why people upgrade when they dotn have enough skill.
Worse yet why new riders seem to pick the 600 cc class as their first bike and then claim insurance on it because they cant ride for jack. Or they torment us GS500 riders for riding a 500cc when I am clearly faster than them around corners (even with bald tires). So I cant wheelie like them, or cant do a stoppie, but its not because i am not capable but its because i want to be a safe rider and stay alive...
Pah! Newbies....
A new GSX-R 600 is staggeringly fast. Also deadly in the wrong hands (ie a ner rider). Now I know some new riders do have respect for the equipment but many are out of their league.
For example. I knew a girl who she wnd her boyfriend bought new bikes. She bought a rebel 250 and he bought a Honda 600r. He crashed it in two weeks getting into a corner too hot. Why? He was a beginner. I warned her he should look for something more tame but he wouldn't listen. Worse, he didn't insure it for collision :o :lol: :roll:
what i dont understand is why ppl think they lose their balls if they are caught riding a 500cc or much less a 250.
I will be happy riding a 250cc.. (or is it because I am secure about myself).
I had tonnes of fun on a lower powered bike, even a 250cc makes life a lot easier. I am looking for a Ninja 250 (really dirt cheap) so I can use it as a track / street bike.
I started with a lower powered bike, i started with a 50cc 2stroke 3.5hp moped.. and I am not ashamed for it. Infact the fact that I started smaller makes me a more confident rider, though sometimes i do not go too hot into a turn because i dont want to crash and have to deal with fixing the bike, i rather ride within limits and enjoy without going too hot.
Anyway the other thing that bugs me is new riders who decide its cool to ride without proper gear. I very very rarely ride wihout my jacket, and even if I dont ride with a jacket its for a very very short distance, and i feel uncomfortable. I dont think i can ride without a helmet, i tried it, its not comfy, i prefer the safety that my helmet gives me, even if it costs only 100 bucks but i still feel safer than without one.
I wont ever get on a 250... I'd be like a over grown baby on one of those plastic toy bike... besides... with my weight... it rather unsafe if you are struggling to make highway speed on the on ramp.
Cool.
Srinath.
The people who make fun of you for riding your GS are probably the same ones who won't still be riding in 5 years.
Sure, I drool over all the new hyperbikes you see in Sport Rider every month. But the truth is, I want to ride for a long time...a VERY long time, so I'm not in any big hurry to run out and buy a GSXR1000(or 600 for that matter). Yeah, funds willing I may get a 600 in the next year or two...maybe not...either way I'll still love riding. At least I know when the time comes, I'll have some experience under my belt to help me adapt to a new machine.
I think if you see motorcycling as a life-long endeavour, you know you have time to do things in a logical progression. You don't NEED to run out and buy the best/fastest thing on the market, yesterday.
I'd be willing to bet that a good many of these new rider supermen on their shiny new muscle bikes will end up crashing or scaring the crap out of themselves at some point, and that will be it. I know a few people who've done that. They go out and get some bike that's WAY over their head for a first bike.....total it (and themselves in the process)...then write motorcycling off as "too dangerous" never to swing a leg over another bike again.
Whenever somebody makes fun of your GS, just smile smugly in the knowledge that in 20 years you'll still be riding around while they'll be mumbling about how crazy you are for doing it.
:cheers:
John
Couldn't agree more. My wife and I stopped to refuel today. (We're both new to riding. She has a Rebel 250, which by the way I find a blast to ride.) Anyway, this knob walks over to us and, while looking over the Rebel, says "Looks like someone's learnin' to ride, eh?" :roll: I know he didn't mean in it in a bad way, but I'm so tired of the attitude that anything less than 1000cc is the "beginner bike" that you only ride until you get your Harley or R1. :bs:
I guess most people who ride these days are in it more for the poser value than for the enjoyment of riding 'cuz smaller/lighter bikes are extremely fun as long as it's not uncomfortably small.
Yea and they buy a new GSXR 1000 and think they are riding a man's big bike... yea... try riding something that has enough power to stand up significantly under acceleration and no handling or brakes to handle 1/3 of the power it makes.... Like riding a bull down the main street in pamplona... Yes a eli 1000 is all of that and it weighs enough to feel like a small truck at parking lot speeds... a small 2 wheeled truck that is... GSXR 1000... please its a joke, better handling and brakes than the GS500, and less torque than the eli 1000 well it does have more power... but...
Cool.
Srinath.
Quote from: seshadri_srinathYea and they buy a new GSXR 1000 and think they are riding a man's big bike... yea... try riding something that has enough power to stand up significantly under acceleration and no handling or brakes to handle 1/3 of the power it makes.... Like riding a bull down the main street in pamplona... Yes a eli 1000 is all of that and it weighs enough to feel like a small truck at parking lot speeds... a small 2 wheeled truck that is... GSXR 1000... please its a joke, better handling and brakes than the GS500, and less torque than the eli 1000 well it does have more power... but...
Cool.
Srinath.
yea. that gsxr100. thats like a really fast bike right. i think im gonna get that for my first bike. the first thing im gonna do ist get in some shprts t-shirt. tennis shoes and some cool $150 pair of sun glasses and ride really fast down mainstreet while doing a wheely. and then im gonna run into a brick wall and die. you see what i get for starting out on a big bike.
yea u know what that sounds like. im perfectly fine with my gs and if some poser comes up on a r1 and doesnt know how to shift the damn thing or even lose his brakes while hes doin 180 down a freeway and gets cutoff by some fool on a cell. im gonna laugh cause he dont no what the hell hes doin. yep thats how i feel.
IMHO, the most important part of the equation is the rider, not necessarily the bike. You can hurt yourself just as quickly on a GS as on any other bike if you don't respect the throttle and learn/practice your fundamentals.
That having been said, an irresponsible rider will be more likely to pick up a GSXR or a CBR, or something like that as a first ride. Granted they are the minority, but there are those who start off on higher powered bikes and live to tell the tale ;)
Maybe I live a sheltered existance, but I haven't experienced any ridicule or anyone disrespecting the 500cc bikes. In fact, most of the time when I'm on the highway, I get a 'thums-up' :thumb: from at least one cager on my ride. I love my GS, and in the appalachian twisties, its just as good as any sportbike... I fully plan on keeping the GS even after I 'upgrade'. In fact, i'll most likely log more time on the GS even after I buy my next bike.
well said vtlion. you make a good point and i too plan on keeping my gs for my all-around bike. unless i need the money to bu the one i want. personelly, i want an sv650s/1000s as my next
Ok, im not falling inline here, i love the gs500e, i have to admit, its one of the neater handling bikes i have had the chance to ride agressivly. i like my maxim for alittle more pull power and crusing, my all time favorite bike was an 85 Yamaha FJ600, it handled well (for that time) and wasnt warp 7 break your neck. At this point just about everyone here can tell that i am not new to rideing, my ideal stable if bikes would be the following classes of bikes.
a nice 750-1000 cc general porpose/cruiser, this would have big fairing and hard bags. this could be a GS1000G, a GL1000 (goldwing),XS750-1100, or KZ1000
a nice trackdays type bike but still able to use as comuter too RZ350,gs500,GPZ550,FJ600 or FZ600
a major playbike that i can go to BUM F#@$ EGYPT (local slang for way out in middle of nowhere) and do HIGH speed runs for the speed demon in me, i like the older stuff, like the 89-93ish GSXR750's. the FZR750, theZX1100,or the Hurricane 750's
then, something to get dirty, this would have to be 4 stroke thumpers of the 250-500cc range and would have to be dual sport, i dont like HAVING to trailer my diggers around. Point is, idont hate the big bikes cuz someone doesnt veiw anything less then XXXXcc as anything more then a toy/beginers bike, i just dont respect the person who made the comment.
I used to work bike-setup at a DC-area dealer and I remember one day putting together a yellow Honda 929 when the salesman told me to hurry up with the prep because he had already sold the bike and he had the customer waiting. Turns out the new owner was upgrading from a scooter. The mechanics and I made jokes as to how long it would be before we would see the bike again, if it would be two or maybe three weeks before the guy would have it in for new bodywork.
Well, we were wrong. The guy didn't even make it out of the parking lot. He wound up the motor, dumped the clutch, panicked and low-sided for a good 10-15ft.
Well, as you all can tell by my counter, I'm new to these boards, however, I can't agree with you all more. I looked for a good while when I was trying to decide what bike I wanted to start with. It turns out that the GS500E kept popping up in conversation as a great starter. I'm so glad I got it. I had NEVER riden a motorcycle before, and I actually was up and riding around before the weekend was over on my GS. I'm not proficient enough to ride on the street by myself yet, but I don't think it will be long before I will be. I also respect the speed/power in motorcycles. I was AMAZED at the acceleration of this bike! I've owned a few sports cars such as tuned Mustang 5.0s, a Twin Turbo Z, and a Corvette, however, I don't believe any of them could have out accelerated this bike (how fast do they do 0-60 anyway?) The acceleration was A LOT faster than I expected. I can't imagine trying someting more poweful right now, nor do I understand why any beginning rider would want to. I can say that I am having a blast learning, and I really enjoy what I've done so far. I want to stay alive and enjoy many years of my new found hobby.
Being out in the wind, on top of something as opposed inside etc all add to the illusion of speed... Believe me for the most part a tuned (how tuned...) newer 4.6 overhead cam mustang will wipe the floor with a GS.
But also maybe I am very very slow as werase likes to point out...
Cool.
Srinath.
Yeah too many new riders are getting on too powerful bikes as their first bike...(A freinds son is likely going to be riding in the spring and he's mentioned the New zx6r...I'm working on him..)...
I'm not falling in line either...I ride a ZX11 (fair handling for a 600 pound Sport-tourer..and the acceleration goes without saying..).
I started on a Gs500e...and am currently putting together one for fun..for me.I also buy-fix-and sell bikes here and there and I love the GS ( especially for working on them/parts availability..)...
I still really like riding them....light and decent handling (mine will get the progressives and a b-12 shock..). You don't have to have 150 Horsepower and be able to do wheelstands all day to enjoy riding....
But there is something nice about having that arm-lengthening power on tap...
oh Yeah...Hey there Koko....good to see you on the board- Welcome...the 92 is now running by the way.
I don't see a problem with a 250 or whatever, there are some good little bikes out there. I'm just a couple of years away from the dreaded 60th birthday and keep active and fit etc but the old upper body strength does creep away, if I get to the point where I cant manhandle the GS I'll happily ride something smaller and lighter especially if the alternative is to stop riding. When the sporties come screaming over my shoulder I'll smile to myself, bin there..done that...Keep riding that's the thing.
I think most people get caught up in the marketing. We all get caught up in it to some degree, but the majority get truly suckered in.
Case and point H-D. People will spend tons on accesories just b/c it says H-D. People will spend the extra cash for a Harley over a cheaper/imported cruiser b/c of the image.
I've had a few people give me smile for my "small" displacement bike.
It does bother me a bit, but that all goes away when I hit the start button.
One of the H-D guys at the office doesn't understand why my next bike will most likely be a 600-650cc bike. I don't have the heart to tell him that he has to have a huge engine b/c it so inefficient H-D has to make things bigger.
Also, bear in mind that most negative attitudes come from the land of big trucks and SUV's. I seriously doubt you'd get many questions on your GS in Europe.
My buddy has a ZRX1200 and he's told me time and time again I picked a winner of a bike. Starting on something with tons of power...well the odds are against you.
My two cents.
RC
Speaking from experience: I had a 450 nighthawk, and "upgraded" to my GS.
My buddy bought a ninja 250, R6, GSXR 750 and GSXR 1000.
We go riding together sometimes and occasionaly we'll switch bikes. I'm telling you these super sport bikes a NO FUN at slow speeds.
I used to love riding his bike - (yes I've been over 290KM/hour) - but now, I don't even want to ride it, cause unless you doing 100 MPH/160KMH your bored.
I don't think there is any reason that these bikes even exist. Even a GSXR 6 or the like can do about 240KMH or more. Europe has the correct Idea in limiting the HP you can have when starting.
I'll get off my soap box now :cheers:
...Also, I can keep up with him on twisty roads, cuz I can RIDE. He also can ride, but you don't need a super sport to handle well. :cheers:
i am completely in favor of horsepower limitaitons for new riders. I want to do a study of motorcycle crash data between the US and countries where the HP limitation is in place. My first bike was and still is a 1967 yamaha ycs1 (see WOF pic) . It's a 180cc and to be honest, I think it's even more fun than the GS to ride around in town. Plus iget more attention on it ( the poser in me i guess).
Jake
so you guys want to go the "lets defend our bike rout" OK I'll play along. :)
Actualy, I have recieved two complements for my choice of bike (1998 gs500e) and both were from guyes on much bigger machines. One was a harley something or other and the other was a friendly neighbor-hood shadow 750. Both were very friendly and the shadow said... "nice little bike" (he had lots of respect in his voice........ no, realy, he DID) :P
The thing I realized as the Shadow pulled away (waking up most people on that saturday morning with his abnoctiously laud "farting" pipes) was that we all love to ride, and most of us ride what we feal are comfortable tastefull machines. And no it's not the size that counts. If I can apreciate the laid back styliing of the Shadow and he can apreciate... well what ever it is that he sees in the GS then we can all get along on the twisty roads of life. (some faster then others and some scraping less crome, but we can all get along with big smiles on our faces) 8)
QuoteIt's not the cages it's their drivers and 1% of bikers
I have to agree with dsmirnov83 about cruiser riders. They seem geniunely interested when I meet them in the parking lot and frequently chat about the GS. On the highway I miss a wave or two when a cruiser rides by, but when they see you at zero mph with your visor up, as a person and not a bike, they're just as cool as the rest of us.... with rare exception, of course ;)
i dont have a problem with older rider, / mature riders who know that there is nothing wrong about riding a 500cc, each is their own and as long as their a good rider and stays to the laws they actually appreciate us riding a GS500 even if we have been riding for more than a few months.
They respect us cause we are sensible bikers.
But if they see a new rider on a new bike obviously they get a little worked up.. and its true i do too.. that's why this thread..
I have a friend who really shouldn't be riding. He has owned two bikes. He crashed both of them. They were both 6oo's. now he says he is going to get a hybousa. "What!" I said. "Are you crazy?" He thinks there is no problem, and it wasn't totally his fault that he wrecked. One of them was, he was just being dumb, and riding beyond his skill level. The other, he hit a deer. Under normal circumstances, I would oblige, but he was going over 70 in a 45. DUH!
-Anti
All I have to say is: No one gets behind the wheel of a Ferrari their first time driving, so why get a super fast bike your first time riding?
Here, in Australia, you are only allowed up to a 250cc, or in some states, up tp 660cc with a power to weight ratio of less than 150kw/ton (no, I don't know what that actually means :? ), when you are learning, for the first 3-12 months (depending on your age and license)
The GS500 is probably one of the most powerful learner legal bikes here, and there are absolutly tons of people riding 250's.
I think it's totally crazy to be able to get a motorbike license and just go and get a 600+ cc sports bike.
Of course, I'm just hanging out for my unrestricted license, so I can get a 600cc sports bike ;)
Well, if the 250cc bikes are 4 cylinders like the CBR 250RR or ZX-2, then they will have close to the power of a GS (but at much higher rpms)
If the 250 is a NSR, TZR or RGV two-stroke, however, it could have up to 70hp in street trim.
I guess the 400cc bikes might be over the power to weight limit in Australia.
Panik...best guess is about a 10 pounds per 1 HP rating for new riders .... (1 kilowat is about 1.34 horsepower..). If your bike weighs 500 pounds..you are allowed 50 horsepower.......
I also think that displacement/power restrictions for new riders should be mandatory......It's just common sense...(but I guess not everyone is born with as much of that as they need ...)
Anyway....
Quote from: Adam RIf the 250 is a NSR, TZR or RGV two-stroke, however, it could have up to 70hp in street trim.
I guess the 400cc bikes might be over the power to weight limit in Australia.
Those two stroke 250s are actually specifically banned for learners here, but the Honda RVF 400 is learner legal apparently
http://www.geocities.com/nikoslz/Honda_RVF_400_Specs.htm :o
Quote from: JaredPanik...best guess is about a 10 pounds per 1 HP rating for new riders .... (1 kilowat is about 1.34 horsepower..). If your bike weighs 500 pounds..you are allowed 50 horsepower.......
Yeah, that's about right. So if the GS has 47hp (35kw) and weighs 372lbs (170kg), it has a power to weight ratio of 205kw/ton (1000kgs) :?
either my maths sucks, they don't measure power to weight like I do, or they approved it anyway?
Maybe they include fuel and a rider (+70kgs?) that would be about 145kw/ton...
Here are the Learner legal bikes in NSW, Australia. If anyone is interested.
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/licensing/tests/motorcycleridertrainingscheme/motorcyclesnoviceriders.html
They may use the Rear wheel horsepower figure...47 hp is at the crank if I'm not mistaken....
Most gs's will get 42-43 rwhp with a Pipe-jet-filter upgrade ( if tuned well)..
So a stock one is less ...( I don't know the figure..)..
But yes maybe they do figure in a rider weight and fuel/oil in the bike...
New riders should be required to take a riding exam of some sort. I know it won't stop them from showing off but at least they'll know how to ride before starting of on 100+HP.