You guys are always good for some random bits of advice. Well here's something random for ya. I was able to purchase a 16-piece Calphalon One Infused Anodized (http://calphalon.com/calphalon/consumer/products/subProductLine.jhtml?catId=CLCat100145) cookware set this past week for a very good price. Cooking, in general, is not something I'm totally passionate about or even interested in, but I figured you buy a nice set like this and you're set for life. It felt like one of those things that are just a decent investment considering how many Ikea pots and pans I've gone through.
Now I'm thinking a real nice set of kitchen knives would be nice too. Again, it's not something I'm passionate about. Just something I think would be a good investment and I'm willing to spend decent money on them. So I've narrowed it down to a block set of Wusthof Classic Ikons (http://www.wusthof.com/en/classic-ikon-knife-block-sets.asp) or a set of Shun Classics (http://www.kershawknives.com/searchresults.php?search_by=category&search_value=22&brand=shun). I've tried both and they both feel very good in my hands. Thoughts? Any others you can advise on?
Wusthof and Kai both make great knives...Wusthof knives have a very heavy, full feel and you can really beat on them. Kai knives are about the same, but they look and feel a little cheap to me.
Some things to look for with knives:
First, if you're trying to go with high end stuff, go for Japan. When it comes to cutting tools, the Japanese do it like no other. Germany is second...a distant second when compared per dollar, but a close second when it comes to worldwide standards. The only thing you'll find that will surpass Japanese steel is ceramics...and I just don't know anything about them except they're wicked badass.
NEVER NEVER get a knife with a hollow plastic handle. If it has a plastic handle, make sure it's solid nylon. All my Kai knives have a solid nylon handle and hold an unbelievable edge, but the blades do feel thin and cheap (despite the latter being anything but true). Wooden handles are great but make sure it's hickory or oak. Generally, I say to avoid wood but there's something cool about an old school set of chicago cutlery or a nice Rikaki cleaver (bamboo). The best knives are full body (solid steel from one end to the other), so look for those.
Never go with ornate styles unless you just want something to look at. Complicated ornamental designs collect grit and rust (even stainless steel). They're hard to clean and if you use them regularly they will appear to age very quickly.
Never be afraid to ask the salesman to let you play with the knives. I don't care if it's a $5 Wal-Mart pearing knife or a $1100 San Mai cleaver...if you can't touch it, go somewhere else. You have to keep in mind that a knife will only be used in your hand, so a comfortable build and balance is crucial. Some people have big hands and Kai's have smaller handles...on the other hand (pun) brands like Fusionwood have awkward handles to me.
If I were to buy a set and money was no object...which is always is...I would be buying from Phoenix or I would buy San Mai. I do have to say, though, that Calphalon's Katana series looks WICKED COOL and the blades feel very nice. No experience actually using them, but when I was playing with them at Bed, Bath, and Beyond I was extremely impressed.
http://www.calphalon.com/calphalon/consumer/katana/thecollection.jhtml
Oh and I will say that the Wusthof set you linked to comes with the BEST sharpener you can get without spending some serious cash.
Which brings me to something else...never buy a serrated knife.
:confused: :confused:
How about these
http://www.ontarioknife.com/oldhickory.html (http://www.ontarioknife.com/oldhickory.html)
and These
http://www.lodgemfg.com/Logic-skillets.asp (http://www.lodgemfg.com/Logic-skillets.asp)
Food Tastes Just as Good or better in these. ;) Make good Weapons too.Not to mention it takes Practice to Cook in Cast Iron,You get your daily dose of Iron in your Diet from both the Skillets and Knives and they'll last for Centuries instead of Just a Lifetime.
If you want a Real Challenge get you one of these too
http://www.lehmans.com/sdx/H21489.jsp (http://www.lehmans.com/sdx/H21489.jsp) :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: They do come in Handy during Power Outages. :D
cutco. that's it. I have a set, and they are the best and sharpest knives i've ever used. full tang (blade goes all the way through the handle), nickel rivets, the handle is a great shape that doesn't slip and it's made out of this resin material that doesn't heat up, and they will sharpen the knives free for life and replace them if they break. i've cut tree limbs down with them, tin cans in half, still sharp. good stuff there.
If you are not 100% into catering I would think twice about buying a set in a block, sure they look nice in the kitchen but you will probably end up using two knives out of the five or six in a typical set.
There is no doubt that a block is a good way to keep knives, much better than in a kitchen drawer so I would seriously consider buying them as seperate items, or if you are good with wood make up something yourself, simply an elevated wooden shelf with slots, like a pipe-rack that you may have made in woodwork classes at school. That way you can taylor it to your individual requirements. I have a keen interest in all things gastronomic and had an interest in a catering business in times past, I have a great many knives but I find that I tend to use three, maybe four at most. A small pointed paring/boning knife, a "French-cook" knife with about an eight inch blade that is pretty rigid and a G.P. knife with about a four to five inch blade. These cover most applications I could ever want. Adding a small cleaver and possibly and second GP would just about cover everything. The two that I use the most I bought individually as I did my sharpening steel and I recomend that route.
Whichever way you go avoid serrated blades except for possibly a breadknife and don't go for a stainless thin bladed "stays sharp for nine million year gauranteed" set, they are usually rubbish.
If you need to get a really sharp edge consider non-stainless steel, they will give you the best cutting edge but need a lot more looking after, for most normal kitchen jobs stainless is fine. I do have one non-stainless that i bought in France where the kitchen is a religion, many years ago and it still comes out now and again.
If you keep "overflow" knives from your rack or block in a drawer consider making simple cardboard sleeves for them. If you really get into this at some point you may consider things like butter knives and cheese knives but they don't need an edge so you can chuck them in the drawer with the lemon squeezers, garlic presses and other crap you probably won't use. Bon appetite.
ps Get one of them big two-pronged forks if you are going to be carving.
Quote from: makenzie71 on January 13, 2009, 06:00:17 PMWhich brings me to something else...never buy a serrated knife.
Sad that this still needs to be said, but you're right to make this very important point.
I have an 8 inch Wusthof chef's knife that is all I need for 80% of my kitchen work. It's supplemented by a full set of kitchen knives marketed under the Cuisinart brand.
Even though the Cuisinarts are very high quality (high carbon stainless-steel, full tang, through riveted, solid nylon handles and two are of the santoku bōchō style), they don't hold a candle to the Wusthof. That thing is simply a serious, no-compromise tool that just exudes quality.
That being said, I also have heard that the Japanese make world-class kitchen cutlery. Honestly, you can't go far wrong getting anything Wusthof, Henkels or the top end Japanese steel.
If you can find them, I can't remember the brand but costco had a set of very very nice kitchen full tang damascus (sp) knives for a really good price. It was around $250 and they were really incredible knives. As stated above, cutco will do the job, but you're into the serrated thing again. Costco always has the wusthof classic set there for around 350 or so and its a really nice set also.
We use a magnetic mounted knife holder at home. It mounts to the wall with a couple of magnetic strips and you just stick your knives to it. Keeps em nice and tidy up against the wall. You can also tailor your set to what you actually need. Like said before i only use possibly 3 different knives. I would advise against getting anything thats not a solid handle. The sandwich style handle with the blade running through the centre will crack and break if you drop it. Crap seeps into the gaps.
As mac said, the best knives are full stainless in one piece. Easy to clean, difficult to break. High quility japanese and often they come with lifetime gurantees or free knife sharpening etc.
Why not serrated. My favorites (and I am no knife nut by a long shot) are all the lightly serrated ones, the huge serrated ones I feel are not good, they chew up stuff bad.
I like my 20 year old 20 buck Ginsu set, which you cannot buy any more. The cheap ass ginsu of today is junk.
Of course the damn smaller ones tend to lose their handles. Sharp as ever, but handle comes loose.
Cool.
Buddha.
http://www.warthers.com/kitchen_knives/ (http://www.warthers.com/kitchen_knives/)
These are very high quality but kinda pricey. While you're at it, click on the museum link...Ernest Warther's carvings are unbelievable.
SS...serrated knives don't hold a proper edge and they all "chew" through the material instead of cutting it. You want the cut clean, not sawn, if you're looking for quality to show in your work. The most basic reason why they're not recommended for the "nuts" is because they're not easily sharpened by your average joe, and they never have a proper edge. Serrated knives were intended for lazy people...which isn't meant to sound insulting, but they wanted a product that appealed to those who did not know how, or just didn't want, to use a sharpener. That's why they're all made out of stainless steel, as well.
A proper knife has a straight, honed edge, and is made from a relatively mild steel so that it can be sharpened to a proper cutting edge easily and quickly.
wusthof, or ja henckels ive got both in mine. and teh calphalon cookware as well. the kitchen is my xanax. i have a bad day i go there and cook. and eat well. one day after my other plans materialise, i want ot open a restaurant somewhere. ( but not in east tn. err inthe clinton area. my prices would scare people off)
Mak: The serrated ones I like are mildly serrated. I can cut very nice straight cuts with them. There is these french bread things that are rock hard on the crust and very soft inside. I can cut it prefectly with serrated, like a bread knife but its not. The old ginsu I used on it is lightly serrated and cannot be sharpened. In fact I dont care about sharpening them. I rather not.
I am no connoiseur though for sure.
Cool.
Buddha.
That's the thing...there's different things for different people. It's like asking why buy an MV Augusta F4 1000 Senna when a 1992 Suzuki GS500 can do everything you need?
I love Wusthof's Classic Ikon line. They took everything that was great about the Classic series and fixed the 2 or 3 niggling little problems. It's a great knife and really the highest evolution of the German-style knives, imo. That said, do you really need the whole block? I have the 8" chef's knife and the paring knife and that's all I've ever needed.
Japanese are good too, but I personally don't like the santouku style.
I like my Ikea setand love the magnetic wall holder!
I'm like an Ikea ho or something. My dining room table, coffe table, end tables, entertainment console, bed spread, tupper wear and awesome helmet rack! Great quality can't beat the price!
Mary
ikea had a bitchin computer desk a few years ago, i cant remember what is called, but if i see it again, im gonna grab one. but alas, no ikeas around here
yeah, they built an Ikea here in Orlando around last Christmas. They are having a 60% off sale so I'm thinking about stopping by after the GI appointment. gotta pick up some bulbs for the lamps. Who sells a lamp without a bulb and turns out can only get it there! Gives me a chance to get me some Swedish Meatballs for a buck! Will probably aggravate the Chrohn's disease but dang you gotta enjoy life too!
Mary
i have eaten those and want more lol, ill have to figure out how to make them :icon_twisted:
I use Cutco mostly and have an old Chicago Cutlery Cleaver that I enjoy very much.