Hi,
I've been riding a 250cc standard (Suzuki TU250X) for a few months now and am considering buying something a bit bigger.
I want to stay with a reasonable standard riding position, and I much prefer naked bikes to ones with fairings. I've found that I get more fun riding twisty roads rather than fighting the wind at high speed.
I don't have much desire to go faster than 75mph ... but would like to have to option of being able to accelerate out of trouble on the freeway ... which I don't have with my TU250X.
The GS500 seems like a nice bike, and I've taken a test ride on a 1999 model which felt comfortable and fast enough for my desires. It did leave me leaning forward a bit more than I prefer, but I assume that I can fix that with a different handlebar or risers, and maybe also some lower footpegs.
So ... as far as I can see there are 3 models available ... the older 1989-2000 GS500E, the short-lived 2001-2003 GS500, and the fully-faired 2004-2009 GS500F.
It looks like the fairings can be stripped off the GS500F pretty easily and replaced with the older headlight to convert it back into a naked bike, and then the fairings could be sold to recoup some of the extra purchase price.
Is there any reason to prefer (or avoid) the older 1989-2000 GS500E, or to prefer (or avoid) the 2001-2003 GS500?
Does the updated 3-jet carb in the newer GS500F (and maybe the 2001-2003 model) really perform better than the older 2-jet carb?
Are the Spanish-produced bikes (2003-2009) any better/worse quality than the Japanese-produced bikes?
Does anyone have any other thoughts?
Thanks,
John
I've long said the change from the 2 circuit carbs to the 3 circuit carbs was the biggest performance change made to the GS500s as far as everyday riding goes. The bike pulls stronger and smoother thru the mid range and all around in general except at the top end and also pulls from a lower rpm at the bottom end, needed 4k rpm to get the 97 pulling smoothly and my 02 pulled nicely from 3k rpm.
I rode both my old 97 that I had put 80k miles on and my almost new 02 with only about 4k on it back then for a while and the difference was obvious to me. Yet that 97 with 80k miles on it still pulled a bit stronger on the top end. I have 100k miles on the 02 now and never touched the carbs on either but my bikes never sit and dry out for long. Could be there was a cam change too between the 2 and 3 circuit carb models but I've never been able to confirm that one way or the other.
I've had no personal experience with the Spanish built GS-F bikes myself but some claim they are not as good on quality control as the older ones. I've always claimed the 01-02 models were the best because I like them naked and they also have the 3 circuit carbs. :icon_lol:
Not all 04+ are fairing bikes. There is a GS500F and a GS500E. The E model is the naked one
All 04-09 models sold in the US were the faired GS-F models. The 04 and newer naked GS-E models were sold in other countries. There were no 03 model GSs sold in the US, naked or faired.
I've been riding a 3 jet carb fitted onto the 95. I dont think its made any gains per se over a properly jetted 89-00.
However I think out of the box, the 3 jet version has allowed them to shove the epa mandated problems into 1 small rev range and leave the others relatively well set.
The carbs in all GS'es need a rejet, and once you do that you cant even tell.
I find pre 96 is 1 class by itself.
96-97 seems to be apivotal year for all suzuki's ... even katana's slipped in quality ... sp did GS'es, like the 6 position gear bobbin was swapped for a 1 position ... and so on ...
Having said that, till the spanish bikes came by the quality was better overall.
These all will last forever if you maintain them. And are not really really unlucky.
Like I know of someone who had a rear cam guide break apart with 20-25K. Who has any control over that sorta crap.
Anyway, 89 as we all know has the best crap ... however 89's also have the hardest motor removal process.
All GS'es are pretty close ... I am partial to older, however I have had a few new, and worked on several 100 carbs and other items for the new type, I might as well say, if one turned up @ my door cold wet and shivering ... or warm dry and sunny, I'll be happy to toss a helmet on and ride it (once I can walk of course).
Like I told my cousin - I am not even interested in a car till its got about 150K on it ... yea, not interested in a bike till its about 20 yrs old.
Cool.
Buddha.
I have the 94 E model (naked). For what it's worth, I rode it on a 1000+ plus mile trip this summer and had no issues with rider position, and I tend to prefer the standard riding position. It also can zip you past any trouble on the highway pretty easily. I've never been on the F model, so I'm not sure if the riding position changes much between E and F.
One thing I have noticed after riding through the mountains a few times... when leaning forward over the tank a bit more... twisties take on a different thrill than sitting upright in the standard position. The bike really seems to respond to dips and curves in a pleasing manner. Then while on the highway... it is easy to sit upright and chill.
89 and 90 models here and have never had any issues with either. :woohoo:
Gs500f is a fantastic learner bike. Voted #1 learner bike of all time
Quote from: Erika on October 06, 2013, 03:41:06 PM
I have the 94 E model (naked). For what it's worth, I rode it on a 1000+ plus mile trip this summer and had no issues with rider position, and I tend to prefer the standard riding position. It also can zip you past any trouble on the highway pretty easily. I've never been on the F model, so I'm not sure if the riding position changes much between E and F.
One thing I have noticed after riding through the mountains a few times... when leaning forward over the tank a bit more... twisties take on a different thrill than sitting upright in the standard position. The bike really seems to respond to dips and curves in a pleasing manner. Then while on the highway... it is easy to sit upright and chill.
With that wrap around seat, the 01 and later model is maybe an inch lower for the seat. It also is maybe an inch wider ...
It should be more comfortable ... but they put such crappy foam in the seat it hardly makes a difference.
Cool.
Buddha.
Thanks for the input :)
It sounds like there's no reason to rule out an older (pre-2001) bike, but little reason to actually prefer one. I guess that I need to sit on a 2004+ model and see how it feels.
I'm seeing prices kind of all-over-the-place. Ignoring the obvious high prices, like the guy that wants $3,000 for a 2002 (4,000 low miles, perfect condition) ... I'm seeing a good-condition 2000 model with 8,000 miles for $1,900 and a good-condition 2008 model with 8,000 miles for $2,800.
There are also a couple of REALLY low mileage bikes for about $2,800, like a 2004 with 300 miles and a 2005 with 650 miles. I'm guessing that these have sat unused for a long time and so could have problems. Should I avoid bikes like these, or are they potential "bargains"?
These are Southern California prices, and we're all a bit strange here ;) Do these prices sound reasonable?
At those prices there is plenty of reason to prefer older -
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/mcy/4104723782.html
700 bones but needs unspecified work but runs awesome once fixed ... which one is it ... its like he/she can see the future and can speak of it as it were in the past ...
I dunno, You may want to buy a bike from someone outside the species ... outside the LA species.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on October 06, 2013, 04:21:25 PM
Quote from: Erika on October 06, 2013, 03:41:06 PM
I have the 94 E model (naked). For what it's worth, I rode it on a 1000+ plus mile trip this summer and had no issues with rider position, and I tend to prefer the standard riding position. It also can zip you past any trouble on the highway pretty easily. I've never been on the F model, so I'm not sure if the riding position changes much between E and F.
One thing I have noticed after riding through the mountains a few times... when leaning forward over the tank a bit more... twisties take on a different thrill than sitting upright in the standard position. The bike really seems to respond to dips and curves in a pleasing manner. Then while on the highway... it is easy to sit upright and chill.
With that wrap around seat, the 01 and later model is maybe an inch lower for the seat. It also is maybe an inch wider ...
It should be more comfortable ... but they put such crappy foam in the seat it hardly makes a difference.
Cool.
Buddha.
I could not believe the difference in seats when I swapped a '04 tank/seat on my '93. The 93 was narrow but comfy and squishy while being supportive. Never a sore butt. The 04 seat was wide but pretty dang firm. I didn't like that my butt started feeling every little bump in the road through the seat. But I much prefered the wider seat pan... Tradeoffs.
I also found that my 93 felt bigger with a 04 seat on it. Because it was wider I could not flat foot in tennis shoes, only in my boots.
I have ridden the tu250x and I would say the riding position is very similar to my GS, which does have risers. Loved the tu250x, and really wish they sold the 450 version in the states. Would have been a tough decision between a tu450x and GS500 though I'm sure. Its a great modern bike with a classic look and is a blast to ride.
- Bboy
Quote from: mustangGT90210 on October 06, 2013, 07:05:13 PM
Quote from: The Buddha on October 06, 2013, 04:21:25 PM
With that wrap around seat, the 01 and later model is maybe an inch lower for the seat. It also is maybe an inch wider ...
It should be more comfortable ... but they put such crappy foam in the seat it hardly makes a difference.
Cool.
Buddha.
I could not believe the difference in seats when I swapped a '04 tank/seat on my '93. The 93 was narrow but comfy and squishy while being supportive. Never a sore butt. The 04 seat was wide but pretty dang firm. I didn't like that my butt started feeling every little bump in the road through the seat. But I much prefered the wider seat pan... Tradeoffs.
I also found that my 93 felt bigger with a 04 seat on it. Because it was wider I could not flat foot in tennis shoes, only in my boots.
Thanks ... it sounds like I really to need to try a 2004+, but may want to stick with an older pre-2001. I'm a fairly small 5'7", 140lbs and I really like that the TU250X, the older GS500E, and even the VX800 that I tried are all very narrow.
I absolutely hated the width of both the Nighthawk 750 and CB650 that I tried recently, and am still amazed that I actually passed my MSF course on a Suzuki GZ250 on which I felt totally uncomfortable and unbalanced.
Quote from: The Buddha on October 06, 2013, 06:57:06 PM
At those prices there is plenty of reason to prefer older -
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/mcy/4104723782.html
700 bones but needs unspecified work but runs awesome once fixed ... which one is it ... its like he/she can see the future and can speak of it as it were in the past ...
I dunno, You may want to buy a bike from someone outside the species ... outside the LA species.
:laugh: I'm trying to contact that one, but expect that it's LA-speak for "high mileage, engine seized and everything covered in rust".
Yes, I'm looking outside LA (and outside California) for a decent deal.
Quote from: BockinBboy on October 06, 2013, 07:24:58 PM
I have ridden the tu250x and I would say the riding position is very similar to my GS, which does have risers. Loved the tu250x, and really wish they sold the 450 version in the states. Would have been a tough decision between a tu450x and GS500 though I'm sure. Its a great modern bike with a classic look and is a blast to ride.
I'm glad to hear that the risers will help with the riding position.
The TUX250 is an absolutely wonderful bike, so beautiful and so much fun to ride ... but IMHO really at-or-above it's limits with LA freeway traffic. OTOH ... I'm having a lot of fun finding all the backroads that I never knew existed when I just jumped onto the freeway instead.
The idea that Yamaha may be bringing the SR400 into the country next year is intriguing, but it will be out of my price range for a few years.
Quote from: elmer on October 07, 2013, 12:09:59 PM
Quote from: BockinBboy on October 06, 2013, 07:24:58 PM
I have ridden the tu250x and I would say the riding position is very similar to my GS, which does have risers. Loved the tu250x, and really wish they sold the 450 version in the states. Would have been a tough decision between a tu450x and GS500 though I'm sure. Its a great modern bike with a classic look and is a blast to ride.
I'm glad to hear that the risers will help with the riding position.
The TUX250 is an absolutely wonderful bike, so beautiful and so much fun to ride ... but IMHO really at-or-above it's limits with LA freeway traffic. OTOH ... I'm having a lot of fun finding all the backroads that I never knew existed when I just jumped onto the freeway instead.
The idea that Yamaha may be bringing the SR400 into the country next year is intriguing, but it will be out of my price range for a few years.
I'll second your opinion of the tu, it's is fantastic, in its element.
What I have noticed is that prices tend to fall a certain amount on used vehicles and then bottom out. So often you'll see the same price for a newer bike as an older one of the same model. It's probably less of an issue in Southern California where the weather is warmer, but a fairing makes riding a lot more comfortable when it cold(er) out. You could even ride down into the 50's LOL.
Try looking for the newest bike you can find at the best price. I have bought two beater bikes in my life and regretted it both times ~ I would have had to spend an enormous amount of time and money to get them back in respectable running order again. Unless you like working on your bike while others are out riding theirs, look for something that's been cared for in the first place.
When I bought my first "bike in boxes" my wife looked at it and said ... Oh hey, you'll save time on this one, its already apart.
Cool.
Buddha.
Bikes that have sat for a long time can have issues with dried out tires and carburator boots, plus gunked up carbs from old fuel. Check the important rubber bits and make sure it idles properly and doesn't have any hesitation in throttle response. Bikes stay in amazingly good shape if stored properly indoors ~ we bought a1986 Honda VF500C Magna that had been ridden for a few years then only a few hundred miles in the next 10yrs. We had to replace the tires and some of the cam cover seals, but other than that it ran fantastic until I collided with a deer on it.