brakeing options

[joweaver88]

Crasm,

Once you do the suspension and brake work, the bike is amazing. The GS has a surprisingly good frame compared to most of the budget bikes. It's lighter weight and lower speeds mean that the suspension works better than a super-sport.

When setup properly, the GS500 is insanely confidence inspiring - my best laptimes are on the GS; I haven't been able to beat those times on my BMW or my wife's CBR. My trackday videos are out there if you doubt what the GS is capable of.

Awesome, I would like to see these video! 

[burning1]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gymLfLw654Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mj1g2TgYmQU <-- I'm on #857, lined up to the front right of the camera bike.

[Janx101]

niiiiice burning1 !! .... in the straights against the 600's meh!? ... but you and that machine are corner monsters!! 

not been on a track myself.... and dont try riding anywhere NEAR that pace .... but now i feel positively ....

 

edit.... bahahahah ... wait... theres a video! 

[gsJack]

+1 burning1   Very nice.

When I rode that Nighthawk over to the dealer about 40 miles from home it was a cold day in March.  It was about 38F when I started home on the new 97 GS a day I still remember.  After finally adjusting to it's leaness and getting it warmed up I hit moderately hilly twisty River Road and cut loose.  It felt lik a sportbike right out of the box compared to the NH and I've been sold on GS handling for the 15 years and 180k miles I've been riding them since.   

[TheOzTurkish]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gymLfLw654Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mj1g2TgYmQU <-- I'm on #857, lined up to the front right of the camera bike.

That is some wicked shaZam!, howd you get it so far over

[Janx101]

Confidence that comes with knee sliders? ... And just him knowing how I reckon!! 

[TheOzTurkish]

Confidence that comes with knee sliders? ... And just him knowing how I reckon!! 

True that, would be fun though and to see the looks on some of the big boys faces at the local track

[burning1]

That is some wicked shaZam!, howd you get it so far over

The GS500 grips surprisingly well once the basic suspension upgrades are complete. The right tires, tire pressures, and the right surface are also pretty key (racetrack pavement is grippier than street pavement.) At those lean angles, the most critical thing is to relax on the bike and let it do it's thing. Most of the time, when theres a crash, it was caused by the rider and not the bike.

[Janx101]

What's the blue bottle thing just above the belly pan?

[burning1]

It's a Dasani water bottle. Was a baby bottle before that, but the baby bottle fell off. I found the Dasani bottle in the trash.

...

If you look closely, you'll see some drain tubes leading into it.

[Janx101]

Saw the tubes.... But.... Drain tubes? ... It's a pee bottle? 

How long you racing?

[robfriedenberger]

Amazing riding, I'd really like to see this guy on  600.....I guess it would be dumb because he would be lapping every one


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[burning1]

You'd think that, but I'm slower when I ride a 600. A lot of it comes down to confidence and setup.

[Badot]

Just out of curiosity, do you feel if you put as much time and effort into the suspension/setup on a 600 as you did on the gs500 that you'd still be faster and more comfortable on the gs?

[joweaver88]

I have no hard evidence to back this up, but going by appearances, it appears that the GS500 has a significantly lower center of gravity than a supersport (600, 750, or 1000). The engine on the GS is very low slung, almost like it is hanging there. Supersports have their (heavier) engine mounted higher and the fuel tank sits behind or in front of the motor... and of course the actual fuel tank is a plastic fuel cell under the cover, but half of whats underneath the cover is just more engine. The higher center of gravity would make changing the lean angle of the bike (I am sure there is a correct scientific term for that) much quicker, but the lower center of gravity on the GS would give you more stability at all angles, especially extreme knee dragging angles.

I am probably wrong though. 

[Badot]

I'd imagine it would be the opposite, going in quicker but being less 'stable' in turns. Lower center of gravity means the 'pivot' point is lower... you'd have to move the bottom of the bike less distance to get the same lean angle. Then the lack of 'stability' could be compensated for with rake/trail.

But of course I have very little experience in this field so anything I say is 100% conjecture. Perhaps someone with a background in this stuff can chime in.

[joweaver88]

I'd imagine it would be the opposite, going in quicker but being less 'stable' in turns. Lower center of gravity means the 'pivot' point is lower... you'd have to move the bottom of the bike less distance to get the same lean angle. Then the lack of 'stability' could be compensated for with rake/trail.

But of course I have very little experience in this field so anything I say is 100% conjecture. Perhaps someone with a background in this stuff can chime in.

The amount you move the bike would be constant, its not as thought the frame is a noodle, it is solid therefore if you have two bikes with the similar frame geometries the bottom of each bike will move the same amount to produce the same lean in angle. However the way in which it behaves will be different... imagine a pendulum and then an upside down pendulum and think how they would behave if the pivot point was at the bottom (the tires of a bike are the pivot point). The pendulum with the weight at the bottom (the GS500) would take more force to push over, however it would right itself and bounce right back, making it very stable. However the pendulum with the weight at the top (supersport) would push over very quickly with very little force and would carry the momentum with it all the way until you stop it or it flops over (laying the bike down and going for a slide). Conversely a bike with a higher center of gravity would be more difficult to bring back to the upright position hence why it would be less stable.

However this is not taking into consideration the gyro effect... so i dont know, but I think my simplification is accurate.

[Badot]

Doing some rough 'math' in my head... this is why I hate physics... I'm beginning to feel that it would mainly be a question of rotational inertia rather than center of mass. Beyond my willing level of thought at the moment 

One of my trains of thought right now... Properly leaning requires traction on the front wheel... I think this can be agreed on. Let's say one bike has a center of gravity 1 foot off the ground, and one has a center of gravity of 2 feet off the ground. Lean a bike to 30 degrees off the ground, and you've halved the height of the center of gravity (trigonometry) -- the 1' COG bike has to lower its COG by .5 feet to transition from upright to leaned, and the 2' COG bike has to lower its COG by 1 foot to go from upright to leaned. The only thing pulling the bike down is gravity... so is it quicker to 'fall' half a foot, or a foot? ('falling' is required to keep the front wheel traction)

[joweaver88]

I think you are conceptualizing this incorrectly... but we are starting to hi-jack the thread. It all comes down to the bike acting like a lever to move its own weight.... here read this, it supports my interpretation (high CG equals faster/easier turn in but less stability... low CG equals slower/harder turn in but more stability).

http://motorcycletripper.com/?page_id=379420

[burning1]

I have no hard evidence to back this up, but going by appearances, it appears that the GS500 has a significantly lower center of gravity than a supersport (600, 750, or 1000). The engine on the GS is very low slung, almost like it is hanging there. Supersports have their (heavier) engine mounted higher and the fuel tank sits behind or in front of the motor... and of course the actual fuel tank is a plastic fuel cell under the cover, but half of whats underneath the cover is just more engine. The higher center of gravity would make changing the lean angle of the bike (I am sure there is a correct scientific term for that) much quicker, but the lower center of gravity on the GS would give you more stability at all angles, especially extreme knee dragging angles.

I am probably wrong though. 

A lower center of gravity will make the bike feel lighter and easier to manage at low speeds. You'll be less likely to drop the bike.

For a race bike, you want the mass centralized. When turning aggressively, the bike turns around the center of mass; the wheels actually move to the outside of the turn, and the top moves to the inside. If you watch race videos, you can see this behavior. Mass centralization makes the bike a little easier to turn.

A higher center of gravity also slightly increases ground clearance, due to the way the contact patch moves across the tire. in a turn, the contact patch isn't under the center of the bike; it moves to the inside edge of the tire.  Installing wider tires has the same effect.