Hi everyone, my name is Woogs and I'm stupid.
I'm stupid because I didn't check the oil levels in my '07 GS500F. And then I did my first ERC. Which was a lot of fun. And which also happened to destroy my clutch plates as best I can figure, as now my clutch slips constantly.
I've also got a track day coming up this Saturday, so I'm stupid and panicking, it's a great combination.
In any case, my new clutch plates will arrive tomorrow and I can get to work (hopefully) repairing the damage I've done. I have a couple questions about that.
#1 I'm using the Haynes manual for the '06 to cover my repair job. I read on here to soak the friction plates in my engine oil before installing, which wasn't in the manual. I also read about using some loctite for the rotor bolt, as it can work its way out. Any words of wisdom that aren't in the Haynes manual beyond that people have to share?
#2 Last night was prep work - getting the fairing off and reading over the instructions, looking over tools and so forth. Also, looking at removing the pulse coil generator (the generator pulse coil? The pulse generator coil?). The pair of screws securing the rotor plate were extremely stubborn - to the point where I stopped for the night there. The rotor plate was still warm from the brief ride to the garage - would that make it more difficult to remove the screws?
#3 While I fiddled with my freeplay at handlebar and engine, I couldn't get in to the pushrod adjustment screw because the screws on the left side cover seemed to be on too tight. Is there some kind of trick to getting those off, or should I just crank the torque up to 11 to get those out? More to the point, someone tell me that the pushrod can't be responsible for the slipping and that I was right to get replacement plates (it'd make my day).
Thanks
Woogs
Quote from: woogs on June 03, 2008, 06:50:41 PM
Hi everyone, my name is Woogs and I'm stupid.
I'm stupid because I didn't check the oil levels in my '07 GS500F. And then I did my first ERC. Which was a lot of fun. And which also happened to destroy my clutch plates as best I can figure, as now my clutch slips constantly.
I've also got a track day coming up this Saturday, so I'm stupid and panicking, it's a great combination.
In any case, my new clutch plates will arrive tomorrow and I can get to work (hopefully) repairing the damage I've done. I have a couple questions about that.
First things first... take a deep breath! :laugh:
If I understand correctly, the oil was low and this may have lead to a burned clutch? Seems strange to me. If anything, I think it is more likely that the replacement oil you used has some anti-friction additives (these are not always friendly to wet clutches). Can you give some details on the oil you used?
note: see here for an example of this:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=40591.0
Quote
#1 I'm using the Haynes manual for the '06 to cover my repair job. I read on here to soak the friction plates in my engine oil before installing, which wasn't in the manual. I also read about using some loctite for the rotor bolt, as it can work its way out. Any words of wisdom that aren't in the Haynes manual beyond that people have to share?
#2 Last night was prep work - getting the fairing off and reading over the instructions, looking over tools and so forth. Also, looking at removing the pulse coil generator (the generator pulse coil? The pulse generator coil?). The pair of screws securing the rotor plate were extremely stubborn - to the point where I stopped for the night there. The rotor plate was still warm from the brief ride to the garage - would that make it more difficult to remove the screws?
Someone else can comment on this better than I can. I would suggest replacing the oil with a motorcycle specific type before replacing the clutch.
Quote
#3 While I fiddled with my freeplay at handlebar and engine, I couldn't get in to the pushrod adjustment screw because the screws on the left side cover seemed to be on too tight. Is there some kind of trick to getting those off, or should I just crank the torque up to 11 to get those out? More to the point, someone tell me that the pushrod can't be responsible for the slipping and that I was right to get replacement plates (it'd make my day).
You definitely want to adjust the clutch before going for the replacement. Are you looking at the right screws? There should be two Phillips head screws holding on a little panel on the left hand side sprocket cover. The clutch push rod adjuster is under that panel.
If you trying the correct screws and they are stuck, you may want to use an impact driver to get the screws unstuck.
Lots of pictures (and a better description) are available here:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=20468.0
Go to NAPA and get some coarse valve grinding compound. Put it on the tip of your screwdriver, then insert it into the head of the screw. The grit will help prevent the tip from camming out of the drive recesses.
Before you go though the hassle of disassembling the clutch basket, try resetting the clutch pushrod and lever freeplay per the haynes manual. If that doesn't help, you may very well have to replace the clutch.
As Berto said, are you certain your oil does not contain friction modifiers? Check the API classification label on the back of the bottle/jug. If it says "energy conserving", that's probably your problem. In which case you'll likely have to change the clutch, just don't refill the bike with that oil!
Quote from: GeeP on June 03, 2008, 09:42:08 PM
As Berto said, are you certain your oil does not contain friction modifiers? Check the API classification label on the back of the bottle/jug. If it says "energy conserving", that's probably your problem. In which case you'll likely have to change the clutch, just don't refill the bike with that oil!
Assuming friction modifiers are present in the oil, it's possible the clutch can still be saved. The first link I posted was an example where ohgood added oil with "friction inhibitors"; when he drained and replaced the oil, the clutch was good to go!
Definitely not the oil. This was a before-and-after thing with the ERC - rode the bike there, she handled like .... a bike that needs progressive front springs (those are in my living room right now). On the way back, my first thought was that the engagement point for my clutch had moved somewhere past the end of the lever - I kept trying to push the lever, hoping to get some more "slack" out of it (physics 101, you can't push on a rope :laugh:)
Oil that's in there is the same it's always been - 4-stroke motorcycle dino oil, cheapest I can find at the local crappy tire.
And when I say "oil got low", I mean I immediately did an oil+filter change after the ERC, thinking it was an oil problem. I drained a bit more than 1 litre of oil, put 2.8L back in :o
If you need a clutch and wanna upgrade get a 99-02 SV650 EBC or Barretts clutch.I have kevlar friction plates and EBC springs.
Always use loctite on the ignition bolt.
I took a zip lock bag,put my friction plates in it,filled it about half way up the plates,pushed all the air out of the bag,and let them sit until I got everything tore down.You can use the oil in the bag if you keep everything clean.
I always use MC oil.
Quote from: ben2go on June 03, 2008, 10:39:47 PM
If you need a clutch and wanna upgrade get a 99-02 SV650 EBC or Barretts clutch.I have kevlar friction plates and EBC springs.
Always use loctite on the ignition bolt.
I took a zip lock bag,put my friction plates in it,filled it about half way up the plates,pushed all the air out of the bag,and let them sit until I got everything tore down.You can use the oil in the bag if you keep everything clean.
I always use MC oil.
now theres something i didnt know .... we can use the 99-02 sv 650 clutch plates in our bikes....sweet..
Quote from: nastynate6695 on June 04, 2008, 10:24:40 AM
Quote from: ben2go on June 03, 2008, 10:39:47 PM
If you need a clutch and wanna upgrade get a 99-02 SV650 EBC or Barretts clutch.I have kevlar friction plates and EBC springs.
Always use loctite on the ignition bolt.
I took a zip lock bag,put my friction plates in it,filled it about half way up the plates,pushed all the air out of the bag,and let them sit until I got everything tore down.You can use the oil in the bag if you keep everything clean.
I always use MC oil.
now theres something i didnt know .... we can use the 99-02 sv 650 clutch plates in our bikes....sweet..
That's a big 10 4 good buddy.Ya learn sumin new ever day.
AH! CRAP!
Note to everyone here: if your torque wrench doesn't measure down far enough for the job at hand, spinning the gauge down "past the bottom" is NOT the way to do things. Even if it really looks like you ought to be measuring 5 ft lbs, you aren't. I just snapped one of the bolts that secures the pusher plate! Fortunately, there was enough of the bolt protruding to remove it from the basket without resorting to bolt removal kits etc.
So tomorrow I'm looking for a replacement bolt. I'm assuming that any old 6x40 bolt will do the trick? At least that's what bikebandit.com seemed to be selling me for a replacement. Actually, I'm looking for 6 replacement bolts (I'm a little troubled that one snapped in the first place, we weren't exactly reefing on it). Then again, pressing against that spring with decent length torque wrench makes it tricky to judge =\
Oh well - I can still save her. <Homer Simpson>It's just a little airborne, it's still good!</Home Simpson>
How did this go Woogs?
Eh, a simple bolt replacement and the clutch was fine.
Of course, then the bolt holding the timing rotor in place snapped off, and the timing rotor just flopped around loose after I rode the bike 100 metres.
Then the bolt holding the flywheel on at the other end backed itself out and bounced off the crankshaft.
But my clutch repair went fine ...
Quote from: ben2go on June 03, 2008, 10:39:47 PM
If you need a clutch and wanna upgrade get a 99-02 SV650 EBC or Barretts clutch.I have kevlar friction plates and EBC springs.
From here http://www.brakes4u.co.uk/supersearch.asp?step4=yes&catType=M&catParent=9&pMake=All+Clutches&pModel=SUZUKI (http://www.brakes4u.co.uk/supersearch.asp?step4=yes&catType=M&catParent=9&pMake=All+Clutches&pModel=SUZUKI)
GS500
clutch plates CK3333
springs CSK61
SV650 99-02
clutch plates CK3377
springs CSK69
What gives? :dunno_white: