Need help so my bike does not catch fire.... Wiring issue

[89gS500_Kirk]

I have a 89 GS500 and have been riding it for a few months now, I was planning on riding it to work today so I went to do a run through on it last night and while trying to start the bike I noticed some smoke from under my seat. So I took the seat off and noticed the smoke was coming from 2 areas.The first was the Side-Stand/ignition interlock relay. A couple of the wires were melting together, so they may have been bare wires but again I have never had any problems starting the bike before this. The second area I do not know the name of it, the part is hooked on the battery box and has a 20 amp fuse in it. The fuse actually melted! (I will post a pic with my phone shortly)

The bike was in neutral and I has been cranking on it on and off for about 2 min before this happened. Any and ALL help would be appreciated, I do not know wiring well at all. Let me know if you need more information to help, when I get home I will take a pic of where the fuse was plugged in to.

[89gS500_Kirk]

Here is the fuse

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

[mr72]

Amazing that the fuse melted. We used to call those "no-blo" fuses. There's a range of current you can draw through a normal plated-filament fuse which will cause the plating to amalgamate to the core filament causing conditions like this. You are correct that the next thing likely to happen would be a fire. I can't imagine what caused your bike to do this, though. The fuse should have blown. For the fuse to do this would ordinary indicate some other problem causing too much current draw for a long time resulting in a fuse going south to the point that it doesn't create enough heat to blow but does create enough heat to melt or catch fire.

On a practical note, you will just have to chase down and test everything to find the culprit. Ordinarily my vote would be the regulator/rectifier. Possible the starter relay is shorted? Dunno.

[89gS500_Kirk]

Thanks Mr.72, I will start with the starter relay since I was trying to start the bike when all of this happened. Great information on how and what happened to my fuse. 

[mr72]

Great information on how and what happened to my fuse. 

Haha. Just happens to be one of those unusual things I have greater than average experience with.

FYI, from a previous life:
https://www.google.com/patents/US6873243

[sledge]

If you have been cranking the bike for TWO MINUTES!! am not surprised.

You have taken the electrical system miles outside of its normal operating conditions and subjected parts of it to all sorts of prolonged high current conditions.

I am surprised the starter motor is not burnt out, the solenoid is not damaged and the battery didn't boil up.

Change the fuse, charge the battery and see what happens. If you are lucky there won't be any damage and, needless to say........avoid holding the starter motor in for more than a few seconds.

[89gS500_Kirk]

I did not mean I held the starter in for 2 mins, I would hold in the starter button for maybe 5 to 10 sec then let off. I then gave it a little break (which was me trying to look at the bike like I knew what I was doing when I have no clue) then I would try it again. I should have clarified that, thanks sledge. It does read like I just sat there holding the button down lol.

[89gS500_Kirk]

FYI, from a previous life:
https://www.google.com/patents/US6873243
[/quote]

WOW MR.72 you are legit 

[mr72]

WOW MR.72 you are legit 

Haha. I invented a fuse that nobody uses as far as I know. Actually this was developed in response to a similar "no-blo" fuse behavior for telecom fuses in high voltage situations where the fuse blows but the potential across the two ends of the broken filament is enough to arc through the air inside the fuse, so it continues to conduct even though the fuse is blown. This all happened during a time (end of the 90s) when it was not known which broadband technology would eventually win, and DSL was a candidate. The telecom fuse thing is really only a problem when trying to pack a ton of phone lines into a small space like in a telephone company central office, for example on a DSL CO system. Anyway, nobody cares anymore because the DSL business really took a hit once 3G wireless picked up and people began consuming web content on their phones, nobody (that I know of) ever manufactured fuses based on my patent, and that tech along with most of my other patents (several others related to DSL/telecom, etc.) just became a boring part of an obsolete technology.

I also invented some other things, some of which people actually do use. I invented some other things that never were patented. Nowadays when I "invent" something it's primary use is as a plot device for a sci-fi story.

Back to the original discussion. You should do a complete starting system check. There are instructions in the FAQ. It's not hard to do and it will help find any electrical problem. Believe me a fuse with a melted body is a cause for concern.

[sledge]

In which case I would suspect the battery first. My thought is that its struggling to accept charge (maybe a cell down) and the reg/rect is working flat out trying to charge it and power the rest of the bike leading to overheating. Are the levels OK? Any signs of overflowing? Connections good?

I would get it properly load tested, static tests mean little, and check the charging system...reg/rect, stator, all connections etc.

Also look for a flickering headlamp, this is an indicator of over voltage in the system and a duff reg/rect.

[89gS500_Kirk]

So over the weekend I tore the bike down and replaced the fuse box since it melted along with the fuse. However when I turn the bike on the fuse gets red hot and the orange wires running to the kick stand relay that is on the side of the bike get very hot as well. I know less than nothing about wiring any suggestions?

[mr72]

If the side stand relay wires are getting hot, you have probably found your problem. Disconnect the side stand relay and try it again. Just turn the key to "ON" ... bike won't start or run with the SS relay disconnected.

If the fuse/wiring heating issue (short circuit, overcurrent) goes away then you know the problem is a shorted primary on the side stand relay. Replace the part and be on your way.

If the problem persists with the side stand relay disconnected then it's shorted upstream of the relay. I'd look at whether the insulation on the wiring has melted somewhere causing a wire to short to the chassis or other thing at ground potential etc. This is the process of chasing down everything to check for a short. It helps to have a multimeter set to resistance and then you can probe around as you disconnect things. I'd start with the side stand relay and work my way back to the battery testing every connection (disconnect any connector, measure non-ground wires resistance to ground at each connector). Isolate the section of wire that's failing, then replace that wire. Or component, or whatever.

[89gS500_Kirk]

Thank you Mr.72, I actually bought a used side stand relay thinking that was the problem but it is still causing this issue. So I will be tracing some wires this evening.

[mr72]

This is a good time to get familiar with the wiring diagram.

Also worthwhile to verify someone (previous owner) hasn't modified the wiring, causing this problem.

There's a number of things in the same circuit as the side stand relay, IIRC. I'm not looking at the diagram right now.

[sledge]

Change the diode pack.

[89gS500_Kirk]

How do I change the diode pack? I looked online for a diode but not exactly sure what I am looking for. Thanks for the suggestion, after reading other people having problems with the diode it makes sense this could be the problem.

[sledge]

Diode pack. Part # 3661138A00

Its little black plastic rectangle, similar to a blade fuse but with 3 terminals.

Its not actually fixed to anything and its difficult to say exactly where its located. It just kinda plugs into the wiring harness close to the battery.

On the schematic........follow the blue up from the neutral switch.

[89gS500_Kirk]

Sledge you are awesome, thank you I will get one ordered. I saw this part when I was putting the bike back together months ago, so I think I know a round about area it is in. 

[89gS500_Kirk]

So I got the overheating fuse issue taken care of, however the orange wire running from the side stand relay is still getting super hot. I checked this wire and there is no exposed wires or anything like that. If the bike is in neutral and the kick is down the bike will not turn over, again the bike is in neutral. However if I put the kickstand up the bike will now turn over. The orange wire still gets very hot regardless of the position of the kick. Did I maybe plug the relay in wrong when I unplugged it from behind the rear brake... Maybe which I just now thought of, however can anyone think of anything else that could be causing this issue?

I really want to ride my damn bike...

[qcbaker]

So I got the overheating fuse issue taken care of, however the orange wire running from the side stand relay is still getting super hot. I checked this wire and there is no exposed wires or anything like that. If the bike is in neutral and the kick is down the bike will not turn over, again the bike is in neutral. However if I put the kickstand up the bike will now turn over. The orange wire still gets very hot regardless of the position of the kick. Did I maybe plug the relay in wrong when I unplugged it from behind the rear brake... Maybe which I just now thought of, however can anyone think of anything else that could be causing this issue?

I really want to ride my damn bike...

Sounds to me like there is a short in your side stand safety switch. The bike should turn over with the kickstand down in neutral.