Should have just taken a video.... ugh!
battery is too low and im not in the mood to push the bike to my car a 3rd time....
Bike just cranks.
No sputter, nothing. just crank crank crank
but my only worry is.
while its cranking, I can clearly hear a Thump Thump Thump everytime it cranks.
as if the piston is smacking the head.
not a ticking, grinding or anything, but a perfect Thump thump thump. (guess my bikes humping itself!) HAHAHAHHA :cookoo:
Plan to check the timing and valve clearances again tomorrow.
but hope theres nothing wrong below that!
just put a Good 95 or 96 head on an 89 engine (89 lower end and cylinders + pistons)
anything to worry about?
or just the timing is off? (which I dunno how that would happen ><)
(edit)
I can only Hear it btw.
with my hand on the top of the engine, I dont feel anything hitting eachother.
Check and recheck the timing chain if you just had the head off. Be sure the crank is at TDC and your timing marks on the cams are right when you mount the chain. I wouldn't crank it anymore in case the timing is off before checking.
-My 2 cents.
Did you spin it by hand? Anything feel unusual?
-Jessie
Does it sound like air passing thru a hole? I would guess a loose exhaust - where the headers bolt up.
nope, it honestly went together, cranked, and all felt Great!
I'll recheck everything when I wake up tomorrow.
(edit)
yeah I'll check the headers.
I did those in a bit of a hurry.
because it was POURING!
and I got quite drenched.
Quote from: BaltimoreGS on April 01, 2012, 05:43:19 PM
Did you spin it by hand? Anything feel unusual?
-Jessie
+1.....If you pull the plugs out you should be able to turn it over by hand with relative ease and "feel" any abnormalities.
Fwiw, headers being bolted up or not will have absolutely nothing to do with the mechanics of the engine. It will run without them, albeit not well, and you risk burning valves but none the less it will run. Tomb, I'd double check timing. Does it sound erratic? You can def tell a difference when its out of time or in time when cranking.
it sounds absolutely fine other then a thumping noise.
normal cranking noise and just wont start.
I'll take the cam shafts out again tomorrow and just reset everything after rechecking valve clearance Again! (tho I KNOW they were good!!)
if worse comes to worse...
I'll just replace the valve that isnt seating properly in the head I replaced and put that Back on and then get more problems... hahahahaha
(edit)
im tempted to go out and mess with it now.
but I just cant shake this mood now.
so I'll try to by killin some Zombies <3 :2guns:
Quote from: Tombstones81 on April 01, 2012, 06:36:52 PM
it sounds absolutely fine other then a thumping noise.
normal cranking noise and just wont start.
I'll take the cam shafts out again tomorrow and just reset everything after rechecking valve clearance Again! (tho I KNOW they were good!!)
if worse comes to worse...
I'll just replace the valve that isnt seating properly in the head I replaced and put that Back on and then get more problems... hahahahaha
(edit)
im tempted to go out and mess with it now.
but I just cant shake this mood now.
so I'll try to by killin some Zombies <3 :2guns:
nothing like killing zombies to curb frustration lol
dude, you have the worst luck ever.
Every time i read one of your new posts i feel like starting my bike up, pointing it in your direction, put a throttle lock on, and watch it fly into the sunset, or rise, or no sun, depending on what point of the compass you are from me. With any luck, it'll get there and still be running.
or maybe it will get there, run, and then cease running the next day... :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: Funderb on April 01, 2012, 09:04:37 PM
dude, you have the worst luck ever.
Every time i read one of your new posts i feel like starting my bike up, pointing it in your direction, put a throttle lock on, and watch it fly into the sunset, or rise, or no sun, depending on what point of the compass you are from me. With any luck, it'll get there and still be running.
or maybe it will get there, run, and then cease running the next day... :icon_mrgreen:
touché my friend
have you put the pistons in the right way round (BACK TO FRONT ) ??
Quote from: twinrat on April 02, 2012, 12:59:23 AM
have you put the pistons in the right way round (BACK TO FRONT ) ??
didnt take them off.
was no need to.
heck, there wasnt any need to even clean the tops.
sides were clean and tops didnt have much buildup on them at all.
and yea Funderb, I've been saying that all along.
I got some bad luck! hahaha
but I wont be pushed around by even that!
Im not going to stop until this suckers fixed!
kk, up a lil earlier then usual.
work 3rd, was off and wanted more daylight to work so I went to bed early.
gonna sit here and catch my bearings, then go out and tackle this prick yet again!
goodluck mang! we're all definitely pulling for ya!
^^^ haha tnx
well!
good news for the thumping.
+1 to Big Rich :bowdown: :thumb:
It was a loose header.
the right side wasnt fully pushed in.
So that thumping noise was the exhaust passing out the headers instead of through to the muffler.
which it is now doing.
sounds like a freakin heartbeat when the bikes cranking hahahaha... CLEAR!!!
We're losing her! hahah
still just cranks tho.
gonna go out in a min and check the valve clearance and timing again.
(edit)
fairly confident now, as my only worry was that thumping.
... see what happens when your in a hurry to do work?
started Pouring so I hurried and put the exhaust on......
<<<< Dumb@$$!!!! :cookoo:
I honestly Pray it runs now when im done.
as my biggest worry was an oil leak.
and with all that cranking, I think if there was one worth worrying about, it would have shown itself by now. :thumb:
:mad: :mad: :mad: :2guns: :2guns: :2guns: :technical: :technical: :technical:
got it started... sounded GREAT!
was so happy..... for a few Seconds!
YAY!
now im back to a previous problem!!!
F'er bogs and dies when I give it too much throttle again!
if I give it slowly, RPMs will raise.
but as soon as it nears above 5K, it bogs.
then I hear a gurgle or some kinda noise from the top end.
I forget now.
Im about to go take a video of it and upload it.
then take a compression test when the bike warms up nicely.
i'm curious of the condition of the stator. when my bike had a bad ground it would sit and idle all day. any input of the throttle would cause it to run like shaZam! instantly. rechecked grounds and re terminated a few and voila, back to 100%. when it would go haywire the headlight was flashing with the voltage spikes. has to be electrical at this point buddy, you've eliminated everything else. maybe the cdi is taking a crap on ya
dunno....
but the video turned out good.
can hear it quite clearly.
uploading it to FB now, so it will be a lil bit.
meantime im going to try and relax before going out for a compression test.
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=3597411095133
hopefully it uploads before i have to work lol, i'd like to compare it to the sounds mine made keep it up man, i know its hard to do, easy to say over a computer but you'll get it. the problem is specific to this engine it seems, which is why i suggested the stator check, etc. you might have a broken wire somewhere causing an intermittent issue which is even harder to track. check your wires, specifically stator and cdi wires
its uploaded.
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=3597411095133
posting again since its on the first page.
(edit)
started ticking too when I first started it in the video.
it didnt prior to that.
(edit)
the timing is perfectly set and the valve clearances are fine.
but it was a lil hard to crank the motor by hand at one point in the rotation.
not Too hard but enough to get my attention.
sounds like the timing is off. that spitting noise sounds like backfiring through the intake.or it could be valves to tight after they seat themselves in. idk. i'd like to hear others inputs. also while idling it sounds like it only running on one cylinder.
thank you.
Guess im going to be checking it Again! (timing and valves)
I really have no comprehensible clue as to How so many problems arise when I am doing everything Perfectly!
timing was set correctly.
valves were straight and sealing 100% last time the head ran in the old engine. (also looked at them before I put them on the new engine)
clearances are ALL between .04mm and .08mm
and last, I checked the carbs.
took the cover off the floats, all were good.
cover off the tops.. diaphrams ok and lil O rings.
plenty of good fuel and lines are fine.
petcocks all open on tank and side.
fuel is flowing freely
and the gas cap open helps none.
(edit)
oh yeah.
am I supposed to be able to blow air thru the fuel intake line of the carbs?
with the throttle closed or open.
I put my mouth on that yucky sucker where the fuel line attaches and couldnt blow air through it.
"I put my mouth on that yucky sucker"
:cookoo:
(http://www.motohouston.com/forums/images/smilies/laughing6.gif)
Quote from: Tombstones81 on April 02, 2012, 09:58:35 AM
thank you.
Guess im going to be checking it Again! (timing and valves)
I really have no comprehensible clue as to How so many problems arise when I am doing everything Perfectly!
timing was set correctly.
valves were straight and sealing 100% last time the head ran in the old engine. (also looked at them before I put them on the new engine)
clearances are ALL between .04mm and .08mm
and last, I checked the carbs.
took the cover off the floats, all were good.
cover off the tops.. diaphrams ok and lil O rings.
plenty of good fuel and lines are fine.
petcocks all open on tank and side.
fuel is flowing freely
and the gas cap open helps none.
(edit)
oh yeah.
am I supposed to be able to blow air thru the fuel intake line of the carbs?
with the throttle closed or open.
I put my mouth on that yucky sucker where the fuel line attaches and couldnt blow air through it.
if the carbs are full of gas no. needle and seat must be working properly then. My vote is still timing or valves too tight.
kk that was SCARYYYYYYYY!!!
after letting it idle for awhile and messing with the idle screw etc.
then draining the carbs (float lvl is ok)
it seemed to act a lil better.
so I jumped on it and it was getting enough power to get up to around 4K without boggin.
so I took it for a spin within 25 yards of where I work on it.
started boggin so I just opened the friggin throttle up.
all of a sudden the RPMs shot up and seemed to act good then.
before I can continue testing (head cover is leaking oil as its not tight enough)
I took it back as it was smoking Wayyy too much from oil on the headers.
soon as I parked it I revved it up again to around 9 or 10K (didnt expect it to)
when WHOOSH! hahaha
I hear the headers ignite!!!
oil? or did gas leak somehow?
scared the holy hell out of me!
nothin nearby but i blew it out....
shoulda left it BURN!!!
dunno, letting it cool before seeing it whatever it was naturally got fixed...
(edit)
was acting fine minus some weird sounds for a little while.
left it cool and was going to make a video of Those sounds....
but now its back to bogging......
Have you pulled your plugs again to inspect? What color are they?
This is a similar behavior to when I first picked up my bike from the PO. It would bog down above 6k, and then sometimes catch again if you could get past it with WOT. I pulled the carbs and realized that it had a 145 main jet and 2 washers with a stock exhaust :cookoo:. Obviously it was running very rich. Not sure if that helps you at all, but might want to do some checking around your carbs. Maybe your slide is stuck open? Floats stuck?
float lvl is fine.
def not rich.
have a K&N open air filter and Cobra F1s slipon.
with 130 mains and 40 pilots.
nothing but stock as the needles are concerned.
plugs look fine as well.
and after it running, they are not soaked in gas as if too rich or discolored to indicate such.
and im surprised nobody laughed that I actually caught my bike on Fire now!!!
I mean come on!
EVERYTHING else has gone wrong with the bike.
I had to light the sucker up sometime or another! hahahahaha
Stupid instincts!!!
I didnt think.
I simply shut the bike off, put the stand down as fast and I could, noticed nothing to use to put it out with....
so I just started huffin and puffin on it hahahaha
didnt make anymore progress today tho.
I just gave up for the day and went out.
just got back now.
(edit)
but yeah.
tomorrow if I get to it.
I'll check to make sure the needles are fine.
and warm compression test was fine.
I just hope the or a valve didnt get messed up like the previous head as its acting the same as that one was....
Is there anything wrong with your slides? For the motor to bog, then rev way up.........I dunno man.
Have you tried swapping coils and plugs? A loose electrical connection could have connected, then revved the motor up.
Quote from: Big Rich on April 02, 2012, 08:35:05 PM
Is there anything wrong with your slides? For the motor to bog, then rev way up.........I dunno man.
Have you tried swapping coils and plugs? A loose electrical connection could have connected, then revved the motor up.
I got One extra coil with the 89 motor.
I've swapped it once with the right one with no luck but i'll see how they act swapping with the left.
if anything possible with electrical, I have a tester.
Just point me in the right direction. hahaha
You could check primary and secondary resistance of the coils with a tester, but I doubt they are bad (and doesn't explain a bogging motor anyway).
I'm assuming you've pulled the plugs on each side while it's running? Do yourself a favor - use insulated pliers and don't touch the bike with your other hand........
Quote from: Big Rich on April 02, 2012, 08:45:43 PM
You could check primary and secondary resistance of the coils with a tester, but I doubt they are bad (and doesn't explain a bogging motor anyway).
I'm assuming you've pulled the plugs on each side while it's running? Do yourself a favor - use insulated pliers and don't touch the bike with your other hand........
yeah I've pulled the plug wires off the plugs while it was running.
the left one and it kept running with the right.
the right one would stall the bike.
Ok, so it's only running on the left cylinder - at least for the majority of the time. The exhaust and the stock airbox are shared, so remove them from them equation. If the compression is good on the right side along with the valves, the only things left are the carbs need work (which I REALLY doubt) or the electrical system.
The electrical system is : spark plugs, coils, igniter/ CDI box, and the pickup sensor at the end of the crank. Which of those might need looked at (or looked at again)?
actually its running on both All the time.
the low sound it made while running on only the right cylinder...
I've Never heard that before until then.
Sorry Tomb, I can't watch vids on FB on my phone - the speakers don't do any justice.
I thought you said it stalled if you pulled the right plug wire?
Quote from: Big Rich on April 02, 2012, 09:00:31 PM
Sorry Tomb, I can't watch vids on FB on my phone - the speakers don't do any justice.
I thought you said it stalled if you pulled the right plug wire?
yeah, the right plug makes it stall.
when I pull the left one, only the right cylinder is working.
how low the sound is when running like that is what I've never heard before.
Ahhhh.... sorry.
Personally, I would check and double check every connection on that side. It may be just a bad spark plug boot, or a shady connection around the coil.
I'll check everything over.
but Honestly......
I might just put everything back in my old motor now that I know why it was leaking. (since it ran 100% before but leaked oil badly)
Which was because the copper washers were Shot and I mixed up the engine bolts as I didnt know until like Yesterday that they are differently sized.
So putting good engine gaskets in, using the copper washers from the new engine (which just go down over the studs vs old ones screwed in... MUCH BETTER!)
putting the bolts in the correct way and torqued down 100% correctly..
and tightening up that allen head bolt in the oil filter area.
Then I think she will be golden. (so I THINK as I cant find nothing else to cause a leak)
and finish it off with putting the old motor back in.
afterwards.
get the new motor back up to 100% working condition.
which would include, new gaskets, copper washers, and replace the one exhaust valve that isnt seating properly.
I honestly think my current problems are valve related.
because its acting the Same exact way it did with the previous head with the exhaust valve not sealing.
Cloud 999999999999999999999999999! baby!
HELL YEAHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:
Knew it was valve related... Just Knew it....
Only thing I didnt try yet, was putting the new engines cam shafts and half moon things in the old engines head that is on the new engine now.
so.. I did! :bowdown: :thumb:
Got all done and cranking it by hand was SOOOOOOOOOOO much smoother!
at that point (with my dad sittin there watchin before he went home) im like... Yep! its GOING to start!!
I just knew it was going to be good!!
Checked the valve clearance.
Right exhaust and intake were perfect.
left 2 were loose.
260 in the intake made that one Perfect.
265 (was 260) in the exhaust made it a Little tight. (probably .03mm)
but I needed the only extra 260 I had for the intake, so that had to due vs .11mm or .10mm in the exhaust.
So now I will order another 260 shim on Friday for the exhaust valve.
put it all together. (to make it short)
Crank... VROOM!
She starts Right up and jumps to 5K with the choke on!
Took the choke off... hit the throttle.... NO boggin or bad sounds!!!! :bowdown: :thumb: :woohoo:
adjusted the idle screw.
Hit the throttle again... PERFECT!
well, the throttle was a little tight, so I adjusted that before a test run.
Took it around the block.
PERFECT!!!!! :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:
got back, took a look in front near the headers....
wait for it.....
wait for it..........
NO OIL LEAKING !!!! :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:
Washed up and got my gear on.
went for a quick 5 mile test run and to stop for gas.
Shes ALL GOOD!
except I have a little tinkering to do.
thats why im home now
letting it cool off.
gotta adjust the headers so they are perfect and seal up the area where the exhaust meets the slip on.
and now the throttle has a lil too much free play (it let up more when I hit the throttle)
other then that and the headlight cowl installation (another day)
well, and the one exhaust shim I need to buy Friday
shes ALL GOOD!
Damm im so happy!
sorry, no video of it starting for the first time and it being GOOD!
I literally was TOO happy!!
(edit)
kk exhaust should be cool enough.
time to go adjust them and tighten them down Fully (didnt wanna take a chance at stripping them since I had to take em off so much)
they are tight enough not to cause a problem, but not 100% tight, probably like 85% to 90%.
then seal up where the exhaust meets the slip on.
then take it for a longer test ride!
(http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/Videos/high5.gif) (http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/Videos/minicat-3.gif)
(http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/Videos/smilieRR.gif) (http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/Videos/vtr2.gif)
(http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb442/adidasguy/Videos/spoton.gif)
Hell Yea! :cheers: :thumb: :woohoo:
(http://www.todayandtomorrow.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/hell_yeah.gif)
Yes! Finally. Now DO NOT break an exhaust header bolt off in the head.
Good work bud.
And my wife always wonders why i like to fix things on my own.
Because its a great feeling when it all comes together.
WAY TO GO :woohoo:
My bike has sounded EXACTLY like that, twice...
Once, when the carbs were horribly out of sync.
The second, when I unplug the spark plug boot from one of the plugs.
Regardless, sounds like your running on one cylinder, or one cylinder is doing all the work.
FML, never mind, I was still on the first page. Carry on. :cheers:
You deserve it after all you have been through!
Congrats :cheers:
Now time to RIDE
Awesome news to hear!! :thumb:
-Jessie
That is fantastic, you da man. Way to go bro, I was hangging in there with you. Congrates.
Cheers
Cool! :woohoo:
Now, what fixed it? You essentially put a new camshaft in? And what are the half-moon things you speak of?
Hell yeah! Road trip to florida! Come ride on the sandy beaches!
Hell Yeah! Nothing like kicking that sucker in the butt and making it work. Now quit typing and go ride!
Congrats on the runner! Just so you know, an exhaust valve that is on the loose side is not a bad thing. Others more knowledgeable than I have said that it keeps your exhaust valves cooler. I have seen up to about .13 and I am running at .11 on one of mine. Just food for thought but again, enjoy your running bike!
Quote from: 4strings on April 05, 2012, 09:31:10 AM
Congrats on the runner! Just so you know, an exhaust valve that is on the loose side is not a bad thing. Others more knowledgeable than I have said that it keeps your exhaust valves cooler. I have seen up to about .13 and I am running at .11 on one of mine. Just food for thought but again, enjoy your running bike!
thanks :thumb:
and I've read about the exhaust up to .13mm loose, thanks tho.
It was at .10 or .11
but I had to use the last 2.60 shim that was in it to tighten the intake valve to within spec.
I have a 2.60 shim to go in it that Steezin sent me as soon as it arrives :bowdown: :thumb:
and since my project thread didnt get a reply, thought I would copy over one thing to here for attention.
also what might be because of a tight exhaust valve or I need new header gaskets (will get them anyways)
exhaust sound coming from the front area of the bike.
fairly loud in comparison to what it was like last year.
Might be a combination of both, the exhaust valve and needing new header gaskets.
even tho the headers are on really good.
also some lack in power spots until I open the throttle up more.
any other possibility I need to worry about on that???
and need some input on the plug colors (copied from my project thread as well)
also, I do plan to get brand new ones tomorrow, so they will be more accurate in color when I finish the exhaust valve.
almost forgot.
took some pics of my plugs after a total of like 70 mile test run since yesterday.
and bare in mind, these were not brand new clean when I started.
these have been the plugs I've been using since I thought I finished my old engine (when the oil leak began) (bought new back then)
so im not sure if that matters.
brown one is the right side of the engine where the valve clearance is all good.
(think thats from the slight surface rust in the tank that I need to take care of)
other one is the left side of the engine that needs the exhaust valve clearance loosened.
(it was pretty much black when I started yesterday, now half and half)
obviously running lean from the tight exhaust valve.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b165/Chronno1201/100_0075.jpg)
HELL YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!