OK my mystery shock gave up the ghost.... So I am going to take it apart... So simple question... How...
Does the eyelet screw on the shaft or the clevise... This shock has the fuild on top... and a collar instead of threaded rings... so how do I split it open so that I can re fit it. Ofcourse I need to slice open the fluid column and buy seals and re fit it... but I have a plan for that.
Cool.
Srinath.
Be careful, even with the preload backed completely off, the spring could have some tension on it or it might have some gas pressure left in it. Disassemble it wrong and you might launch a piece of it into something.
I would recommend coughing up the dough to have a suspension shop do the work. They should be able to do three things you can't:
1)Identify where it came from.
2)Tell you if its rebuildable or not (alot aren't).
3)Rebuild and revalve it with experiance at fiddling with suspension.
JamesG... Duuuuuuude...
A replacement costs $20-30 on ebay etc... I aint paying $75 for a "professional shop" to do a thing....
1. Identify - It didn't matter for 6 years what do I care now...
2. Its not... It has a collar for spring adjustment not the threaded rings, so it needs a special trick to open it... How the hell did they put it together BTW.
3. Revalve... I dont care... Its a dead shock as it sits... open the damn thing and I may learn something... or it will be a sliced up dead shock... boooo hoooo... Right now its as pogo stick and bloody dangerous. And you know better than to suggest I take to a shop...
Cool.
Srinath.
You did ask if you could open it up with the aim of refiting it...
:dunno:
Matter of fact I did... But its no fun pointing out all the facts so yea what the hell... I'll prolly ruin it... and will learn a valuable lesson... Probably not to slice open a sealed shock... but I must learn... its currently serving no purpose...
Cool.
Srinath.
Yeah that ok.
I bought a cheapy GSXR shock off ebay that came with a cut hose. So I took the valving apart. Very in-to-rest-ing...
I think though your cheezy shock maybe a disapointing and maybe a bit of a uh... shock (be dum Bump crash!). Ball point pens are made with about as much quality control.
Btw- these nonrebuildable shocks are put together with press fitting, crimping, and spot welding.
Remote reservoir is more complicated... I'd never open one of those. The high pressure nitrogen... I am not touching it... hell I haven't touched one of those in 5 years...
Cool.
Srinath.
yeah that 2 ounces of nitrogen(@300psi) will kill you...better take it to a shop.... :nana:
Nope... not worried about that... just worried about the $50 they want to refill the bloody thing with nitrogen... and my non remote reservoir shock which was welded up and crimped and closed off permanently from every which way... had a nitrogen warning in the label... BS you think werase or did it really have nitrogen... I am thinking of sealing it and putting light wt...10 wt oil in it and making some rig to close it.
BTW I sliced it open... I'll post tommorow... Too busy right now trying to cook up some eat and sleep. Where can I get those seal type things... and are those oil seals... can I drop in oil seals instead...
Cool.
Srinath.
Quote from: seshadri_srinathRemote reservoir is more complicated... I'd never open one of those. The high pressure nitrogen... I am not touching it... hell I haven't touched one of those in 5 years...
Cool.
Srinath.
Actually they aren't. Instead of having to contain everything within the body of the shock, the external resevoir is really just a pressureized can with a bladder separating the gas charge that puts pressure on the oil (mostly just to keep air bubbles from forming). the compression vavling at the top of it regulates the flow of oil in with a separate valve for rebound or out out flow, instead of a single set of vavles to do both.
BTW- You can't buy seals for a non rebuildable shock unless you happen to have an inside contact at the Kayaba or who ever, because the shock is not designed to be rebuilt...
give it up and go buy a good shock. :P
I already bought a shock... a 92 GSXR 750 one... which I picked up from a local duuuuude... I might give back to him if I get my other issue solved... which brings me to a few Q's about the GSXR shock...
Where do you put the reservoir... its right now zip tied to the sub frame by my right foot.
The shock seems to also pogo a bit especially when sitting on it and bouncing, ohn the road it seems fine ... rebound is too low?? If I alter that, would it affect anything else.
And finally... the Katana short clevise shock I had saved up just for the occassion... did not fit the alloy linkage 89. So whoever wants to know... steel linkage is better, grind it cos its grossly overbuilt and fit the shock that you like.
Ok now back to my original topic...
The seals are available... they just go by ID, OD and thickness... infact there is companies that you send your seal to and they will match it and send it back. C'mon james you knew that. The shock was not designed to be rebuilt... but that doesn't mean you cant re build it. I already know how to close it back... Its not hard... but considering you can buy a katana shock for $20 there has to be a compelling reason to rebuild one... and mine is... my bike actuallt felt better with that shock than anything else... even a GSXR one... The gsxr one sits up too high, currently pogo's more than I like but that should be addressed shortly, and the reservoir location is just irritating. Further it cost me $75... I am currently looking for the steel linkage... and once I find it, I am going to fit the short clevise shock on it, and give the GSXR one back to the guy. Then I'll see if the shock needs rebuilding. But from this point on... it will go back together just fine I think. How it will work after... well that's the mystery. I am hoping it will be close to before... cos nothing else is.
Cool.
Srinath.
<shakes head sadly>
I predict we will be seeing a post from dear seshadri shortly; "My rebuilt shock blew out on the road today and I fell down..."
You HOPE you can get replacement seals, you don't know that for sure.
Suspension is too important on motorcycles to duck around with. If something gives at the wrong time IT WILL KILL YOU!
IMHO you need to throw that bad shock in the trash and either get that GSXR one dialed in for your bike, or pick up a fresh Katana one off ebay.
I actually have a steel linkage lying about burning a hole somewhere... or ther is one under the 91... and its got the stock GS shock... so an alloy linkage will work fine on it. I'll grind the linkage and drop that in the 89 with the Katana short clevise shokc... I'd rather use what I have lying about... that's why I held on to it in the first place. And I hear you on the being inportant part... However I dont belive I will do anyworse than the POS already was. I am planning to make a thick walled sleeve that slips over the cylinder tight, and weld it to it... have a groove cut in it at the right spot for a circlip. Then the whole insides go in with fresh seals, new 10 wt oil and I put a thick custom made washer and the criclip... O I may skip the washer, have the washer like thing made with threads and cut threads in the sleeve. Then use a spanner type tool to screw in the washer thing. Before you roll your eyes... its not my idea... I am copying something I saw a few years ago on american thunder or some like that. The guy opens and does some crap in the hydraulic part (Dont remember that part exactly but its a harley so who cares) and re fits it with such a fitting. And that shock was twice the diameter of ours, and that nut was pretty thin... maybe 5 mm or so... I figure 5mm thick should do it in this case as well...
I am betting if you tried to pull the piece apart... Mine will need more force to pull it apart than the stock (not GS stock but what this was before I sliced it open) or the rolled end crap of a katana shock....
Cool.
Srinath.
If you want to see the internals of a Nitrogen shock, I have a dissasembled 1994 YZ 250 shock I can send you free. The shaft was bent and not rebuildable. Really not much to them. Just a bladder and some valving.
Yes please... Though I have also scored a bent shaft non remote one free from my friend... I want to actually try and use parts from other shocks in case it can make my life easier. Please send it to 9227 swallow tail lane, charlotte NC 28269. I'll send you a check for your postage.
Thanks.
Srinath.
(http://www.gstwins.com/forum/images/smiles/bowdown.gif), keep posted on what you can accomplish, im kinda curious to see :) :?
hmmm nitrogen, funny , i work at the airport, they use nitrogen in the tires intead of air. hmmmmmmmm. if someone has one of these shocks laying around and is willing to part with a functioning unit dirtly cheap. i will see if i can get the guys from delta, or southwest to fill it, if they can, then i might be able to open up a cheaper source,most of them are cool enough.
OK update...
The seal I need is a 14X30X5... easily available is a 14X30X7... costs $1.45 btw. Dust seal, also available easily for ~$1.50 is 14X20X3... right about perfect. To fit it back together, I have to machine 1mm (actually less than 2mm cos it was 6mm before wearing is what the guy said cos the slot it fits into was 6mm+) off the cap and sorta cut a different groove for the dust seal. The stock one was pathetic... to fit a decent one, it needs a slightly different profile. I could re make the entire end cap and have it fitted back so it bolts together, clips together or fine welds back but in a better position where its easier to open if needed. Might do that instead... so I have a choice of seals... some much better seals are available in the 13.9X25-27 size range. Also re fabbing it lets me weld sorta far away from the sensitive parts like oil, O-rings and seals. BTW the GSXR shock is not pogoing any more... but its stiffer than I like. Even my weight is doing little to compress it... I think the mystery shock is going to come back to life just fine and prolly cost me under what a Kat shock + shipping will be and every subsequent rebuild will be just a couple of bucks and I can actually open the thing and tune it... I mean really tune it not just do rebound adjustments.
Cool.
Srinath.
OK JamesG I am probably not rebuilding the shock I sliced open... are you happy now...
Just kidding... The reason is... there seems to be a little divot in the slider rod right where it would sit in the seal. Its chromed over and I didn't even notice it till now... But I can get a finger nail feel of it and I definitely can see it... so that explains why it blew... But it held for 15 years... Surprising... And no I didn't hit it with the saw or other tool when I sliced it open... its over 1/2 inch lower down the shaft. So I am screwed... Now that I have 90% of the seal work done.. I might fix it anyway just for practice... and more of a feasibility study thing. I'll show you the pieces when we meet... 18-20 dec good for you. I can actually drive to columbus if you aren't coming towards atlanta.
Cool.
Srinath.
OK I know how it held for 15 years.
When the shock is fully extended... which is when the edge of the divot in in the inner edge of the seal... There is no pressure on the fluid. The shock compresses even 1mm and the divot is in the oil and the clean part of the shaft is in the seal. Then as it compresses more and more... the pressure increases and the seal holds up fine. This shock has the fuild reservoir upside down, and when the seal went hard... the entire contents of the reservoir got dumped. Now I am thinking I should be able to compensate for the divot. I believe I can make the body longer by 2mm and machine up a 2mm spacer/washer and put it on the rod. I might lose 2mm of the stroke... but I have never used 1/2 its travel, and remove the divot from the equation. Or just do the spacer, not the body and that would shorten the shock by 2mm, make the ride height lower by 4mm... but the read end is over 1.5 inches higher with this shock over stock... so it would be 1.25 inches higher over stock... big deal.
Cool.
Srinath.
If you let me throw that POS in the trash for you when you come down here I will GIVE you a perfectly good SV650 shock or your choice of several GS ones.
:P
If you see what the things looks like... you'll encourage me to fix it... I sliced it open quite nicely. And it has adjustable rebound. Well I have a bunch of GS shocks... and well an SV shock would be fine but mine had rebound adjustment... I should be able to fix it easy... I am welding it back together BTW... so one less thing to worry about. BTW... How did the suzuki morons weld the thing up so close to the O-ring without worrying if the O-ring will burn out...
Cool.
Srinath.
It HAD adjustable rebound...
Ha ha...
It has, and it will again. Worst case... I'll slice open the one with the bent rod, and drop this rod in with new seals etc, and slice off the clevise on the other end and weld the eyelet on from this one... cos its got the eyelet connected to the rod unlike this which has the clevise and rod as one piece.
BTW... How many zip ties can your bike have before you are officially "white trash". Cos the bike now has 16,000... even for me that's a bit much.
Cool.
Srinath.
OK I sliced open another shock, it had a bent rod...... This was more like the GS/katana shock... but unlike a Kat shock it didn't have rebound adjusters... Now This was crimped over, I ground off the crimp lip... easy with a becng grinder... Hold it at an angle, holding the eyelet/rod and it spins the shock body beautifully... making its own lathe... anyway... it opened up, and had to have some serious force to yank it open... This is the ball point pen quality you are referring to. My other one was 1000 times better. Now I know what you were referring to. However this is boubd to be easier for me to close up, I prolly wont but this was easier to open and will be eaiser to close. The thing also has hydraulic damping separate from the sealing... and it has a simple 14X42X12 seal... easy to get... anyway...
Cool.
Srinath.