But when it comes to modding a bike (aside from unbolting an exhaust pipe and bolting on a new one), I am quite the newb.
I've been reading up on quite a few things and taking mental notes of what I'm going to do once I get my gs back in a few months (sold to a friend so he could learn to ride, now i want it back).
Picked up a 05 Kat 750 rear shock last night on ebay. Was planning on putting progressive springs in the front. However, I saw a quite a few threads/posts about swapping the whole front end for a Kat front end.
What exactly is the benefit of swapping the whole front end? How does it compare to just putting prog. springs in front? Thanks!
well the main difference between the forks on the two of these bikes if i am right is that one has adjustable rebound and the other has adjustable preload (preload-gs, rebound-kat)
secondly the kat forks take a slightly smaller disc by a difference of 10mm but at that with the kat front end you can put a twin disc on the front end.
Not quite. Forks on the kat are 41 mm GS is 37. Kat comes with the 2 disks standard GS with 1. The 1 brake will push the leg its fitted to back under braking, that causes weird wear on that leg and causes it to lose the seal often. The kat tends to push both back and as such doesn't twist into a weird shape.
All the rest as he said, Kat forks also have a drain bolt on the bottom as well as a machined end fitting and damping rod making it an easy unbolt item. No need to hold from top like the GS. It cant spin. The 89-95 kat is that way. Not sure of the later.
However ist not a straight on fit. There is some machining and welding or spacering and foregoing ... needed.
Cool.
Buddha.
So if I understand this correctly, the Katana front end takes less 'abuse' while braking, and is easier to do maintenance on?
Good to know, thanks!
I think for the moment I'll go with some new progressive springs and later take a look into swapping the front end.
Its also less prone to rusting cos they are better quality, stiffer and longer lasting brakes, they cool better and take in less heat. There is 4 pads that have dual opposed pistons (8 total) instead of 1 pair of non opposed pistons in the GS. Somehting like 8 times less wear on brakes I would imagine.
Cool.
Buddha.
Hi Merritt,
Your idea is a good one -- just go with Progressive springs and new fluid and you'll be fine.
Buddha, as much as I love him, always tells everyone to replace their GS500's front end with a Katana front end because it is stiffer, better, nicer, more fun, shinier, cooler and has better features. That's all perhaps true.
But is it really NEEDED on a GS500 twin for the average rider who wants to ride their bike and enjoy it?
The answer is simply, "no."
It's not needed.
And besides, to do the switch one needs to have very good mechanical skills, access to a good machinist who can make the spacers and do the shop work needed in switching over the triple clamps to the steering stem, etc.
Yes, it probably is a good upgrade.
But most of us don't need it.
Will your bike be better if you do it?
Maybe, but depending on one's riding skill level, many riders will likely either not be able to take advantage of or perhaps even notice the extra front end stiffness, improved braking, etc. The "twisting front end," "weird wear on the brake side fork leg," and "causes it to lose that seal often" -- I haven't seen those issue in all the years I've been riding my bike. Besides, I think my GS500's braking ability is great -- especially since I long ago installed Progressive fork springs and EBC high-quality brake pades front and rear, as well as Russell stainless steel brake lines. And I haven't even installed my custom-made billet fork brace, which should make the already perfectly acceptable front end even stiffer.
All much easier and cheaper mods than swapping a front end.
Everyone's got an opinion, and this is mine.
I've been riding for 34 years and have owned my GS500 for 16 years. It works just fine.
Enjoy and have fun,
Best wishes,
Trwhouse :)
If you haven't made any mods to your GS 500 yet, the first and best place to look is the seat. Look to upgrade there first, IMHO. www.knoplace.com
Trwhouse, are you another middle-ager who has a blast on the "mediocre" GS 500 and thinks it's pretty much fine as-is? :thumb:
/\
Here's another one!
I agree with trwhouse, and would also say that the increased unsprung weight in the Kat conversion would be to the detriment of the handling in bumpy corners. Everything is a compromise, and for me the GS is a good balance of lots of factors. If you want to seriously race one (why?), the Kat forks might be good, but for general road riding not worth the expense and time. You'd be better off saving GS upgrade money and buying a bigger better bike later.
"better" is there such a thing as a better bike then a gs500????????
Good question!
Back in '84 when I had a GS450, my girlfriend went to Italy and came back a few months later with a Moto Guzzi 850 LeMans. It sure was great to see them both! That was an awesome bike, and my GS spent some time in the garage around then.......
As for 'bigger and better', I've got an 08 Suzuki Boulevard M50 right now. Once that's paid off (in a couple years) I'll be picking up a GSXR 750 or 1k (and keeping the M50). I'm getting my gs back from a friend I sold it to. Going to use it as a small money pit. Sure, it will never be as fast as my other bikes, but if I can dump a little money in it here and there, I'm fine with it. The gs was my first bike, and is a hell of a lot of fun to ride. Perhaps one day I'll actually learn to ride on a track and take the gs out.....and if I do, I've got friends with more mechanical skills than I do, and have all the tools to mod whatever I need.
Anyway, thanks guys!
Has anyone that has posted here even ridden a GS with a better front end? :dunno_black:
From what I have seen, the mechanical skills required for the swap may be more than some (if not most) have here, but it is not really that complicated.
If anyone is capable of noticing an increase in unsprung weight, they are advanced enough to know the weaknesses of the GS front end.
Better braking is achieved with the dual 4-piston calipers over the GS single 2-piston caliper. Control and confidence is probably the best gain over all.
I am not saying that the GS has to have a better front end, but it performs better with one.
The best you know is the best you have ridden.
Hi dgyver,
Point well taken but then:
The GS500 is a budget motorcycle, not a superbike from the factory.
And if I put a Ferrari F1 suspension into my 1994 Honda Accord, it too may handle better.
But so what?
It's still a Honda Accord.
You want a non-flexing, hotter-stopping, superbike front end, then buy a superbike already. It can be done, but I think the extra effort may not be worth it. Now you have a hot suspension and brakes, but still have the same 36 horse engine. Overkill to me. And I wouldn't minimize the skills needed to do such a swap. It is NOT a bolt-in by any stretch of the imagination. Many people are just not ready to undertake such a thing. It's not as easy as an oil change, and look how many people strip or break the studs on the oil filter cover. :)
I've certainly ridden BETTER, newer, more advanced motorcycles and can certainly appreciate better, newer, more advanced systems and technologies.
But honestly, this is just a GS500 -- which is not a put down. This is not a rocketship, track-day superbike kind of bike right out of the dealership's showroom. I love my GS500 otherwise I wouldn't have owned it for the last 16 years. It is light, nimble, fast enough, great fun to ride, fine for two-up touring, a comfortable-enough highway cruiser (I took it 2000 miles to Wisconsin and back from my home here in PA and on other long trips), easy to maintain, reliable, pretty to look at, FUN, handles well (the things I did do to it are truly easy -- Progressive fork springs, 15w fork oil, Michelin Macadam tires, Russell stainless steel brake lines, EBC brake pads, Corbin seat, Fiamm dual electric horns), cheap to insure and is plain FUN (did I mention FUN?).
I've owned plenty of faster and better handling bikes in the past -- a 1984 Yamaha RZ350, a 1982 Suzuki GS550MZ, a lovely 1975 Honda CB400F (OK, my GS500 handles better and had more power, but I loved that CB400F). The point it, on the street you can't use up all of any motorcycle's potential. That's for the race track.
And for the street, a GS500, in my opinion, does just fine for most riders.
ANYTHING can be made better. It just doesn't have to be made better.
Sometimes, leaving it alone is just fine most of the time.
That's all.
No bike or car is perfect as it is. But putting too much into something can be overkill and not worth the 1/10th improvement.
I agree with you. Our GS500's are not perfect and could take some new front ends, bigger engines, better swingarms and more to make them better. But they don't absolutely need these fixes. That's all I'm saying.
Will most riders notice those changes? Probably not. Will they require such upgrades on the street? Probably not. That's what I'm trying to point out. Some riders, maybe 1 in 1,000 -- will feel and appreciate the difference. I can't even get my daughter to notice a new noise when she's driving the car. Most riders or drivers don't notice these things, I would argue.
Of course, anyone can do anything they want to do. But he asked about it and folks here are offering their opinions.
Ah, the beauty of this system!
Best wishes, and I hope this fellow does whatever his heart tells him to do.
Yours,
Trwhouse
^^^^ I love what you just said!! :thumb:
At least my question was answered completely.
for me i will be installing a kat FE next winter on my gs. id be doing it now if the wife would let me but i guess i have spent enough money on the gs this year.
ok,so two more questions now....
I was putzing around here on gstwins earlier this week and came across a thread about the chin spoilers. somebody posted a link to some company who was making aftermarket chin spoilers for the gs. for the life of me, i can't find that thread anymore. anybody recall the thread or the website?
in addition- oil coolers. i know the 04+ models have em. mines a 92. can i just simply bolt on a newer oil pan and the cooler or is there more to it?
it was under for sale section but i copyed the web site for you so here you go.
http://www.superbikestore.com/
Quote from: Merritt on March 05, 2009, 02:19:17 PM
ok,so two more questions now....
I was putzing around here on gstwins earlier this week and came across a thread about the chin spoilers. somebody posted a link to some company who was making aftermarket chin spoilers for the gs. for the life of me, i can't find that thread anymore. anybody recall the thread or the website?
in addition- oil coolers. i know the 04+ models have em. mines a 92. can i just simply bolt on a newer oil pan and the cooler or is there more to it?
I don't think the oil cooler hookup for the newer bikes comes from the oil pan, I think they're on the block, but I could be wrong. Why bother anyways? The oil cooler was added because airflow over the engine was decreased by the faring, if you don't have one on your '92, you're not going to have overheating problems...
Quote from: Merritt on March 05, 2009, 02:19:17 PM
ok,so two more questions now....
...
in addition- oil coolers. i know the 04+ models have em. mines a 92. can i just simply bolt on a newer oil pan and the cooler or is there more to it?
Correct. Not bolt on. Besides the different oil pan... 04+ have plumbing cast into the cases, along with a restrictor to split the oil pressure to the motor and the cooler. Sadly it still uses the same oil pump, probably at a reduced volume since it is being divided.
I rode my 1999 GS500e for five years and over 11,000 miles. The only upgrade to the forks was progressive springs and heavier 15w fork oil. I've riden twisties in five different states (including the dragon), and I've used every millimeter of my tires. I can honestly say that the front end on my bike was always more than adequate. I only recognized its deficiencies when I got my new bike. Knowing what I know now about how improved a front end can be, do you know what I would change about my GS if I had it to do again? ...NOTHING. It was great. I had a blast then, and I'm having a blast now.
Do the springs, the fork oil, and upgrade the brake pads and lines if you wish, then go out and ride. :thumb: