GStwin.com GS500 Message Forum

Went out to College Station (about 2 hours from Austin) to Texas World Speedway, running on the 2.9 mile layout

(http://www.texasworldspeedway.com/images/29mile.gif)

First session I went out I was going very well, got stuck behind people, but eventually got to pass them. A lot of the instructors were impressed when they saw how much I was hanging off. I'm like a monkey, apparently. They were even more impressed when I was able to drag my knee, especially with how cold it was, and especailly since it was my first time there.

Dragging my knee the first time scared the crap out of me. Totally didn't expect that feeling, so I panicked slightly and had the front end wobble a bit. Next time around I commited to it and learned to love that feel.

Second time around I got about 15 minutes into the 20 minute session and came around turn 10, the "Horseshoe", which is the tight U-turn towards the right and lower-center in the picture. Halfway into turn 10 I lowsided, sliding off the track on my knees and fingers, looking back at the guy who was following me. I got up after I stopped and had to sit down again because my knee was hurting me so badly. The tips of my fingers were burning from the friction, but I looked and saw that the leather didn't rip through at all, so I knew it was just heat transfer from the asphalt. The ambulence came around and I climbed up inside so they could check me out. Final diagnosis? A sprained right knee and a jammed left thumb. The knee got sprained because when I lowsided I got rotated about with my right leg still on the bike.

The bike came out alright, nothing but front end damge, most of it easily repairable. Since I didn't get my track tank in time, my current tank will now be my track tank, as it suffered two large dents in the sides where the handlebars hit. The bars were severely bent and rotated downwards. The front brake lever broke off, and my SS brake line snapped. The right barend's screw got bent, and chewed up the right grip a tiny bit. The right footpeg's rubber was chewed up a bit, and the exhaust was scraped. The most serious damage, aside from the tank, was the tachometer's inner white plastic bucket broke. The chrome ring and glass survived, but it pulled that white bucket's lip off in a place and pulled the gasket out with it. The metal frame that houses the guages got bent a little bit as well; fixable though.

What caused my lowside? Numerous factors. The track was cold, and my tires probably wern't as warm as they should have been. I talked to some of the Level 4 riders (the highest level) and they said that turn 10 can get pretty slippery. I'm not sure wether I was going to fast, as I had made that turn before at what felt like a similar speed and wasn't off on a bad line. Also, and here's the kicker, I sneezed right in the middle of this turn. f%$king lame, I know. It pisses me off, because that sudden jolt to the bike and my concentration was probably the deciding factor in what sent me down. My hands and shoulders get a twitch when I sneeze, and when you're cranked over dragging knee in a turn like that, you do NOT want sudden steering inputs.

Important things I learned:
-Make sure your tires are fully warmed
-Don't ride above your level
-Make sure you're not sick
-Make sure you can get junk body work on time so that you don't ruin your good stuff.
-Knee dragging is addictive
-My knee hurts like hell

I came out of it alright, and the bike is easily repairable, thankfully. Pictures forthcoming, including my knee dragging pictures from session one that the track photographer took at the same turn I crashed in.

EDIT: Oh, and my newly installed caseguards did their job very very well. Minor scrapes on the right hand side one, and that's it. I can sand and repaint it, or leave it battle scarred. Good cases savers though.

The leathers saved my ass, too. Damage was mainly on the pants, and a minor amount on my jacket. A hole wore through in the crotch area on the pants ( :o ) and in the right knee. The right knee scraped through all the way to the armor, too. The jacket had a slight scrape on the elbow and some more serious scrapes on the right hip area. The boots got some minor roughing up on the outside toes and the tip of the toes on one boot. Nothing to serious, thankfully. Not a scratch on my helmet.  :)

Sorry to hear that you crashed. Heal up well. Where were you looking when you crashed? Did you crash right after you sneezed? It wasn't tires if you already went through it several times, the tires would have been warmed up enough; even after 15 minutes into the session.

Turn 10 would be the right-hander, going counter-clockwise, center left of the track picture.

I was looking almost towards the next turn, right before it, thereabouts. I crashed RIGHT after I sneezed, if not during.

And yes, that's turn 10 you described. It's a great turn when you don't crash. I think someone said that I might have been going somewhere in the neighborhood of 50mph through it. I taped over the speedo, so I have no idea.

Wow Alpha, glad you are ok. And thanks for sharing your insights like what you learned and how to prevent it again  :thumb:  Got photos of the bike? The gear? What kind of gear?

And more importantly, when are you going back?  :mrgreen:

Aren't you glad you had leather pants?  :)

Sorry that you crashed, but glad you're OK.  Talk to the instructors - they should have some input on what happened and how to use that experience as a positive lesson in the future.

Quote from: PhaedrusWow Alpha, glad you are ok. And thanks for sharing your insights like what you learned and how to prevent it again  :thumb:  Got photos of the bike? The gear? What kind of gear?

And more importantly, when are you going back?  :mrgreen:

Yeah, I've got photos of the bike and the gear, I'm just too lazy/sore/tired/depressed to post them right now.

Gear I was wearing:
Teknic Lightning Jacket with Fieldsheer armor in the elbows and back
Teknic Sport Pants (Thanks RG! Your pants saved my... well, not my ass since I was sliding on the front, they saved my crotch!)
Teknic Kevlar race gloves (old, planning to replace ASAP)
Sidi Strada Evo Tepor boots

I'll be riding the track again on either March 4 or April 15. Then again in July and again in September. I love free track days.

Glad to hear you are okay, Alpha.  Scary stuff.  Best of luck getting everything repaired.  Just happy to hear that you weren't hurt too badly.  The important thing to do is to learen why you went down so it doesn't happen again.  Crashed are less painful if you learn something in the process.  Best wishes, man.

I might be wrong, but when I was knee dragging around turns, it sort of felt like the rear was getting a bit slippery. Am I imagining things, or is that possible?

If you put too much weight on the puck you'll unload the rear and she'll want to come out from under ya. You'll actually go slower draggin' puck. Next time use the puck to guage your lean angle. Actually, don't do that, just concentrate on riding. The puck is there for just in case you drag your knee. Kenny Roberts was the first to drag knee; he used duct tape, because a leather knee will wear and roughen and then grab the ground.

Well, I think that's what happened then. I think I was putting quite a bit of weight onto the puck because no one told me otherwise  :(. Ah well, at least I learned something.

knee dragging on your first day at the tracks? if that's the case then the reason why you crashed was probably being too cocky. I used to photograph these kinds of track days and you really have to work your way up. i rarely see knee dragging until the intermediate groups and only see it properly done (i.e. not sticking your knee out for the sake of it) at the advanced group. take your time man!

still crashing is a bummer but at least you came out relatively unscratched!

Considering it was your first track day maybe overconfidence and lack of experience played a part. I dont like to be brutal and I know it will hurt your pride but its the way I see it. You cant turn out first time and expect to perform like Carl Foggarty!! Take it a bit easier next time and get a proper feel for the bike and track before trying the fancy stuff.

I think a lot of those factors played in. Overconfidence was probably one of them. The track had a pretty good feel to it, I think. I think that the reason I scraped puck so early might have also been atributed to how much I hang off.

Don't worry about hurting my pride, I hurt it enough already. I'm still pissed off at myself. I'll get pictures on Wednesday (when the track photographer puts them up) and you can tell me what you think then.

Kudos to Alpha for being a good sport  :thumb:

Hey, I made a mistake. I want to learn as much as I can to avoid this happening again. I want to be a better rider, and making mistakes is one way to go about learning.

So yeah, if anyone has any insight or tips or tricks or comments or whatever, please post them!

Quote from: Epileptic SneezeMan X5any insight or tips or tricks or comments or whatever, please post them!

SHINY SIDE UP! RUBBER SIDE DOWN!  :lol:  Anyway, glad to hear you're ok, and damage to the bike is minor, and looking forward to the pics on wednesday! Heal up quick man! And be glad it was just a sneeze, not your epilepsy kicking in!

Alpha, I'm glad that you're ok, and it's VERY refreshing to see you owning your mistakes and keeping your ears and mind open to the constructive criticism of the vets here. :thumb:

Next time, ride more, drag less, and DEFINITELY keep the shiny side up! ;)

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/knee.jpg)

My knee right now. It's still hurting, and that bruise is all that's visible. It's a bit swolen, but not too much thankfully. I'm keeping off of it, staying in bed and watching movies and studying. Keeping it wrapped up to prevent excessive movement, too.

Maybe I should shave... :lol::lol:

Quote from: AlphaFire X5Maybe I should shave... :lol::lol:

Dude...might I suggest a lawn mower or weed wacker!?  :?


:lol:  :kiss:

other things you should learn....

a good street bike....will become a roachy track bike...after a crash

therefore... buy a roachy nail for the track.

race tires are better than street tires on the track
and they heat up sooner

if it is a track bike....remove all body work....why buy more bodywork for a roachy nail

good gear is much more important than the bike....back to the nail comment.

my first race bike had a tank,  fender, and number plates for 2 or 3 years

i love the attitude you take to your day at the track, i sensed nothing negative, i forsee many more trackdays in your future

Quote from: werase643other things you should learn....

a good street bike....will become a roachy track bike...after a crash

therefore... buy a roachy nail for the track.

race tires are better than street tires on the track
and they heat up sooner

if it is a track bike....remove all body work....why buy more bodywork for a roachy nail

good gear is much more important than the bike....back to the nail comment.

my first race bike had a tank,  fender, and number plates for 2 or 3 years

Why even bother with number plates? I just duct taped my #45 right to my seat. If I ever scrounge up enough money for another bike (in a few years, no less) I'll be turning the GS into a track bike for for my dad and me. Mainly for me, though.

And I totally understand what you're saying about good gear. That's why my gear is almost worth as much as my bike :lol: Okay, not really, but it's gettin' there. The GS was great for the track. It was really great and I was able to wind it up and fly through the corners. Even though I got passed in the straights, I got to pass them in the corners. This thing is just so flickable it's wonderful.

Does anyone thing that perhaps a wider tire (a 150/60 supersport rubber type) might have made a difference?

tire width has nothing to do with the size of your contact patch for tracting... if anything it will hurt you in the corners moreso

man alpha should have sent me an email i would have went .. to watch .. i dont have all my gear yet .. i just bought my jacket fri. hoping to have the pants by next payday and the boots the pay day after that :) . i was wondering if there was a track here in texas for bikes :)  ... hit me up the next time your gonna go .. so i can be ready :) you have a link for that track .. so i can read up on what i have to have and all that :) i love racing .. i use to race motocross so .. :)

:(
i never done a track day

I bought my GS, safety wired it, rode it up and down the street about 5 times and went to the Ed Bargy rider school.

my first set of tires were BLEM race tires for a VTR 250
both tires were 75$

my 2nd set were dunlop 591's

Quote from: werase643if it is a track bike....remove all body work....why buy more bodywork for a roachy nail

wow, been a long time since we disagreed...


if its a track bike you can leave the bodywork on it. if you crash, zip tie it back together, or other quick cheap fixes. The more you go to the track, the more you see this sort of thing. My track bodywork is going to look like crap now...glad you werent hurt worse. I can tell you-it sucks.

trackdays are totally addicting. soon you'll be eating ramen 3x a day to save money for a bigger track bike...or for suspension investment into the gs.

I stripped the body work off this one because it's my street bike, too. If it was only a track bike, I'd probably leave the body work on. Hell, I might even put the F fairings back on if it goes to permanent track bike status.

I do plan on upgrading the suspension on this thing, but the whole lack of funds is a major issue for me.

Pablo, any insight as to what might have caused my lowside?

Quote from: AlphaFire X5
Pablo, any insight as to what might have caused my lowside?

I think any and/or all combinations of what you thought it was in your assessment hit it right on the money. Could have been cold tires (how many laps had you done already? 2-3 and tires are good to go.), definitely possible the sneeze had a LOT to do with it. I know my body spasms violently when I sneeze and mid tight turn it would be disasterous. My money is on the sneeze being the #1 contributor, but that doesnt rule out any others. Were you cocky? probably, but if you were in that turn at the same speed/angle/hanging off as you had been previously its not likely hubris caused this accident. maybe you had too much tension in your arms/hands on the handlebars when you sneezed-maybe you were using the bars to support your weight...

Lets see those photos. its possible you were hanging off too much. ie trying too hard to get your knee down, consciously or not. It does feel like you're hanging WAY off when you do it right but still a possible factor in your crash.

hard to bench race the crash since non of us were there, but hopefully whats posted here will help enlighten you as to what happened.

threadjack:


sidenote: all three of you have crashed at the track


end threadjack.

yes, that is true

I have crashed 4 times at the track
T2  @ RRR.....low side/slid in the rain
T7 @ RRR......low side/bounced on the tire wall
T15 @ VIR.....low side/cracked some back bones
T12 @ VIR.....high side/cracked a bunchof ribs, broke collar bone, punctured and colapsed lung(<----- i don't recommend one of these)

hey, you can't high side a GS....... :x  :mrgreen:


but the best thing about crashing at the track....medical will be there in 3 min.
if my last crash would have been on the street...i don't think i would be typing this

AlphaFire,

I was the one riding the Triumph Sprint RS. As far as I know you were looking pretty good out there. I was tailing you through most of that session. I had to pit for about 10 because thats when I began to notice there was something funny going on with my shifter. By time I got back out, I was exiting turn 7 when I saw the yellow flag. By time I got through 8 and 9, they were waving red at 10. I saw you standing up as I entered 10, then pitted.

This was my first time on the track but I cannot say that I noticed anything out of the ordinary. I do know there is a little dip right by the CP for turn 10. I got a bit of a wobble everytime I hit that dip.

Also, on another note, it looks like we may be on for that frame. It will probably be next week before I can get it though.

So here are the pics that were taken of me at this corner. Please critique my positioning, lean, etc... Sorry about the big copyright thing across them.

(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7115.jpg)

(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7147.jpg)

(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7178.jpg)

well, unfortunately, I don't know enough about riding to critique, so all I really have to say is DAMN THAT LOOKS FUN!!!!!

Well, I'm no pro... But, it looks like you already know the problem with dragging too much... :dunno:

Is it me or does the handlebars make him look like his arms are too stiff?
Good
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7115.jpg)
Not quite there
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7147.jpg)
LOOKING GOOD!! :thumb:  :thumb:
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_7178.jpg)
This last one has you looking through the turn, which is excellent!! The only thing I could nitpick would be where your head is; if you slide your butt off one cheek, your head should move over an equal distance. Get your chest down more. I can't see your inside foot, but it looks like the sole is on the peg; don't do that, put your sole against the frame or heelplate. This is so you can't put any pressure or weight on the inside peg. Right hand good, left hand...well, it looks like your gripping the bar and too tight I might add, this doesn't allow the bike to bobble and weave like it wants to, to absorb bumps and imperfections. And, so you can sneeze and not crash. :P  ;)

Those bars feel like f%$king ape hangers when I'm going through a curve like that. I don't think I CAN get my chest down any more without stressing my arms too much.

The pictures are in chronological order, so that first one is probbaly the first time I touched knee down. I'll be sure to loosen my grip on the bars next time I go out and ask around and see what the upper level guys and instructors can tell me about the sole of my boot being on the peg.

Another thing about putting your foot against the frame is that it really causes you to grip with your outside leg more, making it even feel like you're 'pulling' the bike over, and allowing you to lighten up on the bars. Regarding the bars: rotate them down a degree or two (probably ends up like being 5, but you get the idea) to get the controls closer to you so you don't have to stretch out so much to reach them. When you start leaning closer, you can open your palm on the left and just palm the bar. No grippy :nono:  Too much of a chance for you to tighten up. Also, if you start to fall, what are you going to do? You're going to try to pull yourself up by the bar. What happens when you pull on the left? You countersteer yourself right into the ground.

look good but I agree, the 3rd picture has you looking through the turn best. work on making that a habit.

also, turn your wrists down a bit. in all the pics it looks like your wrists are pointed up a bit. if you pointed them down a little or made them more horizontal you'd find it easier to relax and also easier to get your body lower...which brings us to...

you're scootching your waist and but over to get your knee to touch but your upper body is still over the tank. this is called being "crossed up". your body/spine needs to be parallel to the bike and your head forward and toward the turn exit. in fact, when you're IN the turn you should be looking at either the far end of the following straight or the entrance to the next turn. I do this to remind myself to look as far in front of me as possible.  try to get your head as forward and over as possible-they call this "kissing the mirrors" because thats about where your head ends up-where your fairing mounted mirrors would be.

like scratch says about your hands...also, when in the turn keep your hands off the levers! You dont need brakes mid turn (shouldnt) and you dont need clutch for sure. palm the outside hand is a good way to think about it-I can usually take my hand completelly off the outside grip but choose to keep it loosely on it. the outside hand isnt really doing anything when turning.

if anything, try to get your outside forarm on the tank and use that for added leverage. I do that all the time but its easy for me since I'm a smaller rider. at your height it might be more a problem.


I also noticed some breaks in the pavement (dark lines, not really breaks). these transitions may have been a factor in your crash.

wow those are great 1st trackday pix...looking good in scanning thru the turn!  :thumb:

Is it just me, or does it look like I'm almost at the edge of the tire's limit in that third pic? It looks like it's right up to the edge on the rear wheel, or am I just seeing things wrong?

Anyone know where I can get a new tank?  :)  :)

Quote from: AlphaFire X5Is it just me, or does it look like I'm almost at the edge of the tire's limit in that third pic? It looks like it's right up to the edge on the rear wheel, or am I just seeing things wrong?

Anyone know where I can get a new tank?  :)  :)

yeah..you are.... at least you got rid of the chicken strips!

I'm just thinking that might be a reason why I felt my back end getting slippery: no more tire.

The first photo seems to have you at the greatest lean angle. I think you could lean it over more. At least 47 degrees. You're not even touching peg!

Quote from: AlphaFire X5I'm just thinking that might be a reason why I felt my back end getting slippery: no more tire.

not necessarily. you can ride what looks like the edge quite a bit. if your tire pressure was too high (you did lower it to about 30psi, right?), and the tires were in good shape, and are sticky tires you should have been fine.

look at this pic:
notice my rear is pretty much on the edge, or thereabouts.


then look at this, much more lean angle, still on the edge of the tire, just less contact patch overall. lower pressure allows a bigger contact patch on the ground.


here's me from a couple trackdays prior to the above pictures. I know, its tiny...but you can still see how badly I'm crossed up too. After I saw these I started to work almost exclusively on getting myself over properly. still working on it.



{yes, shameless photo whoring}

I always buy the photos so I can see what I'm doing and work on things I'm not getting right the next time.

Don't feel bad about photo whoring. I'm taking notes, man! :lol: I totally see what you mean about being crossed up. Soon as the bike gets street worthy I'm going to work on that.

I'm buying my pictures as well so I can say, "Hey, look what I can do", as well as to track my progress and critique myself.

I'm getting a 10x15 print of the third shot so I can remind myself to fix my problems. Well, that and to show people and say, "Isn't that f%$king awesome?"

My rear pressure was a little over 30, I think I was at 33, as suggested by a few people out there. Think that might be why my back end felt sloppy? Trying to evaluate everything so that I can prevent any mishaps in the futre. I also just want to learn about this stuff.

Quote from: pantablo

like scratch says about your hands...also, when in the turn keep your hands off the levers! You dont need brakes mid turn (shouldnt) and you dont need clutch for sure. palm the outside hand is a good way to think about it-I can usually take my hand completelly off the outside grip but choose to keep it loosely on it. the outside hand isnt really doing anything when turning.

OMG...i just reviewed my other SOW pix my finger are covering the brake all the time...i just remembered i got spooked when a 2 stroker passed me while in the "bowl"..i pressed the brake midturn...lemme say, i learn my lesson and try not to do that again... :nono:

I cover my brake out of habit from street riding. I don't use it in turns, but it's a habit. I've even gotten used to controlling the throttle very well without my index and middle fingers. I should work on changing that, shouldn't I?

i guess just on track riding...but yeah street riding covering brakes is good :dunno:

Quote from: AlphaFire X5I cover my brake out of habit from street riding. I don't use it in turns, but it's a habit. I've even gotten used to controlling the throttle very well without my index and middle fingers. I should work on changing that, shouldn't I?

yeah, I'd kill that habit on the track. you only really have to worry about the left lever and only when you're approaching the turn, setting up and slowing down. once you're ready to do your turn-in forget all about that brake. only think about accelerating. Hell, the only time I use the clutch lever is to do my downshifts approaching the turns...

just like its a habit to cover it, its a habit to use it if you get spooked...like celica there did.

Quote from: AlphaFire X5...I'm buying my pictures as well so I can say, "Hey, look what I can do", as well as to track my progress and critique myself.
Well, that and to show people and say, "Isn't that f%$king awesome?"

dotn feel bad. me too.

Quote from: AlphaFire X5...My rear pressure was a little over 30, I think I was at 33, as suggested by a few people out there. Think that might be why my back end felt sloppy? .

I think its a little high for the track. I run about that pressure on the street (only canyon riding) and drop to about 30 on the track. the reason you do that is because at the higher speeds, higher loads the tire sees it expands more from the heat. so if you're starting out at 33 its 36+ when up to temp. The idea behind lowering the temp is so that after it expands its still about 33. so you always check them cold, and you dont adjust throughout the day (because they've warmed up).

Michelin Pilot Power tires are the exception. Their sidewall construction is so soft that you can run a little higher...or so say the michelin reps. I tested it and its true. not only that, the tire doesnt look all thrashed afterwards...okay, that eliminates some bragging though... :roll:

I'm thinking about getting Pilot Powers after the Sport Demons wear out. Do you think that stickier, wider tires might help me at the track? All the reviews of them on here are for streetability.

they are definitely stickier but they're not suited for the stock gs wheel width and you'll really feel the difference at the track-bike will want to fall in when really leaned over. thats enough to scare the crap out of you. the reason is because the tire gets a bit pinched on the too-narrow-for-150 rim. when you get cranked over onto the "edge" of the tire you have a smaller contact patch than if you had a proper size tire.

I was thinking about what you said about trying to get my forearm on the tank for support as well, and I realized that I couldn't have done that with the setup I had, I don't think. The bars were so high and wide, and my arms so long, that trying to get my forearm on the tank would have required countersteering to full lock. That's a bit too flat trackerish for me, and I don't think I could pull that.

I keep thinking about the tire pressure thing too, and I think it's possible that the higher pressure could have made the back end a bit more slippery than I'm used to.

So, things I've learned:

Run tires at about 29F/30R
Position my upper body off the bike more to avoid getting "crossed up"
Inside foot on the frame/heel guard to avoid putting pressure on the inside peg
Keep the wrists down
Don't grip the bars so tightly, think about palming the outside one instead
Do NOT cover the break in a turn. Ever.
Pivot around the tank, as if I'm "kissing the mirrors"
Support yourself with the outside leg and forearm
Be sure to look towards the exit line or the entrance to the next turn
Try and get my chest down more (easier with lower bars, I'd assume)
Don't put a lot of pressure on the puck because it can cause the back end to become unloaded
Take it easy for a few laps to let your tires get fully warm
Don't try to push yourself too early in the day
Be sure to get junk bodywork in time so that your nice stuff doesn't get messed up
Make sure you're not sick and can fully concentrate on riding
Take everything in stride and learn from mistakes
Take criticism and evaluate it so you can fully learn from the experience
Invest in a wider rear rim so I can fit supersport rubber :lol:
Track days are addicting
Crashing sucks
[/list:u]

Go sit on the bike and position yourself like you are in a corner. For left hand turns put the bike on the centerstand, rearstand or trackstand. For right-hand put the bike on the sidestand. You should position your head such that if you looked down you would see your hand. Practice your body position. It helps.

You learn well, grasshopper...kudos to you.

Wait, don't you mean for left hand turns put it on the side stand? So I'm already leaning? Or am I working on moving more than the lean angle itself?

Good catch. This is garage practice. I forgot which side the sidestand is. It's on the port side (left), correct? So, that would be for a left turn...okay, I got my bearings back. Carry on.

me too!

pics explain a lot (very helpful for me)

Quote from: AlphaFire X5...I'm taking notes, man! :lol: ...

More pictures! Gear is towards the bottom.

She's prepped and ready. I kinda like the look like that, actually.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0204.jpg)

Loaded up and ready to head out.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0206.jpg)

The jacket. You can see the minor scrape on the elbow and the heavier ones around the straps at the waist
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0207.jpg)

The pants. Hole in the crotch needs to be fixed. Going to wipe it down with a leather cleaner and try to get some of the abraisions out.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0208.jpg)

Right knee. Wore the leather through to the armor.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0209.jpg)

Left knee, not as bad. Still need to get them fixed somehow.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0210.jpg)

Left boot. Took off a layer of leather at the toes and a couple of scrapes on the inside. I'll redye it black after cleaning them up a bit.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0211.jpg)

Right boot. Scrapes along the outer toes and the tip of the toe. I'll clean it up and redye it. It's still useable.
(https://webspace.utexas.edu/bah562/Photos/05-12-10/IMG_0212.jpg)

Pictures of the bike will come later. They're on my dad's camera at home.

Okay, now I see a sideshot of your bars, and yes they are rotated way too far up and forward.

Okay, and I have an update on the inside foot placement, only put your foot against teh frame if you can still point your knee into the turn. This is why I want you to go out to your bike and practice your body position on the bike.

I've got long arms. When they're back further it feels uncomfortable, too upright. When I get the position I do like my arms are way too bent. I'm getting better bars soon.

Alright, here's some pics of the damage I'm working with. The guages were already off at this point. I think I've got a picture of them on a different camera.

The bars. One side turned into a clip-on posistion!
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0214.jpg)

Brake lever snapped off and the brake line snapped, too:
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0215.jpg)

Right side of the tank:
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0216.jpg)
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0220.jpg)

Left side:
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0217.jpg)

Exhaust got a little scraped up, but it's only cosmetic:
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0218.jpg)

Case guards did their job:
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/GSTwin/04crash/IMG_0219.jpg)

Well, glad to hear you're okay. You're two for two, and in this case that's NOT a good ratio ( :P) , but keep your head up and learn from your mistakes. Is your insurance company going to pay for this, considering you were at a race event, or are you on your own?

Quote from: streetsweeperWell, glad to hear you're okay. You're two for two, and in this case that's NOT a good ratio ( :P) , but keep your head up and learn from your mistakes. Is your insurance company going to pay for this, considering you were at a race event, or are you on your own?

I'm ALWAYS on my own. The damage really isn't that bad. I'm running without a tach, and all I need to get roadworthy right now is the brake lever. I (thankfully) got some SM2 bars for Christmas, so that took care of that. So, brake lever, new guage housing, new tach, and cleaning up my pipe is all I really need to do. I'm going to buy my dad's old pipe off of him sometime next year. It's a Yoshimura RS-1 oval can he used on his FZ1. Muuuuuch nicer looking. That takes care of that. eBay pricing on a good condition tank for an '01+ is usually around $80 or so, sometimes $100. Not really that much considering.

And really, I'm 3 for 3. I have crashed my dirtbike soooo many times it isn't even funny! :lol: Okay, maybe that time I ran into a tree, or the time I jumped it off a motorcross jump and lost it mid-air... those were pretty funny.

:o  Glad your ok Alpha.  Racing seems like fun but i'm too old and wise for it.  Take good care of yourself.  And please..........keep the rubber side down.  :cheers:

Stuff I've fixed:

SM2 bars are now on, and the throttle cables dealt with (had to reroute them).
Metal guage bracket is now (mostly) straight. Still needs a whack or two with a rubber mallet, but it'll do for now. It's tweaked near the tach which isn't there. Not much concern at the moment.
Old crappy rubber brake line replaces the broken SS line.
Tail plastics back on.
Lighting (headlight, brake light, turn signals) put back on.
Passenger pegs put back on.
License plate put back on.[/list:u]

All I have left to do is get a new brake lever and bleed the front line properly, followed by putting the mirrors on and I'm good to go.

On a note of being alright: my thumb is still hurting pretty bad. Whenever I bend it or put pressure on it it hurts pretty bad. Possibly broken?

Quote from: streetsweeperWell, glad to hear you're okay. You're two for two, and in this case that's NOT a good ratio ( :P) , but keep your head up and learn from your mistakes. Is your insurance company going to pay for this, considering you were at a race event, or are you on your own?

a trackday is not a race event. It is an educational event. A race event would involve organized timing (and prizes).

Quote from: pantabloa trackday is not a race event. It is an educational event. A race event would involve organized timing (and prizes).

You're right, track days are not race events. People are more reserved on track days than they are race days too, from what I understand.

I do want to race in the future though. Sometime when I'm more financially secure most likely. This is a good way to pass the time until then, and a learning tool to boot! Good for street skills is only an added benefit. :)

Quote from: pantablo

Quote from: streetsweeperWell, glad to hear you're okay. You're two for two, and in this case that's NOT a good ratio ( :P) , but keep your head up and learn from your mistakes. Is your insurance company going to pay for this, considering you were at a race event, or are you on your own?

a trackday is not a race event. It is an educational event. A race event would involve organized timing (and prizes).

i have heard of insurance companies not picking up the tab from trackdays.  the simple fact of that you being at a race track is the clencher.

most people have no trouble with insurance companies and trackdays. check the fine print of your policy if you're unsure.

Quote from: pantablomost people have no trouble with insurance companies and trackdays. check the fine print of your policy if you're unsure.

I've got liability only, so it's not really an issue with me.

Soon as I get enough money for that F3 I'll probably baby my GS!

Alright, I got the real picture (shrunk from a 15x18 photo) now. No more copyright!

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b123/AlphaFire_X5/kneedrag-800.jpg)

very cool.

I noticed something though-does that suit fit you properly? it looks big on you.

^ditto...it looks quite loose around the shoulders and chest.

Yeah. YOU try finding gear that fits a skinny ass mofo like me. I have no shoulders/chest, so that's why it's loose. It's just time to hit the gym.

Mine fits me pretty good.  A "little" loose in the chest.  I think I wear a size 42?  I'll have to measure my chest...I'm a pretty lanky dude.  6'2" and 150lbs

Quote from: makenzie71 on February 16, 2006, 09:41:13 PM
Mine fits me pretty good.  A "little" loose in the chest.  I think I wear a size 42?  I'll have to measure my chest...I'm a pretty lanky dude.  6'2" and 150lbs

5'10 and 130. I have 38 in the chest, I think. MAYBE. Probably smaller.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Motorcycle-Racing-Street-Riding-Leathers-2pc-Race-Suit_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6750QQitemZ8038945182QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

That's what I wear...I ordered mine a size larger than needed so I could wear stuff comfortably under it.  They can cater to a 38" chest (you skinny bastard)...AND they're cheap.  They have a couple other color combinations.

Excellent suit and unbeatable value.  Mine's lasted 3 years with no problems.

Hm. Not bad. I am poor as hell now though. I figure if I get to the gym more often I can just size myself into my current one. That'd probably be easier and cheaper than buying a new suit. The pants I have I bought off RG are size 30 and they fit me fairly well, but I know my waist is a 28. The elastic in the waist compensates for that enough at the moment though.

well you really should do something.  Leathers that don't fit propperly will not protect you propperly.  The reinforce areas will slide out from under you under stress, so will the armor.  Plus, in wind, excess material tends to ripple and "flap" which can cause a whole new set of problems.

How exactly SHOULD leathers fit? When are they too tight?

I get mine just loose enough that I could wear a sweater underneath without suffocating.

In general you shouldn't be able to grab a handfull of leather while wearing the suit.  If you push on the armor at the shoulders and elbows it should not be able to move more than an inch or two in any direction (key impact areas, you want the armor ot stay put).  None of it should be "baggy" at all.  It should generally be "t-shirt" tight all around...I think that's a good way to describe it.

5ft6, 125lbs. I wear a 36 chest suit jacket, 29 waist, 30 inseam. I feel your pain but you can find stuff that fits better. Some of the euro stuff is cut smaller, like my alpinestars stuff has really small sizes. thats why I was looking into custom 1-pc suits (and why I'm ecstatic about winning the Kushitani suit!)...

Keep on the lookout for stuff that fits because if its loose like that it wont protect you as well as properly fitting stuff.

Yeah Pablo. I wish I could try some AStar stuff on before I had to buy it, but I don't think there is a place that sells it around here. The Teknic stuff is cut pretty slim as it is, but I just tried the jacket on and it IS too big. I never realized that before. So leathers should be fairly freakin' snug, right?

Yeah they shouldn't be loose at all.

you can get a custom fitted suit for under $700 from syed leathers (highly recommended). save up. or just keep trying stuff on when you see it (like when the int'l moto show was around). In our sizes stores dont usually carry much in those sizes anyway...look for extra small or better yet look for sizes that are numerical (sm is a larger range than say my 36 jacket). Joe Rocket fits my like its 10 sizes too big, even though its a small...

even in this pic you can see how my upper arm bunches up from poor fit. Better than your fit though because the armor is where its supposed to be and doesnt move around much.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v505/pantablo/MM3I8963.jpg)

My jacket is a bit loose when I don't have the 10 inches of waterproof/super heated/good for any bad weather liner in it. Unfortunately, I had to buy a slightly larger jacket since I have a fractured elbow with a little bit of bone still in it. I tried on some very well fitted leathers and such, but they put enough pressure on my elbow that I would almost scream out in pain (actually brought tears to my eyes  :icon_rolleyes:).
So I figure I can just wear maybe a sweatshirt of something to keep the armor where it needs to be, and not be too hot in San Diego weather.

I'm another guy who had problems finding leathers.  I am 5'7", about 145 pounds, light upper body build.  I found a great suit, skin tight, well constructed and padded.  It's by a small company that cut me a great deal.
http://www.motogearusa.com/products.php#product01
They make an extra small!!!  Fits great, feels great and has a lot of perforated leather for good breathing ability...

Problem with an extra small for me is that usually sleeves and torso are WAY too short, i.e. only coming up to my mid forarm, ot just not fitting right. I'm going to hit the gm and see if I can't work out some of my issues that way, but I think I'm going to end up going the custom route in order to getting something that fits properly. That's a lot of money for my own poor ass starving college student budget, and I think that I'd rather get a track bike so I don't tear up my street bike. It'd be $700 either way. Maybe I can swing both if I get a decent job this summer.