GStwin.com GS500 Message Forum

First, I didn't go into work today b/c I was sick. Then, this evening I decide to get off my arse and work on my GS. If you think you've had it bad, then read on:

unfinished task #1
- I finished chiseling the new opening for my newly acquired Pingel petcock/adapter plate, but they won't thread together completely :dunno: (have to send it back)

unfinished task #2
- went to clean my carbs, but I need to order some diaphragms before I can put it together :nono:

unfinished task #3
- went to check the valve clearances while following the Clymer manual, but I ended up with more questions than answers....


QUESTION #1
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v254/Flash_gm/breathercover_800x600.jpg)

QUESTION #2
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v254/Flash_gm/camshaftnotch_800x600.jpg)

QUESTION #3 & 4
If the answer to the previous question is YES, then how is it possible to check B when the lobe is facing straight down and C is slightly below hroizontal? (You would think you should check each lobe in a specific position) Does the feeler gauge need to slide out the other side?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v254/Flash_gm/valveswithnochin_800x60.jpg)

I feel like I haven't been productive at all today. And to top it off I think at least lobe A (with the notches facing outward) is too tight :x

the "Notches" are on the END of the cams. they should face each other, looking like a C and a backward C.   heavy filmy oil Concrete up there is normal.aslong as the vent system isnt pluged.   new Diaphrams? you have holes in them?

Quote from: Flashwent to check the valve clearances while following the Clymer manual, but I ended up with more questions than answers....

Remind me to scan in the 2 pages from the Haynes manual some day.... :roll:

Quote from: FlashQUESTION #1  Is this oil residue normal?

Yep.  And so is the "Brillo pad".   :)

Quote from: FlashQUESTION #2  Are these the notches we are trying to match up?

Blueknyt covered this one.  Perhaps you can take a photo of the two 'C's facing each other?

Quote from: FlashQUESTION #3 & 4 [...]
You would think you should check each lobe in a specific position

The Haynes manual has you rotate the crank with a wrench and then measure more than one clearance at a time, even though the cam lobes are pointing in different directions.  But, (from a PM I just wrote to Mk1inCali):

Quote from: KerryI did it that way the first time, but lately I have just used the "Srinath method":

* Pull the spark plugs

* Put the bike in 6th gear (or so)

* Rotate the rear wheel in its usual direction until the cam lobe for the "target valve" points directly away from the shim below it.  (I believe Srinath's actual phrase was "points to the sky".)[/list:u]

Quote from: Flash Does the feeler gauge need to slide out the other side?

NO.  That is, you don't need to push them through until you can see them poking way out.  But they DO need to at least pass the "halfway point" where the lobe is closest to the shim.  Your fingers will tell you....

Quote from: FlashI feel like I haven't been productive at all today. And to top it off I think at least lobe A (with the notches facing outward) is too tight :x

Sounds productive to me!   :thumb:   In my experience, if one valve is tight it will be an exhaust valve.  You could almost say that if two valves are tight they will BOTH be exhaust valves.   :dunno:

The whole "point the cam cutouts towards each other" thing isn't too helpful.  You end-up checking one valve pointing at 9 o'clock, one at 12, and one at 3 o'clock.  Ideally, the lobe should have the same clearance at all 3, but this is not the case on my bike.

If you are an optimist, just check each cam seperately, with each lobe pointing at the sky (12 o'clock).  Good clearance at 12 o'clock means that the valve is fully closing.

If you're a pessimist, check each cam with the lobe at 9 o'clock, 12 o'clock and 3 o'clock (which takes a while).  My experience is that some valves are tighter at 9 or 3 than they are at 12.  I would say that ideally, you want enough vavle clearance at the tightest point in the valve rotation.

That said, some people here have reported better results with valve clearance set at the low end of the specifications range.  I think scratch decided to run his slightly under clearance, to get rid of the ticking noise.

QuoteGood clearance at 12 o'clock means that the valve is fully closing.

careful on your use of words, 12oclock to engine would be incorect. 12 oclock in relation to the Valve it operates would be more accurate. this places the back radius of the lobe facing the shim for greatest gap. the valves are kinda like 45 degrees in relation to the cyl, and the cyl isnt pointed at 12 either.

follow what the book says is your best bet, atleast untill you reach the poiint of 40W making up about 20% of your blood. :lol:

heres a shot of the cutouts from the how to adjust valves page (with pics)

(http://www.gstwin.com/images/how_to/carb&valve/15sm.jpg)

they are highlighted in yellow.

http://www.gstwin.com/adjust_valves.htm

thats the link to the "how too" on this site

My GS500 has around 17k miles on it and has never had the valve clearance adjusted.  It makes a very subtle pinging, but barely anything noticeable.  Do you think i can wait on getting the valve adjustment done or should I go ahead and get it done now (money is an issue right now so if its not really necessary right now i'd wait).  How many miles till they usually need their first valve adjustment??  lastly, how much do dealer's usually charge to do this?  (I am considering trying to do it myself, but i am very mechanically uninclined and would probably break something, lol)

Quote from: Rema1000That said, some people here have reported better results with valve clearance set at the low end of the specifications range.  I think scratch decided to run his slightly under clearance, to get rid of the ticking noise.

Did somebody mention me? Yes, I prefer to run mine on the loose side, but still within specs (.08mm). I'd err on the side of loose to prevent a valve meeting the piston, but you can't go too loose or you'll spit a shim at higher rpm's.

My last valve adjustment was made last month at the 20,000 mile mark (every 4,000 miles), I only had to adjust one shim, and luckily I had the right size. It was the No.2 exhaust, it was tight on the .038 feeler, so I changed out the shim from a 275 to a 270, rotated the crank over a full 360 and remeasured. It now slipped the .076 feeler loosely without allowing the .102 feeler in at all, so I deemed it good. The adjustment before that had me tightening up that same valve from a easy fitting .102 feeler to a loose .038; swapping the same shims in reverse.

Again, valve adjustments should be made every 4,000 miles.

Quote from: jamesmcbMy GS500 has around 17k miles on it and has never had the valve clearance adjusted.

That's about the same mileage my bike had when I adjusted the valves the first time.  :oops:

Quote from: jamesmcbIt makes a very subtle pinging, but barely anything noticeable.  Do you think i can wait on getting the valve adjustment done or should I go ahead and get it done now (money is an issue right now so if its not really necessary right now i'd wait).

You can certainly wait ... but the bike would love you for adjusting it.  :kiss:

Quote from: jamesmcbHow many miles till they usually need their first valve adjustment??

Like scratch (and the manual) says: Every 4000 miles.

Quote from: jamesmcblastly, how much do dealer's usually charge to do this?

I haven't ever had it done, but at about 1 hour for 60+ per hour, figure on $70+ dollars after tax.  For which you could buy a valve shim tool (somewhat optional), some decent dial calipers, a set of feeler gauges, and a few replacement shims.  ALL of which you could reuse in another 4000 miles, and another, and another....

Quote from: jamesmcb(I am considering trying to do it myself, but i am very mechanically uninclined and would probably break something, lol)

Doubtful.  I knew nothing about wrenching on bikes when I got my GS.  Just be deliberate, stay organized, be patient, and start building up a set of tools.  There ARE a few tips and tricks that you will pick up the first time around, but most of it is fairly obvious.

BTW, if you'd like to "try before you buy" I am willing to mail the necessary equipment (and the current collection of cast-off shims) to just about anyone for the cost of my shipping them to you.  jake42 is one (hopefully) happy customer.  Manjul (The_good_guy) is another, although I hand-delivered (and applied) the tools for him.  :roll:

Again, the package I sent to jake42 included feeler gauges, the valve tool, dial calipers, a pen-sized telescoping magnetic picker-upper, and several shims.  It cost around $3.85 to send via Priority Mail (each way), and all I ask is that you toss your cast-off shims into the collection.

Interested?

I appreciate all your help guys. I knew yall would come through.

A special thanks to Blueknyt for responding so quickly (at 1:40am no doubt). I actually read your message and eagerly went back into the garage and found "the Notches are on the END of the cams. they should face each other, looking like a C and a backward C"

Well, good news. Three of the four valves are fine (.038mm feeler was fine, but the .051mm feeler would not clear). The bad news is the left exhaust valve is too tight (.038mm feeler would not clear). Next step is to remove the shim myself w/o the special tool and order the correct replacement from the local Suzuki dealer.

More good news. You guys were right. Pingel Customer Service is excellent. The sales guy e-mailed me promptly the next day and told me to ship it to him and he would try to fix the problem or send me out parts that would work. Wow :cheers:

I love this forum. I can't wait to get my GS500 runnin again. :thumb:

Quote from: scratch

Quote from: Rema1000That said, some people here have reported better results with valve clearance set at the low end of the specifications range.  I think scratch decided to run his slightly under clearance, to get rid of the ticking noise.

Did somebody mention me? Yes, I prefer to run mine on the loose side, but still within specs (.08mm). I'd err on the side of loose to prevent a valve meeting the piston

Darn, Scratch; I thought I remembered you choosing to go on the tight side to stop the ticking, but I guess you decided to go on the edge of loose-ness (of which I approve).  It must've been one of the racers who said he went on the verge of overtightness.  My grey matter is not keeping all the bits lined-up in my head like it used-to.  BTW, I approve of keeping the clearance towards the loose end.  We non-racers are more concerned with keeping things working 'till the next adjustment, rather than 110% performance.

i like running the valves alittle on loose side too, things tighten up with heat, so if one day it is hotter then normal, i want that extra smidgen of play.

Quote from: FlashThe bad news is the left exhaust valve is too tight (.038mm feeler would not clear). Next step is to remove the shim myself w/o the special tool and order the correct replacement

WARNING!

All you know is that the .038mm feeler won't fit.  That's not the same as knowing what the clearance is.  You need to know both the clearance and the current shim thickness before you can determine the correctment replacement shim thickness.

If you can make the "bucket" (or "cam follower", or "shim container") rotate with your fingers then you know the clearance is somewhere above 0.  And if you go down one shim size you'll get an extra .05mm of clearance and you should be OK.  There is a small chance that the new clearance will be between .080mm and .088mm ... right?  Which is undesirably loose.  :(

On the other hand, if the valve is so tight that you can't turn the "bucket" you don't know HOW tight it is.  Which means you could easily order the wrong shim.  :x  Two of the three bikes I've adjusted had exhaust valves that needed to go down by 2 or 3 or even 4  :o  shim thicknesses.

Here are your options as I see them, in order of desirability (assuming money is more important than convenience):

Option 1
Hopefully at least one of the other shims is thinner than the one on the tight valve.  Find the thinnest one.  Swap it with the tight shim.  (NEVER turn the engine without ALL shims in place!)  Turn the engine over a few times by pulling the rear wheel around.  This will squeeze any oil in the bucket out from under the shim, so your measurement will be more accurate.  Now measure with the feeler blades.  If the clearance is "within spec" then you know which shim thickness to order.

Option 2
Find a feeler blade that's less than or equal to .03mm thick.  (Not very easy to do.)  

Option 3
Tell me your current shim thickness.  I'll see if I have any thinner ones.  If I have one or more thinner shims (of different thicknesses) I'll mail them to you.  If one of the shims fits, great -- keep it.  Send back the rest, along with your too-thick one.  Oh, and reimburse me for shipping them out.  :mrgreen:

Option 4
Find a way to make the current shim a little thinner.  Good luck with this option.  :roll:  I tried it once, by laying different grits of fine sandpaper down on a flat, cast iron jointer bed and "scrubbing" the shim around in circles and figure-8s for most of an hour.  I took off MAYBE a 10,000th of an inch (~.002mm).  In the end I just put the shim back in.  :dunno:

Option 5
Order one shim.  Wait for it to arrive.  Insert it and turn the engine over a few times.  Measure it.  If the .038mm feeler blade still won't go in, order the next thinnest shim.  Repeat until the blade goes in.

Option 6
Order 2 to 4 shims at the same time - starting at the sizes just thinner than the current shim and going DOWN.  One of them is (almost) guaranteed to be the right size.[/list:u]

I run it tight...why, in the 38K I have tortured the bike ... I know when hot the clearance goes up... did it on a hot motor and have the burn marks to prove it... and my valves always go loose... never go tight. They have gotten ~ 2 thicker sizes... on all. If I can spin the bucket freely with the cam pointing away from the bucket... I'll call it good sometimes. I also measure the shim that comes out, add the thickness of the guage that fit, and drop in a shim that is very close to, but under that thickness ... whooo hooo digital calipers...
Cool.
Srinath.

I will say it would be ideal to run your intake clearances a little tighter than the exhaust side, the reason being to optimize the cooling effect of the incoming air/fuel charge to help cool the intake valve. The exhaust side I would still run loose to optimize the time that the valve rests against the valve seat to transfer heat to the head and maximizing fuel economy through not allowing unburnt fuel to escape so quickly past the exhaust valve. Also, the hot exhaust gases passing by the exhaust valve heat up the valve, causing it to expand; I would like to minimize the amount of tme that the exhaust valve has to endure that by having the valve on the loose side.

Rema1000, I think you may recall me stating something like the above.

Quote from: Kerry

I haven't ever had it done, but at about 1 hour for 60+ per hour, figure on $70+ dollars after tax.  For which you could buy a valve shim tool (somewhat optional), some decent dial calipers, a set of feeler gauges, and a few replacement shims.  ALL of which you could reuse in another 4000 miles, and another, and another....

Wow!!  well a Suzuki dealership here in Raleigh, NC quoted me at around $250 for a valve adjustment......I definately think I am going to try to do it myself, but probably not till I do my next oil change so I can do it all at the same time (i just changed the oil so it'll be another 4k miles before I do it).  I cant find any other motorcycle repair shops besides the Suzuki dealer's....I just dont know where to look....and the dealer's charge an arm and a leg to do anything.  I guess thats why its nice to have a messageboard of knowledgable folks to help guide you through doing it yourself...  :)

Quote from: Kerry
BTW, if you'd like to "try before you buy" I am willing to mail the necessary equipment (and the current collection of cast-off shims) to just about anyone for the cost of my shipping them to you.  jake42 is one (hopefully) happy customer.  Manjul (The_good_guy) is another, although I hand-delivered (and applied) the tools for him.  :roll:

Interested?

I dont understand what you mean by the try before you buy thing.  You own the tools and you'll mail them to me to try if i pay shipping??  And then if I want to buy them do I buy them from you?  Or do I try them, send them back, and then go to the store and buy some?

Quote from: jamesmcbWow!!  well a Suzuki dealership here in Raleigh, NC quoted me at around $250 for a valve adjustment

I wonder if they just charge a flat rate for ALL valve adjustments, from a 16-valve 4-banger to our easy-to-work-on 4-valve 2 banger.  :dunno:

Quote from: jamesmcbI dont understand what you mean by the try before you buy thing.  You own the tools and you'll mail them to me to try if i pay shipping??  And then if I want to buy them do I buy them from you?  Or do I try them, send them back, and then go to the store and buy some?

I meant the latter.  I definitely want my tools back -- so I can loan them out again!  :thumb:

Quote from: Kerry
That's about the same mileage my bike had when I adjusted the valves the first time.  :oops:

Like scratch (and the manual) says: Every 4000 miles.

Interested?

Kerry, you said that you didnt get your valves adjusted for the first time untill around 17,000 miles right?  so I take it until then you dont have to get it done as frequently....but after your first one you are supposed to get it done every 4000 miles right?  Am i understanding this right, or are you always supposed to do it every 4000 miles, you just didnt do your first one till 17,000.  is it always 4000 miles between them or does that vary on drivin conditions?

Ok. New dilemma.

The manual states to rotate the shim bucket so as to position the notch for easy shim removal. I can easily rotate the intake valve buckets, but the two exhaust valve buckets won't budge. What's even more perplexing is the fact that the right exhaust valve has at least the minimum spec valve clearance :dunno:

I figure, unless someone has any ideas on this matter, I will have to unbolt the front camshaft to remove the buckets entirely. Besides, I don't even have the special valve tool anyways & this might save me some grief anyways.

Any recommendations on a torque wrench when I bolt it back on? what is the range (lbs/ft) we need to get for the GS500?

edit: Which one would you prefer/recommend & why? --> $10 Clicker torque wrench (10-150 ft. lbs.) (http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=239) or $30 Beam torque wrench (0-150 ft. lbs.) (http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944642000&tab=spe#tablink)
both are accurate within +/- 4%

Quote from: jamesmcbKerry, you said that you didnt get your valves adjusted for the first time untill around 17,000 miles right?

I just checked my records, and my first valve check was at 16,586 miles.  Only the left intake valve was tight, but not by much.  I took the shim out and tried to sand it thinner.  (Ha!)  In the end I just put the shim back in and rode on....

Why did I wait so long to check my valves?  Mostly because I was scared to fool around with any part of the engine.  But once I had done it I realized that it is a fairly straightforward procedure, with very little chance of breaking anything.

I checked the clearances again at mile 23726 and they were ... close enough.

When I checked them again at mile 30249 both the right intake and right exhaust valves were loose.  I went up one shim size on both.

But when I checked the valves today at mile 32965 (while video-ing the whole procedure  :) ) I found that both of the valves on the right were tight again.  :? I went back to the original shim thickness on the intake valve, but the exhaust valve needed to drop by 3 sizes.  I put the original size back in for that valve too, because that was the thinnest shim I had.  So what do you know - at the moment I'm back to the original shim sizes on all 4 valves!  (Although I still need to drop 2 sizes on one of them.)

Having said all of that, would I recommend skipping your valve checks, or doubling/tripling  the service interval?  NO.  For whatever reason, I think I just got lucky.  When richard and I checked the clearances on his bike for the first time at around 12,000 miles (my fault  :oops: ) his exhaust valves were WAY out of whack.  After we adjusted them his mileage and power took a very noticeable leap upwards.  I'm not sure how many miles he has on the bike now (several thousand more) but he recent;y said that his bike seems to be having similar symptoms again.  :x

One more thing.  It's easy for me to say that you should check your valves every 4,000 now that I'm comfortable with doing it myself.  But if I was looking at a $100 or $200 shop bill every 4,000 miles you can BET I would put it off!

Quote from: FlashI can easily rotate the intake valve buckets, but the two exhaust valve buckets won't budge. What's even more perplexing is the fact that the right exhaust valve has at least the minimum spec valve clearance :dunno:

Hmmm.  That IS perplexing.  :?

Quote from: FlashI figure, unless someone has any ideas on this matter, I will have to unbolt the front camshaft to remove the buckets entirely.

I would modify that and suggest that you LOOSEN the camshaft bolts.  You could remove them entirely, but make sure that the sprocket on the cam shaft doesn't skip a link or two on the camchain.  (If you don't entirely remove the bolts there's no chance of a problem there.)

You said "remove the buckets entirely".  You meant "remove the shims", right?  I wouldn't even know HOW to remove the buckets.

Tell you what.  Try this:

:o   :o  EDIT: WARNING!   :o   :o
I have not tried the following procedure myself, and I now have reason to believe that it's the WRONG thing to do.  (See the Idiot! Bent valve. thread.)  Try it at your own risk!!

1) Loosen the camshaft bolts until you can rotate the bucket and gain access to the notch.  That notch really is important.  I hope you have a teeny screwdriver or something to put in there, to lever the shim up and out when the time comes.

2) Rotate the engine until the cam lobe is pushing the shim/bucket in question DOWN as far as it will go.

3) Eyeball the space between the rim of the bucket and the camshaft above it.

4) See if you can find or fashion a stout piece of metal that will JUST fit (vertically) in that space while standing on its edge.  It should have a clean, rectangular cross-section so it will ride nicely against the camshaft, push down solidly on the bucket rim, and not "wander over" and get hung up on the side of the bucket (or on the top of the shim).

5) Insert the metal into the space and rotate the engine until the cam lobe points away from the shim/bucket.  Do what you must to KEEP the metal on its edge; it needs to accept the substantial pressure exerted by the valve spring and keep the bucket in the DOWN position.

6) With the cam lobe pointing away from the shim you will have as much clearance as you're going to get without loosening the camshaft bolts.

Quote from: FlashAny recommendations on a torque wrench when I bolt it back on? what is the range (lbs/ft) we need to get for the GS500?

Here are the fasteners that I always torque down, and the torque values for them:

Front axle nut
36 to 52 N-m ... 27 to 38 ft-lb

Rear axle nut
50 to 80 N-m ... 37 to 59 ft-lb

Front brake caliper mounting bolts
30 to 48 N-m ... 17 to 35 ft-lb

Engine mounting bolt nuts (when I install/remove case guards)
60 to 72 N-m ... 44 to 53 ft-lbs[/list]

Here are some others that I have been known to torque down:

Valve cover bolts
13 to 15 N-m ... 10 to 11 ft-lb

Exhaust header bolts
9 to 12 N-m ... 7 to 9 ft-lb

Handlebar clamp pinch nuts
8 to 12 N-m ... 6 to 9 ft-lb

Fork clamp bolts (top yoke)
18 to 28 N-m ... 13 to 21 ft-lb

Fork clamp bolts (bottom yoke)
25 to 40 N-m ... 18 to 30 ft-lb

Oil drain plug
20 to 25 N-m ... 15 to 18 ft-lb[/list]

And here are some that I haven't messed with yet, but would certainly torque down if I did:

Shock absorber mounting bolts
40 to 60 N-m ... 30 to 44 ft-lb

Suspension linkage rod and arm bolts
70 to 100 N-m ... 52 to 74 ft-lb

Swingarm pivot nut
55 to 88 N-m ... 41 to 65 ft-lb

Alternator rotor bolt
110 to 130 N-m ... 81 to 96 ft-lb[/list]

BTW, that last entry is by far the largest torque value in the manual.  The only others that come close are the "Primary drive gear nut" in the engine (90 to 110 N-m ... 66 to 81 ft-lbs) and the "Suspension linkage bolts" listed above.  The vast majority of fasteners need less than 60 N-m ... 44 ft-lbs of torque.

Quote from: Flashedit: Which one would you prefer/recommend & why? --> $10 Clicker torque wrench (10-150 ft. lbs.) or $30 Beam torque wrench (0-150 ft. lbs.)
both are accurate within +/- 4%

The first torque wrench I bought was the 1/2" Craftsman unit you linked to.  I chose not to go the "clicker" route because of its worthlessness at low torque values.  (Play with it in the store - the clicker simply doesn't kick in until you get up to some hefty torque values.)  I used the Craftsman for 2 or 3 years and was happy with it.  There were  only 2 "downers":

1) If I wanted to check small-to-mid-range torque values I had to use small sockets which my set only had in 3/8" drive versions.  So I had to buy a 1/2" to 3/8" adaptor, which made me uneasy about measurement errors.

2) In several situations the wrench was just too long and more awkward than it needed to be.

My solution?  I bought the Craftman's "little brother" - the 3/8" beam torque wrench!  (It's listed in the sidebar on the page you linked to.)  Here is a picture of both wrenches at last year's sale - when the MSRP for each wrench was $5 less than it is now.... :x



And here are the two scales - 1/2" wrench first:





As you can see, the scale on the 3/8" wrench offers higher precision.  And the shorter handle just may prevent you from unintentionally twisting off the fastener you're trying to tighten!

Flash wrote:
I can easily rotate the intake valve buckets, but the two exhaust valve buckets won't budge. What's even more perplexing is the fact that the right exhaust valve has at least the minimum spec valve clearance  

Hmmm. That IS perplexing. >>>>>

And a pain in the butt too!  I've got the same problem with the same valve!  Bought my 02 GS in Sept 03 with 4k miles on the clock.  This spring, I checked the valve clearences with 8k on it and found the 2 intakes and #1 (left) exhaust valve to be OK.  The right exhaust valve had about .008" clearance.  Wow, could hear a valve ticking on start up, but everything was quickly OK as bike warmed up.  Smooth and quiet.

I tried to turn the bucket with everything I could think of including a couple of the wife's crochet hooks grabbing the notch and pulling hard on it.  It wouldn't budge.  The bucket is tight in the head and loosens quickly when warm up starts.  Not wanting to tear it down, I buttoned it up and used it all summer including the trip to the mountains in June.

Now I have 20k miles on it and recently replaced spark plugs again.  As I always do, I checked compression with the old finger in the hole process and was good pop on #1 cyl and then found no compression on the #2 cylinder.  That exhaust valve was stuck open.  I let it set a day (used the 97) and then put plugs back in and all was OK.  Started up and it stopped ticking and smoothed out in less than 30 sec.  A little heat loosened it up again.

I feel I should correct this problem before spring, I'll be using the 97 to splash around in the salt water again this winter.  If I pull the exhaust valve camshaft, I haven't got any idea yet on how I'll get that tight bucket up out of the head to free it up.  Anyone have any ideas on how to get that bucket out w/o pulling the head?

The bike still runs like new as soon as it starts to warm up and there is no tappet noise or rough idle that would be there when valve is open.  I'm thinking of maybe pulling the camshaft with the engine hot so I can lift the bucket out with a magnet.  Pulled the cover on a CB750K with a hot engine 20 years ago to check the valves hot, but I was in my youthful early 50's then.   :lol: Not sure I can do it fast enough now with my arthritic fingers.   :(

Ok guys. I am thoroughly disgusted right now, but before I rant I would like to thank Kerry for loaning his valve shim checking/replacing kit to me on short notice :thumb: . I received it yesterday and didn't get started on my bike until after midnight (much more peaceful that way). Here is my progress report:

Good News
-- the valve shim tool and everything else Kerry sent me worked like it was supposed to and I was able to get the two exhaust valve shims out for measurement.

Bad News
-- both exhaust valve shims measure 2.14 and 2.16 mm respectively. Guess what, Kerry says Suzuki doesn't manufacture shims any smaller than that. Therefore, I have a valve clearance of <.038 mm, I can't put smaller shims to increase this gap, and both of the buckets they sit in won't budge either  :( :(

Really Bad News
-- I stripped the threads on one of the camshaft cover bolt well. It all started when I found out the intake camshaft was not aligned properly with the exhaust camshaft. Apparently, the repair manual says there is supposed to be 18 teeth from a particular arrow marking on the exhaust camshaft to the intake camshaft. Mine suprisingly enough was set at 19 teeth in between. So I follow the manual on how to disassemble the camshafts and put it back together. It was farely easy, but when I went to torque the bolts with my newly purchased torque wrench the 3/8" adapter would not let it clear the frame for the exhaust camshaft. So I had to do it by hand  :x  :x  :x

Conclusion
-- I guess I am going to have to take it to the Suzuki dealer and have them loosen the valve springs or something to alleviate the pressure on  shim buckets and have them rethread for the camshaft cover bolt.

Is this going to be ok to ride 15 miles to the dealership in this condition?

I guess I won't have my bike ready for my 1st Track Day (one week away) after all :nono: All this headache and frustration is just adding more fuel to the fire. Boy, I can't wait to sell the GS and get myself a 2005 SV650s :cheers:

I can do the thread repair for you if you get strapped for cash and the dealer wants too much.  You'll have to ship me the head though.

Probably easier just to have the dealer take care of all you other stuff at once.  But just in case they want $50 bucks and you aint got it..you can send it to me.

L8r

If you have ever tapped a hole you can rethread it yourself in a couple of minutes.  It's one of those things that you beat your head against the wall after learning how to do it because you have paid a shop $50 to do it in the past.

You need to teach yourself how to use helicoils!  You will save thousands of dollars over a lifetime.

Here's how.  Buy yourself a Helicoil kit.   www.helicoil.com  It's the exact same thing they use at the motorcycle shop.  Exact.  Contact your local nut and bolt store and they will have the exact kit you need for the exact metric thread that is stripped.  You probably won't spend over $15 for the kit that includes everything you need to do the job, except for tapping fluid, just a special fluid to help you make perfectly smooth taps and saves wear and tear on your taps.  I use Rapid Tap(nut and bolt store will have something like it).  Make sure you get the right tapping fluid for the metal you are tapping(i.e. steel vs. stainless vs. aluminium).

Drill the hole with the included drill bit, tap the hole with the included tap, screw in the helicoil, and your done.  One tap, that's it.

After reading this thread I am certain my bike needs a valve check and more properly adjustment, but, besides shims and tools what else do I need? new valve cover gasket? what else?

Quote from: TRI am certain my bike needs a valve check and more properly adjustment, but, besides shims and tools what else do I need? new valve cover gasket? what else?

Here is the package that's making its way around the country (U.S) right now.  Except for the generic tools needed to get the tank and valve cover off, this set covers just about everything.



I would be surprised if you need a new valve cover gasket.  If you're careful when you take it off you should be able to reuse it.  You may need a new O-ring or two for the valve cover bolts, but I just replaced my first one - after removing the cover several times.

Would you care to receive a copy of my (rough-edit edition) How To video?  I don't know what the postage would be, but I can look into it.  If you can play a Windows Media file from CD I could send you one the day after I get your address.  $.71 plus postage.  If you want a DVD-R version ($.92 plus postage) you'll have to wait for a week or more while I spruce it up.

Quote from: KerryHere is the package that's making its way around the country (U.S) right now.  Except for the generic tools needed to get the tank and valve cover off, this set covers just about everything.

WOW! It looks so clear that I feel like if i had already adjusted the valves... I guess I'll need some shims, but seems better tol buy them once the clearance is measured...

Quote from: Kerry
I would be surprised if you need a new valve cover gasket.  If you're careful when you take it off you should be able to reuse it.  You may need a new O-ring or two for the valve cover bolts, but I just replaced my first one - after removing the cover several times.

Good to know, I just hated to disassemble something and get stuck 'cause didn't have a new O-ring or gasket.

Quote from: Kerry
Would you care to receive a copy of my (rough-edit edition) How To video?  I don't know what the postage would be, but I can look into it.  If you can play a Windows Media file from CD I could send you one the day after I get your address.  $.71 plus postage.  If you want a DVD-R version ($.92 plus postage) you'll have to wait for a week or more while I spruce it up.

Not at all, I'll send you my address. Any, VCD or DVD, would do, pls let me know how much does postage cost to Mexico City.