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Retaking the MSF course?

Started by Watcher, August 18, 2014, 06:35:10 PM

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Watcher

OK, so I've been bugging a friend of mine for years now about getting his license to ride and he's been claiming he wants to but never takes opportunities to take the free state subsidized MSF course.  I think I may have finally convinced him to take it at the price of me taking the course with him.

As a rider of nearly 3 years now I am way advanced for the beginner course, but have been wanting a refresher on laws and such so I'm actually seriously looking forward to it.


But I have a devious side, and I wonder if instead of admitting I have a license and ride and saying I'm there for moral support I should take my Golf there, claim Im a newb, say I am "borrowing my brother's gear while his bike is in the shop", then the last day show up on my GS and be like " Just kidding!"
I wonder if it'll be more fun seriously helping some newcomers as a role model, or throwing the instructors for a loop!

What do you all think?  Anyone here ever retake the class by choice?
"The point of a journey is not to arrive..."

-Neil Peart

Big Rich

I don't think the instructors would see the humor in that. I would take your GS and see how well you do with it instead of a 250cc bike though.
83 GR650 (riding / rolling project)

It's opener there in the wide open air...

Watcher

If they'll even let me use it...  I don't think they'd appreciate the straight pipe, but they might enjoy the smell of 112 octane...
"The point of a journey is not to arrive..."

-Neil Peart

Rallyfan

#3
I recommend taking it again. I will, to keep a relative company. My relative has been riding since 1966 and I've been riding since 1986. I have a license but he let his lapse in the 1970s, and now he wants it back. He's ridden across the country and yet he'll be there ready to learn.

We both plan to show up, follow instruction, and let the instructors do their job. We'll ride their bikes, not ours. The local course only allows their bikes, and rightfully so; your bike is of unknown quantity and quality, and they have numerous students to teach in a controlled manner.

There will be ample opportunity for humour after you've both passed the course.

If anything though if I were you I'd wait until the weather gets cooler, find a course that's rain-or-shine, and pray for rain. That's my plan to make it a productive and comfortable experience.

Electrojake

Quote from: Watcher on August 18, 2014, 06:35:10 PM
OK, so I've been bugging a friend of mine for years now about getting his license to ride and he's been claiming he wants to but never takes opportunities to take the free state subsidized MSF course. 
I think I may have finally convinced him to take it at the price of me taking the course with him.

What do you all think?  Anyone here ever retake the class by choice?

Most MSF schools have several levels of classes you can take.

I took the "advanced" course a few years back.
It was 1/2 day in the class room and 1/2 day on the drill pad with the bike. It was well worth the $125 to get a full day of (refresher) training.
They also have a new "sport bike" class for $150, and something called the "experienced rider" course.
I'm over-due to take an MSF refresher course myself.  :icon_neutral:

- - - - - - - - - -

As far as What do I think about you re-taking the course. . .
I think if the state finds out your re-taking the course on their dime you'll probably get arrested & fined.

On a more positive note...
It's nice of you to help your buddy get his motorcycle endorsement. I can understand a new rider being a bit worried.
You're a good friend.  :thumb: And have fun out there.
Current Stable: Suzuki DL1000k6, a Grom, two 70's vintage PUCH mopeds, and my kid's WR250R

Watcher

Quote from: Electrojake on August 20, 2014, 06:38:31 PM


Most MSF schools have several levels of classes you can take.


- - - - - - - - - -

As far as What do I think about you re-taking the course. . .
I think if the state finds out your re-taking the course on their dime you'll probably get arrested & fined.


Yeah, here in Illinois they offer the Beginner, Intermediate, and Advanced.  Beginner is just that, Intermediate is for anyone who has ridden but doesn't have a license (dirtbikers or expired licensees) and has a few advanced maneuvers, and Advanced is for riders with licenses and X hours/miles of riding and is a course for techniques that you take on your own motorcycle.

IIRC the beginner and intermediate are free and the Advanced might cost like $80 or something.



As to me being fined and arrested for retaking the class on the states dime, they never forbade me to take it again, nor did I "graduate" on any condition that taking it again would cost me $$.  I get raped paying taxes here in "Crook County" as it is, so I don't think its right if you want to call a morality card on me for "stealing" taxpayer money, and if I did take it again I would donate the $20 retainer instead of keeping it like I did last time because I think having the classes available and cheap (free) is wonderful.

But to be honest, I never really looked up if a retake is frowned upon.  I might wanna make a call or two before I actually tell my friend I'm down 100%.
I'm sure they'd have no issue with me at least hanging around the class, even if I don't ride or anything.
"The point of a journey is not to arrive..."

-Neil Peart

Electrojake

Quote from: Watcher on August 20, 2014, 09:02:58 PM

But to be honest, I never really looked up if a retake is frowned upon.
I might wanna make a call or two before I actually tell my friend I'm down 100%.
I'm sure they'd have no issue with me at least hanging around the class, even if I don't ride or anything.

I guess the important thing is that you support you friend.
Give him the confidence he needs to show up at the class and get certified.

Be sure to post a follow-up here at the GSTwins forum and let us know how this all plays out.
Maybe even snap a few photos at the class and post them here at the forum!  :thumb:
-Ej-
Current Stable: Suzuki DL1000k6, a Grom, two 70's vintage PUCH mopeds, and my kid's WR250R

Watcher

Just an update, I got into the course with my friend as the last 2 open seats.  I had to submit my license for identification and they noticed it was an M class and told me with a smile, "Oh, are you here supporting your friend?  That's great!". Don't ask don't tell on whether or not I took the MSF before, but I think they figured that out pretty quickly by my answers to questions and my range behavior.

So far its a blast!  Riding a little TW200 makes me really appreciate the speed my 500 is capable of, but at the same time showed me some key limitations my bike also has.  Its a fun change of pace, I am being reminded of some good habits potentially forgotten, and since I am setting a prime example for some of the newbies I am a welcome ally to the teaching staff.
I've already been used in examples, have asked some more technical questions which have helped other riders, and suggested some alternative techniques to those who were struggling.

My friend?  He's gunning for #2 in the class!  He is nailing a lot of the techniques, and having me as an off-duty coach is proving invaluable to his skill development.  I have utmost confidence he will pass and be a great riding companion in no time!
"The point of a journey is not to arrive..."

-Neil Peart

yamahonkawazuki

Jan 14 2010 0310 I miss you mom
Vielen dank Patrick. Vielen dank
".
A proud Mormon
"if you come in with the bottom of your cast black,
neither one of us will be happy"- Alan Silverman MD

Watcher

Class is over, man am I exhausted!

Not surprisingly, I scored a 0 on the range.  I also only scored a 1 on the written, following distance messed me up a bit.  Should have gone with my gut and I would have been absolutely perfect, but even so I was #1 in the class.  Unfair advantage disqualifying me, my friend ended up #1 with a 0 on the range and 2 on the written!

So proud of him, he actually impressed the instructors and the whole class by completely dominating the box.  He did it better than I was capable of, made it look like child's play.  He's really got the counterbalancing technique aced, it seriously looked like he was going down because the bike was leaned in so much, but he never even wavered!
I had instructors asking me if I helped him with it, and I really didn't all that much.  Just told him my technique of holding a high idle, trail-braking, and feathering the clutch.  Forcing the bike down and counterbalancing was all residual mountain-biking technique from riding cross-country single track for several years...

It was a lot of fun for me too, and helped me weed out a few bad habits.  Turns out I had some minor target fixation at low speeds, so the whole weekend I was making sure to keep my head up and looking to where I wanted to go.
I was doing better than I thought because in one of the exercises one of the instructors told me, "you should be an instructor, that was excellent!". Not only that, but after the "graduation" the other instructor suggested the same thing, asked me if I'd be interested in being an instructor because I had the skill and knowledge.
And to be honest, I think I would like it!  I'm considering taking the class to become certified, helping my friend ace it was a joy for me and hopefully getting other students to the same skill level will be just as rewarding.

Its unfortunate that of the 12 that started, only 7 passed.  One girl opted out after some difficulty, 3 more girls got ejected, and one girl and one guy didn't pass the evaluation.  In the end none of the women made it, and one of the guys came so close if he got a single extra point on the range he would not have passed.  My friend and I were the only ones to score perfect on the range.



Anyway, to wrap it up retaking the class, despite it being the beginners course, was rewarding and even fun.  I'd recommend everyone to retake a class, any class, every couple of years or so to ensure bad habits aren't taking hold, to refresh some traffic law knowledge, and maybe even meet some new friends.  The instructors I had even encouraged those there to retake it whenever they want if they wanted some extra practice, because (at least in Illinois) its free and the techniques taught are life savers.  Its not enough to practice on your own, professional critique is a huge benefit to anyone.

If you have a friend taking it, take it with them!  Do it!  Don't think you'll be so far ahead of the class that you won't learn anything, open your mind, discover bad habits, fix them, and better yourself all while being a personal mentor to those who need your support...
"The point of a journey is not to arrive..."

-Neil Peart

ShowBizWolf

#10
That is so cool!  Thanks for posting about the experience... it was a good read!!  I just took the course (I live in PA) last summer and I really enjoyed it.  There were 10 in my class and only 6 of us passed though.  The two other chicks besides me gave up during the riding portion (they kept falling) and 2 guys simply did not pass the riding test at the end.  If it wasn't such a pain to fit it in around my work schedule, I think it would indeed be fun to take again. 

You will hafta keep the forum posted if you do decide to be an instructor and of course post about how your first class goes in the future!  :thumb:
Superbike bars, '04 GSXR headlight & cowl, DRZ signals, 1/2" fork brace, 'Busa fender, stainless exhaust & brake lines, belly pan, LED dash & brake bulbs, 140/80 rear hoop, F tail lens, SV650 shock, Bandit400 hugger, aluminum heel guards & pegs, fork preload adjusters, .75 SonicSprings, heated grips

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