GStwin.com GS500 Message Forum

Hellow all!

I been trying to solve this problem for a long time, and searched the forums multiple times as well as started my own postings about this.

So here is the problem, I can not figure out if my GS needs Progressive springs or not. Every one always talks about how the stock forks are too soft and that Progressives are the first mod to get. I bought my 2002 GS used, but with only 90 miles on it.  One of the employees at my local Suzuki dealer was riding it before me. It was kind of like their demo model. Now when I bought it, there was already an aftermarket pipe, but I can not imagine them changing the fork springs.

I had the bike for 2 years now and I can not figure out if I need new springs or not. I can not seem to understand if my bike buttoms out or not. I have done everything that people describe causes the bike to bottom out. I did sudden brakes from considerable speeds with the front brake only, I hit bumps, and even did wheelies. I don't know maybe the bike does bottom out and I just don't realize it.

I brought the bike to my car mechanic today for an oil change. He owns multiple bikes himself and helps me out. So after he supervised me changing oil I asked him to take a ride on it and tell me if he thinks the suspension is too soft. When he got on the bike I actually saw the front forks contract, but thats it. He is twice my 145lb, so yea the load was heavy, but he said it seems fine.

So now after this long description here is my question: how can I figure out if I need to change my fork springs, or if they are fine. how can I figure if the bike bottoms out or not?

Is there any other way than to just take apart the forks and see if it's stock springs in there? Even so how will I be able to tell if they are stock or not.

Quote from: Zhenya13Is there any other way than to just take apart the forks and see if it's stock springs in there?

Not if you want to be SURE.

Quote from: Zhenya13Even so how will I be able to tell if they are stock or not.

Well, here is what the stock spacers and springs look like:



If you have Progressives:

* The spring "wire" itself is much thicker.

* The spring windings are closer together at one end than the other

* The springs will be much longer than the stock ones

* The spacers will be much shorter than the stock ones.[/list:u]Sorry - I wasn't yet a "documentation nut" when I put my Progressives in, so I don't have a picture of them.   But way back when

someone had a comparison picture.  Hmmm....

EDIT: Duh - the picture I'm thinking of is the one on Pablo's page.  The one I used when I replaced my springs!   :roll:  BTW, if I were you this is the way I would remove the springs.  It's actually pretty easy to do.

The pic of both can be seen at the bottom of Pablos site on progressive fork spring install here:

http://pantablo500.tripod.com/id2.html

(I tried showing the pic in this thread but Tripod wouldnt let me)

+1

use the 1/2" ratchet head, if you have a 3/8" ratchet, you can get a conversion (3/8" to 1/2") head from home depot for cheap.

Jonah

You would know it if your forks were bottoming out. BAM!, SLAM!, BOOM! (in Batmanese) at every pothole and bump in the road.  If you can't feel it, it's not bottoming out.  I believe that low fork oil is a bigger factor, especially for someone light like you, than changing the fork springs.

I thought it was more of a *TONG* when it did it...

Thanks alot everyone, I guess I will just take my forks apart and check it out, now that i have pictures.

One question though: will I have to replace the oil if I take it apart just to look, or can I just take the spring out and stick it back in without replacing anything?

Quote from: Zhenya13One question though: will I have to replace the oil if I take it apart just to look, or can I just take the spring out and stick it back in without replacing anything?

No need to replace oil.  Just pull out the spring carefully and don't let the oil make a mess.

Put the bike on centerstand and put some weight on the back so the front is extended as far as possible to reduce the spring pressure on the fork.  The fork will still be under compression, so be careful when you take off the end cap as it will want to fly out.  A piece of rag over the breaker bar and cap will be helpful if it were to come flying out.

When you put the cap back on, you will have to press it down and turn at the same time.  It can be frustrating but take your time with that and don't cross-thread the cap.  You'll be fine.

Cheers,
e.

Quote from: Zhenya13...........................how can I figure out if I need to change my fork springs, or if they are fine. .............

If you strictly ride single and haven't noticed excessive nose diving when braking then I expect you don't need to change the springs.  However, if you ever ride double you might experience it.

I weigh 215 lbs and haven't seen any problems when riding alone.  But with a rider on the back an ordinary stop becomes a nose dive from hell.  I'll probably change mine for that reason.


:cheers:

You won't regret the purchase of Progressives.  I've only had mine for a few days, but I can feel the difference.  I ride with more confidence with these new springs.  Go get some progressives, you'll like 'em  :thumb:

I don't weigh much more than 145lbs, but Progressive Springs were a BIG difference.  The stopping distance, braking power, handling in general all significantly improved.  I didn't really understand the big deal, but after ordering and installing my progressive springs, I completely understand why they really do make such a big difference.

Here's about the best deal you'll get.  If you order progressive springs, install them, and are unhappy with the difference, send them to me with the original bill, and I'll reimburse you.

:)

The main difference I noticed going from stock to progressives was my riding position.  On stock springs, I sat with my groin about 4 inches aft of the tank and the "horn" at the front of the seat.  I grabbed the tank with my knees, to keep from sliding forward and into the tank (ouch!).

After switching to progressives, I noticed that I started riding with my groin right up near the seat.  It doesn't hurt the family jewels when I hit a pothole anymore, so that affected my riding position.

honestly I didn't notice much difference.  I suspect the previous owner may have changed to 15w oil though..

when I did my fork seals I installed progressives and used 15w...  I mean.. it may have a tiny tiny bit stiffer (if any...)

Question.... Who has the best deal on the progressive springs?

My F model has bottomed out on me a couple times. Usually when I pull into this one gas station near my house. And I'll back up John Bates statement about 2 up riding, the nose dives pretty hard.

When I bought my F model I thought there was something wrong with forks. I went to a Cycle World show where you could hop on different display bikes and did a little bouncing on their GS, that's just how their made.

If you pull the front brake and put your weight on the front and rock back and forth you'll see way too much travel. My buddy's katana does the same thing but just not as bad.

Quote from: fettcolsQuestion.... Who has the best deal on the progressive springs?

Check this thread.  The links and prices are still up-to-date.

I bought Progressive Springs from Motorcycle Accessory Warehouse (MAW)  <www.mawonline.com>  for $57.95 plus insurance and shipping/handling.  Shipping is 4% or $4.95, which ever is greater, but I can't remember the insurance charge.

This is pretty easy to do with the forks on the bike, unless you need to do seals and fork oil also.  Put the bike on the center stand, and put something under the exhaust headers to elevate the front wheel.  Next remove the handlebar clamps, and push or tie the handlebars forward out of the way.  Carefully remove both fork caps, the stock spacers, the stock springs, and the spring cups.  Then I used a floor jack to collapse and hold the forks all the way up.  Add or remove fork oil as necessary to acheive a level of 5 1/2 inches from the top.  Remember that this measurement is suppose to be taken with the fork legs vertical, but you still have them in the bike at an angle.  I used the engine oil dipstick, and tried to point it right down the center of the tube.  Just pull it out and take your measurement.  I had about 2 1/2 oz. still left over from two 16 oz. bottles.

Let the jack down holding the front wheel up.  Install the new Progressive Springs, the stock spring cups, and your new spacers.  I used PVC caps that were about 1 1/4 inches in diameter by 7/8 inches tall.  The toughest part is pressing down evenly on the Fork Caps, and starting the threads without cross threading them.

Check my site for a lazy mans install of the progressive springs. You dont need to take the forks apart to find out if you have the stock or progressives in there. Just use my easy method to open up one of the fork legs from top side and pull out a spring. stocker is only about 10" long with massive spacer as shown in picture above, progressive spring fills the entire fork leg, just about.

You'd know if you were bottoming out due to the loud "thud" you'd hear when it compresses all the way. I'm only 120# and still managed to bottom mine out.

Can Progressives weaken if they take too much abuse? My GS's previous owner apparently put Progressive springs in, but it seems like I bottom out all the time. Of course, it only happens when I hit very nasty potholes; maybe the potholes are so bad that even better springs won't be immune...

It's a terrible sound to hear, though. Very painful.

Quote from: miloOf course, it only happens when I hit very nasty potholes; maybe the potholes are so bad that even better springs won't be immune....

progressives can only do so much. stock springs would sound like that hitting the lip on a driveway apron!

Quote from: miloCan Progressives weaken if they take too much abuse? My GS's previous owner apparently put Progressive springs in, but it seems like I bottom out all the time. Of course, it only happens when I hit very nasty potholes; maybe the potholes are so bad that even better springs won't be immune...

It's a terrible sound to hear, though. Very painful.

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Pull your fork caps, the spacer, spring cups and springs.  Jack up the front end and then check your fork oil level.  You may find that you're low.

QuotePull your fork caps, the spacer, spring cups and springs. Jack up the front end and then check your fork oil level. You may find that you're low.

Just a heads-up -- by the above he means you need to fully compress the fork before attempting to measure the fork oil level.  With my bike on its centre stand and all the weight off the front tire, all it took to fully compress the forks was a single brick.

C

Ok I got my progresive in the mail today, purchased PVC tube and made spacers, now before I start I have 2 questions.

First how do you properly drain the oil, not the lazy way, but completly get rid of it so that I can put in w15

Second is once I drain the oil how do I measure how much of the new one I need. Should the springs be in or not when I pour and measure oil? How high should the level be? Do I measure from the top or the bottom of the fork?

thanks

I dont have pregressives but it should have instructions that tell you how much to put in, I think it is a number amount.  When I replaced my oil I just took out the fork legs one at a time and poured them out and pumped the leg alittle.  I think the lazy way might be siphoning it out.

Quote from: Zhenya13First how do you properly drain the oil, not the lazy way, but completly get rid of it so that I can put in w15

Remove forks, and turn fork assembly upside down to drain completely.

Quote from: Zhenya13Second is once I drain the oil how do I measure how much of the new one I need

382ml or 12.9 US oz.  You could also fabricate a special oil length measure tool, and check that the level 3.9 inches (with fork vertical, completely compressed and no springs).  If you plan to do this work yourself, I'd strongly suggest picking up the Clymer manual.  And if you are ordering it online, use the link on this site.

Quote from: sys49152You could also fabricate a special oil length measure tool

Or buy a purpose-built one, if you're into that sort of thing.  For some info on both options, see this post and the next few after that.

Which way do progressives go in?

Quote from: Zhenya13Which way do progressives go in?

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I believe that the instructions that came with the springs indicates that it doesn't matter.  I put mine in with the tightly wound coils down.

Quote from: BUZZINI believe that the instructions that came with the springs indicates that it doesn't matter.  I put mine in with the tightly wound coils down.

That's right -- the reasoning provided in the instructions said something along the lines of, 'Some people found installing the springs tightly-wound end down reduced spring noise...' but that didn't make a whole lot of sense to me.  How noisy could springs suspended in heavy oil really be?

C