registered to my name. It is common practice to transfer money just before we go into the little cabinet where the operator of the CSDD sits, where the re-registration is done. So, to avoid mistakes, I just should check the technical pasport of the bike, real owners ID, and the VIN, if everything matches, then I should procees with paying 10$ for VIN checking in the CSDD to be 100% sure that there are no problems with VIN number. If everything goes well there there should be no problems further.

I mean, before going to view it I will ask the seller to confirm validity of everything I've mentioned above, so that there wont be any surprices when I'm there (120miles to go to view the bike). I will tell everything I'm about to ask him, that I want to see the ID of real owner, I will want to check VIN by myself and also by CSDD, and so on... if that won't trouble him by phone everything should go well.

P.S. also I will ask the owner the VIN of the technical passport, if it checks out with the starting letters and numbers as someone mentioned above, it should be fine. If it doesn't, I don't think that I'm gonna go and view it, cause as far as I know, there is no good way to alter the VIN, every VIN plate that has been touch in some way is really suspiciusly looked at CSDD and they dont let them PASS.