Clutch, gear problems

[Suzuki Stevo]

The MSF course in the States teaches us to hold the clutch in at stop lights for a quick escape, a wet clutch can be held in without any damage.

Jack, you've obviously never had a wasp fly up into your helmet whilst sitting at the lights! That's guaranteed to have you involuntarily dropping the clutch as you desperately try to get it out. I've seen blokes accidentally drop the clutch just by absent-mindely reaching to adjust their mirror at the lights. Different strokes eh?
Me? over 50 years riding on about 23 bikes, -(I've never counted up the k's).
I never ever ride the clutch, but that's just me. But I really, really would like to wise up some of our newbie mates before they kill themselves.

[bmf]

Remember what hapenned to addidas guy! We must always be ready to gtf out of any position asap. We can't always see the idiots but if we do we must be able to act fast.

[Janx101]

I do both clutch situ depending on where I am. .  Its a bit like the loud pipes/oil type/ mods or stock theories though... never gonna be a consensus eh! Lol

[axexandru]

So, I've been out riding tonight, and because it was not crowded i tried a frew things, first of all, putting the bike in neutral while it's still rolling, did not manage that, I probably need a lot more practice to do it, second, at the red light, after I put the bike in neutral, moving the bike back and forward, just a little bit, this worked, I manage to shift into first gear every time.

I will test again tomorrow, I want to try this when I am at a red light and the bike does not want to shift into first, I want to see if moving the bike back and forward will help, tonight I just moved it and after that I try to shift it into first, so it is not a valid test.

Thanks for all the help, and good advices.

[Joolstacho]

Just needs a little bit of pressure down on the gearlever from 2nd gear position towards neutral position, just as you pull in the clutch to stop, in the last foot or two before you come to a stop.
It's is so easy once you get the knack of it you'll be able do it without thinking.
Rocking the bike back and forth while you are stopped in neutral will not make any difference at all (assuming your gearbox isn't 'binding' in neutral). That technique is used to help get into neutral when it's in gear (usually with the motor stopped, though you can rock it on the clutch with motor running to achieve the same thing).

Yep, recover quickly Jack, everyone on the board values your experience ... I've just had heart valve surgery (came out of the blue, totally unexpected) and I'm pretty pissed off that I can't get back on the bike yet!)

[ragecage23]

OR, don't ever put the bike in neutral outside your garage!
Keep it in first, clutch pulled in, and keep an eye on the rearview mirrors, so you can see if the car driver behind you noticed you & is slowing down. Also have an escape route prepared.
Paranoia saves lives my friend.

I firmly believe this is the right practice. I have never put the bike into neutral at a stop. And I've accidentally dropped the clutch while at a stop and I haven't been taken more than a few inches forward, not feet into an intersection.

[Joolstacho]

Well there are opposing views here. BUT here's the ACTUAL thing: If you can't get into gear easily from neutral OR you can't get into neutral easily from gear within, say, half a second YOU NEED TO FIX THE PROBLEM!
Because certain circumstances may bring you unstuck and be potentially very dangerous with either problem.

Personally I cringe at the thought of recommending to young learner riders that they don't need to worry about finding neutral at lights. - Some people seem to have had a common-sense bypass!
And just because some misguided, politically correct, so-called 'educators' recommend something, that doesn't make it right.
(Where shall we start calling out 'so-called experts'? - I'll maybe start with all those 'brilliant' economists who didn't foresee the '08 GFC coming). 

[ragecage23]

To each his own I guess. I just don't see why anyone would need to be in neutral while on the road.

[Slack]

Does anyone who drives a manual transmission car sit at stop lights with their car in 1st the whole time, foot on the clutch? You don't want to get rear ended in a cage either!

Do you people who claim to never go into to neutral really sit there in 1st, watching your mirrors, after there are already 5 or 10 cars sitting stopped behind you?

[ShowBizWolf]

I couldn't imagine *never ever evaaaaah* clicking into neutral... but especially after a long ride... finally coming to a stop at a light or a stop sign I like to sit back and stretch a little bit, look at the scenery wherever I am yanno and then get rolling again.

[Suzuki Stevo]

On the way to work this morning, I found myself at a stoplight, in "N" holding the clutch in...I think the coffee hadn't kicked in yet?

[Suzuki Stevo]

Anybody that has ever had to pull a transmission to change a Throw Out bearing will always use "N" in a car/truck 

Does anyone who drives a manual transmission car sit at stop lights with their car in 1st the whole time, foot on the clutch? You don't want to get rear ended in a cage either!

Do you people who claim to never go into to neutral really sit there in 1st, watching your mirrors, after there are already 5 or 10 cars sitting stopped behind you?

[gsJack]

I generally have always held the clutch in with the car in gear on a manual shift car at stop signs/lights since I started driving. Same on hills with foot on brake or just holding car with clutch and foot on gas ready to go.  Never have had any clutch repair, throw out bearing or plates, on any car I bought new but have replaced clutch once on cars I bought used.  Clutches love me.

Due to advanced age and weakening legs I always hold the bike with 2 legs when stopped, particularly on hills.  I hold the front brake with fingers and work throttle with thumb for startups on hills.  This has led me to taking rides with never having the bike in neutral.  In gear all the way, garage back to garage.  You can do it if you have to.

And it's not a claim, it's a statement of fact that I've always held the clutch in with the bike in gear at stops since I started riding unless I expected to be there a long time like in traffic jams, etc.   No I don't sit looking in the mirrors at stops but if I hear a screech I check it.

[ragecage23]

Does anyone who drives a manual transmission car sit at stop lights with their car in 1st the whole time, foot on the clutch? You don't want to get rear ended in a cage either!

Do you people who claim to never go into to neutral really sit there in 1st, watching your mirrors, after there are already 5 or 10 cars sitting stopped behind you?

Yes I keep my car in first as well. No matter the circumstances, car or bike, 1 car behind me or 10 cars, I'm always aware of what's going on around me.

[Slack]

You guys must have never driven/ridden a vehicle with a really stiff clutch? I've driven vehicles that I couldn't physically keep the clutch disengaged for more then 20-30 seconds without muscle cramps. And I'm a strong guy. My wife couldn't even pull the clutch lever on my KLR before I modified it.

Yes I keep my car in first as well. No matter the circumstances, car or bike, 1 car behind me or 10 cars, I'm always aware of what's going on around me.

I completely agree! It's always smart, no matter the task, to be aware of your surroundings.

But, keeping a vehicle in 1st doesn't help keep you aware of your surroundings. If you have full situational awareness you will never be caught in an instance where you need to slam it into 1st to get out of the way. With awareness you can see a car approaching from behind, knock it into 1st, watch the car stop, kick it back to N.

By leaving it in 1st (for safety reasons, not reasons like Jack listed) you are admitting that you don't always watch your back, and you want to be able to quickly dump the clutch should you hear squealing tires and look in your mirror as a car is screeching up behind you. That's the only situation where it will help - when you aren't paying attention like you should be.

[ragecage23]

Yes I keep my car in first as well. No matter the circumstances, car or bike, 1 car behind me or 10 cars, I'm always aware of what's going on around me.

I completely agree! It's always smart, no matter the task, to be aware of your surroundings.

By leaving it in 1st (for safety reasons, not reasons like Jack listed) you are admitting that you don't always watch your back, and you want to be able to quickly dump the clutch should you hear squealing tires and look in your mirror as a car is screeching up behind you. That's the only situation where it will help - when you aren't paying attention like you should be.

Again I don't agree. By leaving it in first I eliminate a step into getting out of danger.

[Joolstacho]

+1 Slack.
There's not going to be any resolution of this is there?

BUT!!!
Remember the OP was about not being able to get into first easily. The point is that whatever you believe re: neutral or gear at lights, for safety's sake YOU NEED TO BE ABLE TO GET BOTH INTO GEAR AND INTO NEUTRAL when stopped. (Sorry to shout!) So fix that problem.

[Slack]

There's not going to be any resolution of this is there?

There never is in any of these types of threads (N at stops, oil type, etc), but in years of surfing motorcycle forums I had never given my personal opinion that IF your paying attention then you have plenty of time to switch to 1st, so there is no need to sit there in 1st. . . Aren't we all entitled to share?

[ragecage23]

Well for the OP, when in neutral I just give the shift lever a moderate slam and it'll go in everytime. If I can't get neutral I will rock the bike forwards and backwards while applying upwards pressure on the shift lever.

Do whatever you feel is comfortable for you and a stoplight.

[Joolstacho]

Err, missed the point again!
The OP had difficulty getting into gear from neutral (he's at lights... his motor is running so rocking the bike in neutral has no effect at all, that works getting neutral from a gear). He has a mechanical problem that needs sorting eh? The fact that you and I don't have his problem is immaterial... (we can get neutral and we can get first to take off).