Hey all I thought I'd do a different type of fuel thread instead of asking what grade etc etc to put in I'm asking what BRAND of fuel have you found that works for you bike/s and your cages? Personally I found that in my GS Shell fuels seemed to burn through quickly and no real gain in power whereas BP gave me reasonably good fuel economy. My current (Subaru liberty) car I haven't noticed closely enough what fuel it likes the best, I seem to get the same power and economy from all different brands. But in my F800R I have noticed Shell and BP give me increased fuel consumption and Caltex fuels give me a noticeable increase in fuel economy. What have you guys found or you havnt noticed enough to care?
I mostly use Shell. Not because I think it does any better, but because that's the filling station my family has used since 1986. And being on a first name basis with the owner and employees has it's benefits. For example, last time I had my bike inspected there was a 1.5 day wait for 'customers', I had to wait about 45 seconds :D
When I'm on the road I use whatever I'm near when I hit reserve. I do try to avoid Sheets (too much water too little gas). And with the BS B.P. has pulled I refuse to support them.
I'll only fill at Caltex when I'm cruising around town. Shell (Coles Express) have had issues in the past here with their fuel, dirt and shaZam! all through it, I just don't trust the pumps.
When travelling, I usually travel on the bike with a couple of other guys who only have a range of about 200 km on their big cruisers. I can find something else if I don't like the look of the joint.
I buy whatever I am aroundexcept eExxonMobi. They are more expensive for some rreason
My family used to be loyal to Texaco. Since they've disappeared we use Wawa, or my preference is Sunoco. Those two seem to be the longer lasting fuel for me, and I can feel the difference when I don't use regular. Other stations seem to burn faster on me and I get annoyed when I drive my car to fill up more than once a week.
Eh slips ... You know that most of the fuel in Aussie all comes from pretty much same place yeah? .. Just a few minor tweaks in the 'recipe' depending on the tanker that's filling ...
But ... FWIW ...in the cars and trucks - Caltex mostly ... BP after that ... And shell if I have to .... Their prices (when not the Coles tie in) are generally 4-8 cpl dearer most places I look ..
In the bike I'm using the 'Enhance' chain e10 94ron stuff... All good
Few tweaks make all the difference janx
Either BP or Caltex 95 in mine... haven't noticed a difference in economy with either, although sometimes I fill up at the Liberty over the road from work but only when necessary. They have a "Premium" pump that doesn't list octain... I'm always sus on that one... there are no Shells to speak of where I ride...
I usually time it so I'm close to one of the "big name" gas stations (BP, Shell, Marathon, Mobil)...unless it's one of the ones that changes every year or two. There's one station that I pass fairly regularly that used to be a Shell, then they went independent, then they became a Marathon. Now they are back to a Shell...this all in the space of the last 5 years. I also refuse to use the "budget" gas around here (Speedway, Citgo, Meijer, Costco, Sam's Club, etc), unless I have no other option and not using them would mean walking more than 2 miles if my bike/car went dry.
I use Sunoco because its right near my house, when I run out on a ride its whatever major brand I pass next.
I usually fill up at Safeway, cheapest gas near me. This last month I have been filling up at Chevron because my credit card gave me 11% back filling up there in May. Unless its ethanol free, I have found that gas is gas.
I use any brand, doesnt seem to make a difference except in cost.
Of course i choose the cheapest if im not desperate for fuel, but she seems just as happy running on ASDA fuel as ESSO / BP.
Hey so I'm new to the biker world (been here a little more than a year) but I'm pretty darn versed with cars, ESP BMWs, which are the most picky and fickle cars on the market. To take the best care of the engine I use either HESS or (believe it or not) SAMs Club Super Grade. The reason I don't like BP (besides all of the politics) is that this "Invigorrate" crap that they put in it, just hinders your performance and adds more gunk. If your really wanna clean out ur fuel lines, buy the high grade stuff from ur autoshop.
As for my bike I abide by the same rules with the addition of one other. Try to avoid Ethanol as much as you can. I know it's hard but as a synthetic chemist I can tell you ethanol does NOT burn in the same fashion as Octane. It's no good for a bike engine which tends to be more sensitive than big car engines.
I hope this helps and if anyone knows more about the truths of ethanol in bike fuel please let me know!
Ill see if I can find the picture a bike mechanic mate of mine took of a triumph sprint fuel pump eaten by ethanol fuel.
Chevron, because they are between my house and Interstate 5...that I travel daily. Plus 20+ years of using Chevron with FI and zero issues with that :thumb:
Quote from: slipperymongoose on June 03, 2013, 01:58:25 PM
Ill see if I can find the picture a bike mechanic mate of mine took of a triumph sprint fuel pump eaten by ethanol fuel.
Cool ....
I don't have a fuel pump .. ;)
Janx mate your missing out.
Yeah I know :sad: ...
... This has a fuel pump!! :icon_twisted:
I personally like shell and chevron. I noticed a difference when i filled my bike up with the v-power. Roared to life! :cool:
Quote from: lynx124 on June 03, 2013, 01:22:46 PM
Hey so I'm new to the biker world (been here a little more than a year) but I'm pretty darn versed with cars, ESP BMWs, which are the most picky and fickle cars on the market. To take the best care of the engine I use either HESS or (believe it or not) SAMs Club Super Grade. The reason I don't like BP (besides all of the politics) is that this "Invigorrate" crap that they put in it, just hinders your performance and adds more gunk. If your really wanna clean out ur fuel lines, buy the high grade stuff from ur autoshop.
As for my bike I abide by the same rules with the addition of one other. Try to avoid Ethanol as much as you can. I know it's hard but as a synthetic chemist I can tell you ethanol does NOT burn in the same fashion as Octane. It's no good for a bike engine which tends to be more sensitive than big car engines.
I hope this helps and if anyone knows more about the truths of ethanol in bike fuel please let me know!
ok, can't resist...
what exactly are you cleaning from your fuel lines with 'high grade' stuff ?
where does said 'cleaned out stuff' go ?
does it go into the carbs, and clog the jets or magically poof away instead ?
I use whatever gas is at the pump whenever I've hit reserve. oh, and cheapest. never seen any increase or decrease in milage with any brand over another. then again, I don't have an odometer, speedometer, trip meter, or a care.
Quote from: ohgood on June 03, 2013, 05:54:36 PM
Quote from: lynx124 on June 03, 2013, 01:22:46 PM
Hey so I'm new to the biker world (been here a little more than a year) but I'm pretty darn versed with cars, ESP BMWs, which are the most picky and fickle cars on the market. To take the best care of the engine I use either HESS or (believe it or not) SAMs Club Super Grade. The reason I don't like BP (besides all of the politics) is that this "Invigorrate" crap that they put in it, just hinders your performance and adds more gunk. If your really wanna clean out ur fuel lines, buy the high grade stuff from ur autoshop.
As for my bike I abide by the same rules with the addition of one other. Try to avoid Ethanol as much as you can. I know it's hard but as a synthetic chemist I can tell you ethanol does NOT burn in the same fashion as Octane. It's no good for a bike engine which tends to be more sensitive than big car engines.
I hope this helps and if anyone knows more about the truths of ethanol in bike fuel please let me know!
ok, can't resist...
what exactly are you cleaning from your fuel lines with 'high grade' stuff ?
where does said 'cleaned out stuff' go ?
does it go into the carbs, and clog the jets or magically poof away instead ?
I use whatever gas is at the pump whenever I've hit reserve. oh, and cheapest. never seen any increase or decrease in milage with any brand over another. then again, I don't have an odometer, speedometer, trip meter, or a care.
"high grade stuff" (the 'high grade' part being relative to the crap BP puts in their fuel) meaning fuel line and injector cleaners that you mix in with your fuel every few years. I didnt mean this for bikes, but rather cars, especially heavy duty work trucks. The "gunk" basically gets burnt off, which admittedly could cause further problems for the car if used too much but quickly solves fuel injection issues. That comment wasnt meant for bikes as I have no clue if its good to be used on a bike or not. Sorry for not being clear and thanks for pointing that out!...besides for a bike fuel lines (I'm assuming only because I have yet to change them on my bike) are much easier to swap than that of say, an e46 BMW 3-series...
Always shell in all my bikes. There is a noticeable difference to me.
I won't put ethanol in my bike... mainly because it reportedly goes "off" a hell of a lot quicker and I've heard of bikes left for relatively short periods of time (ie. a couple of weeks) getting gummed up carb circuits because the ethanol has gone off so quickly. Maybe there were more issues there but I've heard too many bad news horror stories about it to even try it.
Quote from: Nahian on June 03, 2013, 08:31:41 PM
Always shell in all my bikes. There is a noticeable difference to me.
you really need to have your mates setup a double blind test with 4-5 brands of fuel, in your bike.
I only use shell 91
Quote from: ohgood on June 04, 2013, 09:40:25 AM
Quote from: Nahian on June 03, 2013, 08:31:41 PM
Always shell in all my bikes. There is a noticeable difference to me.
you really need to have your mates setup a double blind test with 4-5 brands of fuel, in your bike.
Don't really need to..I had Sunoco in my other bikes (never did with the gs, cause I only recently got it, always shell in her) and then the bike would run weird and the carbs would get dirty, the same with wawa and valero. This has a more profound effect on my 2 strokes than my street bikes. Maybe I am superstitious but, I have just never had a problem with shell gas so I just stick to that lol. That being said, I never really thought about what octane gas is best for the gs500. I've been putting 93 but I know that is not necessary in many cases. What do you guys think? I live pretty close to sea level too. I know elevation matters somewhat.
I use whatever it the cheapest, then whatever is closest when I'm about to run out. I haven't noticed much difference, although my riding traffic is so erratic, I wouldn't really be able to track it anyway.
It's hard to find here, but like others have said, I think the ethanol content makes a bigger difference than the brand. It might just be a coincidence that a certain brand puts less ethanol in their gas, or maybe even no ethanol in some premium octanes.
Who knows, don't ask me though, I use the cheapest gas I can find, and Rotella T motor oil made for diesel trucks.
I've suggested the "double blind test" to satisfy all the Internet arguments on gas brand, octane...mileage, "power"...spark plugs...oil...additives, fat tires....etc etc.....
Nobody has ever taken me up on the offer............
BTW on a similar note...Here in NJ there was recently an expose...the bars were serving crap whiskey.....poured from the expensive brand bottle....nobody seemed to notice.....but worse some bars were mixing food color with rubbing alcohol... and passing it off as scotch......hmmmmm
Cookie
Quote from: ohgood on June 04, 2013, 09:40:25 AM
Quote from: Nahian on June 03, 2013, 08:31:41 PM
Always shell in all my bikes. There is a noticeable difference to me.
you really need to have your mates setup a double blind test with 4-5 brands of fuel, in your bike.
Quote from: twocool on June 06, 2013, 04:07:35 PM
I've suggested the "double blind test" to satisfy all the Internet arguments on gas brand, octane...mileage, "power"...spark plugs...oil...additives, fat tires....etc etc.....
Nobody has ever taken me up on the offer............
BTW on a similar note...Here in NJ there was recently an expose...the bars were serving crap whiskey.....poured from the expensive brand bottle....nobody seemed to notice.....but worse some bars were mixing food color with rubbing alcohol... and passing it off as scotch......hmmmmm
Cookie
Quote from: ohgood on June 04, 2013, 09:40:25 AM
Quote from: Nahian on June 03, 2013, 08:31:41 PM
Always shell in all my bikes. There is a noticeable difference to me.
you really need to have your mates setup a double blind test with 4-5 brands of fuel, in your bike.
yessa, I've heard of similar things.
the thing is, a dyno might be needed to find any differences at all, and if so, who cares.
I haven't noticed a difference in either of my thumpers from any brand or octane to another. they cruise the same, acclerate the same, idle the same.
different gasses, different octanes, different locals... the only time gas is thought about is when I have to switch to reserve.
I could care less about what brand of fuel goes in the GS. My car is a good test of fuel quality though....turbocharged, ignition advanced as far as possible, if the fuel isn't top notch the knock light starts going crazy at full throttle.
Quote from: RossLH on June 11, 2013, 06:17:38 PM
I could care less about what brand of fuel goes in the GS. My car is a good test of fuel quality though....turbocharged, ignition advanced as far as possible, if the fuel isn't top notch the knock light starts going crazy at full throttle.
that's octane, homie, not quality.
I only ever use 93oct. Low quality 93oct will cause bad detonation in my car.
Quote from: RossLH on June 11, 2013, 06:52:45 PM
I only ever use 93oct. Low quality 93oct will cause bad detonation in my car.
i'm confused, you only use 93 octane and live with the detonation ?
93 octane is 93 octane, unless it's different methods of determining the octane, or different levels of ethanol.
Ethanol content doesn't really matter, ethanol effectively raises the octane. It's any combination of age, crappy additives, and water in the fuel that can affect the quality.
And yes, the car is very sensitive. It's tuned to run higher than stock boost on top of a lot of timing. That combination can quickly lead to detonation if the fuel isn't quite right.
Quote from: RossLH on June 12, 2013, 09:10:18 AM
Ethanol content doesn't really matter, ethanol effectively raises the octane. It's any combination of age, crappy additives, and water in the fuel that can affect the quality.
And yes, the car is very sensitive. It's tuned to run higher than stock boost on top of a lot of timing. That combination can quickly lead to detonation if the fuel isn't quite right.
but you said "low quality octane causes deton..."
low octane causes detonation, yes.
That's not at all what I said. Take for instance E85. Octane rating of well over 100, but ethanol is hygroscopic. When E85 takes on water, the octane rating remains the same, but the fuel is shot. Same octane as before, much lower quality. Very distinct difference.
You can use just about any brand, i prefer to use Chevron premium because around where i live they generally have a higher octane premium, though when im working full time i tend to use a race blend or an octane boost which runs better than any premium fuel that ive bought from a gas station before.
I wouldnt use E85 because it tends to pull water from the atmosphere into it if it sits for any period of time which can cause problems for your gas tank / petcock
Quote from: RossLH on June 13, 2013, 08:45:20 AM
That's not at all what I said. Take for instance E85. Octane rating of well over 100, but ethanol is hygroscopic. When E85 takes on water, the octane rating remains the same, but the fuel is shot. Same octane as before, much lower quality. Very distinct difference.
were not talking about water in fuel, were talking about fuel. of course dumping water sand or pie into a fuel will make it poor quality. was the quoted bit changed ?
Quote from: iclrag on June 13, 2013, 08:47:00 AM
You can use just about any brand, i prefer to use Chevron premium because around where i live they generally have a higher octane premium, though when im working full time i tend to use a race blend or an octane boost which runs better than any premium fuel that ive bought from a gas station before.
I wouldnt use E85 because it tends to pull water from the atmosphere into it if it sits for any period of time which can cause problems for your gas tank / petcock
what are running the racefuel in ?
got any dyno or temperature graphs that show your bike/car/airplane actually running better ?
I top up with Sainburys 95 unleaded. Works fine in the bike and I am returning 64mpg (UK ones). Or whatever is closest to me when the tank is going dry! Still working on where the reserve kicks in and as I lost around 1 litre of fuel when taking the tank off at the weekend (previous owner did not use clips to hold the hose on), I'll have to wait till next week before finding the true reserve point.
Quote from: ohgood on July 09, 2013, 03:21:26 AMwere not talking about water in fuel, were talking about fuel. of course dumping water sand or pie into a fuel will make it poor quality. was the quoted bit changed ?
You misquoted me. I said "low quality 93 octane causes detonation". You quoted "low quality octane causes deton". I always buy 93 octane. Always. If I buy a lower quality fuel (still 93 octane), it will cause detonation. High quality 93 octane and low quality 93 octane have the same resistance to combustion, but higher quality 93 octane will combust more completely.
Quote from: RossLH on July 09, 2013, 10:00:45 AM
Quote from: ohgood on July 09, 2013, 03:21:26 AMwere not talking about water in fuel, were talking about fuel. of course dumping water sand or pie into a fuel will make it poor quality. was the quoted bit changed ?
You misquoted me. I said "low quality 93 octane causes detonation". You quoted "low quality octane causes deton". I always buy 93 octane. Always. If I buy a lower quality fuel (still 93 octane), it will cause detonation. High quality 93 octane and low quality 93 octane have the same resistance to combustion, but higher quality 93 octane will combust more completely.
isn't that the point of an octane rating ?
Fuel quality is not part of the octane rating. Fuel quality and fuel octane are two distinct and different concepts. Octane is a rating of resistance to combustion, or in other words activation energy. Quality is a measure of how completely the fuel burns, which could also be called purity. Impurities in fuel do not necessarily change the activation energy of the fuel, but they will change how much of the fuel burns.
I drive an '09 Subaru WRX and haven't noticed any difference between brands.
You won't notice a difference on a stock or OTS tune. I did my own tuning, and pushed the car to the limits of AFR, boost, and timing. Your car is not at all an acceptable representation of mine. (Not to mention 32-bit ECU vs. 16-bit, 2.5L vs. 2.0L, VF52 vs. TD04-13T, so on and so forth.)
And my Wang's bigger than yours :)
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
Is that the soft oily click of an engineers slide rule I hear? :icon_twisted:
Quote from: codajastal on July 20, 2013, 02:48:05 AM
And my Wang's bigger than yours :)
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
:laugh:
For what it's worth, my car on the stock turbo pushed to the limits struggles to make the same power his does from the factory.
Quote from: RossLH on July 19, 2013, 12:46:00 PM
Fuel quality is not part of the octane rating. Fuel quality and fuel octane are two distinct and different concepts. Octane is a rating of resistance to combustion, or in other words activation energy. Quality is a measure of how completely the fuel burns, which could also be called purity. Impurities in fuel do not necessarily change the activation energy of the fuel, but they will change how much of the fuel burns.
that all sounds nice. where do you find thisi high quality fuel ? refining it yourself ?
I'm sorry man, this is laughable stuff now.
Quote from: ohgood on July 20, 2013, 02:11:55 PMI'm sorry man, this is laughable stuff now.
Ah, the classic "I can't admit I'm wrong, so I'll attempt to make fun of him instead."
Come on guys this isn't a scientific thread this is about how much your in tune with your machine and the little differences you notice and if alot of ppls little differences are the same we may see some sort of trend.
On topic, I put Wawa gas in my bike, and that proved to be a mistake. Went on a group ride a couple days ago, and the two of us who filled up at that station had problems with our bikes running badly. I had to open the choke to make it run rich just so it'd get up to highway speed.
I run the cheapest regular gas I can find, usually Wal Mart. In my 2011 Fiesta I've averaged 45.58 MPG for the last 15,000 miles (6 spped at). In my 97 Ranger (5 speed manual 4 cylinder) I've averaged just under 32 MPG for the last 5000 miles since I bought the truck used with 124k. The GS500E has averaged just under 62 MPG (all US gals) for the last 650 miles since I bought it. It's still lean under light loads but I'll probably take it off the road long enough to go through the carbs when I get the 89 roadworthy.
Pretty sure all the gas here on the east coast comes through pipelines regardless of the retailer. I can get E0 but it's a 60 mile drive and another 40 cents a gallon, simply not worth it. Sure if you let E10 sit in an open container it will absorb humidity, but you don't have to worry about water in your gas if you just avoid letting it sit for a long time. I can tell by the smell when it is old, and I just drain the bike and toss it in the truck or car. I generally ride through winter here unless it gets cold enough for black ice. I have no problem with E10 in a 42 year old bike, at least nothing I can detect in over 2 years and 1300 miles. I have seen E10 sit in cars for close to a year without issues with modern evaporative emissions systems which prevent air from entering the fuel tank.
Alcohol has a very high octane rating. My buddy used to race go carts with B&S engines that dynoed 18 HP (normally 5). They had girdles over the cyl heads to keep them from blowing off the motor and ran pure alcohol. At the end of a race he could put his hand on the cylinder head but not the exhaust. The alcohol fuel cooled the head that much. Old tech flat head with splash feed oiling system.
regards
Mech
Quote from: RossLH on July 20, 2013, 02:33:33 PM
Quote from: ohgood on July 20, 2013, 02:11:55 PMI'm sorry man, this is laughable stuff now.
Ah, the classic "I can't admit I'm wrong, so I'll attempt to make fun of him instead."
I wasn't making fun of you. I asked where you get the higher quality gas ?
also, how am I wrong ?
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 20, 2013, 05:40:54 PM
Come on guys this isn't a scientific thread this is about how much your in tune with your machine and the little differences you notice and if alot of ppls little differences are the same we may see some sort of trend.
soooo, let's make it scientific. if anyone here can tell the difference between 87 octane and 97 in their gs ( most of us have/had one), by all means post up the double blind studies results.
since it won't happen, ill go ahead and call bullshit right now.
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:43:00 PMI asked where you get the higher quality gas ?
In the past few years I've moved around a lot, and each new city I move to I usually have to try a couple gas stations before I find a reliable one. It's trial and error.
Although I will retract my previous statement when I said I don't care what goes into my GS. I found one gas station it surely did not like, I won't be filling up there again.
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:43:00 PMalso, how am I wrong ?
"93 octane is 93 octane, unless it's different methods of determining the octane, or different levels of ethanol." (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=64476.msg769962#msg769962)
That comment right there. All 93 octane is not the same. High quality 93 octane is not the same as low quality 93 octane. That's the entire point of my argument.
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:45:29 PM
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 20, 2013, 05:40:54 PM
Come on guys this isn't a scientific thread this is about how much your in tune with your machine and the little differences you notice and if alot of ppls little differences are the same we may see some sort of trend.
soooo, let's make it scientific. if anyone here can tell the difference between 87 octane and 97 in their gs ( most of us have/had one), by all means post up the double blind studies results.
since it won't happen, ill go ahead and call bullshit right now.
Because I have seen all the armchair scientists in all the other fuel threads so no lets not make it scientific. Science has been flogged like a dead horse on this forum.
I've been calling for "mythbuster" type double blind tests on this and other forums.........
For fuel, oil, additives, batteries, tires, spark plugs, etc, etc.........
Everybody is interested in the bullshitting....but nobody is interested in the scientific test......
sad...
Cookie
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:45:29 PM
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 20, 2013, 05:40:54 PM
Come on guys this isn't a scientific thread this is about how much your in tune with your machine and the little differences you notice and if alot of ppls little differences are the same we may see some sort of trend.
soooo, let's make it scientific. if anyone here can tell the difference between 87 octane and 97 in their gs ( most of us have/had one), by all means post up the double blind studies results.
since it won't happen, ill go ahead and call bullshit right now.
Well then instead of pointing the finger turn that finger around and do the double blind yourself and document the results.
There is that point! :dunno_black: ... Can't demand .. Or even ask for stuff and not give it a go? ..
Not even being convinced that everything is bullshit .... Reverse holds true also... Double blind to prove the bullshit? :dunno_black:
Quote from: RossLH on July 23, 2013, 11:24:42 PM
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:43:00 PMI asked where you get the higher quality gas ?
In the past few years I've moved around a lot, and each new city I move to I usually have to try a couple gas stations before I find a reliable one. It's trial and error.
Although I will retract my previous statement when I said I don't care what goes into my GS. I found one gas station it surely did not like, I won't be filling up there again.
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:43:00 PMalso, how am I wrong ?
"93 octane is 93 octane, unless it's different methods of determining the octane, or different levels of ethanol." (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=64476.msg769962#msg769962)
That comment right there. All 93 octane is not the same. High quality 93 octane is not the same as low quality 93 octane. That's the entire point of my argument.
ok, first point - how are you testing the fuel to prove it's high quality ? seat of the pants ?
second point - see first point, are you testing it ?
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 24, 2013, 01:21:02 AM
Quote from: ohgood on July 23, 2013, 08:45:29 PM
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 20, 2013, 05:40:54 PM
Come on guys this isn't a scientific thread this is about how much your in tune with your machine and the little differences you notice and if alot of ppls little differences are the same we may see some sort of trend.
soooo, let's make it scientific. if anyone here can tell the difference between 87 octane and 97 in their gs ( most of us have/had one), by all means post up the double blind studies results.
since it won't happen, ill go ahead and call bullshit right now.
Because I have seen all the armchair scientists in all the other fuel threads so no lets not make it scientific. Science has been flogged like a dead horse on this forum.
no, it's easy. do a double blind test, you and your mates. armchair warriors regurgitating links and spouting about -possible- results instead of real results are why it KEEPS getting 'beat to death'.
Quote from: slipperymongoose on July 24, 2013, 04:14:28 AM
Well then instead of pointing the finger turn that finger around and do the double blind yourself and document the results.
sounds great !
are the people claiming that they can 'tell a huge difference' in 85/87/93/104 octane fuels going to participate in this and carry the bourdon of proof too ?
i'll -GLADLY- run 85, 87, 93, and 104 through my bike with friends helping and keep it properly double blind.
how many of the proponents of 'higher quality fuels' or 'higher octane fuels' want to give it a go ?
does anyone want to offer facilities or testing of actual fuel samples for actual octane ratings vs advertised at the pump, since we haven't tested that yet ? i don't have the know how, or i'd be happy to.
the whole point of these questions is not a character judgement, but to FIND FACTS and DISPEL MYTHS.
it's annoying as hell to keep hearing people regurgitate internet myths like "loud pipes save lives', 'race fuel', 'lay er down', 'thorough chain cleaning', and other messes.
too often a new rider will believe this trash and put themselves in danger, or worse, continue to spread the garbage to even newer riders that look up to them.
lets find the FACTS. who's game ?
Quote from: Old Mechanic on July 20, 2013, 06:55:59 PM
I run the cheapest regular gas I can find, usually Wal Mart. In my 2011 Fiesta I've averaged 45.58 MPG for the last 15,000 miles (6 spped at). In my 97 Ranger (5 speed manual 4 cylinder) I've averaged just under 32 MPG for the last 5000 miles since I bought the truck used with 124k. The GS500E has averaged just under 62 MPG (all US gals) for the last 650 miles since I bought it. It's still lean under light loads but I'll probably take it off the road long enough to go through the carbs when I get the 89 roadworthy.
I wish I could get close to that in my Ranger... Can't figure out why it is so low, stopped trying... in my '97 Ranger which is also 5 speed manual 4 cylinder, I get 17mpgs... have gotten that since I bought the truck with 34k miles 6 years ago, now has 100k. I also had an automatic 5 speed 4 cylinder '98 ranger for 7 years that got 23mpgs average, but I had tanks that I could pull 29mpgs out of... never broke 30 though... :dunno_black:
I never expected 30mpgs out of either, but 17? come on! you'd think the manual '97 would do better than the automatic at least?
I did find that the timing was retarded when I replaced the timing belt on the '97... which probably reduced fuel economy, but would it make that big of a difference? Truck was owned by an old couple who kept it in a garage and used it for putting around town, so I guess thats why they had the timing retarded maybe... I'm really lost on it though...
Never really mattered where I filled up, cept when I got bad gas at Caseys in both of 'em... both trucks had same symptoms, ran like crap all the sudden, and real hard to start... didn't go there again...
- Bboy
Great make a thread and knock yourself out.
Quote from: ohgood on July 24, 2013, 05:22:14 AMok, first point - how are you testing the fuel to prove it's high quality ?
Knock light.
Do you guys use regular unleaded fuel of premium? I have always used premium the regular unleaded octane level is 91. Im thinking about using regular unleaded as fuel prices are always on the rise and im wondering if i would notice any difference?
You'll be fine with regular. The GS500 isn't real high compression and doesn't run any significant amount of timing advance, there's really no reason to use anything higher than 87oct.
Well my bike and car run like shaZam! with the cheap ass fuel so I use the non ethanol in my car and bike with none of the issues.
Sent from my iPad using a big stick
Brand don't bother me much either... although some of the dodgy little servos I avoid coz who knows what's floating in their old tanks? As long as it's 95 or higher octane my bike likes it... pings like a bastard with 91 in it. And no ethanol, don't trust it.
Quote from: peteGS on July 25, 2013, 03:11:37 PM
Brand don't bother me much either... although some of the dodgy little servos I avoid coz who knows what's floating in their old tanks? As long as it's 95 or higher octane my bike likes it... pings like a bastard with 91 in it. And no ethanol, don't trust it.
you have a pinging gs500 ?
If you have "knock" the problem is not the gas.......GS500 does not knock on regular.....unless some other problem with the motor..
Cookie
Quote from: ohgood on August 23, 2013, 11:52:04 AM
Quote from: peteGS on July 25, 2013, 03:11:37 PM
Brand don't bother me much either... although some of the dodgy little servos I avoid coz who knows what's floating in their old tanks? As long as it's 95 or higher octane my bike likes it... pings like a bastard with 91 in it. And no ethanol, don't trust it.
you have a pinging gs500 ?
Quote from: twocool on August 23, 2013, 03:52:38 PM
If you have "knock" the problem is not the gas.......GS500 does not knock on regular.....unless some other problem with the motor..
Cookie
Quote from: ohgood on August 23, 2013, 11:52:04 AM
Quote from: peteGS on July 25, 2013, 03:11:37 PM
Brand don't bother me much either... although some of the dodgy little servos I avoid coz who knows what's floating in their old tanks? As long as it's 95 or higher octane my bike likes it... pings like a bastard with 91 in it. And no ethanol, don't trust it.
you have a pinging gs500 ?
Agreed
Copied from a previous post of mine:
My tale of octanes, gas knocks, and oil grades.
I had four 400-750cc Hondas I used 10W-40 oil winters and 20W-50 summers after they had some milage on them for the 230k miles I put on them. When I got the 97 GS new I ran 15W-50 Mobil I full synthetic for about 50k miles after break-in. After all 5 (4 Hondas and 97 GS) got 10-20k miles or so on them getting carboned up they developed gas knock in hot weather under load so I used mid range gas in them summers to eliminate the knock. When oil consumption increased I replaced the more expensive Mobil I with the 15W-40 heavy duty aka diesel oil and then one hot summer day I inadvertantly filled it with regular 87 octane gas and it never knocked. And it never knocked again for the next 30k miles I put on it with the 15W-40 oil. My 02 GS has gone all of it's 90k+ miles on 15W-40 oil and regular 87 octane gas without a single knock.
Conclusion: A 89-02 GS500 runs cooler on 10/15W-40 oil than on 15/20W-50 oil, no doubt in my mind. Never had a 04 or later model with an oil cooler so I can't vouch for them but I would run the same in them myself.
I should probably add at this time that tire size had no effect on gas knock nor did the 15T front sprocket I ran on the 97 GS. :thumb:
By the way, peteGS was reporting it was his '82 GS450E that pings on lower octane fuel not a GS500.
The first time I tried to store a bike that had "Freddy Fast No Name" fuel in the tank was a disaster, 3 months later it wouldn't even "pop". My riding lawn mower couldn't run on the drool I drained from the tank. Not all fuel is created equally :whisper:
I don't really stick to a brand but I put "premium" in my tank. It's higher octane (which doesn't really matter) but the important point is it's way cleaner. If you take the premium fuel in a jar and take the regular unleaded fuel in a jar the regular unleaded fuel is far more dirty. This is more of a local problem and not a problem with the GSes.
The result of not switching sooner was it gunked up my carbs and gas tank over time because I didn't have a fuel filter.
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on September 02, 2013, 09:33:28 AM
The first time I tried to store a bike that had "Freddy Fast No Name" fuel in the tank was a disaster, 3 months later it wouldn't even "pop". My riding lawn mower couldn't run on the drool I drained from the tank. Not all fuel is created equally :whisper:
I'm almost sorry for laughing at this... almost. put any modern untreated fuel in a 1/2 filled tank for three months, then come back and look at it. yeeouch.
Quote from: Dr.McNinja on September 02, 2013, 10:24:27 AM
I don't really stick to a brand but I put "premium" in my tank. It's higher octane (which doesn't really matter) but the important point is it's way cleaner. If you take the premium fuel in a jar and take the regular unleaded fuel in a jar the regular unleaded fuel is far more dirty. This is more of a local problem and not a problem with the GSes.
The result of not switching sooner was it gunked up my carbs and gas tank over time because I didn't have a fuel filter.
you're telling me you can see dirt in unleaded, but not higher octane unleaded, from the same station ?
they're leaching fuel into the ground then, and you should call the epa !
Quote from: ohgood on September 03, 2013, 12:33:00 PMI'm almost sorry for laughing at this... almost. put any modern untreated fuel in a 1/2 filled tank for three months, then come back and look at it. yeeouch.
It was treated and still didn't make it to spring, I never have this problem with Tier 1 fuel, Chevron Regular will last over a year treated.
Quote from: ohgood on September 03, 2013, 12:35:08 PM
Quote from: Dr.McNinja on September 02, 2013, 10:24:27 AM
I don't really stick to a brand but I put "premium" in my tank. It's higher octane (which doesn't really matter) but the important point is it's way cleaner. If you take the premium fuel in a jar and take the regular unleaded fuel in a jar the regular unleaded fuel is far more dirty. This is more of a local problem and not a problem with the GSes.
The result of not switching sooner was it gunked up my carbs and gas tank over time because I didn't have a fuel filter.
you're telling me you can see dirt in unleaded, but not higher octane unleaded, from the same station ?
they're leaching fuel into the ground then, and you should call the epa !
That could be the case. I'll have to do a few tests at the nearest gas station to be sure. I didn't even think of that. It happened once (the time I decided to switch to premium after cleaning my carbs) and I just never bothered to check again :icon_eek:.
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on September 03, 2013, 03:57:48 PM
Quote from: ohgood on September 03, 2013, 12:33:00 PMI'm almost sorry for laughing at this... almost. put any modern untreated fuel in a 1/2 filled tank for three months, then come back and look at it. yeeouch.
It was treated and still didn't make it to spring, I never have this problem with Tier 1 fuel, Chevron Regular will last over a year treated.
you can try testing that theory if you like, but I'm not in my bikes.
I was told not to use premium on my old ZZR(98) so since then I just use 91 mainly caltax (ww) or shell if a shop at Coles . Same as my cars.
Quote from: ohgood on September 04, 2013, 03:34:53 AM
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on September 03, 2013, 03:57:48 PM
Quote from: ohgood on September 03, 2013, 12:33:00 PMI'm almost sorry for laughing at this... almost. put any modern untreated fuel in a 1/2 filled tank for three months, then come back and look at it. yeeouch.
It was treated and still didn't make it to spring, I never have this problem with Tier 1 fuel, Chevron Regular will last over a year treated.
you can try testing that theory if you like, but I'm not in my bikes.
So the fuel does make a difference in some ways then? :dunno_black:
Dammit I'm out of popcorn.
Quick dash to the 7/11 then?
Quote from: ohgood on September 04, 2013, 03:34:53 AMyou can try testing that theory if you like, but I'm not in my bikes.
I'm a stones throw from Canada, it's cooler up here, your closer to the equator, much hotter, (heat and gas..not good) what works for me, may not work for you? Now theres a theory you can try and wrap your opinion around :kiss3:
Ooooooooohhhhhhh snap
:whisper: theres gonna be phonecalls now! :whisper:
If my bike sits for a month, I just drain the fuel and put it in one of our cars. In sealed systems in modern US spec cars, I have seen fuel work fine after over a year, but that is in sealed evaporative emission controlled cars. I have also seen a 240Z that had all the exhaust valves stuck open with varnish like goo from bad gas that sat a year while the owner was on deployment and that was before ethanol gas here. The old leaded gas would still work after a decade.
regards
Mech
Guess they don't make fuel like they used to
Quote from: Janx101 on September 04, 2013, 03:56:18 AM
Quote from: ohgood on September 04, 2013, 03:34:53 AM
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on September 03, 2013, 03:57:48 PM
Quote from: ohgood on September 03, 2013, 12:33:00 PMI'm almost sorry for laughing at this... almost. put any modern untreated fuel in a 1/2 filled tank for three months, then come back and look at it. yeeouch.
It was treated and still didn't make it to spring, I never have this problem with Tier 1 fuel, Chevron Regular will last over a year treated.
you can try testing that theory if you like, but I'm not in my bikes.
So the fuel does make a difference in some ways then? :dunno_black:
you mean like "will the bike run without gas?"
ya, that matter.
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on September 04, 2013, 11:10:31 AM
Quote from: ohgood on September 04, 2013, 03:34:53 AMyou can try testing that theory if you like, but I'm not in my bikes.
I'm a stones throw from Canada, it's cooler up here, your closer to the equator, much hotter, (heat and gas..not good) what works for me, may not work for you? Now theres a theory you can try and wrap your opinion around :kiss3:
I'm learning with your input :)
I'm not sure if its just the humidity level or that with large temperature swings, or completely unrelated and only the mix of junk put in fuels now... but yes, down here leaving fuel for three months is a bad idea.
Quote from: ohgood on September 05, 2013, 07:51:33 AMI'm not sure if its just the humidity level or that with large temperature swings, or completely unrelated and only the mix of junk put in fuels now... but yes, down here leaving fuel for three months is a bad idea.
With ethanol fuel in a vented tank, humidity can quickly become a problem.