Hi--
I think this is the right place to post--if not, please direct me so I'm not cluttering up the wrong forum!
I'm brand new to riding (got my endorsement early this summer) and have decided it's time to get my own bike. I've been practicing on a friend's 1987 Intruder, and while I love riding it's not the right bike for me at all. After trying out all kinds of "starter" type bikes, I'm in love with the GS500. :)
I found a gorgeous one at a dealership and am considering going back and purchasing. I'm just worried I'm going to get ripped off, even if I bargain. If anyone has a sense of whether this is a reasonable deal, given the following details, I would love ANY advice!!
Bike specs I know:
2007 GS500
naked conversion
8K miles
no visible scratches except a few on the seat leather
Asking price:
$3500 (I'm in Seattle, so add 10% sales tax for my full price, plus I'm going to get bags and engine guards and probably need rain gear soon, so I'm looking at spending probably closer to $4500 total on the bike in the next month if I get this one)
Kelley BB says $2250, NADA says average retail $2900, Craigslist mostly runs $2000-$3000 for similar bikes (years, milage).
My plan is that if I can talk them down to $3000 or $3100, I'd go for it. Am I making a huge mistake?
Other considerations:
I'm in no way familiar enough with bikes to go see one on Craigslist, for example, and know if it's in good shape at all. So, while I know dealerships are always going to be more expensive, it feels more comfortable to shop there. I do have friends who are into bikes, and one of them looked at this one with me on Saturday and another's coming today, so I'm not going in totally on my own.
Any advice? Should I avoid this deal entirely, what should I ask before I purchase, what price might be fair, any tips on bargaining?
I'm so excited to get my own bike and want this type, so I'm worried my impatience and enthusiasm will get me in trouble!
Thanks everyone who even read this far!!
--Trish
Well, there is always a lot to consider....
IMHO $3500 is much too high. Especially if that price doesn't include tax, tags and title. For comparison I paid less than $4300 including tax tags and title for a BRAND NEW 2009 back in MAY that had 1 mile on it. It came with a warranty and a 30% discount on all the gear I purchased that day. (helmet, jacket, gloves etc....). That was in Indiana with a 7% sales tax. I also got financed with a %1.99 APR.
Consider the fact that I bought it in the spring when bikes are selling like hotcakes and I think I got a pretty solid deal.
Being October, there are a ton of bikes on sale right now.... If you shop around, you will likely find a better deal.
For a used GS500F with 8k on it... I wouldn't pay more than $3k total. Especially this time of year!
Take your time! These bikes aren't going anywhere... A couple of extra days shopping around and you might be able to find something even better for a couple thousand less.
I wouldn't give more than $2800 for it. And that's if everything is perfect. Which isn't likely. 90% percent of your converted F's are due to the bike being wrecked. It's way cheaper to convert it than to replace everything. Are you wanting a nekid, or did you just stumble upon this one? Think about what the blue book is, and what the original MSRP was(including fairings..) and that's 8k miles and like five years ago.. You could get a decently modded bike for less money.
PS... one of our resident parts whores is located in Seattle and probably has some advice on where to find one at a good price.
my guess is he will chime in here eventually :icon_lol:
Which dealership? Aurora or RMC? or?
There are lots of GS500's here in Seattle for good prices. $3500 is a bit high.
New they sell for $3999.
All the fairings are gone - so that drops it down to $3000 max.
What else has been doctored on this bike?
Probably $2500 is fair for a bike that has been "stripped" if its clothing.
There are always good deals on GS500's around here on Craigslist. I keep an eye on it. Bought a 1992 and a 1994 for $1100 and $1000 then put a little money into them to make them fabulous.
Pix here: http://s1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/GS500/
(West Seattle GS500 Club)
Quote from: lucky4034 on October 25, 2011, 09:54:48 AM
PS... one of our resident parts whores is located in Seattle and probably has some advice on where to find one at a good price.
my guess is he will chime in here eventually :icon_lol:
Ding Dong!
You could take a little drive and get this one..
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=58058.0
Let me guess?
http://www.aurora-suzuki.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?sid=7793826E-02X10K25K2011J11I55I34JAMQ4045R0&veh=38086&pov=2379173
If you have friends who know about bikes... have them take a look at this one maybe.
Guys asking $3000 for it and it is fully customized to the core and has less miles.
Judging by all the work he put into it, its likely he took good care of it.... just a thought.
http://kpr.craigslist.org/mcy/2577924772.html
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/mcy/2665475473.html
I think you're better going as stock as possible them customize it yourself to what you want.
If someone else farkled up the bike - you'll be spending extra money because they think everything they did increased its value --- NOT!
You can PM grommett2k and see if his is still for sale.
There were more on CL last week. They come and go every week.
Quote from: lucky4034 on October 25, 2011, 10:07:53 AM
Let me guess?
http://www.aurora-suzuki.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?sid=7793826E-02X10K25K2011J11I55I34JAMQ4045R0&veh=38086&pov=2379173
Bastardized fugley thing. If that's it - tell Mike or Randy $2500 max and next tune up & oil change included. Tell them you KNOW GS500's 2009 NEW were selling for $3999 and used ones NOT stripped and painted black are selling for $2800. This is not the bike buying season so they should be eager to sell. I found those guys pretty nice - my favorite dealership. Parts guys always steer me in the right direction.
Don't forget to get some free popcorn while you're there.
find a fixer upper... payed 1500 for mine with a bad idle, fixed that and did all the maintenance and she runs like a dream... although i do have a fuel leak now... damn crappy hoses...
Its your first bike = you will drop it. A lot.
Its your first bike = don't buy new.
That dealer is asking 1500-1800 too much, and then they will hit you with "fees" at the end of the deal. Skip it.
Buy a gs off craigslist for 1-2000 and do the maintenance yourself, ask questions here. Farkles like case guards are an ebay or gstwins thing. Gear up before you go out, its very cheap compared to surgery.
Keep in mind.... resale, you're only going to get 1-2000 when you sell it, assuming you do.
I bought my 96 with 3000 miles for $1800, put 30000 miles on it and sold it for $1800. Great experience, great fun, great cost of ownership.
Btw, you may like the F model for wind protection, but don't discount the E... its a great summertime ride when its hot.
Good luck :)
Wow, thanks for all the really quick responses!
To respond to a few questions: Yes, it's the one at the Aurora Suzuki, I've liked them in general when I've talked to them, though my boyfriend ordered some luggage from them and it took forever to get in and they were pretty meh about customer service on that issue.
I like the naked look a lot more, but I'm willing to do that mod myself with help.
While I'm willing to do routine maintenance and some modifications, I am definitely not looking for a fixer-upper in any major mechanical way right now. (I know, heresy!!). I want to ride and learn some basics, not be fixing it all the time or have to put in a lot of work before I get out there. Some of that is being burned by the '87 Intruder I'm on now--I've spent more time having friends look at it and trying to get it running than riding it.
I may go look at the one in Eatonville/Tacoma area--Walla Walla is pretty far away and I'm not a freeway rider yet so getting it home would be...interesting.
This is all really helpful--I think my impatience is getting the best of me but I don't want to be foolish just because I'm new at the game and inexperienced.
Thank you!!
Its Seattle - lots of wet roads. Fairing really helps keeping legs dry (dare you ask how I know that?).
Maybe time to let the OP come back in? Don't want to give her too much information and scare her away.
One last tip: Watch out for wet leaves this time of year. They hide things and are like ice.
Ha, adidasguy, OP beat you on that reply by about 8 seconds. :)
This is a lot of information, but hey, it's so new to me that I'm bound to be overwhelmed. I'm not scared away from getting a bike, though I may be scared away from this one (which is probably a good thing given the info here). I suppose I'll go negotiate if I'm feeling up to it, or remember that there will be other options.
My friend B says that anything between about a 2002-present would be good.
And yes! Leaves! Scary! Will be super careful.
And I know the fairing is useful...I just don't like the way it looks. Form? Function?? Gah!
Modifications reduce the value of the bike. Doesn't matter what was done. Aftermarket exhaust? Less value (unless it's a $2000 TI system.) After market signals? $50-$100 less, front and back. 'Naked' conversion? Take $500-$1000 off the price tag.
It's very very rare for someone to install a mod in a way that's not cheesy and destructive to the bike.
Honestly riding season is about over for most people. If you can hold out, I would prolly wait at least a month or two before buying a bike. You'll likely get a better deal.
Quote from: GI_JO_NATHAN on October 25, 2011, 12:12:45 PM
Honestly riding season is about over for most people. If you can hold out, I would prolly wait at least a month or two before buying a bike. You'll likely get a better deal.
that sorta begs the question.. if "riding season is over".. what the point rushing to buy a bike you cant ride? O.o
Quote from: burning1 on October 25, 2011, 12:07:31 PM
Modifications reduce the value of the bike. Doesn't matter what was done. Aftermarket exhaust? Less value (unless it's a $2000 TI system.) After market signals? $50-$100 less, front and back. 'Naked' conversion? Take $500-$1000 off the price tag.
It's very very rare for someone to install a mod in a way that's not cheesy and destructive to the bike.
You can't expect a person to pay full price for the modification of course, but decreasing in value off current year private party price? Maybe if you find a sucker. My bike is always maintained immaculately, all maintenance is logged, and any modifications are done in a professional and repeatable manner. If I'm unable, I have a professional do it. If someone took 500-1000 off my offer because of that, I'd laugh in their face and hold it for someone who could appreciate it.
By your logic the fact that they had the balls to even ride the bike after they bought it is enough to take off 2 grand on private party and try to get the bike for under a grand. It helps if you inspect the bike and the modifications and make sure they were done right before you go off and low ball them. It's fair to offer them NADA value for a bike like this (the NADA for a gs500E, that is - since the F model will consider fairings), and in most cases shooting around 200 less than NADA is considered fair. You have to be careful too. If I sell something I watch the market. When demand for an item or something is higher, and there aren't many posted - I'll post mine at a fixed price and use the "I'm the only one selling a X at the moment, take it or leave it" and walk if they don't pay my asking. It's all business.
That being said, 3500 is way too much for that year. I wouldn't give him more than 2500.
Quote from: adidasguy on October 25, 2011, 10:26:46 AM
http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/mcy/2665475473.html
I think you're better going as stock as possible them customize it yourself to what you want.
If someone else farkled up the bike - you'll be spending extra money because they think everything they did increased its value --- NOT!
You can PM grommett2k and see if his is still for sale.
There were more on CL last week. They come and go every week.
Thanks for the reference Patrick, but I decided to keep the bike. My bike and I seem to have the same relationship as my wife and I. One day I want to get rid of her, the next I can't live without her. I did post my bike on CL, but then deleted the ad the next day :D
To the OP. I think that's a bit steep for what it is. Are you going to be buying it outright? If so, go in a tell them what you are willing to pay. I would offer $2000 to $2500...
Quote from: Dr.McNinja on October 25, 2011, 12:21:26 PM
You can't expect a person to pay full price for the modification of course, but decreasing in value off current year private party price? Maybe if you find a sucker. My bike is always maintained immaculately, all maintenance is logged, and any modifications are done in a professional and repeatable manner. If I'm unable, I have a professional do it. If someone took 500-1000 off my offer because of that, I'd laugh in their face and hold it for someone who could appreciate it.
I'm not going to argue against your offer, I'm going to start with the value of the bike, well maintained and unmodified then adjust from there.
For example, the bike the OP linked to is an 07 500F. KBB says it's a $2500 bike, but since it's low mileage and fairly recent, a good example could probably fetch a bit more than $3K... Let's say $3200.
Now, first of all, the fairing is missing. Don't care how nice a job you did, that fairing is worth money. Include the headlight, windshield, etc... And I'm going to take $700 right off the bat. We're down to the $2500KBB. Flat black tail section, not matched to the tank... Another $100 at least.
Now, to be fair the rest of the bike looks pretty clean. Fender isn't bobbed, stock reflectors, signals, mirrors, etc seem to be in place, so there's a good chance I'm not going to find any hacked-up wiring when I work on the bike. Exhaust is also stock.
So, I'd probably offer $2400, assuming I didn't see any signs of damage, wear, rounded off bolts, etc.
If it had a nice Yoshimura full system, I might concede $50-$100 increase in value. V&H or other brands, I probably wouldn't offer anything extra. If they had chopped the stock can off, and replaced it with anything but a part specifically designed for this bike, I'd subtract $100.
Dealers will do the same thing. I was considering selling my R1150R to a BMW dealer. They looked at the $1200 Remus system, and said that they were going to subtract $500 off their offer to install the stock system. I traded another BMW owner exhausts plus $300 cash, and sold it with the stock pipe.
Quote from: burning1 on October 25, 2011, 01:15:16 PM
Now, to be fair the rest of the bike looks pretty clean. Fender isn't bobbed, stock reflectors, signals, mirrors, etc seem to be in place,
Nope, mirrors look like they're these:
http://www.amazon.com/Emgo-Universal-Trimline-Mirror-Black/dp/B00411QIPU
+1 burning.
If the fairings have been removed it should be priced (and advertised) as a GS500E, not F. The only thing its got that's "F" is the oil cooler.
Now, the next thing I'd ask is why has someone removed the fairings? Two possibilities here, one is they liked the naked look more, the other is they dropped it and it was cheaper to not replace the fairings. Considering they've also replaced the mirrors and repainted the tail its most likely it was dropped. That's not necessarily a deal breaker, (I bought my bike as a repaired write-off) but it should make it a lot cheaper.
Regardless of whether the dealer wants to convince you that the conversion was by choice, not due to damage, when you go to sell it later potential buyers are going to ask the same questions and you will lose out financially.
I don't know the US market, but from what the other guys are saying, and given how cheap they are new over there I don't think its worth more than about $2500.
I think you're right in looking for a naked GS as a first bike, last time I dropped mine (actually backed my van into it and knocked it off the stand :oops:) it cost me $70 for handlebars and clutch lever. If it was an 'F' it would have cost a whole lot more!
Stock mirrors = $$$ (for an "E") and since stock for "F" model was on the fairing, these are aftermarket mirrors.
OP - I don't think you need to worry about getting burned on a used gs. What you hear when you purchase it is what you'll hear for 20-30K miles generally. If you're incredibly paranoid you can pull the side cases and check for goats syndrome and that other one, but I wouldn't myself.
If the chain looks good and the rotors aren't burned, engine sounds good and there is -any- oil change history that looks positive, just ride and enjoy.
really, the gs is a very reliable (for a carbed bike) machine. the transmission will be something you miss on other bikes, as it really is smooth shifting GEM compared to some. put a battery tender on it for those weeks you're not riding. stabil in the tank too. get the tires off the floor if you can, or just move it once a week or so.
have you considered the ninja 500ex / 500r ? or the ninja 250 ? both have good wind protection, and the 250 is great for smaller framed folk. very very fun bikes like the gs, but are water cooled. cheap on insurance and not considered 'race replicas' or similar.
had i known you were female at first, i would have pushed you towards the 250 for ease of use. assuming height is a consideration.
whatever you get, remember it's only a bike. no need in waxing it weekly or worrying about the engine taking a dump tomorrow. pay cash, ride it, flog it, and when the love dies just get another. sooner or later they all come apart for some attention:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gUOMLQFG6oQ/Tpyhh3TmpCI/AAAAAAAACW4/TTZDDcXs4zY/s640/IMG_20111017_163452.jpg)
O0
Quote from: ohgood on October 25, 2011, 03:43:53 PM
whatever you get, remember it's only a bike. no need in waxing it weekly or worrying about the engine taking a dump tomorrow. pay cash, ride it, flog it, and when the love dies just get another. sooner or later they all come apart for some attention:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gUOMLQFG6oQ/Tpyhh3TmpCI/AAAAAAAACW4/TTZDDcXs4zY/s640/IMG_20111017_163452.jpg)
O0
Oh my god, okay, there was a lot of good, *solid* advice in your post, but I have to say--the above is pretty great advice to apply to boyfriends as well! :D *has the giggles*
I looked at Ninja 250s, but they weren't as comfortable for riding position. It was uncomfortable through the pelvis/hips for whatever reason. I didn't have any problems putting my feet on the ground on the GS500 (I'm 5'4" but a little long in the legs). I didn't have the opportunity to sit on a Ninja 500, but I'll keep an eye out.
The other concern I had on the 250s is that I do eventually want to do some highway riding (like Seattle to Portland next summer) and don't want to be struggling to pass, keep up, etc.
I think you're right--I just need to find something that feels good that's a reasonable deal, take decent care of it, and get out there. I think unless I'm feeling really aggressive about bargaining, I'll pass on this particular one.
And now I have to go google "goats syndrome".
Thank you everyone for taking the time to respond so thoughtfully!
Don't Google goats, use the forum search function.
Have a rad of this "buying guide" before you go a hunting. http://www.clarity.net/~adam/buying-bike.html YOu reallty shouldn't need to worry about looking for tie wire holes in bolts on a GS, but the guide has a Lot of good stuff to look for. And if you find a Maybe that's you've gone to see, take some photos of it and post them here for us to Analyse. Tires, chain, rear sprocket, engine, instrument display, handlebars, seat, forks, you get the idea.
Happy hunting.
Michael
It seems high, to me but it all depends on the condition, and miles, they are a beginner bike so they tend to be used and abused by people, if they have the records for oil changes and maintenance on the bike then it helps. But in Minnesota where I live, that would be high.