I know, I know, this is a GS500 forum, altough I'm getting desperate...
I'm trying to get the carbs out of a CBR600 F4 and those fuckers doesn't want to come out. I've loosen all the clamps, rechecked everything but those gas suckers won't come out, they move just a little bit. I've tried also using two long wrenches to pry them out, but no success.
Anyone has experience with those?
Regards,
Loosen the clamps @ the engine as well - I think it has the clamp style ones that go on the manifold not the flange style.
Then lubricate the crap out of em, spray them with wd40 all over.
Then wiggle and shake and work em, and spray more.
Remember this ... getting out is less than 1/10 the difficulty of getting it back in.
Lube and put a 2 X 4 behind it and use a tarchet tie down to the front forks or something.
Cool.
Buddha.
:thumb:
Priceless! That ratchet tie seems an excellent idea!
Thanks! Will post news...
Welcome to the world of carbureted I4's :laugh:
-Jessie
Lol...and I'm yet to get to the valve clearance check! :woohoo:
I'd recommend trying fire
pt 1
http://youtu.be/AXoDX1RzBJ4
pt2
http://youtu.be/pPwbAEI5lm4
Quote from: tt_four on March 21, 2012, 01:31:01 PM
I'd recommend trying fire
Too soon to set it on fire. But it's an idea afterall... :icon_twisted:
Ive seen those videos, that procedure is very similar to an F4. Although in those videos, one can't see the part where he actually pull the carbs. When you see him pulling it, there is already rags at the intakes. I'm 99.9% sure that my procedure is right, but those rubber boots are so dry and stuck that they appear more like molded plastic than rubber. One possibility will be cutting them!
About the ratchet strap...just found out there is no place that I can attach it! The whole engine is at an angle, the boots are at a 90º angle from any metal part in the bike, so I would be pushing them sideways instead of lifting them. Smart approach but I think it won't work in this situation, does it?
I've been told that a air dryer or heat gun will also help. So till now, I've got: Lube, heat, lube, more heat, Crowbar?! Any suggestion? Warnings?
Quote from: The Buddha on March 21, 2012, 09:19:36 AM
Loosen the clamps @ the engine as well - I think it has the clamp style ones that go on the manifold not the flange style.
Then lubricate the crap out of em, spray them with wd40 all over.
Then wiggle and shake and work em, and spray more.
Remember this ... getting out is less than 1/10 the difficulty of getting it back in.
Lube and put a 2 X 4 behind it and use a tarchet tie down to the front forks or something.
Cool.
Buddha.
the Buddha Loves You is right on this one. try carbs on a viagra
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on March 22, 2012, 03:45:13 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on March 21, 2012, 09:19:36 AM
Loosen the clamps @ the engine as well - I think it has the clamp style ones that go on the manifold not the flange style.
Then lubricate the crap out of em, spray them with wd40 all over.
Then wiggle and shake and work em, and spray more.
Remember this ... getting out is less than 1/10 the difficulty of getting it back in.
Lube and put a 2 X 4 behind it and use a tarchet tie down to the front forks or something.
Cool.
Buddha.
the Buddha Loves You is right on this one. try carbs on a viagra
Can you elaborate? Didn't get it... :dunno_black:
Quote from: piresito on March 22, 2012, 04:00:25 AM
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on March 22, 2012, 03:45:13 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on March 21, 2012, 09:19:36 AM
Loosen the clamps @ the engine as well - I think it has the clamp style ones that go on the manifold not the flange style.
Then lubricate the crap out of em, spray them with wd40 all over.
Then wiggle and shake and work em, and spray more.
Remember this ... getting out is less than 1/10 the difficulty of getting it back in.
Lube and put a 2 X 4 behind it and use a tarchet tie down to the front forks or something.
Cool.
Buddha.
the Buddha Loves You is right on this one. try carbs on a viagra
Can you elaborate? Didn't get it... :dunno_black:
I think virago = viagra.
I have 1 small twist there. A 1100 virago has a drain bolt in the float bowl, you can remove and clean and replace the main jet and if you have the right size wire, bend it and wiggle it into the pilot jet and clean it too.
But getting the carbs out = nightmare.
Cool.
Buddha.
You know, the way the carbs are, at that angle, I can take out the float bowls reach the jets and the vaccum chamber. But it became a proud issue, man vs machine. If I can't tame it, I can't ride it.
Here are some pics:
(http://i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh50/julietjameson/CBR600F4i/intakes.jpg)
(http://www.osrclub.com/tutorials/Honda-CCT-10.jpg)
(http://www.osrclub.com/tutorials/Honda-CCT-2.jpg)
As you see, a small screwdriver is all what I need to get the bowls out, but no way I will surrender!! :2guns:
EDIT: I've not taken these pics, I found then in the internet just for illustrative proposes!
make sure you got both clamps, on the carb side and on the intake side. I've never personally worked on an f4 but the f3 I had was a pain in the shaZam as the boots were not letting go. I use a handled prybar to 'gently' pry on them, rock them back and forth, or try to pick up the whole bike using only the carbs. Lube you already got, so I'm thinking you'll just have to keep at it. If those boots are that dry, you might replace them anyways,...exacto to the rescue? Good luck. I hope you keep posting pics of what you're doing. :thumb:
Your bike has the F4i tail on it! take it back to the dealership an tell them you want the fuel injectors put in!
And out they are!! :cheers:
(http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z368/piresito/CBR600F4/SAM_2060.jpg)
I've used and air dryers, tons of WD40, two ratchet ties and two big wrenches. I've put pressure in it with the ties, then lubed, heated, lubed, a bit of pry each side, more tension (up the point the ratchet mechanism started to get warped), then I started to pry with the wrenches on each side and the carbs popped! Really popped like an Champagne bottle cap!! At first I though "Cool..." then I though, "Oops...from the sound I must have wrecked something"...but no, it's a Honda! :cookoo:
Now, the boots are a bit dry, and some of the inner tabs have ripped, in the red marks:
(http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z368/piresito/CBR600F4/SAM_2065.jpg)
(http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z368/piresito/CBR600F4/SAM_2064.jpg)
(http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z368/piresito/CBR600F4/SAM_2063.jpg)
I think that those inner tabs are not needed for an air tight junction, as the clamps press the boots so tight that there is now way a molecule pass trough there, I think. But hey, I never had experience with air leaks.
There is one other problem, I've checked the boots prices...30€ each, thats like 40$, each!! After a second search I've seen them at 12$ each, less problemtic...
What's you opinion for this? Do I really need to get new boots, or it might work with these?
BTW, those pics in my previous post are not mine. They are from the internet, found them in a thread for CCT replacement!
Yup brute force is the best ... why dont you try a stick of dynomite next time.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on March 23, 2012, 07:41:25 AM
Yup brute force is the best ... why dont you try a stick of dynomite next time.
Cool.
Buddha.
I though about that, but didn't have any around... :icon_twisted:
Quote from: The Buddha on March 22, 2012, 06:02:33 AM
Quote from: piresito on March 22, 2012, 04:00:25 AM
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on March 22, 2012, 03:45:13 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on March 21, 2012, 09:19:36 AM
Loosen the clamps @ the engine as well - I think it has the clamp style ones that go on the manifold not the flange style.
Then lubricate the crap out of em, spray them with wd40 all over.
Then wiggle and shake and work em, and spray more.
Remember this ... getting out is less than 1/10 the difficulty of getting it back in.
Lube and put a 2 X 4 behind it and use a tarchet tie down to the front forks or something.
Cool.
Buddha.
the Buddha Loves You is right on this one. try carbs on a viagra
Can you elaborate? Didn't get it... :dunno_black:
I think virago = viagra.
I have 1 small twist there. A 1100 virago has a drain bolt in the float bowl, you can remove and clean and replace the main jet and if you have the right size wire, bend it and wiggle it into the pilot jet and clean it too.
But getting the carbs out = nightmare.
Cool.
Buddha.
getting the fuckers out was easy, getting the fuckers back in was the Buddha Loves You. i dropped a bolt down INTO the intake. i got lucky. after drinking 6 beers to calm down. pulled plug, and used a telescoping magnet, and fished hte screw out
Hi!
Valves adjusted (shim under bucket shaZam!!!), carbs clean and it's time to get them back in the engine...any tips?
P.S: I don't have a Sledgehammer around.
:thumb:
Quote from: piresito on April 19, 2012, 02:15:11 AM
Hi!
Valves adjusted (shim under bucket shaZam!!!), carbs clean and it's time to get them back in the engine...any tips?
P.S: I don't have a Sledgehammer around.
:thumb:
lube hte rubber boots slightly. since im assuming with tears you had to replace.
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on April 19, 2012, 03:30:03 AM
Quote from: piresito on April 19, 2012, 02:15:11 AM
Hi!
Valves adjusted (shim under bucket shaZam!!!), carbs clean and it's time to get them back in the engine...any tips?
P.S: I don't have a Sledgehammer around.
:thumb:
lube hte rubber boots slightly. since im assuming with tears you had to replace.
Yes, I had to replace 3 of them..wouldn't be fun after this work having a vaccuum leak in there. I already lube the boots and the intakes, and left ratchet straps overnight pressing the carbs on the intakes so that the rubber gets used to the "penetration". (lack of better terms)
How did you do in that "Viagra"? (The beer part already tried, no go...)
Silicone spray is your friend ;)
-Jessie
Silicone spray, one more lube to the collection! :thumb:
Thank for that tip, will try that as soon as I can buy one.
As a side question, did ever happened to anyone of you that after a valve adjustment (shim under bucket, cams removed), all the clearances are less than expected to be? Like you expect a 0.21 clearance in a specific valve but you get only 0.17?
Regards,
Did you rotate the engine a few times to squeeze out any oil before taking the measurements with the new shims?
-Jessie
Quote from: BaltimoreGS on April 19, 2012, 05:49:43 AM
Did you rotate the engine a few times to squeeze out any oil before taking the measurements with the new shims?
-Jessie
Yep, a few turns....by your question, this never happened to you? :mad:
If by chance I overtorqued the holder screws, will it reduce the clearance or once the holder surface is seated in the head it won't interfere with the clearance?
I'm asking because, I'm using a needle torque wrench, although its range is 0-200NM which makes it hard to read a 12Nm value. I'm not sure if it did 12Nm, 11Nm or 14Nm, or whatever value close to that.... :technical:
Thanks.
Torqueing just stretches the bolt, it shouldn't change clearances. Are your after measurements out of spec or just closer to the tolerances than you expected?
-Jessie
I've never managed to get all the oil out of a shim over bucket valve with just engine rotation. A short ride or warm up will get it out for sure.
Shim under may be worse - or better not sure how yours were. But I'd trust the math and not worry the actuals after the adjustment.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: BaltimoreGS on April 19, 2012, 07:29:06 AM
Torqueing just stretches the bolt, it shouldn't change clearances. Are your after measurements out of spec or just closer to the tolerances than you expected?
-Jessie
I expected them to be in the looser side of the tolerance, but they are in the tight side, two really in (or on?) the edge. Both intakes. Also, the valves that most needed adjustment were on the intake side, opposite of what happens in the GS! Strange hen?
I was afraid that cam holder would be too tight and might chew the camshaft. So if overtorquing wouldn't change this values, I will ride it this way to check her behaviour, I won't see other factor beside oil and temperature to change the clearance.
Timing is ok, and I measured every shim thickness.
I did flooded the whole thing in oil, even dove the shims in oil, and it was considerably colder weather when I rechecked the clearances. So there is still oil in there, sure it is the culprit (I hope...).
Again, thank you guys, your experience worth it's weight in gold!!
Just to update the thread...the boots got into the intakes by them self...I think! :cookoo:
Left them overnight with a tensioned ratchet strap, pressing them down, but there was no way they wanted to sit properly that night.
The next day, I went to check them and they are just nicely seated in their place. :bowdown:
I think these carbs are fast learners, no way they are were going to win. :technical:
I will update as soon as I (try to) fire it up.