So I've been battling gremlins in my 96 gs500 for a few weeks now. I've started to hear the chain rattle i've heard about across multiple boards for gs500's. In an effort to kill 2 birds with 2 big rock, i took my carbs off for cleaning and ect, and also wanted to check my timing chain tensioner and maybe chain.
long story short, I didn't think about what i was doing, and freed the chain tensioner by clicking the starter and having the motor move the cam chain for me...bad idea. Long story short, the tensioner came out, and it seems ok ( i dont know how to check if its failing.) and the bike will no longer turn over. I am assuming by removing that tensioner, that I've either jumped the chain off the cams, or its slacked off the crack and keeping the engine from turning.
I'm taking the carbs in for an ultrasonic cleaning and a good lookover, because after cleaning them myself, they ran richer than they did before. ( I think I didn't check the float height), and I'm taking the valvecover off the bike to hopefully be able to put the chain back on, freely spin the engine, and then check timing.
Any input past how much of a squid I am would be appreciated.
Dont clean or fix your carbs if your motor is dead. That's like putting a brand new paint job on a 73 AMC gremlin with a rod knock.
Now on to your problem.
Yea you may have got the chain off the cams and crank. Though I'll almost bet its somehting else.
Put pics up or something with the valve cover off etc etc.
Cool.
Buddha.
the motor is far from dead, just more out to lunch.
I'll go ahead and post pics when I tear it apart after work. The noise I heard was like a chain on a mountain bike. When I had the bike running and I would ride it around, you could hear the links clicking inside the head. as if it was a chain on a mountain bike.
That and every once in awhile the engine would give a clunk every 4-8 revolutions that I could feel in the triple tree. Although I suspect that has maybe something todo with my clutch, which needs adjustment badly.
Dont ask how, but I have 3 other engines I could possibly scavenge for parts if I need to, including parts for the top end. My GS was not treated well before I got it, so I'm trying to get the best time out of it that I can. I dont have too much money, so a frame-up restore like I want to isn't going to happen for a long time.
Spare set of carbs for me?! :bowdown:
Might not be that bad, lets see some pics. Oh, and you gotta get used to Buddha, he is well,.............................Buddha.
so you dont do this again, the cam chain tensioner is actually rather simple. you pull off the outside cover, that is NOT those two allen bolts that hold it to the block, and youll see a slot for a flathead screw driver. Turning this clockwise (i think, might be counterclockwise just turn it whatever way it turns) by turning this with your flathead you pull in the tensioner, releaving the cam chain can allowing you to now unbolt those allen heads with out pressure pushing the whole unit out. when you put it back in, turn the slot with the screw driver and it will pull the tensioner rod in again and allow you to bolt it up.
Personally i didnt have a problem just taking the unit OFF with out releaving the tension, but to get it back ON i definately had to do the screwdriver thing
3 motors, I would at this point say you've left buddha in the dust. I didn't get 3 gs motors for parts till maybe 3-4 years ago. At which point I was 10 years and 8 GS'es in.
And no GS gets treated well ...
Cool.
Buddha.
I've about taken the cover off. I got side tracked and decided to do an oil change and get new exhaust manifold bolts while I'm at it. My oil is so bad. I changed it last season, maybe rode all of 7 times since i've changed it. Its sludged like no tomorrow. Would it be a wise decision to go ahead and change it with synthetic, due to the fact that it will carry more cleaning agents and try to get rid of the sludge, and go back to rotella? or just stay dino oil all the way?
I'm going straight home after work to try to get this thing back running. I feel confident that I can get the valve cover off tonight, and maybe get the chain back on and check slack on it, but I still need to get some new side cover gaskets.
updates here. Sorry I do not have any pics, I ended up going out of town and didn't have time on sunday.
So, got a stuck valve cover bolt out, and removed the cover. the chain is on both cams, and the worst that has happen up top is maybe the chain has jumped a tooth.
Pulled out the flashlight, and peered down near the crank. It looks like the chain has folded over on itself, down near the crank. When the tensioner was removed, it seems it suddenly created enough slack to bunch the chain up. Not being at home in my garage right now, I really can't double check, but I think I have two options.
Free the chain, or pull the motor and take the top off.
I'm hoping that I can add some WD40 down along the cam chain guides, and hopefully unbunch the chain. I'd really not like to pull the motor.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Can I remove the front chain guide to get enough room and free the chain, or do I need to pull the block apart ? :bowdown: I pray to the GS gods
hopefully by removing the inlet and exhaust cams (do keep the chain tied up to the frame of the bike) you should be lucky enough to get the cam chain back onto its lower cog,then replace cams and reset the timing, good luck :thumb:
that sounds good. otherwise my other fear is that the timing itself is just mused, and I might not be seeing a part of the chain, and I could be smacking into a valve, which I hope is not the issue. I'm going to get my Clymer out, and gently pull the top of the motor apart and see what magic voodoo I can do.
ok, my night went from good, to awesome, to suck.
I took the cams out, zip tied the chain to the crossmember, and got it so that the engine now spins without any obstructions. Note: the right exhaust spring/valve seemed to come out of the head farther than any of the others, idk if that means I broke something or not, but it would ratchet back down when the bearings went back on.
I fixed and checked my timing according to thebeergarage, and just as I was putting the bolts back in, I didn't see how much lb/ft. I was using, and sheared the last bolt on the left exhaust bearing.
I have another bolt, I have a full used bearing set to scavenge bolts from ( but not use, because that would be bad, mkay). Can I use an easy-out to pull that bolt fragment out of the head?
hi mate.
i think your talking about one of the screws that holds down the cam journal caps?
if so there is no reason why why cant use a screw extractor,you should find it very easy to remove as the screw,as it should of been oiled before installing it.
good luck :thumb:
yeah, it was oiled before I reinstalled it. Just a setback that I keep battling.
sooo.. those bolts are massively hardened, any advice for a drillbit to chew through that? I'm going to have to drop the motor for this :woohoo:
try a 3.5mm hss metal bit,dont force down to hard with the drill,let the bit do its work mate.
i cant see any reason why you would have to remove the engine though :dunno_black:
dropped the entire engine out of the bike, drove it 45 minutes to a mechanic friend of mine. not only did I have to get the bolt extracted, but I broke an exhaust valve. So, he's tearing the motor apart completely, and going to redo it from the bottom up. He's also going to check my clutch basket and make sure I dont have any issues with that.
I'm not sure if I'm getting new intake valves, but I'm getting 2 new exhaust valves, and everything is going to be reshimm'd back to factory spec and set up to be a plug and play affair.
ouch!! :icon_eek: sorry to hear that matey
I'll be getting pictures soon, but this motor has had some better days, apparently i bent the other exhaust valve, and it pinched the piston. Luckily, a sweet girl that used to track gs500's sold me a BUNCH of parts for next to nothing. I ran a spare piston set up to my mechanic, and all the gaskets I had.
New exhaust valves, new valve seals, new piston rings, cylinder rehone, new gaskets.
With that and newly ultrasonic cleaned carbs, this should go like rape ape.
Also, won this on ebay for hella cheap, and I'm not sure if I'll use it or not. http://www.factorypro.com/Prod_Pages/prods10.html (http://www.factorypro.com/Prod_Pages/prods10.html) It was kinda an accident, as I still plan on sending my carbs to buddha for some loving.
little update as to my debacle. Well, I'm now the proud owner of a new OEM piston, new rings, 2 new exhaust valves, and am in the process via an awesome friend of getting my engine back together. Hoping to get back out on the road by Sunday, despite rainy Cincinnati weather. Apparently the spare pistons that I've had from another engine are actually oversized, which leaves me options for later.
Had my carbs cleaned ultrasonically because I wanted to do something while I was waiting. Cleanest I've ever seen. Found out that the guy who re-assembled them pinched my diaphram of my left carb, which caused my slide to not retain vac. I found that out when I played around with the factory pro kit I picked up. Replaced all the float bowl screws with socket head caps while I was at it.
I'll give some pics when its done, and a big thumbs up to the awesome help.
Important question. Would a clutch basket from the 2001+ GS500's be compatible with my 96? Someone is parting out a 2007 and they're selling a full clutch basket for less than the price of a replacement kit. 4000 miles on it.
I have the engine fixed, and back in the bike, but I'm having some issues putting the sprocket cover on, so I can pull the clutch in to test start the bike. I'm starting it without the spark plugs, because I want to prime the system with new oil. I've got the electrical hooked up, and go to start it, and the starter relay clicks, but nothing happends. I know my relay works. I think it might be the clutch safety switch, but I'm not 100% sure how to get my sprocket cover on.
any assist?
Sprocket cover shouldn't affect clutch switch or prevent the bike from starting I don't think...
What are you unclear about?
Here's a wiki page (http://wiki.gstwins.com/index.php?n=Maintenance.FrontSproketCoverRemoval)
Clutch safety switch won't even allow a 'click'.
The sprocket cover just goes straight on, no difficulties in my experience.
thank you for the wiki link. i completely forgot we had that thing. :mad:
so the safety switch wouldn't even allow a click eh? hmm.. I know I need to find my adjuster for my clutch lever, but putting that aside theoretically I should be able to start this without having the clutch cable and sprocket cover on it. hmm...
is there a possibility I messed up my electrics putting it back into the bike? I mean would the best way be to take off the starter cover, and use a meter to see if its getting juice?
Well, in a world not ran by electrical engineers, the starter wire can be any color under the rainbow, especially one usually reserved for ground connections ( black) put starter wire on side of relay, starter magically works. now I need to get a carb diaphram for my right carb real quick and I'm on the road!
when I got my carbs cleaned, a service guy used ultrasonics to clean it. worked fantastic, except he pinched the right diaphram. I have one on order from bikebandit, but does somebody know if I could get one next day?