http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#a7
i believe its in section (A8) , where my question lies.
"A person is not considered convicted for Gun Control Act purposes if he has been pardoned, had his civil rights restored, or the conviction was expunged or set aside, unless the pardon, expungement, or restoration expressly provides the person may not ship, transport, possess, or receive firearms."
this quote was taken directly from that site. now, i bring this up because it's of special intrest to me. you see, as a young lad, i wasn't the brightest of the bunch and made bad choices. some of which were hanging with the wrong influences. but, i'm a man now, and have owned up to my mistakes. in 2002 i was convicted of a felony. i know, you're thinking, "oh f%$k, a felon on gstwins...ahhhhhhhhh." get a hold of yourself now, it was for HOT CHECKS. yes, you read that right, hot checks. i know, i was a dumbass. (at least they were my own checks. :icon_mrgreen: ) anyways. i served 4 years probation and paid back some huge, unholy, yet just fine. in may of 2006 i was released from probation and had my record expunged. so, it's my understanding that because my record has been expunged, i am not considered convicted for Gun Control Act and can therefore legally purchase a firearm. thoughts? opinions?
everyone in bed allready? :dunno_white: i know i should be. :icon_mrgreen:
I'm not sure, but ask a gun dealer... they'll know for sure.
Quote from: jserio on November 06, 2008, 08:16:01 PM
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#a7
i believe its in section (A8) , where my question lies.
"A person is not considered convicted for Gun Control Act purposes if he has been pardoned, had his civil rights restored, or the conviction was expunged or set aside, unless the pardon, expungement, or restoration expressly provides the person may not ship, transport, possess, or receive firearms."
this quote was taken directly from that site. now, i bring this up because it's of special intrest to me. you see, as a young lad, i wasn't the brightest of the bunch and made bad choices. some of which were hanging with the wrong influences. but, i'm a man now, and have owned up to my mistakes. in 2002 i was convicted of a felony. i know, you're thinking, "oh f%$k, a felon on gstwins...ahhhhhhhhh." get a hold of yourself now, it was for HOT CHECKS. yes, you read that right, hot checks. i know, i was a dumbass. (at least they were my own checks. :icon_mrgreen: ) anyways. i served 4 years probation and paid back some huge, unholy, yet just fine. in may of 2006 i was released from probation and had my record expunged. so, it's my understanding that because my record has been expunged, i am not considered convicted for Gun Control Act and can therefore legally purchase a firearm. thoughts? opinions?
should be expunged. if they deny, get the form, along wiht the one you recieved stating the expungement, and that should clear itup
Can you vote? Then you should be in the clear. If you really must know, but aren't going to buy a gun right now you can probably talk a local dealer into running the NCIC for standard transfer cost ($15-20)
My guess is that you'll be just fine with standard long guns and handguns, but depending on state you may still not be eligible for a concealed carry permit.
There's an appeals process if you get turned down, that would be the time to drag up any documentation you have. You could also google and find your local ATF office and run it by them.
Quote from: spc on November 06, 2008, 10:24:25 PM
Can you vote? Then you should be in the clear. If you really must know, but aren't going to buy a gun right now you can probably talk a local dealer into running the NCIC for standard transfer cost ($15-20)
My guess is that you'll be just fine with standard long guns and handguns, but depending on state you may still not be eligible for a concealed carry permit.
There's an appeals process if you get turned down, that would be the time to drag up any documentation you have. You could also google and find your local ATF office and run it by them.
yup ↑ it will however take some time. IF it is not possible first time around.
Sounds like you're ok to own a gun.
Just to be sure, once you get the gun and are driving around and you see a policeman, get your gun and go up to him and show him the gun and your permit. Police are busy men, so you should run up to him, shouting your question. :thumb:
My work here is done. Anyone else with legal questions, feel free to PM me. I'm here to help.
as much as i hate to say so but you are OK to purchase a fire arm. personally i believe that firearms, other than hunting weapons, only belong in the hands of the police and military. perhaps some collectors under strict regulation. we pay the police to protect us, a firearm is more likely to be taken away from you than save you. so i don't see the need. it is just fear mongering. if you are that scared that you feel you need a fire arm to protect yourself then i say you should contact the police or seek medical attention for your psych problem
Quote from: frankieG on November 07, 2008, 02:53:43 AM
as much as i hate to say so but you are OK to purchase a fire arm. personally i believe that firearms, other than hunting weapons, only belong in the hands of the police and military. perhaps some collectors under strict regulation. we pay the police to protect us, a firearm is more likely to be taken away from you than save you. so i don't see the need. it is just fear mongering. if you are that scared that you feel you need a fire arm to protect yourself then i say you should contact the police or seek medical attention for your psych problem
Shut up you damn hippy!!!
lol
I think you are OK to buy one... My friend was (is) a fellon but after serving his time, serving on paroll because of the crime he commited was not violent he is allowed to buy and even carry a gun.
Yes you are OK to own since the record has been expunged,
You will answer no to question 12c per the instructions contained on page 3 of of form 4473 exception 6 definition 1. Most FFL's are pretty helpful if you have a question, gun owners in general are a pretty friendly bunch.
http://www.atf.treas.gov/forms/4473/index.htm
Because you have been arrested and printed odds are that you will be delayed when the FFL runs the NICS, just a fact of life, I get delayed because my prints are in the system and they have to have a second examiner access those records it takes anywhere between a hour and on my rifle transfer almost 3 full business days to get the approval to transfer.
The Oklahoma state bureau of investigation and the ATF maintain records of all licensed CCW's in oklahoma.
If you get denied you can submit an appeals form and attatch supporting documentation and finger prints which they can then investigate, I would suggest in that case you submit a voluntary appeals for as well which allows the NICS to maintain your records instead of destroying them within 24hrs as is mandated by law you then receive a NICS pin number which usually gets you past the delay as they then have the investigative records on file and do not have to start from scratch every time you purchase.
So go buy one and see what pops up. If your facts are correct and you have been expunged you are good to go. Just be patient.
thank you for the replies. they were all helpful. i seemed to have misplaced my copy of the expungement paperwork. funny thing is, i know i said i was putting it up in a safe place where it wouldn't get lost. :mad: but, i have since moved so who knows where it is. maybe i can contact the court and get a copy. hahaha, that sounds funny, really it does. the conversation would go like this:
me: "yes, i'd like a copy of the paperwork filed for my expungement"
them: "sir, you realize expungement meant the event in the eyes of the court essentially never took place, therefore we have no record of it"
i'm sure i'm wrong about the above scenario but it's still a laugh all the same. i'll keep you guys posted.
spc: yes, i can vote.
Big shock Frankie went anti-gun on you....you should be good to go, but a call to the DA's office would tell you for sure.
you know, i don't currently own a gun. but i have shot several. i see them as tools. very useful tools. and like many other tools, they should only be out when you're going to use them. so frankie, your argument that it will just get taken from me is foolish. if i were packing a snub nose .357 or S&W .500, for personal defense and saw fit to use it, (my life or family life in danger), you'd have to get pretty f%$king close to take it from me. before pulling a weapon in a situtation you should be prepared to actually use it and deal with the consequences of such an action. no, i'm not military trained in hand-to-hand combat with james bond style moves to disarm an armed person. that kinda shaZam! is really just in the movies. if/when i ever pick up a firearm for self defense, you can bet your ass i'm pulling the trigger. i don't want a firearm because i feel unsafe. honestly right now, i'd like to go out and hunt with my buddies and in-laws. i don't see gun ownership as fear mongering. i can say this till i'm blue in the face but it just won't get through to some people: GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE, PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE. i can lay a fully loaded ar-15 on my coffee table, safety off, and i promise you, it won't harm a soul until someone picks it up. banning guns will not keep them out of the crimminals hands. it works about as well as Prohibition did. :thumb:
Agreed Jserio.
Guns are only dangerous when handled by a person. None of my weapons have ever killed anybody, and some sit loaded 24 hours a day.
If I am carrying my weapon, chances are you won't even know it (not including long arms), let alone take it from me. The ONLY time it should come out from hiding is when presenting to shoot, or to put it in the safe.
I have had conversations with police officers that did not know I was wearing a gun. I also speak to quite a few police officers (related by marriage) and ALL of the ones I have asked are very comfortable with the public being armed.
Frankie, your idea that "gun ownership for anything other than hunting is fear-mongering" is ludicrous. The same could be said for your statement that "a firearm is more likely to be taken away from you than save you" This statement was made up by the anti-gun groups and is not supported by any facts or data that I can find from the ATF or CDC.
The statement you make saying "if you are that scared that you feel you need a fire arm to protect yourself then i say you should contact the police or seek medical attention for your psych problem" is unnecessary and extremely pointed. You are labeling all people who own firearms for self defense as people with psychotic problems and in need of medical attention. This point alone shows how weak the anti-gun movement is. People fear that which they do not understand.
Your idea that the police are "paid to protect you" is FALSE. The police are paid by the state to "protect and serve" the law. In fact, in a landmark case (Warren vs. District of Columbia), this lack of protection is spelled out very clearly. ""fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen.""
The police work to stop crime when tey can, and investigate the crimes that they can't. Seeing there is some # of police in America between 500,000 and 1,000,000, (let's say a million to be easy) and lets assume that 1/3 of them are on duty any given time (3 shifts). Currently, the us population is 301 MILLION. 301,000,000/333,000 = ~904:1
1 police officer for every 900 people. Now, this number is actually lower, since some police officers are administrative, some are probate officers, etc.. Do you think 1 police officer can protect 900 people? I don't. Even if he could, would he be in the right place at the right time? Maybe caught in traffic or pulling someone over for speeding.
I will NOT rely on anyone to protect me or my family. Just as I won't rely on anyone to provide for me in a state of emergency. People need to take responsibility for their own future and that of their family. People need to prepare for the unexpected and plan for things that they hope never happen. You may think this is fear mongering, I call it wisdom.
You can continue to rely on others to protect you, but don't be surprised or upset when you are staring in the face of some danger, and there is no one there.......but you. :thumb:
Of course frankie went anti gun, hes a liberal, whadaya expect :flipoff: :flipoff: :flipoff:, you should be alright. hell im stockpiling high cap clips now for all glock models. cause if teh new pres pulls a bill clinton, i can make some serious $$$$$, if not i make a slight profit. either way its still money :icon_twisted:
yama,
Not a bad idea for sure, but your plan hinges on Obama re-enacting the Clinton Ban. Chances are, if Obama has his way, his ban will be MUCH more strict than the Klinton ban, and could ban your clips altogether.
Rock on! :2guns:
Quote from: laserred97gt on November 07, 2008, 11:34:23 PM
yama,
Not a bad idea for sure, but your plan hinges on Obama re-enacting the Clinton Ban. Chances are, if Obama has his way, his ban will be MUCH more strict than the Klinton ban, and could ban your clips altogether.
Rock on! :2guns:
maybe so, but meh. id better keep quiet n details :thumb:
8)
prob is those would be impossible to locate, there are dates and other data on them , but nothing saying where they are :thumb:
Motorcycles are dangerous we should ban those too, of wait interesting concept that's actually easier to do you know why, driving is a priveledge not a right gauranteed by the constitution.
i guess i just don't understand why people would want such powerful weapons. of course having served in the military i used weapons so much i became sick of carrying, shooting and cleaning them. so i may be biased when it comes to them. i do believe that the vast majority of the owners are not properly trained. but to me many cops are not properly trained. that would come back to my time in the military lol. if you don't want them for hunting then why do you want one? because you are allowed to is not a reason. for protection? protection from what? that goes to my fear thing. i have seen civilians and others firing on the range or in fields. their lack of skill and knowledge of the weapon is outstanding. many have no idea what to do in a misfire situation, proper firing stance, maintenance and cleaning of the weapon. if you wanted a fire arm to be a collector then you don't need to get a functional weapon. but guys i am beginning to lean to the right a bit. it would sure be fun to have a fully functioning Uzi and then i would build a silencer for it. ok frank why? well some of the reasons you guys do. in case the state, country or planet goes to hell in a hand basket. to have something to make it through day one of the fall of society. yup that does not sound like me but i have been thinking that way, privately, for a bit. the first person i would kill in that situation is my brothers 300lb gf...lol joking.
if you do get a weapon i recommend you learn it inside and out. to be able to strip and assemble it with ease. to be able to fire accurately, reload and pass stoppages with ease. as well as the proper cleaning and storage of the weapon. to do this would take weeks of training and hundreds of rounds down range. my list of post apocalyptic weapons would be...
Assault Rifles
Personal rifle
personal pistol
auto pistol
revolver
shot gun
semi auto rifle
auto rifle
machine gun
sub machine gun
bolt action rifle
long range rifle
high calibre rifle
IMPORTANT - Ammunition
try and keep your ammo the same, 22 LR, .223, 7.62, 9mm, 12 gauge
UZI 9mm with 90 mag and home silencer
12g auto shot gun
22 cal nylon long rifle
50 cal sniper weapon
7.62 assault rifle
.223 assault rifle
7.62 pod semi
9mm nylon auto pistol
9mm nylon fully auto pistol
personal
cammo dress (unless trying to fit into society)
kevlar vest and lid
eye protection
boot knife
bayonette
utility knife
nylon restraints
piano wire
Check out KAC's new 6mm PDW. That's a nasty lil Buddha Loves You. Though the SR25 in 7.62 really tugs at my heartstrings.
Quote from: frankieG on November 10, 2008, 08:58:15 AM
i guess i just don't understand why people would want such powerful weapons. of course having served in the military i used weapons so much i became sick of carrying, shooting and cleaning them.
::snip::
Now you're talking Frankie.
They are for the "what if" situation.
You have fire extinguishers for fires, toothbrushes to prevent tooth decay, etc..
I like to shoot, and I enjoy the time at the range that I spend with my friends, and I enjoy learning new things, building my own parts, and tinkering & cleaning my guns.
If problems do arise and people get out of control, then I know what to do and where to go. I'm glad that you are thinking about self preservation, and I hope that you train and learn the things that you find important to survive. That's what it's all about.
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c99/laserred97gt/DSC01116-1.jpg)
god forbid frankie, that this world should ever come to this
I intend to keep it short and simple in my ammo categories, we have his and hers .45acp's, I ahve been informed that I don't get to build the little 10.5" NFA SBR tactical carbine I wanted to use the new lower receiver for, the wife wants a ri9fle now so I need to pick up another lower for my project that will mean along with the current M4 I have she will have her own 16" M4 in .223 then I get to build a shorty. We are also picking up the best all round utitlity rifle a man could ever need a 10/22, it's for my son for christmas.
I will have 3 calibers to deal with .22lr cheap and plentiful ammo, .45acp not cheap but plentiful and common plus I am reloading now so cost is decreased. and the good ole .223 which is effective for multiple roles including medium sized game getting with the proper loads. And I am reloading for it as well.
well i supose if things do go to hell in a hand basket it will be easier for me to train u plugs if you alread have a bit of knowlege. but most of u i will use as fodder :2guns: :thumb:
Quote from: frankieG on November 15, 2008, 09:40:34 AM
well i supose if things do go to hell in a hand basket it will be easier for me to train u plugs if you alread have a bit of knowlege. but most of u i will use as fodder :2guns: :thumb:
naaah, ill smack you upside the head, with a harley :flipoff: :laugh:
i don't think so. i would prolly get jumped up to general right away and those with military experience will also get battlefield promotions. those without will fill in the ranks. that is just the way it is. you can't expect to lead if you don't have the experience. of course you could go at it alone but you would not last a week.
As said In a previous thread. Im taking over the Walmart. Whos with me?!?!?! :laugh:
We'll just have to man proof it. May not be as effective as it was against zombies. Claymores and (frag/can) traps come to mind. Preset L.O.D.'s to herd the dummies into killzones. Should suffice for a bit. But I dont see that ever happening. maybe...lol...
ZOMBIESSSSSSSSSSSSSSs I HATE ZOMBIESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
what kind of decoy is LOD? i don't think sitting in the middle of a city or a high value target like walmart is a good idea. find or build a nondescript bunker off in the woods or out of the way. then go in with a section at a time with different tasks. 1. zombie killers 2. zombie recce patrols 3. survivor patrols 4. patrols searching for food 5. searching for supplies just to name a few that come to mind.
Quote from: frankieG on November 16, 2008, 04:22:29 AM
what kind of decoy is LOD?
With all that Military Experince and you dont know what an L.O.D. is ?!?!?!?!?! WTF
Give you a hint....wait no, I wont. Forget it. :dunno_white:
well there are tonnes of acronyms for lod
legion of doom
line of duty
letter of destruction
length of day
level of detection
leader on duty
letter of detection
just to name a few.
Judging by the context of my post, it would be something that subconciously herds hostiles into your desired direction. Its preached to Infantry. Thats as far as Im going with the hints mr.seal.
meh so i forgot or it is not a acronym that is commonly used...which could be either. oooh you got one on me ahhhhhh pft whatever lol
Quote from: frankieG on November 16, 2008, 05:21:41 AM
meh so i forgot or it is not a acronym that is commonly used...which could be either. oooh you got one on me ahhhhhh pft whatever lol
line of departure is commonly referred to as a ESA , if you are speaking of line of dep then it i something in a text that is not commonly known. whose who served would know that.
Line of drift. Line of drift. Used in Setting ambushes. The natural path that the human eye follows and subcontiously guides you to do like wise. Most common example, a sidewalk. A Dirt path in a field. A ridgline. The path of least resistance. The most dangerous one you can take in a hostile setting.
enfilade (SP) is what the navy term is. so there u picked out a term from a book...you are ready to lead and become a soldier. pass basic and all wpn training, straight to the front for you.
Quote from: frankieG on November 16, 2008, 04:22:29 AM
ZOMBIESSSSSSSSSSSSSSs I HATE ZOMBIESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
what kind of decoy is LOD? i don't think sitting in the middle of a city or a high value target like walmart is a good idea. find or build a nondescript bunker off in the woods or out of the way. then go in with a section at a time with different tasks. 1. zombie killers 2. zombie recce patrols 3. survivor patrols 4. patrols searching for food 5. searching for supplies just to name a few that come to mind.
zactly walmart is a HUGE f%$king box with multiple inlets, and outlets, not the best place for a "stand-off"
agaisnt zombies? It would be more than adequate. :) Gimmie a layout and id make you shaZam! yourself with what you could do with Whats already in the walmart. :flipoff:
Quote from: shiznizbiz on November 16, 2008, 11:36:35 PM
agaisnt zombies? It would be more than adequate. :) Gimmie a layout and id make you oh my goodness yourself with what you could do with Whats already in the walmart. :flipoff:
well yeah i forgot about teh ammo, the food, and if need be, the fork lifts. OH and beer too :laugh:
that is why terry, myself and the others will be in command. we know what, where and whom to do.
Quote from: frankieG on November 17, 2008, 02:39:31 AM
that is why terry, myself and the others will be in command. we know what, where and whom to do.
be in command of what. not all have ageed to serve under you. if they know nothing of your service. or his or anyone elses. they would not be obligated to serve under you or follow your orders. take that into account. and they might just succeeed. as you might, they might fail, as you might
ya ok...guys that don't come into the fold will be likely be killed because they don't have the knowledge or skill to provide a effective defence or resistances. all prior resistance groups have relied heavily on officers and nco's from professional military services as well as financing.
Quote from: frankieG on November 18, 2008, 12:34:33 PM
ya ok...guys that don't come into the fold will be likely be killed because they don't have the knowledge or skill to provide a effective defence or resistances. all prior resistance groups have relied heavily on officers and nco's from professional military services as well as financing.
lol ya ok. arrogance serves us well. ( notice i did NOT call you arrogant nor anyone else )and were arguing over a zombie attack ;) :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:, and youve no idea wht training that one would have either. not many would, nor would you know what skillset they have etc etc etc. now lets argue about what kinda zombies wed be killing, and what firepower would be needed :flipoff: :flipoff: :laugh: :laugh: :cheers: ( this is fun lol)
ahhhh zombiessssssssss lol
now would rapid fire be necessary? or a large caliber rifle? or a flame thrower? or an incendiary round?, if it were me, and i were "holed" up in a bunker of sorts, id have a cvlay blocking the entrance, and a LARGE cal machine gun set up, as well as plenty of ammo, and a shovel. and MANY mre's. the shovel being, well eventually, ill have to shaZam! :laugh:
mk19's on the roof....yummy. Trip flares set at 400m's as a peliminary warning system. Then any other sort of anti personel defense system you can think of out to about 200m's. And construct long narrow halls to funnel them in to certain areas where they will meet thier impending doom from an emplaced ma duece staring down the hallway to protect her children. Then various rifles for roof top work, and whatever your good with for cqc. Shotguns, carbines, pistols and what not. Oh and dont forget a heavily greased wall of some sort around the walmart. We may need to take over a local home depot or lumber yard for supplies when contruction advances are needed. Adn we could always resupply the walmart with food from other locally owned grocerystores that werent put out of business by the mega corperation.
That should pretty well cover any attempts by a mass horde of zombies to take grey matter away from the rightful owners.
with proper night discipline you should have enough night vision not to need a flares. you don't want to attract unnecessary attention to yourself or your position. as much as you want to bunker up you can't win a siege war. i would suggest a hidden bunker to live in and kept secret. at night when zombies are most active you could use a firing position that is away from your real site. zombies are not that smart. hit and run would be best. keep your base hidden and away from the real fight.
Ummm, yeah, zombies, not intelligent enemies. They would not have any means of defeatign a properly plannd defense system. And what if they "found" the hidden bunker because they smelled brains? Then with out proper defenses there, youd be screwed. SO why not centralize with outpost near and inbetween resupply points? Walmart, Large parkign lots. Then clear cut away anythign thing with in 300m's. A big kill zone leaves them no chance to sneak up.
Oh and the trip flares at 400m's are for warnings of any movement in the distance. give us a chance to pick em off before they come truckign through our minefields. One bullet is easier to replace than a mine. :cheers:
first thing, raid walmart or your favourite gun shop, get weps, THEN go to ammo factory, , and siege there. PLENTY of reloads, also dont forget to hit teh ~key and type in God mode :icon_twisted:. nowaitaminute, this was real? damn, tehn no god mode on then
NO GOD MODE?!?! Oh noes nizzle!! Were fubar'd :o
Quote from: shiznizbiz on November 24, 2008, 03:16:07 AM
NO GOD MODE?!?! Oh noes nizzle!! Were fubar'd :o
nope lol :laugh: :laugh:
You do realize Wal-mart is getting out of the firearms business right? Only 2 of them in my area now carry guns at all, and the others are stocking less and less ammo.
I would pick a bass pro shops to hole up in personally. Guns and Ammo, and pre pack camping food, nothing on the shelves to spoil and become disgusting when infrastructure fails and the power goes out.
hey, BP makes a valid point. they just built a new, huge bass pros shop not to far from here. there are also a few gander mtns in my area. :thumb:
OR raid a mil surplus store lol, get the weps, then take over ammo factory witha govt contract. err which has one. and use their ammo, and if power is stillactive, can make more if needed O0i wonder how the zombies would deal with fire?
Bass Pros or a Cabelas would be a decent choice. Those Cabelas stores are gigantic
I just thought abou that as you said it bikejunkie. Im with you. Well keep walmart as a re-supply point though. lol. An outpost if you will. But f%$k yeah, the Bass pro shop around hre is stocked with weapons up to my eyeballs. Yippee. Lets do it. muah ah ahaha :2guns: :thumb:
:icon_twisted: im in like flynn