Im just curious, after reading though the "Whats Your Gas Price" thread, it seems alot of people (or at least more than I thought) are running premium in their bikes. It was my understanding that you should run the lowest octane fuel you can without pinging. Its not like the GS is a super high compression race engine that requires premium just to run properly. It runs just as well on regular, right? Why the premium?
Quote from: Chris_B... It was my understanding that you should run the lowest octane fuel you can without pinging. Its not like the GS is a super high compression race engine that requires premium just to run properly. It runs just as well on regular, right? ...
You're right, that's why i run regular
I run premium, and use silk scarves to clean up my oil spills.
:P
I guess a lot of people think it is better for the engine for whatever reason. Few days ago I was riding with my dad (I have GSE he has naked Goldwing) and we stopped at the gas station becuase we needed fuel; he said imma pump the good sh*t; which was premium gas.
Sometimes i buy octane booster from walmart, and when i treat it with my gas it seems like when I power shift it into second, my shocks jump up a lot higher than without it. Dunno it could be all mental.
7 and a half bucks for 2.9gallons of regular. i'm gonna convert my bike to run on old vegetable oil.
jake
i thought the difference between the octanes was that they take more or less effort to burn and if you put the wrong stuff in it could be bad. i guess thats why high performance engines have to run the premium because it's easier to burn. i don't know, maybe i should do a google search and really find out what i'm talking about. either way i run the cheap stuff cause the engine still runs on it.
Octane is resistance to detonation. Nothing more. If you're not knocking, you have no reason to run higher octane.
But my bike feels a lot faster when I use those silk scarves.
Regular, filled with Premium once, by mistake, did not notice any difference, only the bill.
Maybe I would have noticed something if I wore a white silk bandana.
Quote from: RoadstergalOctane is resistance to detonation. Nothing more. If you're not knocking, you have no reason to run higher octane.
But my bike feels a lot faster when I use those silk scarves.
indeed... if you want to be obsessive about some part of your fuel choice, I suggest that you run 87 octane and pay more attention to the brand. I put sheetz gas in my R6 twice (proper octane rating, two different states, not sequential tanks), and both tanks the bike ran like crap. I will never put that slop in any of my bikes ever again.
If your compression ratio is around 9:1, 87 delivers the best performance you are going to get.
putting 93 octane in a GS is like putting dropping a shot of Johnny Walker Blue into a Budweiser... what a waste
Quote from: vtlionputting 93 octane in a GS is like putting dropping a shot of Johnny Walker Blue into a Budweiser...
I'm going to have to remember that line. :thumb:
My 97 runs worse with premium. It takes longer to warm up and I have to fuss with the idle screw more. I am sticking with regular unleaded. I do agree with vtlion. Use a good branded fuel.
I do run Redline cleaner through my bikes every blue moon.
http://www.redlineoil.com/products_fueladditives.asp?productID=63
$4 for 20 treatments:
http://www.eap4parts.com/en-us/dept_812.html
I usually run premium, but I will run whatever.
This is second hand, but my dad is in the car business, and he was talking to a oil business guy/ mechanic. Oil business guy/ mechanic (OBGY/M?) said that different brands as well as different octane ratings within brands have different detergents. Different detergents clean different things (better/worse). This also applies to motor oil. OBGY/M says changing octane rating and brands from time-to-time is the best. So, if you always run Exxon 87 once every three tanks put in Shell 92, or something like that. If this info is total BS and you can prove it I want to know, so please share. If you just want to call BS on me well then :nana: .
By the way OBGY/M looks kinda like an OB/GYN and they look at girls naughty parts all day. :lol:
That's why I run cleaner through every so often.
The local refineries have more to do with gas quality than anything else. Most regions are served by a single refinery. Stations add their own additive package.
The one thing that can make a difference is traffic - the more traffic a station gets, the less the chance you'll get gas that has been sitting a while and has gotten water from condensation.
high octane gas iwill make your bike run like POO!
I think the myth was started years ago by the gas companies themselves to get you to move up. The truth is that high octane does not mean high performance, and does not mean additional horsepower. High octane gas is harder to burn. It takes more compression or higher spark or both to touch it off. The reason to use high octane is to prevent pre-ignition, "pinging". If your car runs fine on regular without pinging, there is no need to move up. If you have higher compression, use a higher octane to prevent pre-ignition
:mrgreen:
I thought that higher octane fuel burnt more easily compared to a lower octane fuel. Which, to my understanding why if you have a high compression motor, the fuel is compressed more, so the mixture is more dense, so it is harder to ignite, which is why high octane fuel needs to be used, so it burns fully. no?
...
premium here.
new bike and i don't want to mess it up.
I use 95 Octane unleaded fuel, but that is because it is the lowest Octane fuel I can buy here in the UK.
I got 95 or 98 octane as my choices.
If somewhere sold a cheaper 87 - 94 Octane fuel I'd use that.
The GS just doesn't have the compression to justify using a higher Octane Fuel.
i go with the cheapest price...runs beautifully
Quote from: banneri go with the cheapest price...runs beautifully
Same here. 85 octane! :thumb:
I usually run the Sunoco 94 when it's available, if it's not I'll go with what's around before I run out of gas. And yes I drink imported beer too!
Quote from: fretbuzzHigh octane gas is harder to burn.
No, it isn't.
Quote from: Chris_BI thought that higher octane fuel burnt more easily compared to a lower octane fuel.
No, it doesn't.
Quote from: RoadstergalOctane is resistance to detonation. Nothing more.
Quote from: subcnew bike and i don't want to mess it up.
I have a new bike and I'm not going to mess it up. I run 87. I'd run 85 if we had it. :)
Quote from: fettcolsI usually run the Sunoco 94 when it's available, if it's not I'll go with what's around before I run out of gas. And yes I drink imported beer too!
Your palate and stomach can tell the difference between imported and Bud. Your GS can't tell the difference between 87 and 94.
I have no problem with people running high octane if they think the oil companies aren't making enough money as is, but I don't like myths running around that it's somehow "better" for a bike that doesn't knock on 85.
The GS's engine isn't exactly a high-performance engine. I use 87 Octane fuel and the bike runs great. Why would I want to use higher octane? All it means is worse performance and a higher bill.
Quote from: Kerry
Same here. 85 octane! :thumb:
You can buy 85!? The lowest here in PA I have seen is 87 :dunno:
I run 91, only because there is a definate difference between that and 87 in my CBR.
Quote from: AlphaFire X5The GS's engine isn't exactly a high-performance engine.
What!? :? No one told me this! I want my $ back!!! :P
Tell me this is just an ugly rumour? :dunno:
Oh...I run 87....but he kinda runs like caca no matter what I put in him at the moment...but he runs!! ;)
pandy :thumb:
.
Dittos to what Roadstergal said. Silk cleanup rags make your bike go faster.
(seriously, she is right on the money about octane)
Duh! :? THAT's the problem. If you don't use silk scarves, then it doesn't become a high-performance rocket! :mrgreen:
pandy :mrgreen:
I have found that my cashmere lined battery box creates a brighter headlight. :lol:
Quote from: callmelennyI have found that my cashmere lined battery box creates a brighter headlight. :lol:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Now I'm jealous. :(
pandy :lol:
Well... I was running Premium 'cause I was a little confused about the octane rating I read... After being set straight about EU vs US raitings, I switched to middle... I have issues with my Ford Exploder if I don't run gas with crap-loads of cleaners in it (Citgo, etc)... I guess I just can't seem to kick the habit. :dunno:
Buy a decent regular unleaded instead of buying crappy mid-grade for the same price at a cheap station. There's nothing wrong with buying gas at the local Qwik-E Mart, as long as they don't sell gas that makes your bike run like crap. The only problem is experimenting to find who sells the "good" stuff.
I'm a total Chevron addict... It's my Exploder's fault... Back when I had a '69 Bug, I didn't care if it was gas I soaked up out of the dirt. :lol:
None of my other cars have cared either... But, I've had my Exploder for a long time now (I used to be able to fill it for about $23).
My owner's manual says to run minimum 91 octane or higher (Research method). So I've been putting the "good stuff' in.
A dealer once told me that Sunoco 94 is bad because it contains a high amount of ethanol, causing your poor air-cooled engine to run hotter.
:dunno:
Quote from: daneilahMy owner's manual says to run minimum 91 octane or higher (Research method). So I've been putting the "good stuff' in.
OK, but the octane rating at the pump (in the US at least) isn't the same as the Research Octane Method (RON) number.
For more info, see
this post.
This one also has an interesting link.
85 octane lovingly basted with nitroglycerin and the stuff that they put in A-10 Warthogs is what my baby demands.
I run 87, but only from either Chevron or Shell. A higher octane rating means the gas is less likely to pre-ignie from compression. You could look at this for simplicities sake as just harder to burn. High end cars usualy run 92 octane or better because they get the best performace out of that. They have higher compression ratios and more ignition advance. Some cars, like my bmw, are somewhat self tuning in the fact that they will turn the ignition advance up based on the internal knock sensors, so you when you put in gas with more octane, it returns the car on the fly to make use of that extra igntiaon advance wiggle room. Standard cars are tuned from the factory to use 87, and will get worse performace out of 92 because at the cars compression level, the gas is harder to ignite (this isn't extatly the way it works, but it's close enough for this point)
. So there's the run down.
Higher octane gas doesn't 'burn cleaner' or any other myth, it just takes a higher compression rate to spontaniously ignite. 'Premium' is a horrible word for this because it leads the average consumer to think it is always going to be better, when in reallity, the word 'premium' should be placed on the refinery making the gas and addatives. The bargin brands, are not such bargin gas.
Oh, I know I probably miss-spelled 3/4 of that post. I suck at spell. sorry. :)
I always just pick the midgrade.
the manual says to use 91 or grater octane. and to end the debate on what higer octane does is that it won't ignite before it is supposed to, and the only time it really matters is at higer RPMs. when i put 87 in my tank it makes a ping sound at high RPMs.
Lman
Premium here. The bike tank is so small the ten cents a gallon won't kill me so I splurge a little for my baby.
With the bike it gets 91 or higher, but with my car right now it is 92 or higher due to the PCMs advanced timing. Filling up the car gets a little costly, sometimes I treat it to a little CAM2 high octane but it is not that good for the O2 sensor. I use a stock R/T PCM when I use the spray but now I have an empty bottle so I put the Mopar PCM back in. If gas goes up any more the stock one is going back in and I'm going to sell the other one.
i have used the Sunoco 100 in my bike and really have seen no difference. The car likes it though, but at 3.99 to 4.25 a gallon it don't get it that much.
If you think super is better put it in. What's it cost you? An extra $1 a tank? It certainly won't do any harm.
Quote from: lman123the manual says to use 91 or grater octane.
Look up a few posts... that's not AKI (US octane rating). GSs take 87 AKI (and if your state offers lower, like Kerry's, it's perfectly happy on 85, too).
Quote from: dannoIf you think super is better put it in. What's it cost you? An extra $1 a tank?
But if you think super is better, you're not basing that on any rational premise - and I can think of better places to spend that $1. Over a summer of riding, that adds up to a nice bit of gear (gloves, helmet, anyone?). :)
I run premium, because it's not exactly going to break the bank. 2 gallons in? A whopping quarter? Not exactly a silk scarf.
True about the higher octane making no difference on the GS's engine. But FWIW, I found this to be interesting- "Paduan" over at Beginnerbikers.org, worked for a refinery and this was his take on premium versus regular:
http://www.beginnerbikers.org/showthread.php?t=2862&page=2
Now, why the premium should have less water in it is beyond me, since it is used less on average (I know this from working as a gas attendant, dropping the sticks into the tanks every night to measure use). But the poster is someone whose advice I regard highly.
Like I said, FWIW.
If he's right, and that regular is the dregs of the refinery, then the next step up might be an idea, at least for winter storage (along with a dose of STA-BIL) just be be carburetor safe. An interesting thought.
But for normal riding, the handbook says Regular and I haven't noticed any problem with the bike, or any of my other motors for that matter. As
Roadstergal says, a penney saved is a step closer to buying something else for me or my bike. :thumb:
who uses premium?
rich people with money to blow.
;)
here's my non scientific point of view. normally i use premium. i've only used regular once n that was when i ran out of gas in the stix and had to ask for some off of a stranger. it did seem to have an affect on performance but then again the gs is not a performance bike. so using regular shouldn't hurt (my oldsmobile's used regular since '87 n still runs well), but why not spend an extra 50 cents on premium per fillup.
here's some facts on different fuel ratings:
http://www.epinions.com/content_2346164356
I ran out of gas once and a friend, who owns a plane, only had avgas (127 octane). I can't say I noticed any differance at all. Not even in the low end.
Quote from: Remy_Marathe"Paduan" over at Beginnerbikers.org, worked for a refinery and this was his take on premium versus regular:
Quote"Regular" gas is often reformed or cracked, which means that the molecules have been modified forcibly. This grade is often unstable, and causes the fuel system problems people incur with "stale" gas.
I have a chemistry minor, and as that statement stands, it's :bs:.
Quote from: mjmcondorbut why not spend an extra 50 cents on premium per fillup.
You can spend an extra buck per fillup putting a couple of drops of Chanel #5 in the tank, too. And it will have the same effect on performance.
I wanted to make my first post important, but for some reason i'm moved to respond to this old thread to hopefully help clarify a few things.
In a perfect world, the OCTANE rating of fuel is the percentage of that fuel that is made up of the specific hydrocarbon 'octane' (H18 C8). Pure octane would be a stable, smoothe burning, pressure resistant gasoline when in actuality standard gas is made up of hydrocarbons ranging from something like 4-10 carbons instead of the ideal 8. In terms of engine performance, the octane rating doesn't matter unless you are dealing with a high compression/performance type engine that could possibly prematurely ignite the fuel/air mixture of a lower rated fuel.
When refinement of oil was in its infancy, the octane rating of fuels (by modern standards) was well below 50 which made for lots of knocking, lots of backfires and all the other symptoms we think of old rickety autos. With the volatile fuels made up of all the less stable hydrocarbons, engines would fire less often from a spark than from the pressure simply combusting the mixture in the cylinder before full compression (this is the knock).
For the purposes of this thread, a lot of the argument back and forth about propaganda of the oil companies and better "get up and go" from better fuel isn't a product of the octane/premium rating. A few people have mentioned that the additives, detergents etc make up a large divergence from one brand to the next and this is where a lot of the performance or lack there of will be felt. Also age/moisture level of the fuel will play a roll so if you have a crappy tank it could be "wet" from improper storage, transport or any other number of factors. I would say that the GS doesn't need high performance fuel simply because it doesn't compress enough or run hot enough for it to make a difference so that extra 20-30 cents a gallon can be saved for other excesses...like performance motorcycle oil :mrgreen:
Welcome!
Good info.
Hmmm. Although your explanation of octane rating is correct, I disagree with your conclusion. Let me start off by saying that the difference between 87 octane and 93 octane (which is what my choices are here in GA) are neglible...
...but as to which one would be better... you said yourself that the octane rating measures how close the fuel is to the combustibility of octane (meaning that 87 is more prone to combusting at a diff temperature & pressure than pure octane..which is what these engines are designed for). Now... as a two cylinder 500cc engine, you of course realize that the bore size on a GS is larger than that of your run-of-the-mill four cylinder bike. The larger volume makes for a larger probability of premature (or late) ignition of the fuel mix in the chamber.
Even though we are really splitting hairs here... it should be clear that ceteris parabis, higher octane fuel will run more smoothly in a properly tuned engine. I submit (without any concrete evidence to back up my claim) that those of you who say they notice that their engines run worse with higher octane fuel probably have valves that are off spec.
I shall patiently wait for someone who knows engines to disagree with me :-).
Quote from: EMTkidI wanted to make my first post important, but for some reason i'm moved to respond to this old thread to hopefully help clarify a few things.
In a perfect world, the OCTANE rating of fuel is the percentage of that fuel that is made up of the specific hydrocarbon 'octane' (H18 C8). Pure octane would be a stable, smoothe burning, pressure resistant gasoline when in actuality standard gas is made up of hydrocarbons ranging from something like 4-10 carbons instead of the ideal 8. In terms of engine performance, the octane rating doesn't matter unless you are dealing with a high compression/performance type engine that could possibly prematurely ignite the fuel/air mixture of a lower rated fuel.
When refinement of oil was in its infancy, the octane rating of fuels (by modern standards) was well below 50 which made for lots of knocking, lots of backfires and all the other symptoms we think of old rickety autos. With the volatile fuels made up of all the less stable hydrocarbons, engines would fire less often from a spark than from the pressure simply combusting the mixture in the cylinder before full compression (this is the knock).
For the purposes of this thread, a lot of the argument back and forth about propaganda of the oil companies and better "get up and go" from better fuel isn't a product of the octane/premium rating. A few people have mentioned that the additives, detergents etc make up a large divergence from one brand to the next and this is where a lot of the performance or lack there of will be felt. Also age/moisture level of the fuel will play a roll so if you have a crappy tank it could be "wet" from improper storage, transport or any other number of factors. I would say that the GS doesn't need high performance fuel simply because it doesn't compress enough or run hot enough for it to make a difference so that extra 20-30 cents a gallon can be saved for other excesses...like performance motorcycle oil :mrgreen:
Quote from: Chris_BIm just curious, after reading though the "Whats Your Gas Price" thread, it seems alot of people (or at least more than I thought) are running premium in their bikes. It was my understanding that you should run the lowest octane fuel you can without pinging. Its not like the GS is a super high compression race engine that requires premium just to run properly. It runs just as well on regular, right? Why the premium?
Premium and "regular" are the same gas. Neither is refined more than the other. Premium is just harder to combust which is great for high compression engines but for the GS, ~87 octane is what should be ran since it's only 9.0:1 compression which is low on a "high performance" scale.
Quote from: subc...
premium here.
new bike and i don't want to mess it up.
You do know that "premium" fuel isn't refined more than "regular", right? It isn't a cleaner fuel, it's all about combustion and the compression of your engine.
Quote from: phirePremium is just harder to combust
It is harder to detonate via compression. It will ignite just as well as regular when sparked.
Quote from: nightshade000'Premium' is a horrible word for this because it leads the average consumer to think it is always going to be better, when in reallity, the word 'premium' should be placed on the refinery making the gas and addatives.
+1 !
I buy the cheapest 87 in town. I also use the cheapest 10W40 Wal Mart brand oil. (Can't beat $0.88 a quart)
Speaking of cheap oil... Has anyone ever actually used that Lucas Oil Stabilizer stuff? I'm always playing with the little wheel when I go to the parts store and am waiting to be checked out.
Quote from: phireSpeaking of cheap oil... Has anyone ever actually used that Lucas Oil Stabilizer stuff? I'm always playing with the little wheel when I go to the parts store and am waiting to be checked out.
Naw, it's too expensive. :mrgreen:
tarzana boy - I think this whole topic is splitting hairs for sure, but a lot of it is dispelling myths about fuel and hype etc. As far as higher octane running better in a properly tuned engine, the properly tuned part doesn't really make a difference unless the "tuning" affects the compression ratio. A fuel/air mixture will sometimes combust before the proper time (ie spark) because of the compression spontaneously igniting the mixture. In a gs there simply is not enough compression to get the 87 octane to burst prematurely. As far as late combustion, that really can't happen as long as you have a properly timed functioning spark plug, in which case it doesn't have anything to do with the fuel.
Oh, and premium is more refined than regular...by nature refined means purified and premium fuel is more pure (octane) than regular...by a small margin, but it is still a little further up the chain chemically speaking.
The history channel actually has a really neat program about the history of gasoline, i think it was a Modern Marvel...I dunno, maybe someone else has seen it? Very simplified explanation into great detail of what is was and how its evolved into the refined forms we have today.
Quote from: RoadstergalQuote from: Remy_Marathe"Paduan" over at Beginnerbikers.org, worked for a refinery and this was his take on premium versus regular:
Quote"Regular" gas is often reformed or cracked, which means that the molecules have been modified forcibly. This grade is often unstable, and causes the fuel system problems people incur with "stale" gas.
I have a chemistry minor, and as that statement stands, it's :bs:.
"Paduan" over at
Beginnerbikers.org also said:
Quote
There is always a certain percentage of water in all gasolines. THats where that little drip from your pipes comes from. Guess which blend has the most?
I don't have a chemistry minor, but in high school chemistry class we learned that the byproducts of hydrocarbon combustion are primarily carbon dioxide and water (in addition to heat, of course). That's where that little drip from your pipes comes from. "Paduan" over at
Beginnerbikers.org is a dumbass trying to sound smarter and more important than he his. Don't base anything you do on the opinions of dumbasses, especially when it's your money.
Quote from: RoadstergalI run premium, and use silk scarves to clean up my oil spills.
I also enjoy lighting very expensive cubans with hundred dollar bills.
:P
:nono:
I don't think I've posted in this octane thread yet...
I run mid-grade in my Ford Exploder because it sucks ass and needs the extra cleaners they put in the gas... If I run cheap gas, it runs like total ass and my check engine light comes on. Don't ask me why, it just does. :dunno: I've taken it to 4 different mechanics and they all fix it the same way... Clean the fuel system... Then it runs great for a while and with cheap gas... Same problem... So, I run mid-grade and haven't had the problem in over two years. :thumb:
In my GS, I've tried cheap gas, mid-grade, and super... I swear it pulls a little harder on super... So, I run super. Yes, it's probably all in my head but the extra $0.80 a tank is worth a healthy head.
I always put the cheapest gas I can find in my wife's Hyundai... Arco, generic, whatever... And it always runs great. :thumb:
So... Screw your science, books, and lectures... I'm going off of non-scientific largely-flawed personal-experience with-hyphens. :nana:
Quote from: RoadstergalI run premium, and use silk scarves to clean up my oil spills.
I also enjoy lighting very expensive cubans with hundred dollar bills.
:P
You, my friend... are a pauper.
I never light my own cigars. Instead, I have one of my Oxford educated PhD servants use one of my $1,000 federal treasury bonds as kindling to light one dozen of the finest Andorran cigars that I keep in my titanium-reinforced cherry humidor. After I arrive in the smoking room on my solid platinum Segway, I choose the lit cigar with the best aroma, and have the rest extinguished with Evian spring water.
I rather dislike the smokey smell in the smoking room, so after I have finished my cigar I have all of the leather+maple furniture replaced, along with the egyptian cotton window treatments.
I find that the texture of $100 bills suits it more for use as toilet paper. I pay a team of seamstresses to stitch $100 bills together as 2-ply toilet paper for nature's inevitable call.
*I only drink water made from the finest tritium
Quote from: RoadstergalOctane is resistance to detonation.
I think some one does not like me. B) xx(
Quote from: Pinoy21337I guess a lot of people think it is better for the engine for whatever reason. Few days ago I was riding with my dad (I have GSE he has naked Goldwing) and we stopped at the gas station becuase we needed fuel; he said imma pump the good sh*t; which was premium gas.
Sometimes i buy octane booster from walmart, and when i treat it with my gas it seems like when I power shift it into second, my shocks jump up a lot higher than without it. Dunno it could be all mental.
I think it's all in your head...
I don't think it matters much with a carb'd bike, but I know that with some fuel injected bikes they clearly advise AGAINST octane boosters as these as the engines/fuel systems are not designed to run on super high octane fuels (although I don't know how much boost you are giving it... ).