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Plug on left is left cylinder when facing the bike.
Final running moments before being shut off was a spirited run to 10k a few times, than a 6k cruse into the parking lot where I Pulled in the clutch and switched it off while still rolling to try to get an accurate reading...
Am I correct in saying that I'm WAY too lean?
Could this be caused by ignition advance, or are my 22.5/65/145 jets just not enough, even though they are washered?
mostly lean. why are your plugs so rusty?
You might want to buy new ones.
Its lean, really, but thats not the end of the world. You're not going to blow pistons or burn valves or anything.
If you really get on the throttle and hear what sounds like rocks tinkling in a can, then you need to worry.
What mods are on that thing again?
Lean x2.
The whitish residue on the ground strap and the extra clean-ness of the electrode and ceramic insulator say lean. Bump her up a notch.
Quote from: Funderb on February 22, 2012, 12:49:06 PM
mostly lean. why are your plugs so rusty?
You might want to buy new ones.
Its lean, really, but thats not the end of the world. You're not going to blow pistons or burn valves or anything.
If you really get on the throttle and hear what sounds like rocks tinkling in a can, then you need to worry.
What mods are on that thing again?
Nope, no pre-detonation. almost 5k miles of testing.
Its ignition advanced (with all the 2001+ emissions stuff eliminated, so it actually works)
22.5/65/145 jets w/ washers under the main and mid-main jets (not the needle)
k&n filter
r6r exhaust pipe
It does pop a bit on decal from 10k to 6k after that, its pretty quiet.
maybe a bit up on the main, and leave the mid-main alone.
Heres a vid clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAgsRloPpDY&feature=youtu.be
I'd bump the pilot up, if its popping a lot. Or futz with the pilot air screws to draw more fuel/air mix into the pilot system first.
Definitely go up on the mains. Remember, unleaded fuel isn't going to read as honestly on the plugs, so be incremental in your adjustments.
A handy spark plug reading thread;
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=58839.msg669465
What are your turns out on the idle screw? You might need to turn it out a bit more. Maybe try 3 turns out. Those are lean for sure. I think your mid should be fine. Is your k&N filter a drop in or a lunchbox/pod type?
I wouldn't worry about it. Ideally they would be a light toasty brown color but slightly white isn't an enormous problem.
I've seen plugs that have a pure white crust all the way around the head of the spark plug and the motor was still fine.
I wouldn't necessarily worry about it. You might think about going up a size on the idle jet but other than that it's probably fine.
Symptoms of a motor being tuned too lean: running extremely hot, popping on revving down when the motor is revved to 6-7k in neutral. Popping during deceleration using engine braking is usually normal if you have an aftermarket exhaust.
Another tell-tale sign is if the idle hangs during revving down after being revved in neutral.
Also, does it seems like it takes a butt-ton of choke to get the motor to run when it's cold? That's another sign of lean tuning.
First off your spark plug is to hot you need to go to next colder plug .second to determine your main jet you need to do a plug chop ,this is done by finding a quiet spot where you can wind the bike out to its highest top speed and hold it there for a few seconds then close the throttle and kill the moter with kill switch and pull the clutch in and brake to a stop with out the moter idling.remove spark plugs and insert spares so you can get home and photograph your plugs and put them on here .and your idle mixture looks rich start at 3 turns out .Also it would be a good idea if you tell us your moter millage as a engine burning oil will spoil your readings
Quote from: Kijona on February 22, 2012, 08:24:38 PM
Symptoms of a motor being tuned too lean: running extremely hot, popping on revving down when the motor is revved to 6-7k in neutral. Popping during deceleration using engine braking is usually normal if you have an aftermarket exhaust.
Another tell-tale sign is if the idle hangs during revving down after being revved in neutral.
Also, does it seems like it takes a butt-ton of choke to get the motor to run when it's cold? That's another sign of lean tuning.
Motor don't seem hot, even for an air cooled.
In neutral, if I rev it to 7-10k, itll slightly pop till about 7 k, than sew machine down real quick.
No hanging, anywhere. It may dip slightly below idle, but itll bounce right back up. My idle is set at around 1100-1200k, and though slightly lopey, its stable.
Quote from: twinrat on February 22, 2012, 11:20:05 PM
First off your spark plug is to hot you need to go to next colder plug .second to determine your main jet you need to do a plug chop ,this is done by finding a quiet spot where you can wind the bike out to its highest top speed and hold it there for a few seconds then close the throttle and kill the moter with kill switch and pull the clutch in and brake to a stop with out the moter idling.remove spark plugs and insert spares so you can get home and photograph your plugs and put them on here .and your idle mixture looks rich start at 3 turns out .Also it would be a good idea if you tell us your moter millage as a engine burning oil will spoil your readings
Next colder plug? Do I just gap it slightly more?
That plug drop thing you described, is basically what I did coming into my lot, rode out 10k for a bit, than came in at 7-8k, and killed it and coasted in. That pic of the plugs is after that.
My idle is set at 2.5 out right now. My mileage averages 50-55 including spirited riding and the daily 1-9k run.
Quote from: xunedeinx on February 22, 2012, 11:45:08 PM
Quote from: twinrat on February 22, 2012, 11:20:05 PM
First off your spark plug is to hot you need to go to next colder plug .second to determine your main jet you need to do a plug chop ,this is done by finding a quiet spot where you can wind the bike out to its highest top speed and hold it there for a few seconds then close the throttle and kill the moter with kill switch and pull the clutch in and brake to a stop with out the moter idling.remove spark plugs and insert spares so you can get home and photograph your plugs and put them on here .and your idle mixture looks rich start at 3 turns out .Also it would be a good idea if you tell us your moter millage as a engine burning oil will spoil your readings
Next colder plug? Do I just gap it slightly more?
That plug drop thing you described, is basically what I did coming into my lot, rode out 10k for a bit, than came in at 7-8k, and killed it and coasted in. That pic of the plugs is after that.
My idle is set at 2.5 out right now. My mileage averages 50-55 including spirited riding and the daily 1-9k run.
I've found that my 07 doesn't like it if I set the idle any lower than 1500 hot (meaning set to 1500 once it's completely warmed up).
I would try 3 or 3.5 turns out on the mixture screws - you shouldn't be having popping when you rev the motor. Though first...try replacing those spark plugs, they're obviously beat to hell.
I'm not sure what Twin is talking about with a "colder" plug, unless he's talking about the gap is too big. Smaller gap = colder, bigger gap = hotter. That's why if you've got spark plug issues they only get worse with time. The gaps keep getting further and further out of spec and your motor will run hotter and hotter - you should've seen the plug that came out of my 86 XR250 right after I bought it - it didn't even have a curve on it anymore. The metal had been worn down to just a little nub at the end of the plug. How it even RAN is beyond me.
I know AutoZone carries the correct plugs for the bike - I don't have the number off hand but it's NGK something or another. I guess that's another thing...are you sure that you have the
correct plugs for the bike?
Found it. Thanks Pablo.
NGK DPR8EA-9 is the plug you want.
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 07:16:52 AM
Found it. Thanks Pablo.
NGK DPR8EA-9 is the plug you want.
Allright, come pay day I'll give them a shot. Than, after some break in, I'll compare 2.5 turns to 3.5. Keep in mind my pilots are 22.5, not 20
Quote from: xunedeinx on February 23, 2012, 09:27:50 AM
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 07:16:52 AM
Found it. Thanks Pablo.
NGK DPR8EA-9 is the plug you want.
Allright, come pay day I'll give them a shot. Than, after some break in, I'll compare 2.5 turns to 3.5. Keep in mind my pilots are 22.5, not 20
They're $3.49 a piece I believe. And also, yeah I guess I didn't think of that. The stock is 17.5. That's a pretty big jump. I dunno. Maybe the mids or mains are the issue. Or maybe there's no issue at all. Or maybe your valves are out of adjustment. I'd try the new plug and see how it feels.
Did you happen to sync the carbs?
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 12:22:27 PM
Quote from: xunedeinx on February 23, 2012, 09:27:50 AM
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 07:16:52 AM
Found it. Thanks Pablo.
NGK DPR8EA-9 is the plug you want.
Allright, come pay day I'll give them a shot. Than, after some break in, I'll compare 2.5 turns to 3.5. Keep in mind my pilots are 22.5, not 20
They're $3.49 a piece I believe. And also, yeah I guess I didn't think of that. The stock is 17.5. That's a pretty big jump. I dunno. Maybe the mids or mains are the issue. Or maybe there's no issue at all. Or maybe your valves are out of adjustment. I'd try the new plug and see how it feels.
Did you happen to sync the carbs?
Stocks 20 i think on the newer carbs
Ghetto synced it a while back, may need it again.
Ima try the new plugs soon and repost up.
Quote from: xunedeinx on February 23, 2012, 12:31:24 PM
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 12:22:27 PM
Quote from: xunedeinx on February 23, 2012, 09:27:50 AM
Quote from: Kijona on February 23, 2012, 07:16:52 AM
Found it. Thanks Pablo.
NGK DPR8EA-9 is the plug you want.
Allright, come pay day I'll give them a shot. Than, after some break in, I'll compare 2.5 turns to 3.5. Keep in mind my pilots are 22.5, not 20
They're $3.49 a piece I believe. And also, yeah I guess I didn't think of that. The stock is 17.5. That's a pretty big jump. I dunno. Maybe the mids or mains are the issue. Or maybe there's no issue at all. Or maybe your valves are out of adjustment. I'd try the new plug and see how it feels.
Did you happen to sync the carbs?
Stocks 20 i think on the newer carbs
Ghetto synced it a while back, may need it again.
Ima try the new plugs soon and repost up.
According to the Wiki they are 17.5's. Still though. I mean, your carbs are PROBABLY fine... it might just be a sync issue that's causing the lopy running OR your valves.
Yea you lean, and 6K but @ what throttle setting ... You should do it under load, 6K in 5th for a proper plug reading and hold it for 5 seconds, the wind down isn't the right time to read it. If you rev the bike to 8K under load say in 6th, and shut off the throttle, that very instant you will still be running near 8K with a closed throttle, guess what, you're super super lean, makes no diff though, the motor isn't working @ all, the bike is driving the motor.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on February 23, 2012, 12:53:44 PM
Yea you lean, and 6K but @ what throttle setting ... You should do it under load, 6K in 5th for a proper plug reading and hold it for 5 seconds, the wind down isn't the right time to read it. If you rev the bike to 8K under load say in 6th, and shut off the throttle, that very instant you will still be running near 8K with a closed throttle, guess what, you're super super lean, makes no diff though, the motor isn't working @ all, the bike is driving the motor.
Cool.
Buddha.
Would 6k in 1st or 2ed work?
Not many areas around here that I can hit 8k in 6th...None legally.
you need to hold it at maxium throttle in top gear for as long as possible to get a reliable reading ,even 10 seconds of idle will destroy your reading.Now when i say you need a colder plug it is not because your engine is running hot ,it is about the ability of the spark plug to transfer heat through to the cylinder head and reduce fouling on the spark plug under certain conditions.read this http://auto.howstuffworks.com/ignition-system2.htm there is a ton of info on the net.
your engine has to be in a healthy condition to give decent spark plug readings that mean any thing.things like good compression ,valves not tight, no air leaks in carburettor,no vac leaks,other wise its just a waste of time.
Got my new set of DPR8EA-9
Stock, one plug was perfect, right before .035, the other one was almost .04, so I made it exactly the same as the other one.
So, out of the box, their not always perfect.
Also changed the idle screw from 2.5 to 3.5, made a WORLD of difference as to the popping on decel, now it won't do it at all unless I bring it to 10k, than drop off the throttle under load, and its only for about 1k rpms.
But, I may have a new problem...
Just to check them, I ran each cylinder independently... without a plug basically.
The right seemed ok, the left seemed a lot more sluggish and deeper pitched (exhaust note) than the right cylinder.
Shes at 14k miles, maybe time for valves?
I have yet to do a compression test, but if it is valves, than it won't do any good anyway.