Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 15, 2005, 12:50:48 PM
Post by: Cal Price on January 15, 2005, 12:50:48 PM
Just rode five mins down the road, stopped and switched of, she had started fine. Two mins later, swith on, nothing, no lights, signals dash lights or starter. Did the obvious, changed the fuse, same thing, tested original fuse after pushing home, it was fine. I am sure battery is ok.
What next?? any advice/experience appreciated.
What next?? any advice/experience appreciated.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Richard UK on January 15, 2005, 01:53:09 PM
Post by: Richard UK on January 15, 2005, 01:53:09 PM
Souns like a major break in the circuit somewhere. Check that the connections at the battery terminals are clean and tight. Check that there is good connectivity between the battery negative terminal and a bare piece of metal (e.g. bolt end) on the chassis.
Title: Aux
Post by: The Buddha on January 15, 2005, 02:33:26 PM
Post by: The Buddha on January 15, 2005, 02:33:26 PM
OK auxillary ground got busted. ... or you got goats or busted somehting huge ...
Cool.
Srinath.
Cool.
Srinath.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Kerry on January 15, 2005, 02:42:14 PM
Post by: Kerry on January 15, 2005, 02:42:14 PM
Quote from: Richard UKCheck that there is good connectivity between the battery negative terminal and a bare piece of metal (e.g. bolt end) on the chassis.Do you have a simple tester like this?
If so, then:
- 1) Attach the clip to cable connector at the + battery terminal.
2) Make sure the tool is working by touching the pointy tip to the - battery terminal. The light in the tool's handle should light up.
3) Now touch the pointy tip against the frame or engine. You may need to poke through paint (or salt :roll:) to contact bare metal, so test in inconspicuous places.[/list:u]If the light comes on, the - battery terminal IS electrically connected to the frame. If it doesn't light then definitely check the ground wire connections.
You might also want to check all of the "obvious" connectors that come off of the wiring harness. Especially the one nearest the battery.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 15, 2005, 03:10:12 PM
Post by: Cal Price on January 15, 2005, 03:10:12 PM
Cheers guys, this happened recently and it's well dark so i won't do a lot till daylight, in the meantime I have put the battery on charge but it showed as discharging 12v on my simple voltmeter. In the morning I will put the battery back and do Kerry's test using my meter. Oh and it is not the other obvious thing, the kill switch. As far as I can tell, with a maglite there is no cable damage, that's why, when it happened I was pretty sure it must be the 20amp fuse (I carry a spare) or the battery connections
I was lucky, it was not much of a push home and pretty much flat, which is realy something around here. I could have lived without the push :dunno: Hate not having the bike :roll:
I was lucky, it was not much of a push home and pretty much flat, which is realy something around here. I could have lived without the push :dunno: Hate not having the bike :roll:
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Rema1000 on January 15, 2005, 09:26:06 PM
Post by: Rema1000 on January 15, 2005, 09:26:06 PM
When I first got my GS, I had a ride like that. The bike would just quit while riding. I'd pull over, take off the seat, clean the contacts on the battery, then get going again.
The hilarious part was that I discovered (by accident) that if I rose up out of the saddle, then sat back down, the lights would sometimes come back on. After discovering that, on the way home, when the bike would just quit, I'd pull the clutch, stand on the pegs, and sit down hard -WHOMP-, and the lights would come back on, so I'd hit the starter and clutch out (this was NOT the way MSF described learning to ride).
At home, I pulled the battery out, and discovered that the battery posts had little metal blocks screwed to them, and the bike electricals were screwed down to the little blocks. I had been cleaning the contacts I could see, but the metal blocks were not making good contact with the posts.
If you can catch the problem and test, then:
unplug the Regulator nylon connector (disconnects the stator)
power from battery +12 to frame: OK battery wiring
power from red wire at Regulator to frame: OK fuse
oil pressure light on: OK ignition
Now plug Regulator back in; lights out = Goats.
I haven't had Goats, so that's just a guess...
Note that the problem might come and go even while you're testing :x
The hilarious part was that I discovered (by accident) that if I rose up out of the saddle, then sat back down, the lights would sometimes come back on. After discovering that, on the way home, when the bike would just quit, I'd pull the clutch, stand on the pegs, and sit down hard -WHOMP-, and the lights would come back on, so I'd hit the starter and clutch out (this was NOT the way MSF described learning to ride).
At home, I pulled the battery out, and discovered that the battery posts had little metal blocks screwed to them, and the bike electricals were screwed down to the little blocks. I had been cleaning the contacts I could see, but the metal blocks were not making good contact with the posts.
If you can catch the problem and test, then:
unplug the Regulator nylon connector (disconnects the stator)
power from battery +12 to frame: OK battery wiring
power from red wire at Regulator to frame: OK fuse
oil pressure light on: OK ignition
Now plug Regulator back in; lights out = Goats.
I haven't had Goats, so that's just a guess...
Note that the problem might come and go even while you're testing :x
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 16, 2005, 02:39:14 AM
Post by: Cal Price on January 16, 2005, 02:39:14 AM
I have put the battery back and I get a good voltage using the test suggested by RichardUK & Kerry. Starting to worry about "Goats" the bike is still under it's two-year warranty so maybe I'll let the dealer worry. I will follow Rema' suggestions but not hopeful with power there and no lights, no dash lights, no horn, no indicators and no ignition this looks like a Sunday without a ride.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Kerry on January 16, 2005, 03:12:27 AM
Post by: Kerry on January 16, 2005, 03:12:27 AM
:x :x :x
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 16, 2005, 08:06:39 AM
Post by: Cal Price on January 16, 2005, 08:06:39 AM
Well no change, I have taken the R/H bar switch to bits just to check the kill switch and apart from no current it seems OK. I either have "Goats" or I have discovered or invented "Icy Pricey" syndrome.
I am not going to take a wrench to it just in case of warranty problems so it's Monday morning and on the old dog'n'bone to the dealer.
I am not going to take a wrench to it just in case of warranty problems so it's Monday morning and on the old dog'n'bone to the dealer.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 17, 2005, 12:32:11 PM
Post by: Cal Price on January 17, 2005, 12:32:11 PM
I'm the bloke that always says "check the obvious first" before getting carried away with the complex and hi-tech problems and solutions.
Rema 1000 was in the right area, the fuse was fine, the battery was fine and the negative earth, or ground wire connection was fine. When I first changed the fuse, a fiddly job in darkness and rain with a maglite clenched in my molars I did not notice that the relay the the fuse goes into to corroded realy badly. I suppose it's the old maratime environment thing again. When I checked it out the following day I concentrated on the battery and frame connection. I knew the fuse was OK so I dis not pull off the red plastic cover and black rubber bit to expose it all.
I have said on the forum before that the fuse is in a very awkward place and any new GS owner should do a dry run changing it because if you do it for real it will probably be in bad conditions. The pic in the owners manual (P58) is worse than useless as it points to the spare fuse, the real one is a couple of inches behind the spare under a red plastic cover that you need to pinch from above and below to remove (at least on an 03 you do) It makes you wonder how much else in that manual is misleading. :dunno:
Anyway once cleaned and smothered in grease, all is well, riding again, could this be salty's syndrome. :thumb:
Rema 1000 was in the right area, the fuse was fine, the battery was fine and the negative earth, or ground wire connection was fine. When I first changed the fuse, a fiddly job in darkness and rain with a maglite clenched in my molars I did not notice that the relay the the fuse goes into to corroded realy badly. I suppose it's the old maratime environment thing again. When I checked it out the following day I concentrated on the battery and frame connection. I knew the fuse was OK so I dis not pull off the red plastic cover and black rubber bit to expose it all.
I have said on the forum before that the fuse is in a very awkward place and any new GS owner should do a dry run changing it because if you do it for real it will probably be in bad conditions. The pic in the owners manual (P58) is worse than useless as it points to the spare fuse, the real one is a couple of inches behind the spare under a red plastic cover that you need to pinch from above and below to remove (at least on an 03 you do) It makes you wonder how much else in that manual is misleading. :dunno:
Anyway once cleaned and smothered in grease, all is well, riding again, could this be salty's syndrome. :thumb:
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Kerry on January 17, 2005, 01:35:27 PM
Post by: Kerry on January 17, 2005, 01:35:27 PM
For future reader's reference. This is for 1990-2000 models. Does it match '01+ models too?
From the Haynes manual:
(http://www.bbburma.net/Scans/Haynes_Fuse.jpg)
(http://www.bbburma.net/HowTo/TimeVoltageTempGauge_Install/100_2068_BikeWiring_PositiveWire_1.jpg)
From the Haynes manual:
(http://www.bbburma.net/Scans/Haynes_Fuse.jpg)
(http://www.bbburma.net/HowTo/TimeVoltageTempGauge_Install/100_2068_BikeWiring_PositiveWire_1.jpg)
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: Cal Price on January 17, 2005, 03:38:27 PM
Post by: Cal Price on January 17, 2005, 03:38:27 PM
That looks very like my'03, it's a lot of bother with the plastic side panel in place, it does "pop" out just enough to let you do it without taking the panel right off.
Title: No electrics at all
Post by: John Bates on January 17, 2005, 05:54:08 PM
Post by: John Bates on January 17, 2005, 05:54:08 PM
Quote from: Cal Price................ the fuse is in a very awkward place........
I wonder if it would be worthwhile to rewire the fuse back to the 89 arrangement with the placement of the fuse by the battery. Looks like all it would take is an in-line style fuse and some heavy gauge wire. :thumb: