I'm trying to get the timing right on my bike. Before i took it apart i put two marks on the chain and the camshafts to line it up when I put it back together.
When I put everything back together, I counted the links in the chain just to make sure everything was right. Instead of 18 from arrow to arrow it was only 17. I adjusted it so that there are now 18 pins between them (like the haynes manual says).
The problem now is that when the marking on the VH advancer points to TDC, the notches on the ends of the camshafts do not face each other exactly. The front one points straight back horizontally like it should (9 o'clock), but the rear notch points diagonally (between 2 and 3 o'clock).
The only time they face each other exactly is when there are 17 pins between them instead of 18.
What the heck is going on?
They have to be set 18 pin apart. Otherwise you will probably end up bending a valve. Do not concern yourself with the notches, they are not used for setting the timing only relative position to each other.
GEE I must be doing something wrong all these years.
I've always made sure the timing slots on the cams were lined up. I think I counted the chain links once a long time ago O0.
Put a screwdriver in the sparkplug hole and feel when it tops out at TDC. Check where the timing mark is on the advancer. Then get the slots on the cams to line up at TDC.
Also make sure you release the cam chain tensioner before you check the timing.
It will take out the slack and move the cams. So you could get a false reading if the chain is not tight.
Quote from: Bob Broussard on February 02, 2007, 11:59:41 PM
I think I counted the chain links once a long time ago O0.
So you're saying that it doesn't matter how many links are between the two arrows on camshaft sprockets?
Considering I have never used the slots to set the timing, I must me completely wrong.
The factory Suzuki manual only mentions the slots to distinguish the right side of the cams. It does not mention anything about lining them up.
Thats kind of a problem isn't it? One of you is doing it wrong, and who knows how many others. The haynes manual says to check for both 18 pins and notches facing each other. They have drawings of both emphasizing the importance of each.
See if this helps.
http://www.upload-globe.com/download.php?&file_id=0268880081 (http://www.upload-globe.com/download.php?&file_id=0268880081)
i haven't had to do this yet, but for some reason I remember when checking my valves with my V&H advancer that the notches would never line up, if i got the exhaust cam lined parallel to the ground the intake would be at about a 10° incline, and the RT spot would be just a little of of the pick-up..
Quote from: facepants on February 03, 2007, 11:29:06 AM
Thats kind of a problem isn't it? One of you is doing it wrong, and who knows how many others. The haynes manual says to check for both 18 pins and notches facing each other. They have drawings of both emphasizing the importance of each.
Facing each other is NOT the same as lined up.
Interesting since both of us have built podium finishing motors. Like Bob, I do not following the manuals either anymore. I know where to set the cams so they are not pushing on the vavles. This way I can install the cam caps without being under any pressure. I do always check the #1 horizontal and the RT mark. It has been awhile since I set the timing using a V&H advancer, but I do recall that the #1 was not perfectly horizontal.
As for the 18 pins....anything else will probably lead to bent valves. If you want to find out, turn it over by hand and when it gets a little tight...turn a little more....then POP...you have just bent a valve.
OK
I just checked the factory manual and it shows BOTH 18 pins and the slots facing each other O- -O.
So I checked out the motor on my bench and guess what? The slots face each other And it has 18 pins between the arrows :cheers:
I know it's on TDC because I cut away the spark plug area to see the piston and valves.
I milled the head down as far as possible just to see what was possible. The cams have to be degreed to make up for removing so much material, but it still shows that both the slots and 18 pins should lineup at TDC.
I just never really bothered counting the pins once I have the slots lined up :dunno_white: :icon_mrgreen:
It's weird as hell.. no matter what I do if there are 18 pins the notches will not line up even if I ignore the rotor markings completely.
Is it possible that somehow one of the camshafts is off?
Have the cam sprockets been slotted to degree the cams? :dunno_white:
Not counting pins...lucky bastard!
Maybe it is just me but there is a use of terms that do not mean the same thing...facing and lined up. Bob you have used both terms apperently interchangeably. To me, they are different...facing is pointing towards each other and not parallel. Lined up is being parallel.
I wish I knew how to post a picture to show what mean.
The center of the slot lines up with the surface that the cam bearing cap rests.
The head is the lower cam bearing surface and the cap bolts to the head. Where these 2 connect is the line that should be in the middle of the slot of the cam. Hope that makes sense :dunno_white:
That is for stock timing. If they are degreed you're on your own :flipoff: :laugh: