I'm thinking of giving a valve adjustment a try (http://www.gstwin.com/adjust_valves.htm). Does anyone know what parts and special tools are required and how much I'm looking to pay for these? The shop quoted me $200 labour and parts for a valve adjustment.
i got a feeler gauge (down to .03mm) and suzuki valve tool for a total of 20ish bucks. i dont remember the exact price. i think it's worth it. some people just use a screwdriver to hold the bucket down.
Check the wiki. http://wiki.gstwins.com/ Lots of info, here is the page for valve adjustments with ebay links to parts you need...... http://wiki.gstwins.com/index.php?n=Maintenance.CheckValves
As far as i know you dont have to remove the carbs. What about the cover on the right side of the bike?
yeah remove the valve cover and signal generator cover. i think it's a 19mm wrench to rotate the crank.
+1 on the wiki as it's been a while since i did my valve check. (havent been riding much) and i always work on my bike at a shop so i just grab what i need, not really paying attention to the tool xD
After watching the video, it looks like you need a series of shims in order to adjust accordingly. I can see a shop having a large supply of these but I'm wondering where you can purchase a package of them?
Quote from: epoxy.guy on August 13, 2010, 02:26:46 PM
After watching the video, it looks like you need a series of shims in order to adjust accordingly. I can see a shop having a large supply of these but I'm wondering where you can purchase a package of them?
I got to the same conclusion...........so here you are with your bike all taken apart, and down to the camshaft, and you do the measurement, and determine what shim you need............then what do you do? Go online and order, and wait 5 days for shipment? Plus pay shipping and handling? Or overnight it for $50 extra? I have seen on one video that even after measuring, when the new shim was put in it did not measure out correctly, so what then? another order and wait another 5 days??
Maybe find a good bike shop near home that has a selection of shims first, then do the measurements, and then a quick run to the shop, and done.........
A quick internet search shows that one shim is like $12.50..........I think a saw a "refill" kit for like $138 with many sizes..............but now your up close to the dealer cost of $200 for the job.........
$200 every 4000 miles is Bulls--t.............make the bike unafforcable in my opinion! If you had a good selection of shims available and only bought what you need, then a valve adjust would cost from $0 to $50 depending on how many you needed, if you do your own labor..........
Looks like the job takes an hour to two hours, so a shop has to charge at least $150 to $200.........
You gotta do your own work..........
Does this group have a "traveling" shim set? (we do this sometimes in the airplane business, when somebody needs an expensive tool, but will only use it once, we pass it along, maybe for a small fee..........sort of like those tool rental places)
Cookie
learn how to check the clearances. if you follow the video than yes, you would need multiple shims already to make measurements. but, lets say you do the bare minimum. your bucket rotates but your smallest feeler doesnt fit. go one or 2 sizes down. done. rotate the cam a few times to see if you get the same feeler reading each time. then figure it out. the math isnt hard.
onto actually acquiring shims. ASK your local shops or dealers. every time i've done valve adjustment, i pull my shim so i can find out what size it is. then i figure out what size i need. once i've done that, i call my local dealer and ask if they'll exchange for me. i know im lucky in that they will do it if they want the shim im giving in return. i have yet to pay for shims and i've swapped 5 or 6 so far. again, i know im lucky my dealership is cool with exchanges. i can't imagine it's the ONLY ONE that will do it though. so just try asking.
Shims are $7 each.
http://www.crc2onlinecatalog.com/valve_shims.htm
Buy 1 of the smallest ones and you'll never measure wrong cause you'll be able to swap the small one in if you don't have enough clearance.
My dealer swaps with me for free. They even loaned me a few for a couple days so I could measure correctly.
Cool about the dealers helping out.............but it still turns an hour job into an all day job, if you don't have a large selection of different sized shims right there with you.........
Seems like you have to borrow the whole shim kit, first, do the job, then return the kit, then order replacements for the sizes you used..........now kit is ready for the next guy...
Cookie
3 tools:
calipers(fun to play with) $20(digital harbor freight)
feeler gauges(can paper cut your friends,jk) $10
suzuki valve tool(looks neat in a tool box) $10-$15
not necessary but a small flat head is very useful, and so is a magnet.
getting a couple of spare orings when you get the valve tool is a good call.
first time i checked shims took my 2 hours. checked clearances, pulled 2 shims that were to tight, measured them to 270, put them back into corresponding buckets. Put bike back together. Ordered 2 265s, and 1 260 for good measure(in case one was too tight). rode for two weeks until i had a chance to do them.
Spent 1 hour at night with bad lighting, swapping new shims in and remeasuring.
as long as you can turn the shim it is OK to ride on it.
total out the door cost including tools i wanted anyways:
shims 30:( I lost my first order :cookoo:)
allen set 15(metrics were missing from case?)
screw drivers 8 (dont really count)
digital calipers 20
feeler gauges 10
valve tool 13
paper towels .50
Total = 96.50
next check = free.
I bought a shim kit from motorcycle superstore for $90, with 24 shims, if you don't live near a shop, I think it's a pretty good deal, a one time investment that'll last the life of your engine.
Quote from: tucsondude on August 15, 2010, 10:52:41 AM
3 tools:
calipers(fun to play with) $20(digital harbor freight)
feeler gauges(can paper cut your friends,jk) $10
suzuki valve tool(looks neat in a tool box) $10-$15
not necessary but a small flat head is very useful, and so is a magnet.
getting a couple of spare orings when you get the valve tool is a good call.
first time i checked shims took my 2 hours. checked clearances, pulled 2 shims that were to tight, measured them to 270, put them back into corresponding buckets. Put bike back together. Ordered 2 265s, and 1 260 for good measure(in case one was too tight). rode for two weeks until i had a chance to do them.
Spent 1 hour at night with bad lighting, swapping new shims in and remeasuring.
as long as you can turn the shim it is OK to ride on it.
total out the door cost including tools i wanted anyways:
shims 30:( I lost my first order :cookoo:)
allen set 15(metrics were missing from case?)
screw drivers 8 (dont really count)
digital calipers 20
feeler gauges 10
valve tool 13
paper towels .50
Total = 96.50
next check = free.
Cool............this is why I always say that you can't go wrong buying good tools...........for 1/2 the price of a single valve adjust bythe dealer, you have allthe stuff you need.....and like you say, all the following adjusts are FREE!
Plus I'd rather work all day on my bike than to pay the dealership $200 for a two hour job for them.......
And some of those tools can be used for other jobs too....
Cookie
OK...Now, what size shims does the GS 500 use? No, I don't meant the thickness, I mean the diameter....
When I did a search and got a micro fische drawing, I see three different diameters shown for the gs 500.
I figured all the valves would use the same diameter...........what is the diameter???
Cookie
29.5mm
If the bucket rotates easily but you can not fit your smallest feeler, then go one size down, if you can not rotate the bucket you have zero clearance and should go at least two sizes down. I had zero clearance on one valve and had to go down 4 sizes to be within spec. Look for a shop that can exchange em with you, my shop charged me $20 to swap both exhaust shims. Here is what I did to remove and replace the shims. I loosened but did not remove the caps holding down the cam shafts, then used some screw drivers to lift the shaft up. I used a knife to lift the shim from the bucket, and tweezers to pull the shim out. When you tighten the caps, don't make them too tight, its aluminum and you can mess it up easily, finger tight + 1/4 turn.
I completed my first valve inspection today. Probably took me longer than the shop time but at least next time I'll be quicker. My stumbling block was the valve cover... it was like a puzzle trying how to get it around the choke, clutch and throttle cables. The casket seal keeps falling off as I took it off so I purchased from sealer so it would stay on the top (as recommended on Kelly's video).
I measured each shim... most were out by .05 mm from what it said on the shim itself. Either I wasn't using the digital gauge properly or these shims aren't what they say. I had .003 clearance on the left side, but I couldn't even get my smallest feeler (.0015) gauge under the right side.
Right Front (shim said 275, I measured 266)
Right Rear (shim said 270, I measured 264)
Left Front (no markings on shim, I measured 265)
Left Rear (shim said 265, I measured 260)
Am I safe to get a 260, and 255 for good measure?
Quote from: epoxy.guy on September 20, 2010, 08:50:28 PM
I completed my first valve inspection today. Probably took me longer than the shop time but at least next time I'll be quicker. My stumbling block was the valve cover... it was like a puzzle trying how to get it around the choke, clutch and throttle cables. The casket seal keeps falling off as I took it off so I purchased from sealer so it would stay on the top (as recommended on Kelly's video).
I measured each shim... most were out by .05 mm from what it said on the shim itself. Either I wasn't using the digital gauge properly or these shims aren't what they say. I had .003 clearance on the left side, but I couldn't even get my smallest feeler (.0015) gauge under the right side.
Right Front (shim said 275, I measured 266)
Right Rear (shim said 270, I measured 264)
Left Front (no markings on shim, I measured 265)
Left Rear (shim said 265, I measured 260)
Am I safe to get a 260, and 255 for good measure?
Go by your ACTUAL measurement of the shim, not the marking on the shim..........this applies for the old shims in hte bike and any new shims you plan to install...........
Once new shims are installed, you have to go back with the feeler gauge and check the clearance......it has to be "in spec"..........I would trust your feeler guage...........if too tight or too loose, you have to change the shim again for the next size up or down, accordingly.............
It is the CLEARANCE that matters, not the size of the shim...........
Cookie
I've done 21 GS500 valve checks and made 9 shim changes and all shims have measured exactly as marked using a 1" size good quality micrometer. All my original and replacement shims have been oem Suzuki ones. I would guess your measuring device is inaccurate or you are using it wrong.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v443/jcp8832/valveclearances.jpg
If the shims are correct, then I can move the RearRight to the RearLeft, RearLeft to the FrontLeft, and place a 260 in the RearRight that should hopefully do the trick. If I measured correctly, then I can still use the 260 or 255 in RearLeft and FrontLeft.
To be on the safe side, I'll order a few extra shims for measure.
Quote from: gsJack on September 21, 2010, 06:09:34 AM
I've done 21 GS500 valve checks and made 9 shim changes and all shims have measured exactly as marked using a 1" size good quality micrometer. All my original and replacement shims have been oem Suzuki ones. I would guess your measuring device is inaccurate or you are using it wrong.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v443/jcp8832/valveclearances.jpg
Even if the measuring caliper is wrong, it doesn't matter, as we are simply measuring the difference in the shims, not the actual size of the shim...........and the final check is always the actual clearance measured with a feeler. The feeler however, MUST be accurate......
But you're right, even a pretty cheap dial caliper (I got mine from Grizzly tools for like $15) should be within .0005".
Cookie
the calipers are probably dirty dirty or not calibrated. clean off the edges and set it to zero. also, when you're measuring, don't squeeze the crap out of it. just close the edges onto the specimen and read.
Is it the right front (exhaust) that you cannot fit the smallest feeler? try to rotate the bucket that the shim sits in, if you can rotate it with your fingernail then go one size down on the shim, if it is very hard to turn then go at least 2 sizes lower on the shim. To remove the shim with simple tools, loosen the cam shaft caps, wedge the cam shaft up with a screwdriver, then use a knife to lift the shim, and tweezers to pull it out. Dont over tighten the cam caps, finger tight + 1/4 turn. good luck.
I've completed the valve adjustment and I only needed a 260 as I was able to move the 270 into the spot of the 275. Both valves on the left side now have a clearance of .004 and the ones on the right are .003
Also, I measured the shims again and it appears I was reading the edge of the shims and not the centre point. Each shim I checked on the centre point measured what it said on the shim.
It took me 1/2 hour to get into the valves, another 1/2 hour to check and adjustment and another 1/2 hour to put everything back together. Mind you, I had all the tools ready to go and I knew what I had to do this time.
Thanks for everyone`s comments!