Removed the filter today and found a couple cm of oil and fuel at the bottom of the air box sitting there.. Any idea what could cause this?
The fuel I'm not so sure about unless you're getting excessive backfiring inside the carb intake. The most likely thing is that the oil blew in there from the vent line that goes from the top of the valve cover to the box. I forgot what it's called but it's some kind of emission control crap. It's possible that you are mistaking the smell of used oil for gas since engine oil, especially on these bikes, usually gets contaminated with fuel. There could be some water in there as well that's adding to the mixture.
I'm not a Suzuki mechanic but I've had my tank/airbox/carbs off enough times to see that there is really no way for any substantial amount fuel to get into the airbox unless you have a leak in your tank, which you would know about. I'd double check but unless you're smelling gas while the bike is just sitting, chances are high that you don't have a leak.
Edit: Oh! Epiphany here...check to make sure the vent line on the bottom of the tank is securely installed. It could be that it fell off and when you fill the bike the gas is spilling down on top of the box and getting in. :)
I've been thinking this over and it occurred to me it's possible your float needle(s) is/are sticking and causing fuel to flow up into the box/engine. Though you'd think this would almost certainly cause the bike to run poorly, if at all, it is something to check on. Just make sure that when you pull the carbs loose that there isn't a bunch of fuel all over the throat(s). If there is...um, well, the next project on your list is going be a carb rebuild. Sorry!
Sold the GS this morning! Thanks for the attempted help (i passed it along to the new owner). Hopefully He has the time to take care of PITA that i didn't have anymore
No problem man. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Quote from: numus on December 26, 2011, 01:43:11 PM
Sold the GS this morning! Thanks for the attempted help (i passed it along to the new owner). Hopefully He has the time to take care of PITA that i didn't have anymore
Does the new owner know of this problem - or - did you hide it from them so we will end up seeing them here asking about it, then watch them get all annoyed when they discover you were here first and knowingly sold them the bike without mentioning this problem?
Michael
As the new owner of this bike, I have to say, yes, numus was quite honest with the issues it has. It appears he has done quite a bit of work on it, and I'm getting closer to having it running again.
Since I purchased the bike, I've done the following: Replaced fuel filters and fuel lines, and cleaned the carbs. It is no longer pouring fuel into the airbox. However, it still has the same problems:
Will idle, but dies after a couple of minutes. Sometimes it will restart immediately, others it takes a few minutes.
While idling, if you slowly give the bike throttle, it will rev to about 4500/5000 rpm prior to dying. If you quickly rev the throttle, it dies almost immediately.
I have ordered new spark plugs, but I'm not sure that will help any. The bike will start with the left plug in, right plug unplugged, but will not start with the right plug in, left plug unplugged. I've tried swapping the plugs, and the issue remained the same. Coils, maybe?
Any ideas? I've been working steadily at it for the past 3 days, and am not making the kind of progress I'd hoped.
And since I'm new here, I didn't want to start a new post, although I would like to so that I can get more replies to my issues.
I had similar symptoms with Trey. However, when I swapped the plugs the problem switched to the other cylinder. So it was the plug. Off thing was it would run with full choke with just the bad plug which made me thing at first it was not a plug. It was a flaky plug - not good and not totally bad.
.......before swapping plugs.....
I replaced coils and ignitor box with no effect.
I did poor-man's compression test by cranking engine with thumb over plug hole and all was OK (later bought compression tester just to be sure).
Cleaned and adjusted carbs.
...................
Given what I did to get Trey running and your symptoms, I'd check for spark. Pull the plug and hold against engine frame. Is there visible spark? If not, probably coil. Could be wiring to coil or bad connection on ignitor box.
You might verify the setting of the mixture screws (if they are accessible. If not, then they are still factory set which is OK).
One other thing might be carb syncing. If you have spark, will it run on the bad side at all? What about full and no choke? If either, then sync the carbs. I did a post on the hillbilly method of carb syncing. It worked really well.
First of all, thank you for the response.
Pulled the plug and held it against the frame, got nice strong spark.
I'm not certain if the mixture screws are accessible, because I didn't want to foul anything up terribly when I cleaned the carbs, so I only removed the main components. The float bowl covers were quite dirty, but the bowls themselves weren't terrible. Although, one was worse than the other, trying to remember if it was the right one (I want to say it was). One of the main jets was completely clogged, the other not. I'm guessing I just need to strip them apart again and see if there is an obstruction.
I tried starting the bike with only the right plug at full choke/no choke, various throttle positions with no luck. It simply will not start. The bike will start with the left plug or both plugs, however if I unplug the right plug while the bike is running it has absolutely no effect.
I also started the bike with the right plug completely removed and had strong air bursts coming from the cylinder, so I assume compression is good?
Also, while I'm thinking about it, I checked the floats to see if they were getting fuel, and the left one is fine. The right one, however, has a stripped screw, so I've been unable to check it. And tips for removing this screw, short of the taking the carbs off and taking a dremel to it?
What year is the bike? I don't thing that was mentioned anywhere.
Sounds like clogged up carb since you have spark. If the plug was wet, then maybe flooding and too much fuel.
If you haven't, use carb cleaner and clean all openings really good and blow air through them. Especially the openings in the air intake side. Put in new jets just to be sure they're clean. A few places can get them to you overnight (like PJ Motorsports). Some people have extra jets but we need to know what year the bike is.
Check for gas in the carbs. Connect a cleat tube to the drain on each side. Bend the tube up higher than the carbs. Then open the drain screw. You'll see the fuel level in the tubes. That will tell you if needles are stuck open, closed or are working right. There are topics on adjusting float levels as well as in the Haynes or Clymer manuals.
PS: If the screw is stripped, you gotta be able to remove it. How else can you clean the carbs if you don't drain them first? (unless you want a quarter cup of gas to spill out when you take the bottoms off).
Stripped screw is a sign someone has really been messing with the carbs and didn't know what they were doing. Pretty easy to open the drain. I recall my carbs had drain screws that were hex head with slot and phillips so 3 ways to open it up. As for the float bowl screws (2 on older, 4 on newer) if stripped, many threads on this topic. Vice grips or dremel. Replace with stainless steel hex key screws or at least good quality new screws.
PSPS: You might want to invest in a spare set of carbs. $75-$150. Buy ones from a running bike and from a reputable seller. I have a few spare sets - some were pretty cheap. I threw on a spare set on Trey as a test to see if my carbs were all farkled. He ran the same with the spare set so his problem wasn't the carbs - though a cleaning of the carbs did make an improvement once I determined it was a flaky plug.
It's a 96. My next step was to check the float height, but as I said, the screw on the right float bowl cover is stripped, so I've got to sort that issue out. Guess I'll head back out and pull the carbs again.
I may just take your advise and buy some new/used carbs. Any suggestions on a good seller?
Quote from: shonole on December 28, 2011, 12:34:07 PMOne of the main jets was completely clogged, the other not.
If you had a plugged main, I would really wonder about the status of the pilots, cause they are 5X more likely to clog than a main?
I'm going to take a look at it now and see about cleaning them.
I bought Phenix's frame and some other parts from here. Looks like these carbs are from that same bike. Frame was expertly repainted, so I would think the carbs were well taken care of, too
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Suzuki-GS-500-Carburetors-/170655128818?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item27bbd69cf2
Seems to be the best deal right now.
PS: Drain screws are special, so just any screw won't work. I gave away drain screws from a junk set I had. Someone might have a junk set and give/sell you the drain screws.
You have old carbs. I got 4 pilots and 4 mains from Bike Bandit. They were so slow shipping I bought ones from PJ while waiting for BB's to show up. So I do have extra jets in the parts bins. Only one spare set of old carbs - which I need to keep - sorry. It would be possible to overnight them tomorrow if you want to work this weekend and pay the express mail postage.
(note: at BB: "In Stock" does not mean on the shelf and can ship right away. It means "we can get it someday then ship to you")
PM me cost and I'll get back to you.
Thanks!
Also, I'm hunting for a rebuild kit (I believe I've narrowed the problem down to the float needle. In fact, I think both of them are shot). Will the one listed here work?
http://www.partsnmore.com/parts/suzuki/gs500/?filters%5Bfitting%5D=custom
It is listed for 89-93, but should work on the 96, right? If not, I'll just order the float needles, as the gaskets look okay.
This is for 89-00 so I suspect any one in that range would work - carbs did not change
http://www.oldbikebarn.com/Suzuki-GS500-GSX1000-Carb-Repair-Kit?sc=2&category=126
I have kits but paid $24 from BB and now they are at $30.56 from them.
This place is $22
http://www.powersportsuperstore.com/K-L-Supply-Carburetor-Repair-Kit-18-9310-p/4070325.htm?Click=35177
If they are selling the K&L, it will work 89-00. Then any should as 89-00 are the same carbs.
Jets would be $11 for 2 each 122.5 mains and 40 pilots. USA used 37's, rest of world 40's. I prefer the 40's as Junior had them (Canadian) and starts better with less choke, better power at low rpm's.
Express mail is $18.30.
Okay, I'll get back with you shortly.
The pilots appear to be stuck, and I'm deathly afraid of stripping them. Any tips? Or am I just screwed?
I'd let someone else say what to do there. I've only removed them from a couple sets and they were easy. I haven't encountered a stuck one.
My first guess would be to heat outside with a hair dryer. The heat can expand the housing and free the jets. PB Blaster or the SeaFoam bolt free-er stuff could help.
Seems that carb is really gunky. Probably the internal passages are fouled, too. You'd need the K&L Carb cleaning tool (sets of small, rough wires for the holes) maybe. If the jets can't be removed, I'd opt for another set of carbs.
Well, I've got them soaking in pb blaster overnight, so we'll see how it is in the morning.
Shonole check the RH coil wire.... Trace it back to above the starter solenoid and desolder the additional wire on that. That is the electronic Tach.. It should not be causing a massive voltage drop to the RH coil to cause a problem (but it may be).
I never took apart the carbs but according to the owner before me, he took it to http://www.floridamotorsports.com/ and had them work on the carb... They usually are really good but they may have stripped it... MY suggestion (since it was what i was doing when i was working on rebuilding the bike) everytime you remove a bolt, go to ace hardware and get a chrome replacement (usually grade 8 i believe).. Thats why you will notice some nice new shiny bolts randomly...
BTW I did do an entire check on the regulator/rectifier and the generator. Everything appeared within the manual specs but i did replace the 3 sets of disconnects on the generator (left side behind left fairing). It was having a random disconnect at those points so i figured to replace the entire thing. The power system (out of the generator and rectifier) shows a good charge voltage...
Just trying to help narrow down that I don't believe it has anything to do with the power system (although you may have a random ground somewhere.. although the symptoms didnt really support that)
Quote from: mister on December 26, 2011, 06:23:17 PM
Quote from: numus on December 26, 2011, 01:43:11 PM
Sold the GS this morning! Thanks for the attempted help (i passed it along to the new owner). Hopefully He has the time to take care of PITA that i didn't have anymore
Does the new owner know of this problem - or - did you hide it from them so we will end up seeing them here asking about it, then watch them get all annoyed when they discover you were here first and knowingly sold them the bike without mentioning this problem?
Michael
I would never do that to someone (because i would hope no one would ever do that to me)...
Trust me.. for the price I sold the bike at, it is worth well more than that in parts alone...
Quote from: shonole on December 28, 2011, 03:34:48 PM
PM me cost and I'll get back to you.
Thanks!
Also, I'm hunting for a rebuild kit (I believe I've narrowed the problem down to the float needle. In fact, I think both of them are shot). Will the one listed here work?
http://www.partsnmore.com/parts/suzuki/gs500/?filters%5Bfitting%5D=custom
It is listed for 89-93, but should work on the 96, right? If not, I'll just order the float needles, as the gaskets look okay.
I believe between 89 and 00 nothing with the engine or carbs was changed... Someone correct me if I am wrong.
Another thing i would advise you to do is to pull the kill switch for now and wire in a temporary one... That showed signs of possibly having problems and would be easier to narrow down if there is any problems in the electrical system.
P.S. I totally forgot to mention this when you bought it... The brake switch for the rear brake did break...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/suzuki-1991-GS500E-brake-switch-/130530477359?item=130530477359&vxp=mtr#ht_500wt_1127 is a replacement but I would advise getting the one that replaces the bolt... Should look something like this http://www.bonanza.com/listings/Motorcycle-banjo-brake-switch-bolt-dual-sport-dirt-bike-ktm/38349712 ... It isn't critical as long as you always use the front brake along with the rear brake (the front brake will activate the brake lights)...
I keep getting other random thoughts and coming back to this post to add them:
Another thing to look at is the fuel overflow line was never installed on the bike (this occurred sometime before I bought the bike) and it is possible that excess fuel dumped into the air box because the port sits right above it i believe... Make sure to add a new line that dumps out the bottom of the bike.
Quote from: numus on December 29, 2011, 12:41:03 PM
Shonole check the RH coil wire.... Trace it back to above the starter solenoid and desolder the additional wire on that. That is the electronic Tach.. It should not be causing a massive voltage drop to the RH coil to cause a problem (but it may be).
Trust me.. for the price I sold the bike at, it is worth well more than that in parts alone...
Simply unplug the tach wires at the tach. No need to cut the wire (unless the wire is worn and shorting)
Though it obviously is not the original tach as a 1996 had a mechanical tach. So maybe the replacement tach is loading down the right side so you have a weak spark? Weak signal from the ignition control unit due to the replacement tach?
I unplugged it while I was working on the plugs, and it didn't have any effect. I'm think that maybe it just wasn't getting fuel, as the float bowl on the right cylinder was WAY off from the left, and the spring on the right float valve was missing. I've order replacements, so hopefully that will help.
I'm also replacing all of the fuel lines, and will be sure to add a drain hose onto the gas tank. I'm also going to toss a chain in with some kerosene (maybe diesel) in the tank to clean it out.
Thanks for the heads-up on the brake switch, I'll be sure to check it.
Quote from: numus on December 29, 2011, 12:41:03 PM
Quote from: mister on December 26, 2011, 06:23:17 PM
Quote from: numus on December 26, 2011, 01:43:11 PM
Sold the GS this morning! Thanks for the attempted help (i passed it along to the new owner). Hopefully He has the time to take care of PITA that i didn't have anymore
Does the new owner know of this problem - or - did you hide it from them so we will end up seeing them here asking about it, then watch them get all annoyed when they discover you were here first and knowingly sold them the bike without mentioning this problem?
Michael
I would never do that to someone (because i would hope no one would ever do that to me)...
Trust me.. for the price I sold the bike at, it is worth well more than that in parts alone...
So the owner had enough info to make an informed decision. Good One, numus :thumb: :thumb: :cheers:
Michael
Okay, ordered new float needles and seats, and bought a spare set of carbs. The carbs in PITA (we'll keep the name!) were ROUGH. The new set looked much, much better, minus one of the float needles being stuck. Put the bike back together, put the petcock on prime, waited a few minutes, and checked the floats for fuel. Nothing. Not a drop. So I worked my way back up, and realized it wasn't getting fuel. I believe the fuel tank petcock may be shot. It was working great before, but maybe turning it on and off so many times damaged it? Any way to test it? I have the tank off currently, and the petcock open. When it's open, fuel will come out of the reserve side, but not the primary. Is it completely shot?
Edit:
I took the fuel tank petcock off, and it appeared to be functioning properly. (I assume when it's open, it's only open about halfway on each side? Can this be verified?) I blew threw it and didn't have any problems. However, after I put the petcock in, and tipped the tank over, I was only getting fuel flowing from the reserve side. The tank doesn't have a ton of fuel in it (as I just put the carbs back together), is it possible that it just doesn't have enough gas to flow through the primary?
Update: Okay, added more fuel, didn't resolve the issue. If you flip the tank over, with the petcock open, shouldn't gas flow from both the reserve and the primary hose?
Quote from: Kijona on December 25, 2011, 03:19:40 PM
The fuel I'm not so sure about unless you're getting excessive backfiring inside the carb intake.
And if you are getting backfiring at the carb intake? I think this might be happening for me. Backfiring's occuring sometimes at random points during the cold start procedure (goes away once warm, but is replaced by low idle and occasional stalling at lights), and it doesn't sound like it's happening at the pipe (don't have enough experience to say with 100% certainty, to be honest, but it sounds like it's coming from below me, not behind me).
I have reason to believe I'm running rich* - is this consistent with what you'd diagnose if carb backfiring is occuring?
* I bought Buddha jets for a bike w/stock filter and exhaust (132.5 main and 20 pilot), and had a mechanic install them but he didn't drill/adjust the air mixture screws, so I think I'm probably not getting enough air. I'm going to do this myself once there're a few inches of snow on the ground.
Okay, I've got the bike running again, but it's idling at about 6000rpm. The idle screw is adjusted all the way out, and the choke is off. If I pull the choke, it only increases rpms. I won't run it more than a few seconds, because I don't want to strain the motor. Any ideas? I know to check for vacuum leaks, but with the idle this high already, I don't want to do any (more) damage.
Update:
I cut it on and sprayed WD40 at all of the gaskets, with no change in idle speed. Of course, it is idling at 6k+, so I don't know if the wd40 would even make a difference.
Edit:
I also realized that I tightened the throttle cable too tight. After loosening it, idle dropped to around 4500k with no choke. There is white smoke coming from the exhaust, and if you give it any throttle it hangs for a second or two. The rpms are now dancing every minute or so between 3500 and 4500.
Any ideas? I've tried searching to forum, and haven't found an answer yet. Could the mixture screws be an issue? It has a K&N drop in (from previous owner), and when I replaced the carb, I kept the jets from the replacement carb (they looked marginally smaller in diameter, but the opening appeared the same) because they looked a little better. Could this be causing my idle issue? It revs well, and doesn't seem to bogging anywhere.
Friday update:
The bike is still idling at around 4000rpm. I guess I'm going to strip the carbs down again and see if it helps any. As of right now, it's still only running on one cylinder. I haven't unplugged the tach yet, but I will be giving that a shot in the morning. I may even take a video an upload it, as if you unplug the left plug and try to start that bike, you can hear it wanting to start. I find it hard to believe that the same carb was messed up on both sets of carbs, but I guess anything is possible. I got new plugs, so I will be gapping them and trying that in the morning. Will update with progress.
Quote from: shonole on January 12, 2012, 10:48:51 PM
Friday update:
The bike is still idling at around 4000rpm. I guess I'm going to strip the carbs down again and see if it helps any. As of right now, it's still only running on one cylinder. I haven't unplugged the tach yet, but I will be giving that a shot in the morning. I may even take a video an upload it, as if you unplug the left plug and try to start that bike, you can hear it wanting to start. I find it hard to believe that the same carb was messed up on both sets of carbs, but I guess anything is possible. I got new plugs, so I will be gapping them and trying that in the morning. Will update with progress.
http://www.gs500e.co.uk/wire.jpg
If my memory is worth a damn, I tapped the black and yellow wire for the tach.. Look for continuity across that wire from the coil to the CDI. Also check to make sure the entire wires insulation is in tact or atleast wrapped... If it is grounding out it will cause a massive voltage drop to the coil...
Honestly until you are able to sort out the RH coil issue I wouldn't trust what the tach is reading at because it is based upon the voltage of that wire and obviously there is something wrong with the RH side of the ignition system.
As for the white smoke you noticed... Atleast 2 things come to mind. If you are storing it outside than it is moisture in the exhaust system and will clear up once the bike and exhaust warms up. It can also be burning carbon. I winterized with seafoam so there might be still some in the cylinder or the carbon deposits loosened and are now burning out.
Do you remember where you spliced them at? I'm having a difficult time locating it.
Okay, so this morning, when I first started the bike, it was running on both cylinders. Cut it off a few minutes later, and restarted, only running on one. I swapped the coils, and tried to start the bike on the right (non-firing) cylinder with the coil from the left. It started, but would not run without throttle. This only lasted for a few seconds, and then it would no longer fire. Still showing good spark. The coil from the right side functioned properly on the left. So I'm definitely chasing a gremlin on the right side of the bike. Any more ideas?
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 10:48:23 AM
Do you remember where you spliced them at? I'm having a difficult time locating it.
Okay, so this morning, when I first started the bike, it was running on both cylinders. Cut it off a few minutes later, and restarted, only running on one. I swapped the coils, and tried to start the bike on the right (non-firing) cylinder with the coil from the left. It started, but would not run without throttle. This only lasted for a few seconds, and then it would no longer fire. Still showing good spark. The coil from the right side functioned properly on the left. So I'm definitely chasing a gremlin on the right side of the bike. Any more ideas?
Was spliced under the right side fairing near the solenoid... Should be a red wire I believe.
Could be a clogged fuel or air valve or one that is sticking...
Quote from: numus on January 13, 2012, 01:59:00 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 10:48:23 AM
Do you remember where you spliced them at? I'm having a difficult time locating it.
Okay, so this morning, when I first started the bike, it was running on both cylinders. Cut it off a few minutes later, and restarted, only running on one. I swapped the coils, and tried to start the bike on the right (non-firing) cylinder with the coil from the left. It started, but would not run without throttle. This only lasted for a few seconds, and then it would no longer fire. Still showing good spark. The coil from the right side functioned properly on the left. So I'm definitely chasing a gremlin on the right side of the bike. Any more ideas?
Was spliced under the right side fairing near the solenoid... Should be a red wire I believe.
Could be a clogged fuel or air valve or one that is sticking...
Killed the tach and it made no difference. So I hooked it back up. Getting spark, but it's still only running on one cylinder. The curious part is that it did run on both cylinders temporarily when I first started it. I'll strip the carbs down again this weekend and see if that make a difference.
Oh, I also replaced both spark plugs. The plug on the right (non-firing) cylinder was fouled by dry carbon.
Could those cause fast idle? The tach seems to be correct, and you definitely tell it is idling way too high.
My biggest issue right now is that it is idling almost dead on 4000 rpm. I've done the WD40 test, numerous times with no change in rpm, so does that completely rule out vacuum leaks? I'll go buy some starter fluid tomorrow and use that instead.
I'm really struggling with this right now, and could use some ideas. Maybe someone close to the Thomasville, GA area that's willing to spend an afternoon helping me figure it out?
Okay, tonight I adjusted the idle air screw on the cylinder that is firing, and if I close it completely, the bike will idle at around 2000rpm.
Also, the bike will rev freely (they do hang a bit) but will not rev past 5000rpm or so when under load.
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 03:24:34 PM
Quote from: numus on January 13, 2012, 01:59:00 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 10:48:23 AM
Do you remember where you spliced them at? I'm having a difficult time locating it.
Okay, so this morning, when I first started the bike, it was running on both cylinders. Cut it off a few minutes later, and restarted, only running on one. I swapped the coils, and tried to start the bike on the right (non-firing) cylinder with the coil from the left. It started, but would not run without throttle. This only lasted for a few seconds, and then it would no longer fire. Still showing good spark. The coil from the right side functioned properly on the left. So I'm definitely chasing a gremlin on the right side of the bike. Any more ideas?
Was spliced under the right side fairing near the solenoid... Should be a red wire I believe.
Could be a clogged fuel or air valve or one that is sticking...
Killed the tach and it made no difference. So I hooked it back up. Getting spark, but it's still only running on one cylinder. The curious part is that it did run on both cylinders temporarily when I first started it. I'll strip the carbs down again this weekend and see if that make a difference.
Oh, I also replaced both spark plugs. The plug on the right (non-firing) cylinder was fouled by dry carbon.
Could those cause fast idle? The tach seems to be correct, and you definitely tell it is idling way too high.
My biggest issue right now is that it is idling almost dead on 4000 rpm. I've done the WD40 test, numerous times with no change in rpm, so does that completely rule out vacuum leaks? I'll go buy some starter fluid tomorrow and use that instead.
I'm really struggling with this right now, and could use some ideas. Maybe someone close to the Thomasville, GA area that's willing to spend an afternoon helping me figure it out?
Okay, tonight I adjusted the idle air screw on the cylinder that is firing, and if I close it completely, the bike will idle at around 2000rpm.
Also, the bike will rev freely (they do hang a bit) but will not rev past 5000rpm or so when under load.
You try removing the choke cable for the time being... maybe it is not releasing all the way (constantly choking the engine when you think it is off)?!?
Quote from: numus on January 13, 2012, 09:44:25 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 03:24:34 PM
Quote from: numus on January 13, 2012, 01:59:00 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 13, 2012, 10:48:23 AM
Do you remember where you spliced them at? I'm having a difficult time locating it.
Okay, so this morning, when I first started the bike, it was running on both cylinders. Cut it off a few minutes later, and restarted, only running on one. I swapped the coils, and tried to start the bike on the right (non-firing) cylinder with the coil from the left. It started, but would not run without throttle. This only lasted for a few seconds, and then it would no longer fire. Still showing good spark. The coil from the right side functioned properly on the left. So I'm definitely chasing a gremlin on the right side of the bike. Any more ideas?
Was spliced under the right side fairing near the solenoid... Should be a red wire I believe.
Could be a clogged fuel or air valve or one that is sticking...
Killed the tach and it made no difference. So I hooked it back up. Getting spark, but it's still only running on one cylinder. The curious part is that it did run on both cylinders temporarily when I first started it. I'll strip the carbs down again this weekend and see if that make a difference.
Oh, I also replaced both spark plugs. The plug on the right (non-firing) cylinder was fouled by dry carbon.
Could those cause fast idle? The tach seems to be correct, and you definitely tell it is idling way too high.
My biggest issue right now is that it is idling almost dead on 4000 rpm. I've done the WD40 test, numerous times with no change in rpm, so does that completely rule out vacuum leaks? I'll go buy some starter fluid tomorrow and use that instead.
I'm really struggling with this right now, and could use some ideas. Maybe someone close to the Thomasville, GA area that's willing to spend an afternoon helping me figure it out?
Okay, tonight I adjusted the idle air screw on the cylinder that is firing, and if I close it completely, the bike will idle at around 2000rpm.
Also, the bike will rev freely (they do hang a bit) but will not rev past 5000rpm or so when under load.
You try removing the choke cable for the time being... maybe it is not releasing all the way (constantly choking the engine when you think it is off)?!?
I hadn't. I've pulled and played with it, and it seems to be releasing, but I'll try taking it off tomorrow anyway. Did it used to require choke to start? Because it fires up now with no choke at all.
Edit: When cold this morning, it required about mid choke for a few seconds, but then ran okay without it. I also believe I've found the cause of my high idle. I got some starter fluid to do the vacuum leak test, and immediately found a leak at the boot between the engine and the carbs. Any good source of these? I've seen some on ebay (used) that are crazy expensive.
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 02:17:39 PM
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Just a thought...but have you replaced the little o-rings between the diaphragm caps and the face of the carb? Also...do yourself a favor, if you haven't already, and get replacement boots for the carbs.
Something else you might consider is smearing a little RTV (hope you're using the high-temp kind) around the connections on those little brass tubes (what're they called?) that protrude from the sides of the carbs...just in case it's leaking there.
As far as the mains...someone correct me if I'm wrong, but those seem awful big.
Edit: If it is leaking from those tubes, give the RTV time to dry before cranking it, as it might suck some into the carb which isn't gonna help anything. :P
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 03:28:19 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 02:17:39 PM
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Just a thought...but have you replaced the little o-rings between the diaphragm caps and the face of the carb? Also...do yourself a favor, if you haven't already, and get replacement boots for the carbs.
Something else you might consider is smearing a little RTV (hope you're using the high-temp kind) around the connections on those little brass tubes (what're they called?) that protrude from the sides of the carbs...just in case it's leaking there.
I have. Replaced them with some that were a little thicker, but the same diameter (best I could find at Lowe's).
I'm hunting for replacements boots now, hoping I can get some from adidasguy.
I'll definitely try smearing some RTV (it is the high-temp kind) there and see how it does. I'm really thinking (HOPING) that replacing the boots will solve the high idle issue. Then, at least, I'll only have to resolve the running on one cylinder issue.
Okay, so after some research, it turns out the new (used) carbs I bought have a dynojet kit. 134 mains, and very thin needles. I kept these when I installed the carbs. Do I need to swap back? Will this help my situation at all?
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 03:38:38 PM
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 03:28:19 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 02:17:39 PM
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Just a thought...but have you replaced the little o-rings between the diaphragm caps and the face of the carb? Also...do yourself a favor, if you haven't already, and get replacement boots for the carbs.
Something else you might consider is smearing a little RTV (hope you're using the high-temp kind) around the connections on those little brass tubes (what're they called?) that protrude from the sides of the carbs...just in case it's leaking there.
I have. Replaced them with some that were a little thicker, but the same diameter (best I could find at Lowe's).
I'm hunting for replacements boots now, hoping I can get some from adidasguy.
I'll definitely try smearing some RTV (it is the high-temp kind) there and see how it does. I'm really thinking (HOPING) that replacing the boots will solve the high idle issue. Then, at least, I'll only have to resolve the running on one cylinder issue.
Okay, so after some research, it turns out the new (used) carbs I bought have a dynojet kit. 134 mains, and very thin needles. I kept these when I installed the carbs. Do I need to swap back? Will this help my situation at all?
Well, the mains/needles do not affect idle. I don't know if I'd go messing around with the mains now since it has modified needles. Check your pilot jet sizes. Take apart an old lamp cord or RCA cable and remove a single strand of copper wire and run it through the pilot jet if you haven't already.
PM me your address and I'll mail you some o-rings. Those ones from Lowes are liable not to be gasoline resistant. I got a whole selection of different sizes that are nitrile.
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 07:52:32 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 03:38:38 PM
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 03:28:19 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 02:17:39 PM
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Just a thought...but have you replaced the little o-rings between the diaphragm caps and the face of the carb? Also...do yourself a favor, if you haven't already, and get replacement boots for the carbs.
Something else you might consider is smearing a little RTV (hope you're using the high-temp kind) around the connections on those little brass tubes (what're they called?) that protrude from the sides of the carbs...just in case it's leaking there.
I have. Replaced them with some that were a little thicker, but the same diameter (best I could find at Lowe's).
I'm hunting for replacements boots now, hoping I can get some from adidasguy.
I'll definitely try smearing some RTV (it is the high-temp kind) there and see how it does. I'm really thinking (HOPING) that replacing the boots will solve the high idle issue. Then, at least, I'll only have to resolve the running on one cylinder issue.
Okay, so after some research, it turns out the new (used) carbs I bought have a dynojet kit. 134 mains, and very thin needles. I kept these when I installed the carbs. Do I need to swap back? Will this help my situation at all?
Well, the mains/needles do not affect idle. I don't know if I'd go messing around with the mains now since it has modified needles. Check your pilot jet sizes. Take apart an old lamp cord or RCA cable and remove a single strand of copper wire and run it through the pilot jet if you haven't already.
PM me your address and I'll mail you some o-rings. Those ones from Lowes are liable not to be gasoline resistant. I got a whole selection of different sizes that are nitrile.
Seriously? You're awesome. :bowdown:
I went to check them the yesterday, and they were tight, so I'm going to try again tomorrow. I was worried about stripping them.
I actually have another set of (stock) needles, so I could just swap those over if the jets need to be pulled.
On a side note, I'm a member of a number of forums, and among them all, I've never been welcomed more openly, or assisted more freely than I have here. My hats off to all of you. :cheers:
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 11:45:28 PM
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 07:52:32 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 03:38:38 PM
Quote from: Kijona on January 15, 2012, 03:28:19 PM
Quote from: shonole on January 15, 2012, 02:17:39 PM
Took the carbs apart again today, cleaned them well, adjusted the floats (right was a little off), put a little RTV on the carb boot (hoping it would help the vacuum leak), fired it up and it still acted the same. If anything, it was a bit worse.
Recap of the symptoms, please help:
Idling around 4k RPM. (Even with idle adjustment all the way out, AND idle air screw completely closed)
Vacuum leak around the carb to manifold boot (attempted to temporarily fix with RTV)
Running on one cylinder.
When running, pours white smoke.
Also, when I took the carbs apart, I noticed that it has 134 main jets, do I need to change back to the 122.5s? It currently has a K&N drop in.
Please help! I'm at a complete loss.
Mods, thank you for changing the title, but can you update it with the new issues, as I no longer have the oil/fuel in the airbox issue. Thanks!
Just a thought...but have you replaced the little o-rings between the diaphragm caps and the face of the carb? Also...do yourself a favor, if you haven't already, and get replacement boots for the carbs.
Something else you might consider is smearing a little RTV (hope you're using the high-temp kind) around the connections on those little brass tubes (what're they called?) that protrude from the sides of the carbs...just in case it's leaking there.
I have. Replaced them with some that were a little thicker, but the same diameter (best I could find at Lowe's).
I'm hunting for replacements boots now, hoping I can get some from adidasguy.
I'll definitely try smearing some RTV (it is the high-temp kind) there and see how it does. I'm really thinking (HOPING) that replacing the boots will solve the high idle issue. Then, at least, I'll only have to resolve the running on one cylinder issue.
Okay, so after some research, it turns out the new (used) carbs I bought have a dynojet kit. 134 mains, and very thin needles. I kept these when I installed the carbs. Do I need to swap back? Will this help my situation at all?
Well, the mains/needles do not affect idle. I don't know if I'd go messing around with the mains now since it has modified needles. Check your pilot jet sizes. Take apart an old lamp cord or RCA cable and remove a single strand of copper wire and run it through the pilot jet if you haven't already.
PM me your address and I'll mail you some o-rings. Those ones from Lowes are liable not to be gasoline resistant. I got a whole selection of different sizes that are nitrile.
Seriously? You're awesome. :bowdown:
I went to check them the yesterday, and they were tight, so I'm going to try again tomorrow. I was worried about stripping them.
I actually have another set of (stock) needles, so I could just swap those over if the jets need to be pulled.
On a side note, I'm a member of a number of forums, and among them all, I've never been welcomed more openly, or assisted more freely than I have here. My hats off to all of you. :cheers:
Wait wait wait...
What were you worried about stripping out?? Be careful! Tell us first...I wasn't telling you to tighten anything I don't...think?
The pilot jets. Lol. I've run guitar string through them to clean them out, because they were a bit stuck, and I didn't want to screw them up by twisting too hard. It would be nice if I could get them out, just so I can see what size they are.
Do you have a set of stock jets too? You don't need to remove the jets to see what size they are. I would try to return the bike to as close to stock as possible. If you're running pods with #37 pilot jets then there's really no wonder why the SOB doesn't run. ;) I know you didn't put it like that though.
My philosophy is...start from the beginning. Get it back to the way it was made...then go from there. Do you happen to have the stock airbox/filter?
Mmmm...
Shine a bright light, or use a hand-held mirror, down in there and see. You should be able to make out their size. You can also tell if you've boogered them up. A flat-blade screwdriver that's slightly smaller than the channel should work. Just slide it down in there and with gentle pressure, turn it until you feel the blade go into the slot on the jet. Then with moderate pressure (10lbs maybe...5?) down on it, begin SLOWLY turning it.
Before doing that, I'd go buy yourself some "Liquid Wrench - Penetrating Lube" and spray it in there. Let sit for a few minutes. Should work.
I do. I've got a pair of 122.5s. I'm actually getting another box from adidasguy, so all I'll have to do is buy a new filter.
I've got some PB Blaster, so I'll spray it down later today and see how it goes.
Quote from: shonole on January 16, 2012, 01:27:42 AM
I do. I've got a pair of 122.5s. I'm actually getting another box from adidasguy, so all I'll have to do is buy a new filter.
I've got some PB Blaster, so I'll spray it down later today and see how it goes.
Excellent! And hey man...let me suggest an EXCELLENT bit driver set:
http://www.frys.com/product/4292254?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
If the shipping is cheaper than it would be to order it here: http://compare.ebay.com/like/110804799126?var=lv<yp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&_lwgsi=y&cbt=y
Or...if you have a Fry's anywhere near you...it'd be cool to get it from the store. I have a set and let me tell you it has come in HANDY for precision stuff like what you're trying to do. ;)
I'll have to check into getting one of those. I have some precision screwdrivers, but they're so hard to grip well.
Well, I put RTV on the leaking carb boot yesterday, started the bike and....
You guessed it! Still idling at 4Krpm. I've got some rubber undercoating spray I'm going to try today, until the new boots come from adidasguy. :thumb:
When I strip it down, I'm going to go ahead and put the stock main jets and needles back in, along with a new (stock) air filter. Hopefully somewhere along the line the right cylinder will decide to join in the party! :technical:
OKay, got the new boots in from Adidas and installed them. I also swapped a new coil on, and when I first started the bike, the right side fired and the left side didn't (opposite of what I had been experiencing). I pulled the right plug wire to see if it was firing, and the bike died. I then checked the left side, replugged the right and fired her up. With half choke she was idling great. I slowly worked her off of choke, and boom, she started idling crazy high again. :bs:
Symptoms:
Still idling high with idle air screw almost all the way closed, and idle adjustment almost all the way out. New boots on both sides of the carb, so there shouldn't be any vacuum leaks. And I STILL can't figure out why it won't fire on the right side (other than for the brief seconds it did when I first started it.
Also, checked the float bowl height using a tube. Filled up to slightly below gasket level, so I assume that wouldn't be part of the problem.
I'm getting desperate here. Any one have any fresh thoughts?
have you checked the carbs are synchronized?also chec that your coils are earthing properly like back to bare metal where they earth
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 04:09:06 AM
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Petcock is functioning, breather is clear. I've got a valve kit on the way, so that is the next major thing I will be working on.
I'm not sure who to check the CDI, any tips? I have a multimeter, guess I could start there.
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 09:18:26 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 04:09:06 AM
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Petcock is functioning, breather is clear. I've got a valve kit on the way, so that is the next major thing I will be working on.
I'm not sure who to check the CDI, any tips? I have a multimeter, guess I could start there.
Checking the CDI, the only way I know is to try a good CDI and look for a diference. :-s
Despite of petckock funcioning, did you really inspect its diaphragm? If its cracked there is going to be problems. I'm remembering that the Orings in the vacuum ports of the carbs is a item that used to be forgoten.A re you sure you didn't forget them?
The GAS in there, is good fresh gas?
Don't know if you checked this:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0 (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0)
Try to hit with a chopstick in every wire and tube (fuel and drains) of the bike, with the bike at idle, so if you can hear a change when you hit certain part...
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 09:34:26 AM
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 09:18:26 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 04:09:06 AM
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Petcock is functioning, breather is clear. I've got a valve kit on the way, so that is the next major thing I will be working on.
I'm not sure who to check the CDI, any tips? I have a multimeter, guess I could start there.
Checking the CDI, the only way I know is to try a good CDI and look for a diference. :-s
Despite of petckock funcioning, did you really inspect its diaphragm? If its cracked there is going to be problems. I'm remembering that the Orings in the vacuum ports of the carbs is a item that used to be forgoten.A re you sure you didn't forget them?
The GAS in there, is good fresh gas?
Don't know if you checked this:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0 (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0)
Try to hit with a chopstick in every wire and tube (fuel and drains) of the bike, with the bike at idle, so if you can hear a change when you hit certain part...
I opened the petcock up a couple of weeks ago and it looked good. Maybe I messed it up? :dunno_black:
O rings are brand new (Thanks Kijona!) Gas is fresh. I'll try the chopstick method.
Went out this morning to check on the bike. Replaced the right side coil with one from Adidas. Started the bike and it ran on both cylinders! :thumb: Unfortunately it was still idling a little high (1500rpm or so). Anyway, I left her running to see how things went and about 4 minutes later, she the idles climbed back to 3500-4000rpm and it started running on one cylinder again. :mad:
Also, while it was running on both cylinders, I tried adjusting the idle air screws to help the idle (as the main idle screw is backed almost all the way out) and when I adjusted on the right cylinder, it had no effect. However, on adjusting the left, it did bring the idle down. Unfortunately, the idle air screws are almost closed and I KNOW that's not right.
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 10:11:18 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 09:34:26 AM
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 09:18:26 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 04:09:06 AM
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Petcock is functioning, breather is clear. I've got a valve kit on the way, so that is the next major thing I will be working on.
I'm not sure who to check the CDI, any tips? I have a multimeter, guess I could start there.
Checking the CDI, the only way I know is to try a good CDI and look for a diference. :-s
Despite of petckock funcioning, did you really inspect its diaphragm? If its cracked there is going to be problems. I'm remembering that the Orings in the vacuum ports of the carbs is a item that used to be forgoten.A re you sure you didn't forget them?
The GAS in there, is good fresh gas?
Don't know if you checked this:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0 (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0)
Try to hit with a chopstick in every wire and tube (fuel and drains) of the bike, with the bike at idle, so if you can hear a change when you hit certain part...
I opened the petcock up a couple of weeks ago and it looked good. Maybe I messed it up? :dunno_black:
O rings are brand new (Thanks Kijona!) Gas is fresh. I'll try the chopstick method.
Went out this morning to check on the bike. Replaced the right side coil with one from Adidas. Started the bike and it ran on both cylinders! :thumb: Unfortunately it was still idling a little high (1500rpm or so). Anyway, I left her running to see how things went and about 4 minutes later, she the idles climbed back to 3500-4000rpm and it started running on one cylinder again. :mad:
Also, while it was running on both cylinders, I tried adjusting the idle air screws to help the idle (as the main idle screw is backed almost all the way out) and when I adjusted on the right cylinder, it had no effect. However, on adjusting the left, it did bring the idle down. Unfortunately, the idle air screws are almost closed and I KNOW that's not right.
Sounds like MAYBE one of your needles is broken. Reason I say this is because with the screws all the way closed, the bike should not run
at all. The fact that it's running that high with them closed means you've still got a vacuum leak somewhere. Remove the needle screws entirely (careful, they're held in with springs) and check them. Also be sure to check the o-rings on them as well if you haven't already.
I had one of mine break and I experienced similar issues.
Don't worry, new ones are only $8 if memory serves.
You should also be collecting items to make a carb sync tool. You'll need about 15-20 feet of aquarium tubing, water, food coloring, a magic marker, and a long (3-5ft) board.
Quote from: Kijona on January 27, 2012, 10:21:51 AM
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 10:11:18 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 09:34:26 AM
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 09:18:26 AM
Quote from: piresito on January 27, 2012, 04:09:06 AM
Petcock diaphragm, is it ok? Clogged carb breather?
Wouldn't valves out of adjustment be a cause of rough idle?
Sometimes, solid state devices start to fail intermittently until they fail totally. Is there a way for you to ckeck if your CDI is good?
There is some more fun to you!! :cheers:
Petcock is functioning, breather is clear. I've got a valve kit on the way, so that is the next major thing I will be working on.
I'm not sure who to check the CDI, any tips? I have a multimeter, guess I could start there.
Checking the CDI, the only way I know is to try a good CDI and look for a diference. :-s
Despite of petckock funcioning, did you really inspect its diaphragm? If its cracked there is going to be problems. I'm remembering that the Orings in the vacuum ports of the carbs is a item that used to be forgoten.A re you sure you didn't forget them?
The GAS in there, is good fresh gas?
Don't know if you checked this:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0 (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=48746.0)
Try to hit with a chopstick in every wire and tube (fuel and drains) of the bike, with the bike at idle, so if you can hear a change when you hit certain part...
I opened the petcock up a couple of weeks ago and it looked good. Maybe I messed it up? :dunno_black:
O rings are brand new (Thanks Kijona!) Gas is fresh. I'll try the chopstick method.
Went out this morning to check on the bike. Replaced the right side coil with one from Adidas. Started the bike and it ran on both cylinders! :thumb: Unfortunately it was still idling a little high (1500rpm or so). Anyway, I left her running to see how things went and about 4 minutes later, she the idles climbed back to 3500-4000rpm and it started running on one cylinder again. :mad:
Also, while it was running on both cylinders, I tried adjusting the idle air screws to help the idle (as the main idle screw is backed almost all the way out) and when I adjusted on the right cylinder, it had no effect. However, on adjusting the left, it did bring the idle down. Unfortunately, the idle air screws are almost closed and I KNOW that's not right.
Sounds like MAYBE one of your needles is broken. Reason I say this is because with the screws all the way closed, the bike should not run at all. The fact that it's running that high with them closed means you've still got a vacuum leak somewhere. Remove the needle screws entirely (careful, they're held in with springs) and check them. Also be sure to check the o-rings on them as well if you haven't already.
I had one of mine break and I experienced similar issues.
Don't worry, new ones are only $8 if memory serves.
You should also be collecting items to make a carb sync tool. You'll need about 15-20 feet of aquarium tubing, water, food coloring, a magic marker, and a long (3-5ft) board.
Checked the needles, both were okay. Removed the needle screws, and one of them was missing an o-ring entirely. :icon_eek: :icon_eek:
Replaced the o-ring, put it back together, and I've still got issues. I've definitely narrowed it down now. I have the right cylinder firing (Thank God!) :bowdown:, and now all I have to do is get this idle issue sorted out. I pulled the left plug wire, and adjusted the idle, and it fired and ran great on the right cylinder. I then left everything along, unplugged the right wire, plugged in the left, and it idles on the left cylinder at about 6000rpm. Seems like a massive vacuum leak on that side, no?
Now I just have to find it. I'm pretty sure it's inside the carbs, somewhere.
Man, you're not going to believe this. I thought about what you said, and how I really needed to sync my carbs (still do), so I got to looking at it to see how off it was, and the adjustment screw to sync the carbs was MISSING. >:( :technical: Took the screw off the other set of carbs, and temporarily adjusted it so that it would idle okay, and now I've got it running. Gonna let it run for awhile and see if that resolved the issue.
Update:
I'm guessing these carbs are in desperate need of synching. The right cylinder will now idle fine, but the left won't stay running unless I give it gas. Could float levels cause this? I'm about to check them again. Also, if my float levels are low (don't reach the gasket level) do I need to bend the prong up, so that the floats will come down more? Or the opposite? Thanks!
That's awesome that it looks like you are really starting to get this sorted. I feel your pain...I've gone through a lot of carb issues before I got it worked out. I made plenty of bone-headed mistakes along the way, and I have a feeling I still have more carb work to do!
One thing I can say...going throug this gives you a lot more confidence for the next project. :thumb:
Sorry you updated your post before I posted.
If your fuel level is low in the bowl, you need to adjust the float height as measured from the float bowl gasket surface on the carb when held upside down to be smaller. That way the float doesn't extend as far into the bowl before shutting off the fuel flow. Bend the tab whichever way accomplishes this. I hope that makes sense...
smaller float height measurement = high fuel level
bigger float height measurement = lower fuel level
Once again this is measured with the float pressed gently into place in the upside down carb (the float should be held up by the tab), from the gasket surface to the top of the float.
Once your fuel level is sorted and you have at least eye-ball synced your carbs, it's back to checking all of those orings and other potential vacuum leak sources.
Quote from: bombsquad83 on January 27, 2012, 02:05:35 PM
Sorry you updated your post before I posted.
If your fuel level is low in the bowl, you need to adjust the float height as measured from the float bowl gasket surface on the carb when held upside down to be smaller. That way the float doesn't extend as far into the bowl before shutting off the fuel flow. Bend the tab whichever way accomplishes this. I hope that makes sense...
smaller float height measurement = high fuel level
bigger float height measurement = lower fuel level
Once again this is measured with the float pressed gently into place in the upside down carb (the float should be held up by the tab), from the gasket surface to the top of the float.
Once your fuel level is sorted and you have at least eye-ball synced your carbs, it's back to checking all of those orings and other potential vacuum leak sources.
That's what I though, just making sure, because if I'm going to adjust it, it will only be a tiny bit. One is spot on, the other is ever so slightly low.
Looks like I finally have it narrowed down to only one simple issue. The left cylinder won't idle without throttle, but even the slightest amount of throttle and it works great. Both cylinders are now firing, and I actually got to take it out for a short ride! Once I get that resolved, it should be good to go! Thanks for all the help everyone!
Quote from: shonole on January 27, 2012, 04:30:40 PM
Quote from: bombsquad83 on January 27, 2012, 02:05:35 PM
Sorry you updated your post before I posted.
If your fuel level is low in the bowl, you need to adjust the float height as measured from the float bowl gasket surface on the carb when held upside down to be smaller. That way the float doesn't extend as far into the bowl before shutting off the fuel flow. Bend the tab whichever way accomplishes this. I hope that makes sense...
smaller float height measurement = high fuel level
bigger float height measurement = lower fuel level
Once again this is measured with the float pressed gently into place in the upside down carb (the float should be held up by the tab), from the gasket surface to the top of the float.
Once your fuel level is sorted and you have at least eye-ball synced your carbs, it's back to checking all of those orings and other potential vacuum leak sources.
That's what I though, just making sure, because if I'm going to adjust it, it will only be a tiny bit. One is spot on, the other is ever so slightly low.
Looks like I finally have it narrowed down to only one simple issue. The left cylinder won't idle without throttle, but even the slightest amount of throttle and it works great. Both cylinders are now firing, and I actually got to take it out for a short ride! Once I get that resolved, it should be good to go! Thanks for all the help everyone!
You still need to sync the carbs. Seriously! You should also, after everything is said and done, check the float height on each carb! :)Duh. I just read the whole post. My bad.
Yeah, check it again and then you should be alright. Just be careful, too high can cause flooding which is harmful to your motor - there's one guy on here who had his motor explode (kind of) with oil out the back because it started filling up with gas. Oil pressure exceeded what the seals could handle and BOOM one gave out and spewed oil all over his rear wheel.
As far as the carb sync tool...it's actually pretty easy to do. I know there are lots of diagrams and such laying around, I just don't know where one is.
Here's a picture of what it needs to be. Just imagine it with only two lines:
(http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6465/dsc00733ji1.jpg)
It doesn't have to be that fancy or complicated. All you really need is zip-ties, about 20 feet of aquarium tubing, water, food coloring (or whatever to color the water), and a board. Oh, and a magic marker or a pen. Just make a big "U" shape on the face of a 2x4 or whatever you have...make the tubes about...oh 2" apart or so, the bend being at the bottom, and have the tubes themselves be about 3-4 feet long. Fill to about the half way mark, mark the board where it sits after you fill it, and then hook'er up! :) It's that easy. And this will give you a very accurate picture of how well your carbs are synced.
check to make sure the little rubber cap is in good condtion or is still on the vacume take off point on the left carb .I put mine to the vacume operated fuel tap so i know it will be a seperate issue if i have problems latter down the track