Hi there, I'm new to this forum and motorcycling in general. I'm getting my license at the end of the month and this is going to be my first bike. I recently acquired a '89 GS500 for a small amount of money, the only problem is that it doesn't have keys and has been sitting for quite a while. The previous owner claimed it as abandoned and I have a clean clear title, there is a little surface here and there but nothing that can't be cleaned easily. Now on to my questions:
Besides emptying it of all fluids, cleaning the carbs and removing any rust what should I look to replace?
I know the drive chain and the sprockets need to be replaced, where is the best place to get these?
If I remove the ignition will they be able to remake the keys or should I look to remove all the locks on this bike and replace them?
What is the easiest way to remove the ignition, I've removed them on cars before but never on a bike.
Are there any good after market gauges for this bike?
Thanks for any help!
I cannot add too much but I believe that once you put in fresh oil, you should do a compression test and check the valve clearance.
You might contact a good local locksmith and ask if they can make you some keys (be sure to mention you have a clear title, etc.). Pretty standard fare for a good locksmith. As far as the bike, changing the fluids, a valve clearance check, new sprockets/chain, general clean up, have a look at the brake pads/action of the brakes., tires not dry rotted/used up, aired up correctly.....if she starts up and runs it's pretty much get on her and go slow.
Oh yeah if you go to aftermarket gauges, give me a shout if you sell your old ones.
If you go through the bike carefully you'll be way ahead of the learning curve knowing you've got something under you you can trust.
Quote from: commuterdude on June 21, 2009, 05:00:02 PM
Oh yeah if you go to aftermarket gauges, give me a shout if you sell your old ones.
The only reason I'm looking to possibly replace them is that I'm not sure if the speedometer works. It appears to me that the odometer might not, but I'm not sure I don't see anyway of actually reseting the trip meter other then to roll it over to zero. If this is how it actually works well then thats cool. But if I do replace them I'll keep you in mind for sure.
Also how do I perform a clearance check?
yeah you just roll it back over to zero. Good to go. For a valve check Kerry on the site here has a great tutorial on youtube. Definitely get a Clymer's or Haynes shop manual though. Basically you just pull the valve cover and check clearance between the cam and valve shim w/ a feeler gauge.
I think you could replace the ignition without too much trouble, it probably just bolts on from underneith, and plugs in. Aside from that, you're only going to be able to go as far as you have gas for before you run out and have no way to refill.
Anyone have an idea what's the best way to get the gas cap off? or do GS gas caps not have the extra security bolt on the inside? If they do, my only guess would be to drain the tank by the hoses on the bottom, find out exactly where that bolt is placed on the inside of the cap, and drill a hole through the top so you can stick an hex key through the hole in undo the bolt that way. No need to worry about ruining the gas cap if you don't have the key anyway.
The gas cap will not come off without the key. (It took me 3 hours and I had to go through the bottom!) Locksmith is the way to go. Ignition should match the tank. A couple of things not mentioned earlier to check for: Once you get the tank open, Check for erosion and rusting. Also: Fork seals have a tendency to harden and leak after long periods of rest....
I am halfway through a recronstruction on an 89 that sat for 10 years....Any questions feel free to ask!
Ignition switch had breakaway bolts holding it on. You will ahve to drill or cut their heads out.
Cool.
Buddha.
Yeah I discovered the ignition bolts didn't have heads after I took the headlamp apart, just like in a cars steering lock mechanism. I took a long look at the bike yesterday and for what I've read and could ascertain without a key:
The engines not seized.
The transmission shifts through all the gears and goes into neutral.
The fork will have to have new dust caps at least, if not completely rebuilt (I expected this and since thats the case should I put in progressive springs?)
Almost all of the rubber parts (bushings etc) are almost all perfect nothing cracked or broken except the fork.
It may need a new exhaust, its pretty rusty and when I get around to cleaning it up, it may fall apart.
The sprockets and chain will have to go as one of the first things along with a new battery.
Spark plugs were brown not black so I think that means when it was last run it was running pretty good.
The tires are new looking (even though they're old) and still have a fair amount of tread.
The frame is in phenomenal shape, it needs a tiny bit of surface rust removed but otherwise its good.
Engine mounts are also good.
All in all I think I picked up a steal on craigslist. I was wondering though, could a locksmith come out and take a look at it to determine if they can make keys?
Last thing, are there any riders in Northern Virginia?
Thanks a million!
call the locksmith and find out....they guy here in town can do it....you might need to order/get a couple of key blanks from Suzuki? I bet the locksmith has keyed a couple of old bikes in his day. My guy had it in like two minutes. Name of Smiley O'Brian....great name for a locksmith....actually it's his son, Smiley the Elder passed to the great beyond a few years ago. What would really hold your costs down is if you could get the bike to his locale.
Dennis Kirk sells a pattern ignition lock for the GS, I believe. But that still leaves the gas cap issue....sometimes a flat blade screwdriver applied gently can open those up.....I had to do it on mine once. Key blanks are out there on Ebay.
Any chance of some pictures of your new bike? We always like those.
I've talked to a few locksmiths and they seem to think they can make a key for me. Now the question is wether I want to have them come out to where the bike is being stored, or if I want to rip the ignition out. Right now I'm leaning towards just having them come out and do it.
As for pictures, those are definitely going up later this week when I get back to the bike. While I was looking it over this past weekend I started to clean it up so its shiny right now. Just for teasers sake its in beatuiful 80's colors of teal and white, perfect to stick out like a sore thumb :D
New question!:
Does the seat lock cylinder use the same key as the ignition?? If so can I just "manually" remove the seat and use that lock cylinder to get my keys made?
I can't remember where all that stuff is, if you pull off the side plastics, you might be able to unbolt the seat latch. Otherwise, if you can't get the ignition off, you could atleast pull off the top triple clamp and just take the whole thing with you. That might actually be less work than trying to get the seat latch off.
You know what everybody? I'm a moron. These bolts are snapped off like I thought they were. They're TORX socket bolts. I just looked it up in the Haynes manual and when I really think about what I saw, thats what they are, it's simple to actually remove the ignition. Just unplug and unbolt.
Well hopefully by the end of today, I'll have new keys for my bike.
Today I finally got the ignition out of the bike, what used to be torx bolts where stripped smooth, so what did I have to end up doing? Taking the entire trees apart:
Here is the ignition still attached to the tree:
(http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/2486/dscf0955z.jpg)
And here is one of the stripped torx bolt:
(http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/1451/dscf0958.jpg)
You can drill that torx head and use an extractor (ez out) I had to do mine trying to fix the fork lock. Unfortunately, I will have to get a new ignition just because what I have is no good however, I replaced the bolts with some allen head bolts that will allow me to remove it if necessary. (Yes, I know. Thieves can too but if they really want the bike that badly, they could simply hoist it into the back of a truck and haul off.)
Quote from: cboling on June 24, 2009, 05:05:38 PM
You can drill that torx head and use an extractor (ez out) I had to do mine trying to fix the fork lock. Unfortunately, I will have to get a new ignition just because what I have is no good however, I replaced the bolts with some allen head bolts that will allow me to remove it if necessary. (Yes, I know. Thieves can too but if they really want the bike that badly, they could simply hoist it into the back of a truck and haul off.)
If my ignition is bad (I don't think it is) I'm not going to even bother. I'm just glad I was able to get all this apart without much trouble, now all I have to do is take it to a local locksmith and I hope they can cut me some keys.
I agree with you if thieves want my old bike that bad, well they can have it at that point.
Stripped looking bolts are the anti-theft bolts or they were already replaced ( the pic looks like the anti's,..). Drill the heads off and replace them- easy job not that you have the top triple clamp off....(assuming you are replacing the actual igntion and not just getting a key made)
Not sure if it was answered...but you asked about getting the key cut from the seat lock.... No- have them do it from the ignition.
Have you checked on a price yet? Lots of guys are mobile almost exclusively now ( locksmiths) but it may be cheaper if you can take the bike to them ( or just your gas tank and ignition now that you have it all off...).
You can usually buy a lockset on ebay or even on here.( there's one from an f on ebay now....a little pricey..but not ridiculous.... hey it's a whole set......The F one MIGHT work..( haven't had a newer set in my hands yet...but it will likely be the same as the 89- 00's...).
Good luck...
EDIT : There are two F sets...one is significantly cheaper but does not have the seat lock cylinder ( the original can be made to fit the new igniton/ gas cap key fairly easily tho...)
Quote from: Jared on June 24, 2009, 08:06:07 PM
Stripped looking bolts are the anti-theft bolts or they were already replaced ( the pic looks like the anti's,..). Drill the heads off and replace them- easy job not that you have the top triple clamp off....(assuming you are replacing the actual igntion and not just getting a key made)
Not sure if it was answered...but you asked about getting the key cut from the seat lock.... No- have them do it from the ignition.
Have you checked on a price yet? Lots of guys are mobile almost exclusively now ( locksmiths) but it may be cheaper if you can take the bike to them ( or just your gas tank and ignition now that you have it all off...).
You can usually buy a lockset on ebay or even on here.( there's one from an f on ebay now....a little pricey..but not ridiculous.... hey it's a whole set......The F one MIGHT work..( haven't had a newer set in my hands yet...but it will likely be the same as the 89- 00's...).
Good luck...
EDIT : There are two F sets...one is significantly cheaper but does not have the seat lock cylinder ( the original can be made to fit the new igniton/ gas cap key fairly easily tho...)
Right now I'm looking to just have a key made. The ignition and all the locks for that matter seem to be in good shape, and I don't think I'll have to replace them. Does the gas tank use a different key then the ignition? I was under the impression that it was all the same key.
I'm having my wife (who's a teacher and off for the summer) take it over to the local locksmith, in Va there are still plenty who operate shops, and most have said they can make new keys if I bring them the ignition.
If I do have to remove the ignition I will definitely use an ez-out or grabit to remove the bolts and then replace them.
If the lockset is original it should all match. I'd take the tank too just to make sure it opened it. The reason I said take the tank was mainly if you were going to replace the set -- the locksmith could get it open for you without having to mangle it...
If you have to remove it (ignition )...once you get the head drilled off the bolt and the ignition off the top clamp the bolts will usually come out by hand.
Enjoy...
dude just cut the ignition off get a new set and take the bike to a locksmith. They can pop that lock in no time and you can install the new gas cap and lock. The entire set 2xkeys, ignition switch, gas cap with lock and seat lock is ~145.
You have already done the hard part now take a dremel and separate the ignition switch from the lock bolt, its hard as shaZam! and ate through a couple drill bits of mine. I was replacing it anyway and once i got the head of the bolt off and then the ignition off the bolt i just turned it out with vice grips. Install new with not bolt and reassemble, don't forget about that gas lock to long though or it will bite you :icon_lol: :icon_lol:
I had my wife take the ignition over to the locksmith earlier today. He said that he has blanks that work with the ignition but since I didn't have the entire ignition apart for him to see the numbers on the lock cylinder he didn't know if he could do it or not. She left it there with him so that another guy could look at it who has done work like this before. If this becomes a pain the butt I saw a set on ebay for around $40, I'll just pick that up have all the locks picked so that they all open and then replace them all.
I'm not in a huge hurry at the moment so I'm taking the wait and see approach. Right now its easier if I get a key made that works, but if it deems itself aggravating I will replace everything.
If it helps, I also opened up my gas tank, and it looks like the lock doesn't have a separate inside bolt to lock it on. If you need another keyhole for him to check out, you could probably just unscrew the whole gas cap and take that to him, unless my bike is just weird.
if you ever get to the point when you want to cut it of i have my old ignition as an office decoration here at work so i could take a pic and upload it so you could see how i cut mine off. I hope that the locksmith can help you but i had the OEM keycode and the iginition lock with me and now locksmith within 100 miles could make a key that worked.
i dont know cuz i didnt read everything but if you didnt cut or drll the screws take a 6mm socket and an extension. flip the top clap over and put the socket on now hit it with a hammer. your socket will stick good enough to remove these bolts with no cutting or drilling needed. i just did it on my kat ignition. socket was a craftsman and was replaced for free cuz some how it was deformed when i got it....no chance of trashing your top plate this way. :thumb:
Wowww ... I have to try this dude ...
In fact I dont even care if I have to buy sockets.
Cool.
Buddha.
i swear it will work i had to take the ignition outta my kat no key worked great. when you have nothing but time and no money if you mess it up youll try everything you can befor eyou cut or drill....lmao
the bolt is actually soft enough that it tuns it into a 6mm hex hed when your done.
W00T!! The locksmith came through for me, I now have a key for my GS!! Also two days of MSF down one to go, I love riding bikes!
So a new question: who sells cycle batteries? When I get back to it later this week, I know its gonna need a new one, so where is the best place to get one? which brand?
Quote from: Elbaryn on June 27, 2009, 03:54:47 PM
So a new question: who sells cycle batteries? When I get back to it later this week, I know its gonna need a new one, so where is the best place to get one? which brand?
http://wiki.gstwins.com/index.php?n=Main.Battery
Hers a link yo a scorpion battery that is the new sealed kind. I paid $40 for my regular, so this seems to be a good deal. All the advantages of this battery can be read about @ that site. Might as well get the good stuff if your already going to replace it.
http://www.batterystuff.com/batteries/motorcycle/sYT10L-A2.html
I finally took the bike apart today. A few things I noticed while working on it. The carbs seem to be in fairly good shape no super visible rust (I have yet to take them apart thats thursday).
The battery is fried, I'm sure its been a long time since it been run.
There was a tiny bit of gas in the oil, what could cause this? Just bad carbs? Could me having checked everything over, (petcock movement, choke movement, throttle movement) have caused this gas in the tank? The air box, wasn't full of gas, but then again I haven't run it yet. The oil was fairly new colored just a little bit thinner then normal. I emptied the oil, is there a special way to clean the pan, or what should I do? Should I be worried about this little bit of gas?
I noticed that one of the carbs had a little bit of this gas oil mixture on it, is this another problem?
What else should I check over on thursday that I haven't already covered(I'll be spending all day with it)
I dont remember where i saw it on here but, how can I double check to make sure the engine turns over without shifting?
Thanks for all your help guys you've helped so much
Hey, Just came across this thread. Is that the bike Eric Schaefer was selling (white and blue-ish)? If you don't mind me asking, how low did you get him to go? I could only talk him down to $500. I wouldn't worry much about the gas in the oil, just change it and see how it runs. Without the key I was concerned about how the inside of the gas tank looks, what did you find? Walmart has a battery that will work for under $40. I think it's a YB10L-A2. The only difference is the vent is on the other side so you have to run a new vent tube. A lot cheaper than the stock B2 battery. Good luck with the bike, it looked like a nice project!
-Jessie
Quote from: BaltimoreGS on June 30, 2009, 08:29:20 PM
Hey, Just came across this thread. Is that the bike Eric Schaefer was selling (white and blue-ish)? If you don't mind me asking, how low did you get him to go? I could only talk him down to $500. I wouldn't worry much about the gas in the oil, just change it and see how it runs. Without the key I was concerned about how the inside of the gas tank looks, what did you find? Walmart has a battery that will work for under $40. I think it's a YB10L-A2. The only difference is the vent is on the other side so you have to run a new vent tube. A lot cheaper than the stock B2 battery. Good luck with the bike, it looked like a nice project!
-Jessie
Yeah it actually was his Eric's bike haha. I haven't had a chance to look into the tank just yet the lock is frozen, so tomorrow I'm going to take the petcock off the bottom and drain. All the gas that I've taken out of it from the fuel lines and everything were clear. Whoever had this bike before him took exceptional care of it (other then it having been dropped), and everything under the seat was dusty and that was it. I took a rag to the top of the carbs and engine and everything shined like it came out of the factory.
My only other concern and I forgot to mention this before are the front forks, they have a bit of surface rust on the top of the forks near the headlight, not down in the travel area, should I be concerned about this?
Jessie, I will have full pics up tomorrow as I begin cleaning.
Do you ride around here? I just got my license and after I get this running I'm gonna be looking for people to ride with.
Congratulations, it looked like a nice project bike to me. I'm in Baltimore but I have friends that work in DC and live in VA. They are thinking about getting bikes, that's how I knew of that one. I'll let you know if they get bikes or hit me up if you get near my area. The rust on the forks is common and not a huge concern if its not in the travel area. Try using a little automatic transmission fluid (I use Dexron III) on a light scotch brite pad and the forks should polish up nicely. Enjoy your new old ride!
-Jessie
Well finally got the lock out of the gas tank and got my first god look into it....its rusty as all hell, looks to still be structually good just has deposits at the bottom and light rust at the top. I'm not sure what to do now, I bought a battery and am currently charging it to see if the electricals work.
Now I ask the community at large, should I get the tank reconditioned? (rust removed, por15)
Find a new gas tank? (no junkyards near me)
Kill the whole project now and find a bike that runs?
Thank you all for your help!
Hmm.... tank rust is pretty common around here. I'm actually cleaning mine out and resealing it this weekend, as well as buying a new battery to see if my bike runs after it sat 4 or 5 years.
There's a ton of opinions as far as methods to clean tanks out. I did it once on my old tank and it worked pretty well. I'm just cleaning it out with simple green, then removing the rust with some phosphoric acid from home depot, then I bought the 8oz can of por-15 for about $12 to reseal it. If it hasn't run since the gas was collected everything else is probably fine, but you might want to check the fuel lines/petcock/carbs to make sure there's no rust floating around in the system, but since the bikes been sitting, they're probably fine.
As far as the bolts to reconnect your ignition, I wouldn't worry about them. Stick some normal hex bolts in there. No one that replaces an ignition to steal a bike is going to take the time to unbolt your ignition, and nicely bolt a new ignition in there. They'll just unplug your ignition, plug their in, and tape/zip tie it to the frame, and replace it later. You're not deterring them by using anything else. On top of that, if I'm gonna go out and steal a bike, it's most likely gonna be a $9000 gsxr, not a $1000 bike that's 15 years old like most of us have.
I'll probably look to reseal the gas tank then sometime in the near future (read when I get paid next). The electricals all work, I hooked the battery up, turned the key and woop everything lights up like a christmas tree, very happy about that.
I do have a more pressing concern at the moment though, I shined a light into the cylinder heads from the spark plug whole and nothings shiny anymore, it looks all rusty.
How much of a PITA is it to rebuild this engine (done cars before never bike)?
Is it worth it? while this bike ever run well again, even after hone the cylinders and whatever else needs to be done?
Again thank you all for the advice!
rebuilding these motors are terrific.. aside from weaseling it in and out of the frame (2 men with gloves and patience, or beer)
yank the motor in the late fall, set up a table in your bedroom and start pulling bolts out until you get at the soft internals. when your gf or mom complains about the oily smell in your bedroom, kick them out and get them to buy you parts from suzuki..
just be wary that suzuki can screw you on parts by shipping them to outer space and back before they get to your local dealer. last winter i had to order parts from an online supplier because suzuki took 2 months to get me the last bearing halfi needed for the crank. the online supplier shipped me the exact suzuki part (in the exact suzuki box) in less than a week, for the same price suzuki wanted.
Quote from: Dr.Sparkie on July 02, 2009, 11:32:44 PM
rebuilding these motors are terrific.. aside from weaseling it in and out of the frame (2 men with gloves and patience, or beer)
yank the motor in the late fall, set up a table in your bedroom and start pulling bolts out until you get at the soft internals. when your gf or mom complains about the oily smell in your bedroom, kick them out and get them to buy you parts from suzuki..
just be wary that suzuki can screw you on parts by shipping them to outer space and back before they get to your local dealer. last winter i had to order parts from an online supplier because suzuki took 2 months to get me the last bearing halfi needed for the crank. the online supplier shipped me the exact suzuki part (in the exact suzuki box) in less than a week, for the same price suzuki wanted.
Haha I wish, if I brought that motor into my apartment I think my wife would slit my throat. I've decided to start the rebuild, what should I look to replace, or is that a matter of what I find inside the engine when I start stripping it?
Happy fourth all!
Spent some time with the bike today, took the ride side cover off and spun the engine by hand, smooth movement no roughness at all. Also took the breather cover off and everything looks fine there.
The Bike all apart:
(http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/1451/dscf1012x.jpg)
The gas tank, got the lock and the top off, going to put on a new keyless gas cap later this month:
(http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/5043/dscf1016.jpg)
The side covers, they still look new except for the drop scratches:
(http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/8571/dscf1018o.jpg)
(http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/2613/dscf1020m.jpg)
Bike all back together:
(http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/9798/dscf1026.jpg)
that's a very clean '89. Shouldn't be too hard to get her back on the road now.
Cool Beans...looking good, one fenderectomy and you are on your way :cheers:
Quote from: JB848 on July 07, 2009, 01:42:25 PM
Cool Beans...looking good, one fenderectomy and you are on your way :cheers:
This is high on my "to do" list after all the mechanical stuff, and cleaning the frame and other little parts of rust, and replacing the fuel lines....Yea haha I have quite a ways to go, but I'm happy about it. Just gotta wait till payday and then I'll see if she fires up.
Thanks for all the positive comments :cheers:
Sorry I haven't posted much lately My wifes been sick and moneys been thin for finally finishing my bike. Now that everythings under control I can get back to work, and I've run into a wall I hope some of you out there can help me.
The bike won't start, and by that I mean I turn the kill switch to run, pull in the clutch, and hit the ignition switch and nothing happens. I did everything in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHm15O8Yd0E and I'm still getting nothing. The right hand kill switch and starter are good, as is the clutch switch, and just about every other electrical connection on the bike, except for the side stand switch.
I made the home made circuit tester like in the video and I can't get the green wire to the stand switch to light up no matter where in the line I test. What I'm wondering is how do I go about checking that this switch is actually dead and not the relay as well? I checked the orange/ blue orange wire going into the relay and they have power as does the diode for the neutral switch/side stand wire.
Thanks for all your help!
u need a sidestand switch or at least to bypass the switch hardwiring the two leads together
Under the left panel the side stand switch has 2 wires. It can be jumpered short ... or I think they even plug into each other like the clutch one inside the headlight.
BTW neutral switch ? is it in neutral ? make sure it is and it lights that green light.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on January 01, 2010, 05:20:18 PM
Under the left panel the side stand switch has 2 wires. It can be jumpered short ... or I think they even plug into each other like the clutch one inside the headlight.
BTW neutral switch ? is it in neutral ? make sure it is and it lights that green light.
Cool.
Buddha.
Ok I'll try that out soon, I also ordered a new switch since I found one of off ebay for next to nothing. The original switch is pretty gummed up with years of crud so I'm sure thats not helping.
Yeah it's in neutral guess I should say that before :oops:
Neutral switches are thrown away ... not worth the $ of shipping.
But ... yea try it, gumming up may not affect it though.
Cool.
Buddha.
Neutral switches or the side stand switch? I ordered the side stand switch. Where on the transmission is the neutral switch found? I never thought to check the neutral switch actually thanks!
And if it is the neutral switch what should I do?
neutral switch / gear indicating switch , same thing. found under the sprocket cover, our switch only lights up when in neutral, not like a gear indicator. this should not make a difference with starting or running, unless the kickstand is down and the bike is in gear, but that would be the sidestand switch.