Ok. So I've lurked here since the spring when I purchased my used 05 F, and have found this place awesome. Managed to do some simple maintenance and learned a couple of things too. Had all my Q's answered so far...
BUT
I haven't found anything about my current problem. Maybe it's a simple noob thing.
I just started experiencing a problem with shifting out of 1st into N at a stop. I come to a stop having downshifted into 1st. If I want to shift into N at this point, I CAN'T!!! Most people it seems have the opposite problem ie. shifting from N into 1st.
I've tried:
- rocking the bike
- lightly letting up and trying to shift out (remember I'm in 1st still so can't let it out fully)
- shifting down (just to be sure I was in 1st)
Other info:
- shifting from N into 1st when stopped isn't a problem, just going from 1st to N is
- shifting into N while coming to a stop is not problem
- the oil and filter was changed in the spring 1300 km ago so it should be ok
- oil level is fine - I've added 4 L since the spring
- starting and also shifting into higher gears isn't a problem after stopping
- clutch feels fine (although I'm not sure what a mushy one should feel like)
- it's started getting cold now and I'm riding in 10-20 deg C (50-70 deg F) weather
I know we have a wet clutch that shares the engine oil but the colour is a light yellow/amber so I figure it's fine.
Is this a clutch cable adjustment problem? If so then I'll just use Kerry's video to adjust it. Only problem is, I'm not sure what is supposed to feel right for a clutch.
Any advice is welcomed advice.
I usually just move the biek forward a couple inches and viola.
Quote from: The Post Whore on September 27, 2006, 07:50:12 PM
I usually just move the biek forward a couple inches and viola.
Thanks, but I did try that in addition to rocking the bike as well. Sorry, I should have been more specific.
This is a problem that just started happening 2 days ago though.
slitly start letting out on the cluch and start pulling up it should shift .. if your at a light .. you really sould not be shifting in to N at a light .. theres no problem with it .but then your stuck if you heap to glance back and see a chager coming .
Gory, how many miles on the bike? This might just be a little cable stretch on the clutch that won't let you fully disengage and wants to keep it in gear. Try the adjuster on the clutch and let us know.
How hard are you riding? Mine would get extremely sticky from running hard through the twisties, not a cable issue just clutch so hot it dont want to let go.
Quote from: gory on September 27, 2006, 07:37:50 PM
I just started experiencing a problem with shifting out of 1st into N at a stop.
I've tried:
- rocking the bike
- lightly letting up and trying to shift out (remember I'm in 1st still so can't let it out fully)
These tactics won't help. They are for problems shifting into gear, not
into neutral.
Quote
Other info:
- shifting into N while coming to a stop is not problem
- it's started getting cold now and I'm riding in 10-20 deg C (50-70 deg F) weather
There's your clue. Getting stuck in gear at a stop is caused by clutch drag loading the gear. Not a problem when the bike is rolling because load decreases when the gear is rotating. Why now? Cold weather = thick oil = clutch drag. Might help to use a multi-grade synthetic oil with a 5W-XX rating. :cheers:
I know you said that you have already tried rocking the bike forward, but how do you do it? I have the same problem as you, and the only way I can get my bike into neutral is to roll forward a bit while pulling up on the shift lever (applying slight pressure). When I say roll forward I mean by slowly clutching out with a tiny bit of gas.
Some times it takes a couple of tries but I never go past 2 or three tries.
Hope that helps?
I've actually had the same problem before. The one thing that I noticed is that after I added some engine oil (because my oil level was low), it was easier for me to go into neutral from first.
Maybe your oil level is low. If so add some and see if that works
Mine from brand-new has never liked to go into N from 1st. Only really does it when I slip the clutch a bit and resist forward motion with my right foot, pull up on shifter with left. Then it'll go just fine.
Always run with fresh oil, 23K now on clock, hot/cold/frozen in MN winter, doesn't matter. New clutch cable/lever/lubing cable doesn't affect it.
Just one of those things about the GS...tranny isn't that slick/nice to work with. Tough, yes, but svelte, no way.
I had that problem AFTER I switched to synthetic. I switched back and I was ok :dunno_white: depends on the bike I guess
Thanks for all the advice!
More details and answers to questions/suggestions:
- as mentioned oil level is fine
- I added and started running with the 10w40 about 2 weeks ago
- I bought the bike at 7000 km and not it has 8400 km
- even if I roll the bike forwards a whole rotation I can't disengage out of 1st
- problem is present in the morning when starting out and all through the 30 min. commute
- I've thought about switching to synthetic but never done it since it's a never-go-back type of choice
I'll have time tomorrow to be out on the bike when the weather is nice and I can try out the clutch cable adjustment thing. I'll post my results.
I'm not sure what other bikes are like for shifting in terms of being smoother since this is my first bike, but I do like the definitive you-are-now-definitely-in-gear-"clunk" when getting into 1st.
slowly let clutch out... I mean SLOWLY... give extremely light gas... and lift up on the shift lever.
A wheel's revolution does nothing if you're not acting on any part of the drive train.... such as forcing the transmission to move slightly by applying alittle clutch.
Try a clutchless upshift.
When all else fails for me I do that with the clutch barely grabbing and it works most of the time.
Quote from: gory on September 28, 2006, 08:42:27 PM
- even if I roll the bike forwards a whole rotation I can't disengage out of 1st
This tactic would work if the engine was off. An idling motor keeps the drag against the gear.
Quote
- I've thought about switching to synthetic but never done it since it's a never-go-back type of choice
I think there's a consensus here that this rule has no basis in fact. Perhaps synththetic won't help as per poster's observation but there's still the option to go for 5W-30 dino let's say.
Quote
but I do like the definitive you-are-now-definitely-in-gear-"clunk" when getting into 1st.
More evidence of clutch drag. Adjust to the minimum free-play for maximum pull/release. :cheers:
Woohooo! Bike shifts without a problem now! :) Thanks to everybody for their thoughtful analysis and advice.
I changed out the oil for fresh 10w40 (I'll consider the synth for next year) since this will be the winter storage oil. Tightened the clutch cable (man that lock ring was tight). Now there is very little play. It feels different. I can't say better yet since I'll have to get used to riding with a properly tensioned clutch.
I never really considered the clutch cable to be too loose since it never seemed mushy to me and I could always shift without problem in all other instances. Guess it's one of those things you have to experience.
The only thing I've noticed now is that I have to be a lot more careful shifting out of 1st into N. I'm skipping right past it into 2nd. Did I tighten it too much or something? ...or maybe that's something typical I'll have to get used to.
It is still making that definitive clunk when shifting into 1st from N at stop, but I actually don't mind that.
Quote from: gory on September 29, 2006, 08:41:26 PM
It is still making that definitive clunk when shifting into 1st from N at stop, but I actually don't mind that.
That
is typical. You have to realize that when the bike is idling in neutral the gearbox is in an active state. All the countershaft gears, 1-2-3-4, are idling along with the engine. Pull in the clutch at a stop and the gearbox is rendered inactive but it takes a moment for the inertia to expend itself. If it still
clunks after that then there's still some drag in the clutch. :cheers: