Here in Ohio, the motorcyle perment (which I hold with pride) restricts us newbies from riding on the highway, ridding at night, and carring passengers. I was just wondering if it was like this in all states.
In Indiana must wear a helmet, no riding at night and no passengers
I forgot that one.
In California, it takes more paperwork to own a hamster than to get an M-class license and motorcycle, at least if you're over 21...and I am...barely.... :roll:
:mrgreen:
In PA you have to wear a helmet unless you take the MSF or have your licence for 2 years. Also with permit.. no night riding or passengers either :mrgreen:
I dont think PA has restrictions on Highways, I think that that would be silly. How would you learn? :)
Anyway, I only had my permit for 2 days :) got it to take the MSF and passed :)
CA: same rules as u.
Massachusetts: No carrying pax and not at night. Highways are okay.
When I lived in New York (more than a few years ago) I recall it was more restrictive...something like you had to have a M endorsed person within 1000 feet of you or something like that (of course, not on the same bike). Perhaps they've changed it since then, but at the time I didn't know anyone with a motorcycle license so it put me off pursuing it.
I can understand the helmet use and no pax if you are riding on permit. I think it is flawed that you are unable to ride on the highway, at night, or "congested roads"(however they define that) until you dodge a few cones at 5 or 10 MPH(the test here anyway). Hell, you got rider "A" who gets their permit and rides for a week and gets their endorsement . Rider "B" rides for 6 months on their permit and during that time can't ride the dark or on the slab :dunno:
those restrictions are only for the learners permit here in FLA, but you can take the test for regular endorsment less then a week, though i have been seeing alot of AGE and school/educational restrictions to keep kids in school more.
In UK, as a "Learner" over 17 you can only ride a 125cc, if and when you pass your test on a 125 you then have a two-year 33bhp power restriction.
However you can take a more advanced course, normally 3 - 5 days on a 500cc under instruction of bike-to-bike radio from an approved teacher no more than two students to a teacher and pass the test with no following restrictions, this is called "Direct Access" if over 21 and "Accelerated Access" if over 17 but under 21, normally you would have to be over 21 for a bigger bike but once qualified in either category there are no where and when restrictions.
there are rules?
Georgia has very similar laws. A motorcycle learner's permit keeps you from:
1.Riding at night
2.Riding with passengers
3.Riding on the highway.
Personally, I think that #1 (no night riding) is the silly one. Not only are you
relatively MORE visible at night on a bike (drivers look for lights, rather than
the profile of an automobile), but there is a lot less traffic than during the day.
No passengers allowed is a sensible restriction.
The no-highway rule actually makes sense to me. Even though riding on the highway is easier in some ways. I don't think its something that a rider without a basic skill set should attempt just because even a small mistake has a higher probability of incurring dire results. Swerving and e-stopping are definitely basic skills, so that is probably what the MSF/DMV thinks as well.
I do think that highway riding practice is valuable... but the practices you use on a motorcycle on a highway can be practiced in a car (avoiding blind spots, keeping safe distances, scanning and keeping tabs on what's around/approaching)
QuotePersonally, I think that #1 (no night riding) is the silly one. Not only are you
relatively MORE visible at night on a bike (drivers look for lights, rather than
the profile of an automobile), but there is a lot less traffic than during the day.
But the "new rider" danger isn't about being seen--that's a general problem that plagues riders of all skill levels and never goes away. I think what they're trying to accomplish with the night restriction is the shortened reaction time due to not being able to see as far ahead. Imagine you come across something in the road (box, tire tread, whatever)...during the day you see it from a long way away, have time to plan and react. At night, you might have to make an abrupt reaction to avoid trouble...experienced riders may do this instintively, but new riders might not, or might take the wrong action under pressure (lock up the wheels instead of swerving, fixate on the object, etc.)
My thoughts on permit restrictions in general:
I often wonder what it is about being licensed that makes one more competent. The day after I got my drivers license, I was no better a driver than the day before on my permit. Of course, I didn't realize this at the time...which resulted in my first minor accident (which involved a blizzard, a steep hill with a sharp turn, a curb, and ultimately a bent wheel). This happened the day after I got my driver's license.
As for the motorcycle licensing requirements...did you have to go more than 15mph to pass your skill test? Afterward, did you feel "qualified" to ride on the highway? In my case, I had my M permit for a little more than two weeks. I got it the week I was going to the MSF classroom session and completed the range section the next week. During that time, my only throttle time was during the class, and I don't think we ever got over 25-30mph or so.
My feeling about permit restrictions is that they are an attempt by the lawmakers to highlight that some activities and situations are inherently more dangerous and possibly overwhelming for inexperienced operators. Hopefully people take this to heart and exercise caution when venturing out in these conditions. *shrug*
NC is completely screwed up
NO permit system at all
ya just have to pass a written test and a cone ride
I asked how to practice for the cone test
ride it in a parking lot....
How do i get bike to parking lot?
silence....
I asked HOW i was supposed to get my bike to the test.....
if i cant ride it...on a permit.... to the DMV
silence......
:? :? :?
Quote from: Mr.7Here in Ohio, the motorcyle perment (which I hold with pride) restricts us newbies from riding on the highway, ridding at night, and carring passengers. I was just wondering if it was like this in all states.
Not true, you can ride all over Ohio on a temp permit on the public highways. Law says permit not valid on congested roads or interstate highways. Must wear helmet also.
http://www.bmv.ohio.gov/engdigest.pdf
QuoteNC is completely screwed up
NO permit system at all
I was curious to see if they had a road test waiver for completing the MSF class like many other states, so I did a quick search:
http://www.ncdot.org/dmv/driver_services/drivershandbook/chapter1/typesLicenses.html#Endorsement%20Types
QuoteMotorcycle Learner's Permit:
* If the applicant is at least 16 years old but less than 18 years old, the applicant must possess a full provisional license issued by the DMV. In addition a parent or guardian's signature is required.
* If the applicant is 18 years of age or older, the applicant must possess a license issued by the DMV.
* The Motorcycle Learner's Permit authorizes a person to operate a motorcycle without passengers.
* The Motorcyle Learner's Permit is valid for 18 months. Required testing includes vision, traffic signs, and the motorcycle knowledge test.
Couldn't find any information about an MSF waiver, though.
Quote from: werase643NC is completely screwed up
NO permit system at all
...
The NCDMV is screwed up. You had a bad office, I think. I got one, so the option exists. Not sure why they didn't offer it to you. It must be the tricky name that threw them: "Motorcycle Learner Permit."
Valid for 18 months (a ridiculously long time), no passengers. Written test only.
Oops--sorry. posted at same time. Badger's is more informative.
QuoteOops--sorry. posted at same time. Badger's is more informative.
Perhaps...but your's is first-hand experience ;)
QuoteValid for 18 months (a ridiculously long time)
In MA, they're valid for 2 years. I also thought that was a long time, but then I had a chat with my insurance agent. I guess they just changed insurance statutes here so that now anyone that has had their M endorsement for less than 6 years is an "inexperienced rider" and pays higher premiums. My agent was saying that she has been seeing a lot of "Harley Riders" (her term) that have been riding for 20+ years on [apparently expired] learner's permits, and now are livid that they are considered "inexperienced" and have to pay through the nose to renew their policies. I heard the same from the rider coach in my MSF class...now that insurance has changed, they're seeing a lot of grizzly harley types reluctantly taking the class.
The perception that this exclusively applies to HD riders amuses me a bit.
I also find it a bit interesting that merely having the M endorsement for 6 years is enough to be 'experienced'...doesn't matter if you haven't been on a motorcycle during that time at all. I'm sure there's no other way for them to verify experience, so this is the best they have.
Here in Iowa you can get a permit at 14, but you have to ride with a parent (them on their own bike of course)
I think at age 16 you can your full license.
What are some of the ages in other states?
Is a perment a permanent permit?
Anyhoo, here helmet required no matter what. With a permit (written test only), you can ride on the freeway, but no passengers and only during daylight.
You have to be 16 and have a valid WA driver's license to get a permit. To get a full endorsement, you have to take the class or pass a rider's test; if you're under 18, you have to take the class.
I grandfathered into my MC license, no test at all of any kind. Am I'm only 31.
Accually I've been caught out at night a few times. Mostly due to the fact that it is getting darker earlier. The only problem I've had with riding at night (and I've had my perment for less than a month) is all the bug that coat my helmet and the Blue Beast.
QuoteAccually I've been caught out at night a few times.
Been caught? By the police? Out of curiosity, how did they know you were out on a permit? Or were you doing something else... :nono:
I think he means that he didn't intend to be out at night, but ended up out.
Get your road course done and get your full license. You can get in trouble if you're doing something you shouldn't (speeding, e.g.) and the cop sees that you have a permit. Or if you get hit by a car - even if it's the cage's fault, their insurance might be able to get out of paying if you're riding illegally. Your own insurance might deny the claim on those grounds. Not good stuff.
VA has the same requirements. No night, no major highways, but with an "experienced" rider watching.
I rode for many years in Iowa, but didn't get the M when I came to VA. So now all over again, and they won't let me just take the riding test, I have to wait 30 days. I ride anyway, but very carefully. Not that I wouldn't be careful anyway.
From the Alabama Dept. of Public Safety website:
MOTORCYCLE LICENSE
Certified state issued birth certificate, social security card, verification for school enrollment if under the age of 19. If you were born in another country, you will need a passport with the I-94 or I-551 stamp or resident alien card. If your legal name has changed, you will need to bring the original legal name change documents (marriage certificate, court order, or divorce decree) There is no road test for motorcycles.
Sad, huh? A helmet is required, though.
QuoteIn California, it takes more paperwork to own a hamster than to get an M-class license and motorcycle, at least if you're over 21...and I am...barely....
Scary thing that, yea Pandy.