I have been meaning to change my oil for a while now and finally today had time and nice weather. I followed the very through outline listed on this site and found it useful as it was my first time changing the oil on a motorcycle (before that I pretty much only worked on lawn equipment and snow-blowers). When everything was said and done, I was really excited to take it out for a ride, but noticed that there is a leak from the oil filter cover. I'll go through my steps and maybe someone can advise how I can fix it. Not sure how I would even get it to a mechanic if I needed to as the leak is pretty significant when the engine is running (not as bad but still noticeable with the engine off).
1) Put my drip pan under the bike while on its sidestand (no center stand available).
2) Loosened the oil filter cover bolts. I was careful to not let any oil leak out as the tutorial said but loosened them a bit. Jumping ahead a bit, when I turned the engine on to heat the oil, oil immediately began to run out from the oil filter cover. To rectify this, I tightened the 3 bolts on the cover slightly and the oil stopped leaking.
3) Loosened the oil drain bolt. Couldn't get my hands on a 21mm socket and after several trips to the hardware store finally discovered that 11/16 was the winner. If it is significant, the oil filter cover was loosened for probably an hour and a half while I tracked down the socket for the drain. I calculated that 13/16 should have been a bit too snug yet it was too loose to even make contact with all the drain's surfaces. Fortunately 11/16 worked well.
4) Turned on the engine for a few minutes and then turned off and allowed to cool a bit (some oil trickled out of the oil filter cover).
5) Removed the oil drain plug.
6) Removed the 3 bolts from the oil filter cover, bottom first then top left and top right respectively.
7) Removed the dipstick and stored away safely.
8) Removed the filter cover and the oil filter.
9) Here is where I am concerned I may have screwed up. I wanted to replace the filter because I was not sure what kind of shape it was going to be in. Actually looked pretty good but figured to replace anyway now that I was using fully synthetic oil (Motul 300V) over the semi-synthetic the PO told me he used. Does the filter just pop on? Does it need to be twisted or tightened somehow? I feel like the old oil filter was on a lot more securely than the new one is. I figured it may tighten over time and dismissed it but now I'm thinking I screwed up.
10) The O-ring on the filter cover looked great so I didn't want to mess with it. Same with the drain plug washer.
11) I replaced the drain plug after letting it drain for at least 30 minutes. I then replaced the oil filter cover and was careful to not over tighten the bolts.
12) I poured in the new oil and some of Marvel's Mystery Oil and replaced the dipstick.
When I went to turn the engine on, the leak was pretty significant. I tightened all the bolts and could only see a leak from the oil filter cover. The bolts are definitely on there well enough. I'll post pictures of the leak in a minute. Thanks in advance.
Filter just pops on. The old filter may have 'cooked', or 'baked', on.
I suspect the o-ring may have come out of the groove and got pinched/knackered.
You may just need to take the cover off, make sure the o-ring is in place, maybe use some grease to keep it in place, slowly replace the cover over the studs, and then tighten the acorn nuts evenly. Meaning, all three finger tight, then all three tightened up with a socket (no wrench), then all three tightened up with the wrench.
Before Pic:
(http://i55.tinypic.com/xd5x8y.jpg)
After Pic:
(http://i51.tinypic.com/2jb1gqs.jpg)
Before, the filter cover was covered in grim as you can see. I cleaned it up decently but just with paper towel basically.
Leaks Highlighted:
(http://i54.tinypic.com/9hv3gm.jpg)
I installed the cover upside down, does that matter or as long as the 3 bolts are on tight I'm OK?
Doesn't matter if it's upside down. The o-ring is what creates the seal and I'll bet $50 it's pinched.
What sucks is that you have to drain your oil again to fix it.
ps; Don't over-torque your oil cover bolts or your snap off the stud.
Marvels mystery oil.... friction modifier right.... usually not good for wet clutches.
I would also say pinched oring.
I believe you can still reuse the oil though... Just take a clean pan and dump the oil in it. Inspect the oring (I would replace it at this point)
Put everything together and fill her with the oil that you just dumped in that pan.
Good luck
Marvel is good for all kinds of uses.
Quote from: Jared on June 21, 2011, 05:11:31 PM
Marvels mystery oil.... friction modifier right.... usually not good for wet clutches.
I think the "Mystery" is what will it do to a wet clutch :D
-Jessie
My bet would also be the O-ring. Although I am wondering why you were loosening the oils filter nuts and drain plug before running the engine??? :dunno_black:
Thanks for the responses.
With the little daylight I had left (longest day of the year my ...) I took off the filter cover and made sure the filter was in correctly and the spring didn't come off or something that would cause a gap in the cover. I also checked the o-ring and again everything looked good; no visible damage or disintegration and fit perfectly in the groove so didn't seemed pinched. When I put the cover back on, I realized that one of the caps may not be as good as the other 2 because it didn't seem to catch the thread of the screw too well. I moved that to the top right position (originally was on the bottom where the majority of the leak was coming). I cleaned up and saw no leak but as soon as I started the engine it was leaking again from the bottom only (the middle orange arrow in the pic above) and not as significantly. I pulled my car in to act as a big flashlight and took the cover off again and replaced the o-ring. It was tough getting it out even with a box cutter. Long story short, the new o-ring as many of you suggested may have solved the problem. It was able to run for a good 5 minutes at idle and saw only one drop. I parked it with a piece of cardboard under the engine so I could see if I had a leak in the morning. I just checked it and after probably 2-3 hours, maybe 3 or 4 drops have fallen. Should I still be concerned? At least now I can take it somewhere but would really rather not if I can avoid it.
Thanks
Quote from: BaltimoreGS on June 21, 2011, 05:33:57 PM
Quote from: Jared on June 21, 2011, 05:11:31 PM
Marvels mystery oil.... friction modifier right.... usually not good for wet clutches.
I think the "Mystery" is what will it do to a wet clutch :D
-Jessie
Oh boy, hope I didn't just screw that up too bad. A friend of mine is a mechanic a few hundred miles away and swears by the stuff. Said its great in gas too. He recently brought a ZX-7R back to vitality after having basically one wheel in the junkyard and the biggest problem he had was gummed up carbs that would not clear up even after taking it apart and soaking twice. Started using the mystery oil in the tank and says its a totally different bike. We'll see I guess haha
CndnMax: I pretty much followed the tutorial on this site as my only instruction. It was good I loosened it before too because the bottom bolt on the filter cover was STUCK and my hands were all over the header pipes trying to get it out. You can see how gummed up everything was in the "Before" picture. Similarly, accessing the drain plug was a bit uncomfortable with no center stand. I loosened them just enough and let go after the original seal was broken if you will. Seemed pretty helpful looking back on it might be worth considering if you ever struggle with bolts in hot areas.
Quote from: RSK70 on June 21, 2011, 09:19:05 PM
It was good I loosened it before too because the bottom bolt on the filter cover was STUCK and my hands were all over the header pipes trying to get it out.
This is what socket extensions and gloves are for :thumb:
If your still getting leaks my next bet would be ether dirt on the engine preventing a seal or more probable is the lower stud is stripped since it was "Stuck" - did u overtighten the nuts by any chance?
pull it all apart, pull out the new filter shine a light inside and make sure theres nothing in there that shouldn't be. take a shop towel or a rag and thoroughly clean the machined surface of the block and clean the machined surface on the cover. apply a small amount of new grease to the NEW o-ring to hold it firmly in place, put everything back together and tighten the bolts to mild resistance and check the oil level and fill if needed... run bike for 1 min or till it leaks... check oil level again, might need to add a tad more... if all is good and no leaks go about your business if there are still leaks... well you got problems... most likely if you did everything right and nothing is stripped or broken then the cover might of warped...
guess what your changing your oil again because it has friction modifiers.
"While Marvel Mystery Oil is compatible with synthetic, semi-synthetic and petroleum based oils, we do not recommend that it be used in motorcycles with a wet clutch. Marvel Mystery Oil is such a good friction modifier that it could have an impact on the transmission and caused some shifting concerns."
I stole this from the MMO forum. After reading I was curious how many are using it in their oil.
i stole this from another motorbike forum, plus it can cause your clutch to slip, ive seen this happen with other friction modifier oils ie: when you hold the cluth in and put the bike into first it will roll ford then stop then roll ford and stop.... get the picture.
Quote from: XLAR8 on June 22, 2011, 12:43:34 AM
ie: when you hold the cluth in and put the bike into first it will roll ford then stop then roll ford and stop.... get the picture.
that sound like a disaster waiting to happen.
change your oil to something compatible with GS.
good luck
Quote from: kml.krk on June 22, 2011, 10:40:25 AM
Quote from: XLAR8 on June 22, 2011, 12:43:34 AM
ie: when you hold the cluth in and put the bike into first it will roll ford then stop then roll ford and stop.... get the picture.
that sound like a disaster waiting to happen.
change your oil to something compatible with GS.
good luck
Agreed. I use Repsol full synthetic, it is kinda expensive but it's good quality oil and works well.
Quote from: crzydood17 on June 21, 2011, 11:11:32 PM
pull it all apart, pull out the new filter shine a light inside and make sure theres nothing in there that shouldn't be. take a shop towel or a rag and thoroughly clean the machined surface of the block and clean the machined surface on the cover. apply a small amount of new grease to the NEW o-ring to hold it firmly in place, put everything back together and tighten the bolts to mild resistance and check the oil level and fill if needed... run bike for 1 min or till it leaks... check oil level again, might need to add a tad more... if all is good and no leaks go about your business if there are still leaks... well you got problems... most likely if you did everything right and nothing is stripped or broken then the cover might of warped..
I agree thoroughly clean the mating surfaces even use a scouring pad to scratch up the surface a bit, use o - ring grease and give it a decent coat and see if that works. Next step if it still doesnt work use a straight edge (metal ruler) and feeler gauges to see if the cover or the block isn't warped, if one or the other or both are it, shouldn't be too hard to remedy this yourself if they are. Hope this helps.
Quote from: aussiegs on June 22, 2011, 03:35:05 PM
Quote from: crzydood17 on June 21, 2011, 11:11:32 PM
pull it all apart, pull out the new filter shine a light inside and make sure theres nothing in there that shouldn't be. take a shop towel or a rag and thoroughly clean the machined surface of the block and clean the machined surface on the cover. apply a small amount of new grease to the NEW o-ring to hold it firmly in place, put everything back together and tighten the bolts to mild resistance and check the oil level and fill if needed... run bike for 1 min or till it leaks... check oil level again, might need to add a tad more... if all is good and no leaks go about your business if there are still leaks... well you got problems... most likely if you did everything right and nothing is stripped or broken then the cover might of warped..
I agree thoroughly clean the mating surfaces even use a scouring pad to scratch up the surface a bit, use o - ring grease and give it a decent coat and see if that works. Next step if it still doesnt work use a straight edge (metal ruler) and feeler gauges to see if the cover or the block isn't warped, if one or the other or both are it, shouldn't be too hard to remedy this yourself if they are. Hope this helps.
DO NOT SCRATCH THE SURFACE WITH ANYTHING OTHER THAN 2000 GRIT SANDPAPERmachined surfaces are machined for a reason... if you "rough" them up your just making more tiny pathways for the oil to flow...
also if the block is warped... its a pretty harsh situation... if the cover is warped... replace it...
That's why I said use a scouring pad it's not like I said 36 grit paper it's a light rough up it won't hurt it at all, I'm a fitter by trade and having clean mating surfaces for gaskets etc is vital for proper sealing. The light rough up will create a labyrinth effect as well creating an impossible path for if any oil does get past the o - ring. But like I said before if it still leaks you will need to look at warping as a cause on the cover or block.