So, I was *supposed* to ride in downtown/midtown Atlanta with my roommate (red '96 VFR 750) and his old roommate ('97 GSXR-600), but we ended up going to Suches, GA to ride around some mountains and some twisting curvy roads. Both of them have years of riding under their belt, but I still brought up the rear. Watching them and comparing my riding I noticed that:
The GS500 turns and leans WAAAAAAAAY easier than either of those bikes. I didn't really have a full appreciation for how agile it is until I'd been through some of the crazy chicanes and hairpin turns. Geometry plays a role, but it is mostly the light weight of the bike. It just readily does what you ask it to. I really really noticed this in S-turns. It was nothing for me to flip my bike from hard lean on one side straight to hard lean on the other side... but with those bikes it takes a bit of planning ahead of time with the throttle (or so it seemed).
On a side note... as we (slowly) rounded a hairpin 180-degree turn, we noticed park rangers and police on the side of the road where a biker had apparently run off the road down the hill. We came upon them too suddenly to stop... but there were already ambulances and police on the way, so there probably isn't anything we could have done. We turned around and doubled back about 15 min later, and the ambulance had already come and gone... so hopefully the rider was ok... but we never found out.
Another side note: On our way back to town, the GSXR took point and I was headed up the rear. We were behind 2 cars, so we were riding at a very moderate speed. We passed a Georgia State Patrol Car sitting in a lot at the side of the road... after I passed him, he pulled right on to the road right behind me. I watched him in the mirror and SURE ENOUGH within about 10 seconds of following me he put the lights on.
I pulled to the side of the road to stop the bike, but the cop just pulled past me behind my roommate on his VFR. At this moment i'm thinking "wtf is going on... did this guy just get an apb or something?".
My roommate pulls to the side of the road to stop and the cop pulls *around* him to follow my friend on his GSXR-600. My friend pulls over and the cop stops behind him. My roommate and I putter on by them as they are pulled over to the side (Note: always keep going for a while lest the cop decides to pad his ticket quota by citing you as well)
Anyways, to make a long story short... the cop didn't clock either of us (he couldnt' have anyway, as we were right behind 2 cars). He claims that he pulled behind us and put on the lights because we 'looked like we came around a corner hot' *cough*bullshit*cough*. He admitted that he didn't have a reason to pull either of us over when he pulled onto the road and put his lights on... but that he decided to pull my GSXR friend over because his licence plate was not easily visible (its way back under the tail... my friend bought the bike like that). My friend pointed out that he obviously wasn't trying to hide his plate to run from the police because he'd pulled over as soon as he saw the cop'. The cop conceded this point, but issued him a ticket for improper tag display anyway.
Moral of the story: Cops will use any excuse (even none) to fish for a reason to cite you. The only reason I didn't get pulled over is because my plate is right on my tiny fender. I am quite sure that had my GSXR-friend has his tag set up like mine, then the cop would have just pulled past everyone and pretended that he was after someone else.... and the police wonder why some folks don't like them. (Hint: its cops like *that*)
I should also add - on our way up the mountain, we passed another copy that had pulled over about 5-7 bikes on the side of the road. We weren't sure whether it was one bike that was pulled over and his friends that had stopped to wait with him... but all the riders were off their bikes with their helmets off, so it is just as likely that somehow the cop was issuing them all tickets (he was still in his car when we passed). None of the riders looked very happy.
Moral of the story: If you're riding in a group and you see flashing lights from ONE car... SPLIT UP and whomever gets followed can pull over and take the ticket. 3 people can split the cost on the scapegoat's one traffic ticket much more easily than 3 tickets
It was an interesting day. I saw a SWEET Honda RVT Liter-bike that was smaller in size than my gs. I'll have to look into them if I ever upgrade.
We finished out the day by swapping bikes. This is what I noticed about the VFR-750 and the GSXR-600:
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From another post i made today (http://www.gstwins.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=205304&highlight=#205304):
Yeah, ditto on the VFR. I rode my roommate's '96 VFR 750 for the first time on the highway today on our way back from the N.Ga mountains. That is a SOLID bike with all the torque you'll ever need for highway trips. The seating position is pretty darned close to the seating position on a GS (mine, at least)... but talk about power in any gear! As far as i'm concerned, V configurations are where its at.... I don't need to maintain 100+ mile per hour speeds, so I'll take my power on the low-to-mid end where it will help keep me out of the way of the cagers.
I also rode my friend's '97 GSXR-600 for a good bit. Its a zippy bike (especially compared to my GS500), but I can't see myself upgrading to it. Besides the horsepower, I wasn't all that impressed with the handling (wide bike that doesn't true-steer very well... you have to lean it to get it to do anything). The one thing I did like was that the engine doesn't mind working at high revs (the tach goes a lot higher than the tach on a gs or vfr).
sounds like a good day. had your friend had his tag at the rear of the bike he still would have been pulled over-for turn signals, exhaust, or just to check against 'stolen bike'. At least around these parts the cops seem to be targeting top shelf sportbikes. They WILL use any excuse to pull you over.
Also, the 97 gsxr is a pig. The newer models are the same weight (or lighter) than the gs500. I know for sure the 2004+ is lighter. That includes the 600, 750 AND the 1000.
Oh yea man.. the new gixxer weighs in at nearly nothing. Makes my old fizzers feel like dead weight. I need to get me one of them thar 600 jobbies!
They (the "Man") has been cracking down at Suches and Deal's Gap because there have been rising fatalities over the past few years. You yourself mentioned passing a crash yourself that day.
<lecture>
Its not harrassment. If you want to go fast on a twisty road, go do trackdays. Safer for you and your pocket book that way.
</lecture>
I'm surprised that I haven't gotten pulled over yet, I still haven't gotten my license plate and the dealer never gave me a license plate over to put on.
The "RVT" liter bike you saw was actually a Honda RC-51. I have no idea what RVT means, though.
I miss my GS :(
I took my 05 zx6r up to ellijay today.... I had a great time outrunning/riding the people I was riding with... a k1200r... duc 999, duc s2r, VFR (1997 750? 600? I dunno), AND a dude with a brand new gsxr-1k. He had ridding a gsxr 600 before for 2 years... he was better than the other people but still absolutely could NOT keep w/ me whatsoever. (THANKS for letting my learn how to ride from my former gs500e2f..)
I traded bikes w/ the guy for a couple corners. Wow.. that bike is WAY too powerful imo. I could break the rear tire loose on accident. scary.
Quote from: JamesGThey (the "Man") has been cracking down at Suches and Deal's Gap because there have been rising fatalities over the past few years. You yourself mentioned passing a crash yourself that day.
<lecture>
Its not harrassment. If you want to go fast on a twisty road, go do trackdays. Safer for you and your pocket book that way.
</lecture>
Forgive me for being impatient... but your (in this case arrogant) condescension paired with your inability/unwillingness to understand what happened in our particular situation before spouting off is irksome.
We weren't (as in were
NOT) speeding. We were behind two cars who were driving at a very moderate pace. In fact, I was getting tired putting along at the pace of the sunday drivers we were following.
That being the case... it is harassment. If what that particular cop did was accepted/normal standard operating procedure, then you would see traffic cops pulling out for no reason onto highways with their lights flashing a lot more often. Try to defend him all you want... but he's a bad cop. Plain and simple.
I'll thank you to keep your future 'advice'/scolding to yourself if you can't keep it relevant to the particulars of the discussion.
Quote from: AlphaFire X5The "RVT" liter bike you saw was actually a Honda RC-51. I have no idea what RVT means, though.
Ah, right you are. I'd never seen one before. RVT most likely means
Racing
V-
Twin (as its a twin cylinder at 90 degree 'V' configuration)
I thought everyone knew that the gap is one of the hot spots that you don't ride a sportbike to anymore.
yes it's a nice road, but as soon as it became famous and the number of riders siginifacantly increased so did the fatialitys. nevermind the traffic.
look at it from a local's point of view you being there is harrassment, you drive up the taxes because they pay to have the ambulances there to haul your ass out of there. never mind that everyone tries to scrape pegs in every corner and when you literaly have thousands of bikes going through there a day, it makes for significant road wear + gaurd rail replacement, rock clearing, other misc maintance that the locals have to pay for. and what kind of economic stimulation did you provide? did you eat lunch, buy gas? probably at a national chain store that provides no kickback to the local economy. it has gotten so bad up there that it is dangerous for the locals to drive on the roads from all the idiot bikers running too fast up there, going wide in corners, crossing the double yellows, passing in blind corners, basicly just being stupid. so to solve the problem they will ticket you for anything if your on a sport "looking" bike up there. I for one find this to be a perfectly resonable solution to the problem of idiot bikers. IMO it has gotten to the point that they just need to ban bikes up there, or establish some kind of permit system to ride there.
"harrassing" sport bikes there is SOP. duh. and like Pablo siad they can pull you over "just to check if the bike is stolen", at any time they choose. and the higher rated stolen bikes are the flashy colored sport bikes so you put yourself into that situation. plain and simple you being there on a sport bike is probable cause to pull you over. I'm really suprised that they aren't issuing more tickets for dustruction of public property. every time that they see a bike that has scraped something hard on the ground is a ticket waiting to happen.
davipu wrote:
"you drive up the taxes because they pay to have the ambulances"
That is wild (and pretty cool actually, unless you are a local)! I've never heard of an ambulance being paid for by taxes. The only time I've riden in one, it was paid for by my insurance. And that ain't cheap, let me tell you. Huh.
Quote from: Jake Ddavipu wrote:
"you drive up the taxes because they pay to have the ambulances"
That is wild (and pretty cool actually, unless you are a local)! I've never heard of an ambulance being paid for by taxes. The only time I've riden in one, it was paid for by my insurance. And that ain't cheap, let me tell you. Huh.
Replacing guard rails as well...insurance usually covers those. I know of many people getting very significant bills from the town after plowing over a few guard rails, road signs, etc.
Also: I was tagged in PA once in my car...the ticket was essentially an itemized bill for all of the services they would have had to provide had I gotten into an accident...fire & rescue, paramedic, I think PennDOT had a line item or two in there...oh, and the fine. IIRC, it added up to almost $300.
suches, ga. ahhh - brings back good memories.
camped out at skeenah mill creek and had the chance to ride the roads of that area with the ZRXOA at one of their rallies last year. riding with that bunch was an eyeopener for me. boy, can they ride!
that's what got me into doing trackdays...
Quote from: davipuI thought everyone knew that the gap is one of the hot spots that you don't ride a sportbike to anymore.
yes it's a nice road, but as soon as it became famous and the number of riders siginifacantly increased so did the fatialitys. nevermind the traffic.
look at it from a local's point of view you being there is harrassment, you drive up the taxes because they pay to have the ambulances there to haul your ass out of there. never mind that everyone tries to scrape pegs in every corner and when you literaly have thousands of bikes going through there a day, it makes for significant road wear + gaurd rail replacement, rock clearing, other misc maintance that the locals have to pay for. and what kind of economic stimulation did you provide? did you eat lunch, buy gas? probably at a national chain store that provides no kickback to the local economy. it has gotten so bad up there that it is dangerous for the locals to drive on the roads from all the idiot bikers running too fast up there, going wide in corners, crossing the double yellows, passing in blind corners, basicly just being stupid. so to solve the problem they will ticket you for anything if your on a sport "looking" bike up there. I for one find this to be a perfectly resonable solution to the problem of idiot bikers. IMO it has gotten to the point that they just need to ban bikes up there, or establish some kind of permit system to ride there.
"harrassing" sport bikes there is SOP. duh. and like Pablo siad they can pull you over "just to check if the bike is stolen", at any time they choose. and the higher rated stolen bikes are the flashy colored sport bikes so you put yourself into that situation. plain and simple you being there on a sport bike is probable cause to pull you over. I'm really suprised that they aren't issuing more tickets for dustruction of public property. every time that they see a bike that has scraped something hard on the ground is a ticket waiting to happen.
I can't believe what i just read. If you are a local and all the motorcycles up there bother you then although I empathize with you, I can't agree that harassment via the law enforcment is the right way to go about effecting a change. Enforcing the current laws and then have your legislature pass new ones if need be. Being followed down the highway by a cop with *lights flashing* for no other reason than being on a sportbike isn't all that far off from being followed down the highway by a cop (lights flashing) just for being black (or asian, or whatever). Police are supposed to harass criminals, not passerbys; and although i realize that most of the bad element are riding sportbikes, the burden of proof in this country falls upon LAW ENFORCEMENT. Read Miranda, and then read the constitution.
A public road is just that... a public road. In this country you are allowed to take your vehichle and drive it around on any and every public road that isn't blocked off due to hazard, construction, or special event. If you want to close the road off to sportbikes, then enact a local ordinance and turn it into a toll road (which they WON'T do because doing so disqualifies that particular stretch of road from recieving federal funds for its upkeep). If that doesn't work then enact ordinances to keep bikes off of it and *then* go head and start collecting more revenue for the municipal coffers through speeding tickets and other citations.
I am thoroughly unsympathetic to people who complain about increased out-of-town traffic in their area. Move onto a larger plot of private property or move elsewhere. Again, we enjoy the ability to move about freely in this country. Their complaints have little more merit than those of anyone else living in any other tourist destination.
I could go on and on, but its lunch time, so I'll digress instead.
TarzanBoy wrote:
"then enact ordinances to keep bikes off of it and *then* go head and start collecting more revenue for the municipal coffers through speeding tickets and other citations."
The money would only go to municipal coffers if the tickets were issued within a city limit and by a city copper. I guess this road is probably within city limits, because you were refering to an ordinance, rather than a statute. If it was Highway Patrol or a Sheriff, then the money would go to the state/county.
I wanted to point that out because I am a jerkoff.
I liked your story, for what it is worth, and even if you had been speeding, which you weren't, I would still have liked it. Sounds like a good time.
hey Jake, your right your insurance does pay for the ambulance to respond to the call, but who do you think pays ther wages? buys the ambulances, pays for the hospital? it's all tax money.
TB, if a criminal goes out and commits a crime do you go out and stop everybody. no you use a profile of the criminal and stop everyone that fits that profile. it just so happens that it isn't the harleys that are doing 120 down every straight strech of road.
some info on the local area
http://www.tailofthedragon.com/news_law.html
What are you getting so pissed about? I don't feel like anyone blasted you on your story. If you're mad at the cops, don't take it out on people here.
We don't have fun roads around here.
You people in mountain/canyon areas are so lucky.
Even if talking about it makes everybody angry.
Quote from: 2005-GS500-PDXWhat are you getting so pissed about? I don't feel like anyone blasted you on your story. If you're mad at the cops, don't take it out on people here.
I'm not pissed. I disagree with the aforementioned tactic of getting motorcycles to pull to the side of the road (a la turning on the lights) until you find come up to one with something that you can pull them over for.
If he had clocked us speeding, then that would have been a legitimate pursuit and stopping of my friend. What the cop did was a slight bending of the rules, but I don't think the situation warranted it (3 bikes doing the speed limit behind 2 cars).
Would that kind behavior would be condoned if the police started doing it regularly to cars on the road? Probably not... the cop was in the wrong, but davipu was arguing that the cop was justified due to extenuating circumstances. I disagree.
Quote from: TarzanBoyI disagree with the aforementioned tactic of getting motorcycles to pull to the side of the road (a la turning on the lights) until you find come up to one with something that you can pull them over for.
Not to add more fuel to the fire........
If you were in fact puttering along at a sunday driver pace do you think he could have seen the poorly mounted plate when you and your buddies rode by? Then pulled out with lights on and folowed until the two non offenders got out of the way. That would be safer than pulling up beside the one he wanted. Just a opinion.
Another thing(just a assumption), did you go to that road and exceed the posted speed limit at any time? Did you intend to do this from the start? If so then what is there to Buddha Loves You about. I would rather have a little plate mounting violation than a speeding ticket or any other speed/safety related ticket. Not saying you did any of that, just raising a general point.
Flame me if you must.
Quote from: BLITZMW77
Another thing(just a assumption), did you go to that road and exceed the posted speed limit at any time? Did you intend to do this from the start? If so then what is there to Buddha Loves You about.
What a load of...
Would you say the same thing if one exceeded the day before? The month before? A year? At what point do we stop saying "since you did x at some point in your past, you deserve what you got"?
Have you ever exceeded? Rolled through a stop sign? Jaywalked? Switched lanes without signaling? (yes, that's a violation)
Those are rhetorical - of course you have. Now wouldn't you have been just a little bit upset if a cop pulled you over because, say, your rear breaklight wasn't working and gave you a $50 ticket for it?
Of course you would! And then you would share your experience with a group and some ass in the crowd would tell you that you deserved it.
Quote from: BLITZMW77
Flame me if you must.
I must.
If you weren't doing anything wrong then what do you have to worry about???