In-Line Fuel Filter Question and Carb questions / My introduction

[Shift-E]

I thought it was just a washer to help protect the oring from thwspring a bit and I'd be okay to go without it..

[mr72]

Nope. While it does keep the o-ring (that new one, that's hard to find, the one you don't want to screw up...) from getting chewed up by the end of the spring, the real purpose here is to seal fuel in the pilot orifice under the pilot jet, and to seal air out of that space.

The washer backs the o-ring, the o-ring seals against the inside of the little channel and the shaft of the needle. Fuel flows through the orifice and takes a 90-degree turn upward into the jet, flowing basically over the top of this o-ring-washer setup. With no washer fuel will leak out the pilot needle/screw in conditions of low vacuum (idle), then when vacuum increases (off idle, higher velocity air over the pilot jet) it will draw air in past this o-ring, essentially a targeted vacuum leak right at the pilot jet. Both situations will make it run very lean at idle, no different than having no o-ring or a bad/hard o-ring in that spot.

So if you already assembled it this way, most likely you need a new o-ring AND a new washer. And you are soon to find that a fresh o-ring, that is one that's soft and pliable instead of the decades-old one that was likely in there before, is very difficult to get out of that hole for replacement. So you'll be tempted to roll the dice and leave the potentially damaged one in there when you get a new washer. If you do that, then you will likely wind up with the same problems I describe above, which is a carb that runs lean at idle and part throttle up to about 4K rpm no matter how you adjust the mixture screw. You'll be back here asking more questions about it and I'll be the guy here telling you to fix it right once and for all and get that o-ring out and replace it.

I know this because this is almost exactly what I did but there was nobody to tell me about this o-ring so I discovered it on my own.

So if you haven't put that needle back in yet because you lost the washer, do yourself a favor and stop now, get a new washer, (doesn't HAVE to be Suzuki but it HAS to be the exact same size), and don't put the needle back in the carb until you have a new washer.

If you have put the needle back, well it's up to you whether you want to roll the dice once you get a new washer. Guess it can't hurt. But first sign of it not running right, you'll be pulling the carbs back off to get that o-ring replaced so if you already have the bike apart, I'd just leave it alone until I could get a new washer and o-ring.

BTW I have a good cheap source of these o-rings but dunno where the washer is going to come from. I'd say a local dealer is likely to be where to get it, probably take them a week to get it in for you and cost $2 but at least you won't pay $8 for shipping. If you were local I'd let you have one off of my spare carbs. And I'd adjust the carbs for you

[Shift-E]

Nope. While it does keep the o-ring (that new one, that's hard to find, the one you don't want to screw up...) from getting chewed up by the end of the spring, the real purpose here is to seal fuel in the pilot orifice under the pilot jet, and to seal air out of that space.

The washer backs the o-ring, the o-ring seals against the inside of the little channel and the shaft of the needle. Fuel flows through the orifice and takes a 90-degree turn upward into the jet, flowing basically over the top of this o-ring-washer setup. With no washer fuel will leak out the pilot needle/screw in conditions of low vacuum (idle), then when vacuum increases (off idle, higher velocity air over the pilot jet) it will draw air in past this o-ring, essentially a targeted vacuum leak right at the pilot jet. Both situations will make it run very lean at idle, no different than having no o-ring or a bad/hard o-ring in that spot.

Sigh. Ya, that makes sense. I just had high hopes that i'd be okay lol.

So if you already assembled it this way, most likely you need a new o-ring AND a new washer. And you are soon to find that a fresh o-ring, that is one that's soft and pliable instead of the decades-old one that was likely in there before, is very difficult to get out of that hole for replacement. So you'll be tempted to roll the dice and leave the potentially damaged one in there when you get a new washer. If you do that, then you will likely wind up with the same problems I describe above, which is a carb that runs lean at idle and part throttle up to about 4K rpm no matter how you adjust the mixture screw. You'll be back here asking more questions about it and I'll be the guy here telling you to fix it right once and for all and get that o-ring out and replace it.

I actually did remove it right after I got your message. It all came out easily. I don't know how much damage the spring alone would have done to the o-ring. However, since I need to order the washer anyways, i'm going to order 2 o-rings with it just for the piece of mind. Im going to swallow the cost of the dealership due to ease. I know your source has them for like 50c, but shipping to Canada isn't worth the price difference at the end of the day for me :/

Like you said, might as well make sure that it's all perfect now, instead of having to rip open the carbs again.

[mr72]

Like you said, might as well make sure that it's all perfect now, instead of having to rip open the carbs again.

Wish I had been that smart when I was fixing up my bike.

[Shift-E]

Parts in Canada are so damn expensive. but oh well, i'll absorb the cost.

I ended up getting 2 rings, 2 washers, and 2 springs (just in case i wanted to change them because i'm a little suspicious of mine). Paying $45 after tax with next day pick up so I can have it before the weekend.

The reason i'm so eager to fix the bike now, is because if I don't have it on the road and ready to drive before the middle of June, I am not going to be insuring the bike to ride this year and i'll need to wait til next year. The cost of insurance wouldn't make any sense.

I don't know what it's like in your area, but in Ontario you need to insure the bike for a full year, even though we cant actually ride it from say late October to April. So insuring the bike to ride for just around 3ish months this year doesn't make sense. I was quoted around 1200 (Ontario has some of the highest insurance costs. Other places were quoting me at over 2000). Mostly because I am a new rider, and have never had bike insurance before. But ya, I'm itching to get this road worthy in the next week lol

[mr72]

Sounds like sound logic to me!

You don't want to hear it, but my insurance is more like $100/year, and here in Central TX if you can stand the heat there's no reason not to ride year-round. There may be a couple of weeks that it is too rainy or barely too cold for recreational riding, and I think July and August are going to be really iffy considering the lows in the AM will be in the 80s and the highs in the upper 90s to 105F which sounds like an awful time to be on a motorcycle. I am a "new rider" but not what anyone would call "youthful" and I only have liability insurance.

[Shift-E]

Im 25 and only have my M2 license and I haven't even had it for a year, so it is more expensive. In Ontario we have a graduated licensing system, M1, M2, M (for motorcycles. For cars it is G1, G2, G). I have had my M2 for less than a year. It is basically like a full license but with a few more restrictions. I need to wait another year before I can apply for the full M. The M1 is essentially a learners permit for bikes.

But now we're getting a little off topic lol. I just cant wait to riiiiide

[Shift-E]

SHE LIIIIVES. MY FRANKENSTEIN LIIIIVES.

She got running, but was screaaaaaaming. Like it was at wide open throttle or something. It was even starting up without using the choke :S. Figured out the problem was a mixture of throttle cable and the fact that the idle adjustment screw was too tight. So i loosened it completely and she seems to be running at a good idle with choke on. But that's when things went bad... i must have somehow tore a pinhole in the reserve fuel line... so now im leaking fuel and need a new line there before i can do a proper test ride.

For the fuel line, is there anything I can do as a temp fix? Like could i tape the line? I know i should change the line, but I'm just curious for something that'll work for a test ride before I take it to do a proper safety test.

[Watcher]

Any job worth doing is worth doing right.

Don't potentially strand yourself.  Just replace the line.  It takes 10 minutes to run to AutoZone, 5 minutes to replace, and costs $2.

[Shift-E]

So any fuel line will do? Or do I need to get OEM line?

[1018cc]

For the fuel line, is there anything I can do as a temp fix? Like could i tape the line?

There is always time to do the job properly the second time.

Tape won't work to keep the fuel in. You need a new hose. One of those hoses has different IDs on each end (but I can't remember which fuel line it is). I'd take a look at it and if it is the same ID on both ends, just go and buy some generic hose rated for petrol.

[Shift-E]

New fuel line in! And it was surprisingly difficult to find. Ended up going to two different places but they didnt have anything that matched the OD. Their hoses were much too thick due to them being braided. Ended up going to the dealership and they gave me a new hose (though after closer inspection the ID might be slightly smaller, but it fit). The hose is clear so at least I'll always know how much fuel i have left in my reserve line lol.

Rode the bike around for about 15 minutes in my neighborhood and got it to operating temperature. Then i adjusted the idle to so that with choke OFF it was a little bit above the point of stalling. Rode it around the neighborhood some more and it felt good to ride still so I think I got it (roughly) right.

Side note. When it comes to fuel in the reserve line. Should i switch the bike to reserve when I fill up the tank so that it can cycle fresh gas in there? Otherwise its just sitting in there never being used, and it could possibly go bad with time. No?

To the best of my knowledge the bike is running OK/Good now. I want to give a huge thank you to everyone on here that helped me out. Especially mr72 for his outstanding patience with me! Without you all I would have never gotten the bike going

Now all thats left is rear brake pads, and a couple rubber spacers in places to stop some rattling pieces lol. There was a lot of those missing from the previous owner...

[Suzuki Stevo]

Side note. When it comes to fuel in the reserve line. Should i switch the bike to reserve when I fill up the tank so that it can cycle fresh gas in there? Otherwise its just sitting in there never being used, and it could possibly go bad with time. No?

Whenever I would start a bike up that had been sitting for any length of time, I would use Reserve to get any water out of the bottom of the tank...so I say why not.

(and when switching to Reserve, the trick is remembering to switch back to On...Ha!)

[Shift-E]

Thanks for the confirmation, Stevo!

[ShowBizWolf]

Glad to read this thread and see ya got everything pretty well sorted out Shift-E !!

What I do is ride until I feel the bike start to run out of gas, then reach down behind my knee and flip to reserve. Then head home or to the nearest gas station. That way I know I'm always keeping that line clear. When I get to the station and fill up, just as Stevo said, I flip it back to on It's a good thing to get used to knowing how to do, flipping to reserve while riding IMO.

[Shift-E]

Glad to read this thread and see ya got everything pretty well sorted out Shift-E !!

What I do is ride until I feel the bike start to run out of gas, then reach down behind my knee and flip to reserve. Then head home or to the nearest gas station. That way I know I'm always keeping that line clear. When I get to the station and fill up, just as Stevo said, I flip it back to on It's a good thing to get used to knowing how to do, flipping to reserve while riding IMO.

Oh I most definitely would switch to it when I need it, but knowing myself i'd probably be filling up before I got to that point. And if I'm always filling without ever using the reserve line, I just don't want to risk letting what is actually in the line go stale. Thus, I think it would probably be beneficial to run the bike on reserve for a few minutes after filling up the tank, just to cycle some fresh gas in there. Just a random thought that came into my mind lol

After cleaning out the dirty carbs due to old gas mucking them up, I want to avoid doing that again for as long as possible

[mr72]

After cleaning out the dirty carbs due to old gas mucking them up, I want to avoid doing that again for as long as possible

That's a pretty good idea. However in the grand scheme of things, I bet you wind up using ShowBiz's method of refreshing the reserve fuel in the line more often than you think you will. Even with the best of intentions I've done this three or four times in just about 7 months of riding. I have gone about 2K miles in that time though...

[Gcook57]

How could just cause more problems than it fixes I have worked on commercial Golf Course equipment for over 40 years Z's machines accumulate a lot more dust microscopic grass clipping probably that anymore machine the $70,000 plus machines I work on always have a gas filter between the petcock and the carb you just have to make sure they can handle the volume of fuel or then you might have problems otherwise it's a no-brainer if you have any kind of rat inside your hoses or the screen in the gas tank could have a hole in it this fuel line filter assuming it is the right one can have no little effect in fact this is your last defense against s*** getting your carb what seems to be a problem of a lot of these issues on this GS website